Sony forced to stop selling PS2s, dual shock controllers, games

by Vladimir Cole { Mar 27th 2005 at 10:28PM }

Japan Today reports that in addition to a hefty, $90.7-million fine for damages, Sony Computer Entertainment may be forbidden from manufacturing, using, selling or importing into the United States any of their products that include computer controlled vibrating motors because those products infringe on patents held by Immersion Corp. The products in question:

Playstation consoles, Dualshock controllers, and those games found by the jury to infringe…. A Bug's Life; Amplitude; Ape Escape; Atlantis: The Lost Empire; Bloody Roar 2; Cool Boarders 3; Cool Boarders 4; Cool Boarders 2001; Crash Bash; Crash Team Racing; Drakan: The Ancients' Gate; Emperor's New Groove; Extermination; FantaVision; Final Fantasy X; Formula One 2001; The Getaway; Gran Turismo; Gran Turismo 2; Gran Turismo 3; Grand Theft Auto: Vice City; Grand Theft Auto 3; Grind Session; ICO; Jak & Daxter; Kinetica; Kingdom Hearts; Legend of the Dragoon; The Mark of Kri; Medal of Honor Frontline; Medievil 2; Metal Gear Solid 2; Monster's, Inc.; Sly Cooper and the Thievius Racoonus; SOCOM Navy Seals; Speed Punks; Spyro: Ripto's Rage; Spyro: Year of the Dragon; Stuart Little 2; Syphon Filter 2; Syphon Filter 3; Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 3; Twisted Metal: Black; Twisted Metal 4; Twisted Metal: Small Brawl; Treasure Planet; and War of the Monsters

The injunction against Sony is suspended pending Sony's appeal, according to the full text of the two court filings posted by an Engadget reader.

Update: Business Week's covering the story now too.

[via Engadget]

Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)

josh @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

that's insane.

Gary! @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

wow.

Ryuukuro @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

Ditto wow. The heat the PSP is generating is a godsend for them right now. It won't save them from this situation but it will definitely buffer the blow. Just think about how it would be if the PSP were a complete dud--or if it used vibration technology!

I'm a Nintendo fan and I'm not hot on megacorps like Sony but even I feel bad for them. Maybe if they were more like EA...

Zeo @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

This is their fault. They knew this could happen.

MS took the smart way out. Sony is stubborn.

Sony right now reminds me of Nintendo N64-era: cocky and stubborn. It will cost the first place in the console race, I think.

namor7 @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

Crazy. So where does this leave Nintendo? As in, they have a rumble feature too.

Jason77 @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

Nintendo's Gamecube uses its own design, not a copy of Immersion Corps, so I think they are ok as far as this is concerned.

This will probably never hold up anyway, Sega had the patents on moveable 3D camera viewpoints in Games, now everyone uses it.

Zeo @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

Nintendo uses a different technology, most likely.

Jed Merrill @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

This is great! Now they need a class action suit for all of us whose PS2's broke in the first two weeks due to shoddy construction--especially the bad lasers that stop reading DVD's or blue discs.

If you can't tell, I'm a little angry at Sony. Cheap stuff in nice packages is bad business.

Jed Merrill @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

Incidentally, the PSP does not seem to be selling as well as hyped. Read this article:

http://www.yorkregion.com/yr/newscentre/erabanner/story/2667519p-3092013c.html

JaXs @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

again i say "Ha ha"

P.S. this is just priceless

Brian @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

Jed Merill #8, hmm why does that article quote the system as retailing at 300$s?

Also, how many did they sell then? pre-rder 10 of 12? sounds good lol.

they wrote this "Sony distributor. It provided just 12, however, and 10 of those were already spoken for from pre-orders by the time his doors opened."

Alex K. @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

it's probably saying the console costs $300 because it did at the time of the original lawsuit.

i'm guessing that nintendo and microsoft use a different technology since nintendo has had rumble since 1996 and hasn't been sued over it. plus microsoft has had force feedback joysticks from about the same time.

PSP definatly can't save sony from this situation since it doesn't make any money yet.

just like i thought, sony is going down in the next generation of games. the competition was already getting much more serious. the xbox was a rushed PC box, and the gamecube right now only appeals to younger kids and doesn't have online play. xbox's size/cost cutting, halo 3, and nintendo's revolutionary whatever the heck it is will likely take a huge bite out of the playstation 3 (which will probably cost more, too)

eXOBeX @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

This is absolutely brilliant. Sony don't give a stuff about their customers, so this is VERY richly deserved.

Posted Mar 27, 2005, 11:09 PM ET by Ryuukuro:
"The heat the PSP is generating is a godsend for them right now."
I thought battery life was the problem with PSPs rather than heat generation - or is it both? :)

Laurens Holst @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

But how long does the Dual Shock controller exist, really? Afaik it dates from the PS1 time... what�s that, 1995?

Why object to it and wave with patents *now*, 10 years later?

Also, 90 million sounds like a rediculous amount. How can you invest so much in the development of something so - well, I wouldn�t call it basic or trivial, but it hasn�t exactly sprung from the mind of a genius? I mean, that�s a shitload of money.

Bah, I hate patents.

~Grauw

Geekzapoppin @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

Patents, when used properly as in this case, are there to protect persons and entities that have invested a lot of time, effort, and money into a product or idea from others who would use that idea, etc. without proper compensation. Sony has known for some time that this other company owned the patent for force feedback and chose to fight it in court instead of settling like MS did. They lost. Now they have to pay.

looker @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

I cannot believe how people are calling this the end of Sony- if you don't understand lawsuits, since Sony appealed to the higher court, they can still sell PS2s for now. And even if they were to have an unfavorable verdict, they could always opt for a settlement before a decision is made. I mean, come on people, do you think Sony would be that stupid to let a cash cow like the Playstation console go to waste just for some lawsuit?

The decision was made in the US district court. If Sony is taking the course to the US High Court as the article stated, it's going to take them months to reach a decision, if not a year or two. By then, Sony might pull the trigger on PS3 a bit early, but it's too soon to tell. Also, the general public can't get an indication on whether Sony or Immersion will win because at this point, whatever evidence they may or may not have against each other will be restricted to the court.

kevin @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

At least this lawsuit is legitimate. None of that speculative "causes kids to be violent" bull.

funkonaut @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

Good thing I bought my slim PS2 and God of War before they're pulled from shelves! GOW rocks!

Some Random Lurker @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

Heh. Well at least Sony's got the balls to stand up to some bullshit patent laws. Lets be honest. Anybody can patent any idea general enough to be used in the future. They don't deserve shit. Come on, just look at how many people are lawyers today. Nothing but a bunch of fucking leeches. I for one, am glad Sony's doing this. May open up a new playing field where the law does what it should and uses common sense rather than listen to some corrupt politician or lawyer. Wishful thinking though :(.

As Henri Frederic stated, "What we call little things are merely the causes of great things; they are the beginning, the embryo, and it is the point of departure which, generally speaking, decides the whole future of an existence. One single black speck may be the beginning of a gangrene, of a storm, of a revolution." More power to Sony.

Black Sheep @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

If this kinda crap keeps up, no one will be able to produce anything 'cause everything will be patented.

Patents are BS. People deserve money for what they produce, not what they can think others will produce.

evild @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

I couldn't care less if Sony (or any other manufacturer) never made another controller with vibration technology. It doesn't do anything for the gaming experience. I don't even perceive the vibrations anymore. Think about. Would you even notice if they stopped making games with the vibration feature?

SetupWeasel @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

Ha! I've been waiting a long time to hear Sony fans have to defend outrageous claims of impending doom.

It's a good thing Nintendo invented the rumble pack before all this. ^_^

ishma @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

The article says the PSP is retailing for $350, which is the retail cost in canada

B. Rad the Dad @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

I am not familiar with people referencing to MS's "smart move" as opposed to "stubborn" Sony. What did MS do? Link if possible.

B. Rad the Dad @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

I am not familiar with people referencing to MS's "smart move" as opposed to "stubborn" Sony. What did MS do? Link if possible.

DJ P @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

24: They sued MS, but MS settled rather than fight. Incidently, MS is now one of Immersion's major shareholders.
Also, while I am of the belief that the patent system is drastically in need of reform, this is quite possibly an occasion where the system is working (hear me out):
1. Its not a pie-in-the-sky patent - immersion have been making force feedback stuff for years (they do some arcade stuff, and logitechs among others) - Sony took an idea that was being used as the foundation of a range of at the market products, and copied it.
2. They didn't wait ten years before contacting sony to ask for licencing. First there was several years of negiotiating, then the lawsuits start (and lawsuits can take a loooong time in this sort of thing, especially if the players involved have deep pockets)

looker @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

Gamespot has more details on this-
http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/03/28/news_6121137.html

Turns out Microsoft paid somewhere betwee $25-30 million for the settlement, and Sony will have to pay a licensing fee to Immersion while they are selling PS2s and the games involved in the lawsuit during the appeal.

A smart move by Sony would be downright buying Immersion, killing the lawsuit immediately.

andy @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

that be a whole lot of bullshit. sony's the best! infringe? fuck you immersport thing. sony is the oly company that actually make very good consoles. PSP might have not sold because u have to make the price at least $220 not $249.

all the games dont hurt my fingers. other companies, stop trying to steal sony's money u just cant help it that they have better business they have it because they are smart u guys aren't.

GUESS WHAT THE not the sony companie

U SUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! desperate mofos

[Ed note: added punctuation to make this somewhat readable.]

Gerby @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

What most people don't realize is the 90 million lawsuit it a drop in the bucket for Sony, they have a revenue of 69.34 Billion dollars a year. Even if Immersion gets the full amount it's results in 0.13% of their revenue. If Sony wanted they could keep this in court so long they could literally kill Immersion through legal fees. Immersion has a revenue of 20 million a year so if they get even 20 million in a settlement they'd probably shit their pants.

Odds are Sony will either give them a smaller settlement, keep them in court till they go bankrupt, or simply start buying up all their branchs and eventually Immersion itself.

Philip Wesley @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

Amazing how stupid Sony fans can be over this. -_-

Immersion invented force feedback controls and patented them. Nintendo thought of using force feedback in console game controllers and owns that patent. In the Nintendo patent, they licensed the idea from Immersion. There are different kinds of patents. In Nintendo's case, it is like Immersion invented the light bulb and Nintendo put the light bulb in a lamp. At E3, we'll see Nintendo putting that light bulb in the DS. Should be interesting. You'll be able to FEEL the game, not just touch it. Picture a brick wall, you break the brick wall with the stylus and you can feel it breaking as you touch it. Not to worry, Nintendo already put out a patent to cover that too. (The new patent still references Immersion though.)

Other companies like Nubysoft, Nyko, Madcatz, Apple, etc. all license haptic feedback devices from Immersion. When Wario Ware Twisted comes out, that motor in there is licensed from Immersion. Microsoft tried to skirt around the company by attempting to pull a fast one with the Xbox controller. They were caught and ended up paying to settle the lawsuit, purchased a little stock in the company as a sign of goodwill, and ended up paying for the license. Licensing Immersions tech is a flat fee for most companies. Nyko spent a couple HUNDRED and licensed the tech. Sony attempted to skirt around the company with the Dual Shock and have been fighting with Immersion since before the release of the Dual Shock.

This is Sony trying to use the size of their company to hurt people. While I have no problem with large companies, I do not like to see them try and step on smaller companies by STEALING other companies technology. This is comparable to -say- Madonna stealing a song written by a small artist out in Kentucky and saying she wrote the song. That is not fair, is it? While the lawsuit's current status and damage is the result of some serious bile between the two companies, it is not without merit. I'm siding with Immersion on this one. Sorry, Sony, you been stealing from the demon and you got caught. And no, I didn't make up that lyric.

JS @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

This is just reall dumb

Sassan Atbaei @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

just plain stupid, why did they sure Sony in 2002? Couldnt they sue Sony when Psone was out? And someone told me that Microsoft owns half of immersions shares.

scionis @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

It's just greedy corporations sueing other greedy corporations for money... and sadly, WHAT ABOUT PS2 GAMERS?!! PS2 is the best system out there... wtf is going to happen to us, the gamers? I will definitely join the strike that is no doubt going to occur if Sony is ordered to no longer export PS stuff. I will buy contraband! I will move to Japan!

No... wait... I can't speak/read/understand/write Japanese... hmm... that will pose a hindrance...

*sigh* WTF CARES?!! JUST GIMME PS GOODNESS!

eXOBeX @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

Best system out there? Don't make me laugh!

It MAY have the best games, but I fail to see how a console which is not only outperformed by the Xbox but has a ridiculously high failure rate (even the PStwo burns out its laser mech coils, and that's the TWELFTH VERSION of PS2) can be regarded as the best!

Sony aren't out to make friends, they're out to make money. They deserve neither.

john @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

SCEA's deep pockets will keep this in court for years and will never hurt them, as far as customers and gameplay go in any real way. And I wonder about all those madcatz devices that vib too? And don't X-box Vibe too????

Sara @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

ARE THEY INSANE?

Docta4u @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

My only question is this. Why after so long is the company just now doing something? And what is the big deal anyways? Didn't ps1 have dual shock controlers.. i mean come on. Its just another company trying to capitalize on another company. Sorta like what happended to wwf..which lost its naming rights and was forced to change it to wwe... so come on

nicscool @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

This is pathetic.
1. I paid 300 bucks for this console.
2. I paid 50 bucks for games.
3. The most damage this doing is to the actul gamers. THE PLAYSTATION WILL NEVER AND I MEAN NEVER BE DREAMCASTED AWAY!!!

Prophecy @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

I think sony should have just settled. They are dragging this thing out and it's becoming a dangerous thing that could mean big losses for Sony.

Joe @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

ya xbox has vibrating controllers but its very diff. in operating then the ps2's. i've modded so many xbox controllers, and ps2 controllers they use a diff type of motor >.<

Sunder @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

i think microsoft put immersion up to this to try to kill sony's reputation

i think sony should either drag this out in court till immmersion goes bankrupt or just buy the whole dam company and all its branches

madrebel @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

immersion stfu
sonys created something good out of something that no other group has done. they took an idea and improved on it shut up, take ur lawyers and crawl under the rocks u all came from bA@#$ds
u get ps2 banned and try to take it away from all of us through a recall, i really hope u like havin flying pigs for dinner
if u do win my system will stay with me and ill buy imports and mods SO F@#K OFF

madrebel @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

ryan @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

you people dont even read..why didnt immerson sue sony with the ps1? easy, if you "read" it says that they were tryin to settle it out of courts, sony gave them the big fuck off so immerson said " you wanna play that way? fine your sued" oh and nintendo came out with the rummble pack first, i have one of the first year ps1s, it has no dual shock, sony jumped on this wagon when star fox came out. if only they paid to use the tec, none of this would of happend, its there fuckin fault

magusss @ Dec 18th 2005 9:06PM

well, it all depends on chronology. what we think is strange that after 10 years from the stealing of immersion's tech we have a immersion sueing sony. look at those two situations:
1 - immersion couldnt get any settlement with sony, but they tried for a long time, so this (sue) is the only solution left for them
2 - bill gates bought immersion and now he's trying to put a stick into sony's ass to get more space for himself on the console market. and more money ofcourse, 'cause its the only thing he cares of :( ,definitely NOT the players.
in this hole situation its hard to say what is all albout. and when it is so, it means that is all about money. NOW: who can earn the most money out of this situation? immersion (about 20-90 mln$)? sony (the same amount)? or MS (bigger share in console market and whole game industry; its even hard to judge the amount of money they could gain on this case , but its surely far more than some shitty 90mln$)? think about the real reason behind this case - CA$H.