Selling violent games to minors now really illegal in Michigan

Protecting our children must be everyone’s top priority… This is a common-sense law that provides parents with the tools they need to protect their children from the effects of violence and graphic adult content.
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Protecting our First Amendment rights is pretty damn important, also. Parents need store clerks fined and/or jailed for selling a game to a 15-year-old as a "tool?" Sounds more like parents need an excuse to do anything but PARENT. This sort of grandstanding crap always bums me out. If Granholm is so concerned about protecting kids, why isn't she crying out for ratings on BOOKS? Because finally people would call it for what it is: censorship. 'Nuff said.

Amen, brother.

I live in MI too. Fuck Granholm. This is rediculous. There is a system in place already to protect your kids, but you have to fucking participate. Heavens no, the parent has to HELP RAISE THEIR OWN CHILD. This is a really bad step for the industry. Next step will be "no games can have any excessive violence", follow by "no sexual references in video games". Maybe not anytime soon, but by 2020 things will suck.

Also, the really dumb part about this law... You have to be 18 to buy mature games now, not 17+ as the rating suggests. I really think that it's rediculous that you can turn on TV and see violence on every channel(which a kid can do for free, who gives them money to buy violent games?). God I really hate America sometimes. I think I need to right this bitch a letter.

"This is a common-sense law that provides parents with the tools they need to protect their children from the effects of violence and graphic adult content."

Yes, there certainly are some tools involved.

I'm sure you've realized that you don't come into all of your constitutional rights until you are an adult so this really doesn't infringe on those rights in any important way. If you're an adult you can still buy whatever you want without hassle. I'm not usually an advocate of appeasement but really what do I care that 13 year old Johnny can't play Grand Theft Auto? If this makes the parents happy fine. Little Johnny will either have to convince his parents that he is in fact mature enough so that they'll buy it for him or he'll have to pay his big brother to do it. Yawn, who cares?

It's Ridiculous, not Rediculous and it's also write not right, Christopher. Just thought that I'd point that out.

Why don't they go all the way for children under 12 can't buy games for teens? wouldn't that make as much sense?

Now sales for M rated games are gonna drop too much. I mean, GTA players are mostly kids, same thing applies for Halo, Resident Evil, Mortal Kombat, etc. Thanks to that, companies will depend on parents willingness to purchase games for adults for their children, and the industry will get hurt for that, and now not even adults will be able to play really long games because there will either be not enough money to make huge games, or they will be more expensive. Of course, half of the gamers aren't children, but a lot are. This is retarded. I hope she chokes. To death.

Sloopydrew...

A-freakin-men dude.

E-mailed her. Anyone else on here I'd suggest doing the same to your governor. I know the industry wrote into Arnold for California not to pass the law. You almost have to admire the irony of pleading that to someone made famous by becoming an action star in violent films...
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My letter to Jennifer went like this.

"I think it's really rediculous that you signed and passed the law making it illegal to sell violent video games to minors. There was already a system in place to moderate what kids took home, it just required the parents to BE parents. I mean, if a kid goes up to the store with $50 to purchase a video game, where did he get the money? Doesn't it fall on the parents to watch what their child purchases? Because it not, they have a lot worse things to worry about their children buying, like marijuana, weapons, or condoms for pre-marital sex. Easing the job of parenting is just going to further relieve the parents from raising their child. For example, now parents will feel it's alright for their child to just go buy any video game and not have to worry what they buy, and won't participate in the child's life or experiences regarding such, as opposed to the responsible parent who plays through the game with their child, or at least checks it out for themself.

I'm also confused as to how this will do anything? Video games show violence in an animated sense(not to mention nine out of ten times in a fantasy setting), yet I can turn on my TV and find multiple realistic violent TV shows. Children can access television without any adult moderation or money. Television has very noticable levels of sexual references, depictions, as well as excessive violence every day. I think going after video games just because it's a smaller(yet growing) industry is pretty low and rediculous. I mean, books don't have any ratings(ESRB for games was already in place), and can be purchased by anyone for a much cheaper price. They depict through words, acts much more heinous than any video game I've ever played.

I'll end with simply saying that I'm greatly disappointed with the passing this law. Many more assanine lawsuits will be placed with this law as their crutch, for no other reason than it's the American way."

Sloopydrew, you hit the nail on the head. All the government is doing is covering their own tracks. They should be inforcing the law on the children's parent or gaudrian, not the stores. It should be illegal for a parent to buy an M-AO game for their child, not for the industry to sell a "violent game". So what, when I have kids, my kids aren't going to be able to play Street Fighter 2020? Rediculous.

”Protecting our children must be everyone’s top priority… This is a common-sense law that provides parents with the tools they need to protect their children from the effects of violence and graphic adult content.”

What I'd like to see is a law that aims to protect people from violence by treating people with problems and sublimating the violent urges into something useful, like building up rundown areas and the like. But hey, what do I know, right?

Wish you pointed that out earlier, Chris Clark. Ridiculous looks strange to me for some reason, but good to know for future endeavors.

Sean O,
"I'm not usually an advocate of appeasement but really what do I care that 13 year old Johnny can't play Grand Theft Auto?"

You don't realize how things are going to snowball after this? It's not "mature games" only, it's violent video games. As in Street Fighter(previously marked 13+ by ESRB ratings) is now only purchasable by someone 18+. I can honestly see a few lawsuits popping up of parents who let their kid buy something like Final Fight for GBA... You say GTA3, which is the obvious cause of this, but that's also the most extreme case. Who says Final Fantasy XII isn't violent? I mean, it revolves around you killing things. Some clerk will sell it not really thinking it's violent, then the parent will be outragged, and badness will ensue. I'm sure it'll be a definite blow to the industry too, otherwise they wouldn't be pleading with Arnold not to pass it in CA.

God... This really fucking sucks.

I doubt Schwarzenegger would pass the law in California to make it illegal to sell violent games to minors. He's like the father of violence. :P

Wait... So what's this mean for arcades? Will those have 18+ sections in order to get to House of the Dead, Tekken, SvC Chaos, Metal Slug, or countless other games that aren't just Dance Dance Revolution and skeeball?

"What about Donkey Kong? Don’t animals have rights, too?"

Um, technically it was the ape that did most of the damage in that game, throwing barrels at the head of what appears to be a human being - albeit a short one. Not to mention the kidnapping and molestation of poor Pauline.

The language of the statute certainly seems broad enough to cover everything from RPGs to sports games and every action game in between.

And Sean O: 1L starts here.

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/cgi-bin/getcase.pl?navby=case&court=us&vol=354&invol=476

My governor isn't doing anything yet (thank God). Of course, I'm in West Virginia, and if every other state does it, we will too.

This is just utter bullshit. Doesn't any parents notice the ESRB? Any GameStop or even Wal-Mart I go into has big signs telling you about the ESRB. But no, it is the game industry to blame, or even the retailers. Arnold was just doing this crap because he knows these self-centered, dumbass parents will be happy if he blames violent games for the destruction of our youth. Its not like these damn politicians actually shop in the common game stores. If they have, they would notice that parents/guardians don't give a fuck when it comes down to it. I saw a 5 year old boy with his grandmother buy GTA and the woman didn't even think twice. You should have seen the look on the retailers face!

God forbid its the parents fault. God forbid they will even admit their mistakes. Parents will just go along with it to make themselves feel like better people. Makes me want to leave America...

This is the email I sent to the Governor. I also called her office and read it over the phone:

I would like a list of the "effects" Governor Granholm claims violent and sexual content in video games has on minors to be posted on the Governor's website. I would also like evidence -- not speculation -- showing how violence in our young is specifically related to the amount of violent video games that they play, rather than bad parenting, bad education, bad Government etc. etc. If this is not provided, it's obvious the Governor is merely using this as a political issue. Why hasn't she called for a rating system to be implemented on novels? Lots of young people read Stephen King and his work is FAR more offensive than ANYTHING in any video game out there. I think it's because it wouldn't gain her any political points with soccer moms and it would finally open people's eyes to what this really is: Censorship.

Man, it's a good thing I live in canada.

Although technically a store can't sell M rated games to minors (I got carded just for buying God of War, WTF? I'm 24), consorship isn't the biggest concern here. Not even piracy.

Games are a form of entertainment, and entertainment "can" be a form of diluted art. Very diluted, but an art form none the less. So there's not a whole lot of push to get a "handle" on this up north.

Rockstar screws up once and everybody suffers... But of course, that's the way I TA, and I like it.

Exactly n8. NFL Blitz is now a 18+ game. Final Fantasy games are now 18+. Final Fight, 18+. Street Fighter, 18+. Megaman surely is, you fire lazers. Tekken, Virtual Fighter, Soul Calibur, 18+.
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"Um, technically it was the ape that did most of the damage in that game, throwing barrels at the head of what appears to be a human being - albeit a short one. Not to mention the kidnapping and molestation of poor Pauline."

Actually, the story of DK is that Mario abused him(DK is his pet), and so he got angry and stole his girlfriend. So it's more like Mario beats animals, and DK gets portrayed as the villian.

That's so sad. I don't think I ever realized that. I've hated DK all these years, when he was really the victim all along. :(

Technically, DK is butt naked. Yet, no politicains attack the real problem. What about Italians too? Look at the stereotype that is Mario. Why don't you attack Nintendo, they are full of immorality?

FYI: For all the fanboys, that was sarcasm.

Your tax dollar at work!

What!? Our troops need better equipment in Iraq? F*&% them, we need to resolve this video game eat babies issue in homeland first.

How about illegalizing having babies by stupid people? that should work better.

Protecting YOUR children should be YOUR highest priority. I don't have any fucking children and, if I did, it would be MY responsibility to protect them. I hate people.

"The new law applies to children age 17 and younger..."

I didn't know children were still children when they were 17. Do they think guys over 12 are stupid? Even guys over seven aren't stupid enough to take games seriously. THEY KNOW, otherwise why do "adults" (people over 17) know there is something wrong to do in real life what games do?

I mean, poor bastard if you are 16.5 years old because you can't play games for 17 years old. Bummer.

I played mortal kombat 1 in the arcades since I was 8-9. My parents bought me Killer instinct 1 and MK3 when I was 11 and 2 when I was 12. I've bought Resident Evils long before I was 18 or 17. And several others. And I'm perfect. And my brother which is three years younger than me bought all Grand Theft Autos before he was 18, and he played all the games I just mentioned above with me. Nothing is wrong with us. Almost all of the friends I have that are my age played those games with me, or in the arcades or at home. I mean, our generation, the generation that keeps buying all that shit and helps jobs get created started playing "mature" games when we were "too young". And we're perfect. In fact, we are much more imaginative than our parents thanks to that. We are much more mentally dexterous than older generations thanks to that. Stupid America, that's why you are in such deep shit.

In fact, why don't you rate Dragonball Z for "18 year olds and over" only? That way little guys won't have to see arms or body parts getting chopped off... oh wait, you already censored it. Good riddance.

what do they want... what do you want... where is there room for compromise?

What are the positives out of this?

If you want to help them see why this is damaging, you may want to think some better answers than :"This is retarded. I hope she chokes. To death." (not trying to pick on you, b)

I do see how this might help in a few kids from being exposed to and execute violence.
I also see the other side... I am not just talking about censorship, but child services. Imagine some angry and selfish social worker that wants to take kids away from their parents for whatever reason. If they can prove that the parent bought, say, a Starwars game for their kid... could that evidence then be used to take the kids away because the parent gave in and bought what they thought was a decent game for their kid for grading? When does the state have absolute power over parents?

I see that everyone is angry here, but we have a chance to come up with real reasons, and then submit them to the right people.

This angry bashing is only giving those people the reasons to show why gamers are not what they want their states kids growing up to become.

Do you really want them to win? Are you ready to do more than just rant?

"This angry bashing is only giving those people the reasons to show why gamers are not what they want their states kids growing up to become."

You know what I don't want my kids growing up to become? People who think they have the right to tell others what to do with their fucking lives. What's worse, really? What kind of empathetic bullshit are you going to play on me when you don't have any rights and everything is completely out of your control? None, because you won't have a fucking voice.

Peter, offer us solutions and good reasons so we can contact the right authorities and tell them in words that they will understand why this is wrong.

I am just trying to get you to think about what you can do to get your voice heard, not tell you to fall down and let them give it to you for the rest of your life.

Offer you solutions? That's just it - you people don't understand the basic framing of this "problem" is entirely in their control - and they just spin it to the fucking dirt.

Abortion, Video Games, it's all the same goddamn thing. We aren't getting fucked over because we can't think of the right 'answers to the problem' but because the problem is humanity and people aren't comfortable with that.

So they are easily suckered into beleiving these laws and practices are justified and "to protect us" (from ourselves?), when really we need to be protected from these kinds of idiots who attempt to erode our civil liberties under the guise of some bullshit crusade every 10 years. Hearing people deride those who disagree with this because they aren't offering any "solutions" to the "problem" makes me sick because you're missing the entire point and playing right into their games.

*nods to Peter*

Can anybody say unconstitutional?

That's right, I knew you could.

Your comments: America is going to the shitter.

Seriously.. unconstitional laws are going to start being passed alot more and more nowadays..America will go to the shitters, just like Germany did in the 1930s, with a roaring applause.

Get used to it or move to Canada.

:D

No! Don't move to Canada. We're full!

Peter it sounds pretty hopeless. I hope you at least get to play the Xbox360 and PS3 before you lose everything.

If you want to know some good cities to live in Canada, I will share what I know...

If it is illegal for minors to rent R rated movies (and it is, it's a matter of it's enforced or not), then it should be illegal for minors to rent/buy video games that they are not "old" enough for.
A rating system is needed. It is flawed. But it is the best we have.
Just because there is video game legislation does not mean it's stupid.

"If it is illegal for minors to rent R rated movies (and it is, it's a matter of it's enforced or not)"

Actually, not so much. The rating system was created so that the Government wouldn't have to make LAWS preventing children from seeing "bad" movies. The MPAA rating system is completely voluntary and any store in America can rent anyone of any age an R rated film. They've made it SEEM like it's illegal, ever since Columbine. When I was a kid, they never carded ANYONE. I just stepped up, bought my ticket to A Nightmare on Elm Street 3, or whatever the hell I was wanting to warp my mind with, sat down and enjoyed the show.

"If it is illegal for minors to rent R rated movies (and it is, it's a matter of it's enforced or not), then it should be illegal for minors to rent/buy video games that they are not "old" enough for."

I totally agree with you. Game legislation should match movie legislation.

So, I looked into it, and it's not illegal to rent R-rated movies to minors. According to your argument, then, this legislation should be struck down. Glad we're in agreement.

i liked when bush defended the makers of doom and told people to stop blaming video games and be better parents. this is bulls*@t!!!

Mabe people should learn to teach there kids that it is just a flipin game and not real life. I grew up watching rated R movies when i was 4 and playing any game i wanted, granted there was nothing like GTA at the time of NES, but thats above the point I'm still not running around hacking people appart with Freddy Crugers gloves.

Teach your kids the difference between games and real life! and there would be no issues with any of this

holy crap, I know no one here is going to beleive me, because if i where in your position i wouldnt either, but this is partially the fault of a friend of mine. His dad is a really high up police officer so they basically bribed him (the cops son/my friend) to go into a game store as an undercover cop and try to buy one of the games on a list of "innapropriate games" that they had. As a reward, he got to keep the game, for free. He ended up getting Doom 3 for Xbox.

If i wanted to i could release tons of info on him and he would probably admit he did it too. I recently moved out of michigan though so i cant strangle him (Ahh good times in michigan, right near that meijer where i got Halo 2 early!)

Well,like I said,videogames have effected me for the worse playing them alot as a kid.

Now when people upset me I roundhouse kick them and then turn into a dragon and eat their upper bodies all because of playing Mortal Kombat as a kid.

Yes, its really illegal. Until the Supreme Court overturns it like they've done with the same laws from other states. The Supreme Court must be really tired of repeating itself. Yes, videogames are protected speech. Yes, depictions of violence are protected speech. No, depictions of violence are not obscene. No, you cannot keep these blantantly unconstitutional laws on the books.

Soon there will be restrictions as to how long you can play video games. No wait, they are already doing that in China. :/