Armored Core 4 trailer comparison results and analysis

I'm sorry Joystiq but this is the lamest piece of pseudo-science journalism I've seen in a long time.

One of the greatest strengths of western society is... the University, and yet that vast pool of accumulated thought, logic and wisdom has clearly not reached the editors here.

Oh well.

Are you serious?

here come the fanboys...

eh #1, if you think that this "vast pool of accumulated thought, logic and wisdom" hasn't reached anyone but you, you might as well not come here again and read about their editorials.

It was an entertaining article, just about half of the people who comment on these articles needs to grow up. It is a GAMING news site.

Now, it's obvious who the fanboy is #1.

Anyhow, I do have to say, considering they're both low quality, it really isn't a very good poll at all, as "interesting" as the results are.

FWIW, the only console of the last gen I own is the Xbox.

Wow Totally retarded article alert.

JoyStiq: these were pre-rendered trailers; they don’t imply anything about the graphical prowess of either system...............

JoyStiq: By all accounts, the PlayStation 3 absolutely should have more graphical horsepower than the Xbox 360.
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Explain to your readers how 2 PRE-RENDERED trailers are meant to have an edge over the other?............ they are PRE-RENDERED.


JoyStiq: and will cost approximately two limbs and a virgin princess.
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Wow youse sure you shouldnt be writing for Time Magazine? thats the stupidest thing to be posted on this site........ or is it?


JoyStiq: However, we’ve also heard varying reports that the PS3 will be notoriously difficult to program for.
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Another Gamestop employee?


Joystiq: How many developers will be willing to spend the time and effort—speak nothing of the resources—of taking a game built for the Xbox 360 and bringing it to fully realize its potential on the PS3?
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How many were willing to make games that were built on PS2 then ported to X Box look better?...... so your answer would probly be, the same amount as this gen.


And let’s not forget Nintendo, who are reportedly making ease of development one of their top priorities. If this is true, then what’s to stop developers from initially creating a title for the Revolution and merely porting it to the 360 and PS3 with some minor tweaks, enhanced textures, and an improved framerate?
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Not to mentioning have to redo the whole game play mechanic and control interface.????


We all know that the PS3 has potential, but just how many developers will be bold enough to turn that potential into reality?
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As many as want to, same devs that did this gen no doubt, so Criterion, Konami, Namco etc etc would.


Oh and the Comaprison is quite stupid aswell all the fanboys would have just gone to IGN and watched both, seen which one is 360 or PS3 and then watched these and voted for the one they knew was PS3 or 360, or they would have just listened to other fanboys.

Whats up with not reporting on some of the abismal scores X Box 360 games are getting? makes 360 look bad so cant report it?

God I love the console war penis measuring contests don't you?

Please repeat after me: "My choice of console and its relative success and popularity do not affect my sense of self worth and in no way can self-validation arise from owning the most successful console"

Looks like anyone who is buying a console for prerendered content has had the 'what console to get' decision made for them

"My choice of console and its relative success and popularity do not affect my sense of self worth and in no way can self-validation arise from owning the most successful console"

Those two vids were too close to call without somekind of higher level of eyesight. Either one could of been seen as 'better'. In this case it was the Xbox360.

What it does prove however is that there will slight to no difference between the consoles this time around and it looks like fanboys will be fanboys- Crying about a biased on a webblog?! If you care to read the majority of news from the past two months, the alarming amount of times disgruntly pre-teens have accused Joystiq of favouring console X is obscene. How can they be biased against all consoles?

Buy whatever the fuck you wan't and if you don't like an article don't read it...
I don't want a point by point analysis on how a piece of news is clearly wrong regardless of YOUR biased as a fan(boy). Let alone 'HEYS GUYS THIS CONPSOUL SUXS LOOADES!!'

So CGI trailers should not be used to infer that the actual game will look like so what have we seen of th eps3 then?

As for th emention of games leading on the revolution then porting to the ps3/360 wont happen

It's a fact, being here for awhile, Joystiq is seriously biased in the next gen wars.

They are sounding more and more like MS advertisers if they don't start being FAIR with their articles.

I agree TOTALLY with D.

Well said R, someone else with a sense of reality and sanity.

Clearly this demonstrates that Joystiq is worse than Hitler and Stalin put together :)

Man, Jostiq just can't catch a break! I heard more flattering comments on Al-Jazeera.

Joystiq are you phucking Bill or dating him... cause you sound like a Microsoft fanboy that is in heat for Bill...

Guys,

Take your time to read the article.

1. The results are based on VOTES from all of you.

2. We state very clearly: "Of course, as many of you were keen to point out, these were pre-rendered trailers; they don’t imply anything about the graphical prowess of either system."

This is the best article all week.

In the end, the graphics between the two consoles will be similar if not the same, much to the dismay of Sony fans everywhere.

The real battle will be what you do with the software, not how it looks.

Maybe Nintendo has the right idea after all.

Wow, First of Joystiq keep up the good work. I find you always have great articles and informative information. I cant believe these people who come on your site and bash you for an article they voted on! Get over it PS3 lovers, Xbox 360 is the system of choice.. Not because any CG movie but because they are innovative with their first party development!! Unlike sony who just comes out with the same games, Jack and Daxter 10 and Mental Gear 15....

Personally it DOESN"T MATTER, cause in 5 DAYS, I"M GETTING MY 360!!!!!!!

So, its a moot point until next Xmas when the PS3 comes out in North America.

games, games, games.....

The amusement I get from these entries arent that they are trying to stir up discussion between fanboys,but I love all the people who come out saying "OMG J0yst1q you guys just want a flamewar and LIKE TOTALLY just lost my respect"

If you don't like the way Joystiq does stuff then go somewhere else.Simple as that.

"Take your time to read the article.

1. The results are based on VOTES from all of you.

2. We state very clearly: "Of course, as many of you were keen to point out, these were pre-rendered trailers; they don’t imply anything about the graphical prowess of either system." "
I agree, people shoulda read the article to begin with and plus they voted for their favorite video clip, the one that got the most votes won. I dont see how its joystiq's fault.

first of all. prerendered CG means that the actual trailer was made using some other software package; not the console or the dev kits. therefore how can it be a measure of either consoles output? thats just like saying that the ffvii prerendered cutscenes are indicative of the graphical power of the ps1. any console can play a prerendered mpg.

this is not one game. not one thats ported over to the other to my knowledge. therefore its not an even measure. if you have two different games, then you obviously have two different artistic teams, capable of different levels of artistic talent.

joystiq, im sure that inciting these types of console wars drives up site hits and ad revenue, but come on... how about a lil bit of journalistic integrity? look up the scientific method in terms of experiments and comparisons. lets save the comparison battles until we see real-time gameplay or in-engine cutscenes of the same game on both consoles.

How funny people are quick to dismiss pre-rendered when it's 360 vs PS3, but when it's pre-rendered tech demos on the PS3, they're all like, 'yeah, that's exactly how gameplay will look'

Guys,

There's nothing wrong with having a DISCUSSION about the merits of various consoles.

We do not want war (and the flames that are implied by warfare). We ban people every single week for being flamey. Keep it cool and stick to the topics.

"My choice of console and its relative success and popularity do not affect my sense of self worth and in no way can self-validation arise from owning the most successful console" happy place happy place happy place....

This was an experiment people, he was merely showing you the observations. And by the way to whoever doesn't believe the PS3 is hard to develop for go ask Japanese developers who said, and I quote 'PS3 is Japanese for SEGA SATURN'

http://www.ps3today.com/Blogs/News/hqs/blr_647.aspx

and the PS2 was hard to develop for aswell, the only reason so many developers stuck with it was because PS2 was the first out (other than dreamcast) and the most people baught it. Its all about money, they could sell the most product on the PS2. I predict the 360 will win based soley that its comming out first, I wish it were Nintendo, but this is just what I think will happen. You guys have to realize that Sony got lucky with the PS2, they're timing was right and the Dreamcast bombed, they had a lot of time to gain speed ; don't you remember the PS2's were barely functional? Sony will not do well next gen. Apparently the Dev Kits are over heating as well.

Yea MS fan boys you are. Every MS article is speculating that the 360 is better, Every Sony article is that they are going down in Flames. Grow up and be fair to all of the systems.

The Gaystation Fanboys are really pissed!

The Gaystation Fanboys are really pissed!

The Gaystation Fanboys are really pissed!

@ #26:
I doesn't look like the mgs4 team is having too much trouble with ps3.

or do you still believe that's pre-rendered even though we've seen videos of them moving around the scene with a controller??

http://www.gametrailers.com/e3_2k5_ps3.php

sorry, but this poll was really stupid. i for one had already seen the trailers over at ign.com and new which one was supposedly from which system. so you know that the majority of the people that took this poll just voted for which one they wanted to look better even though they both looked the same

Chill out guys! Who gives a damn what is posted and what the topics are. Joystiq is not taking any console's side they just post whatever news they get. If you don't like it don't comment. That simple.

I feel bad for the guys at joystiq.
They post news and they are accused of being biased
Sony fanboys........Is it joystiqs fault that the news that comes out about sony is negative???

Also Microsoft is the only company right now with news so of course they are gonna post about them

You people need to relax, its not that serious

1) Has anyone actually RESEARCHED whether from software has actually said whether they are pre-rendered or not? Just because it looks too good to be true doesnt mean it is.

2) I use to believe joystiq was biased against MS, until I realized that there sarcastic tone is standard in the majority of their articles. The fact is they report what they here, obviously the guy who said they didnt report the scores of the 360 games doesnt read regularly as they posted them yesterday.

The fact remains joystiq will post PS3 2x more powerful because Sony said it. They will also post 360 equal because MS said it. They will post Ps3 more difficult to developer for and equal to 360 power because developers say it. Basically they will post most of what ever people say that appears to be news. Period.

3) as for the 360 game scores, please find scores from the Ps2 launch, then we will talk. The only console to release at launch a killer app was n64 with Mario 64 with a perfect 10, and dreamcast with sonic adventure in the high 9's.

Before you complain about the industry, learn the industry history you bunch of idiots.

Hmmm... Sonys playstation 3 console, with more cores to work with, and an advanced optical drive... Means longer hours and man power to create games... hmmm... must mean games will cost more ??? 70$ - $80 hmmm....let me shake the magic 8 ball...it saying, "out-look not so good !"

For 1, I am tired of hearing BS against Joystiq and their bias...

Something bad about Sony, "Joystiq hates sony"
Something bad about MS, "Joystiq hates MS"

Guess what, they are just reporting their findings, and it is personal opinion, you want to talk hatred?

Windows XP sucks, Xbox sucks, Xbox 360 will probably suck but I own one anyhow (won it)

Also, if anyone has paid any attention, most things done for the PS3 are started on PCs, which means that this trailer in NO way indicates potential, PS3 turns out to be a god machine and itll be cool (not as awesome as Revo though)

Oh and also, PRE-RENDERED!

Tales of Legendia, anime intro for PS2
Castlevania DoS, anime intro for DS

Oh sh*t they can both have anime intros? DS is as good as PS2!!!!!!! You want to sound dumb? Its no hidden knowledge that for the first time since they entered the market Sony wants to be the strongest graphically, they just chose a poor time with the revolution in gaming afoot.

The thing is, this survey is as Joystiq pointed out a joke, prerendered means sh*t in the long run, wait until you see a fully scripted, finalized, tweaked PS3 game, then the fanboys can comment.

"By all accounts, the PlayStation 3 absolutely should have more graphical horsepower than the Xbox 360. It’s been in development longer, is being released several months later"

Ben,
This is completely incorrect! The 360 has been in developement far longer than the PS3. Additonally, what gives you the impression that the PS3 should have more graphical horesepower? It certainly isn't the GPU, and God knows that cell hasn't proven to be any more powerful than 360's 3 cores so I fail to understand where you're coming from here.

this is funny. It was a blind test. Had the ps3 won then none of you would have commented. The fact is that most multi platform developers don't feel that there is much of a performance difference between the two. Ps3 only has an advantage in floating point calc. while 360 leads in integer(mispelled) calc. The cell chip is not a revolution and not that far advanced beyond current chip designs, besides what sony would like you to believe. There is a reason that Apple dropped the cell and no one else has picked it up. It's performance gains in some areas come at the cost of performance in other areas. Sorry to the fanboys but the next gen consoles will be closer than the last, and separated by programming not chip design. Your own votes just proved it. Don't blame joysiq, sometimes the truth hurts. At least your just a fanboy and your income doesn't depend on it. Relax, it's just games.

Sorry Paul but the PS3 HAS been in development for at LEAST twice as long as the 360. The xbox 360 project with IBM and ATI began approxiamtely 2 years ago while the cell project for the PS3 with toshiba and Sony collaborating on the cell processor. (consequently they are also battling over the next gen disc format which is also slted to be placed in the PS3, japanese companies are funny huh?) cell has been in development for -5 years, with the nvidia card recently added 1-2 years ago after sony realized they didnt have the gpu shader experience to use multiple cell configurations in the Ps3, which would have resulted in even the revolution appearing graphically superior thanks it it hardware shaders. Basically Sony had no choice but to take an "off the shelf" gpu or risk being made a fool of in this coming generation. So yes the PS3 is "technically" 2x more powerful than the 360 the same way the xbox is "technically" 12x more powerful than the ps2 (6.2 Gflops ps2 vs over 80 Gflops xbox) flops are a measure of operations per second thus "technically" the xbox can do 12x more calculation per second then the ps2, however the reality is these measurements are meaningless, sony knows it but crams it down fanboys faces and they swallow it up. So until fanboys acknowledge the xbox is 12x more powerful then the ps2, no one will believe the ps3 is 2x as powerful as the 360 as the unit for measurement is meaningless. The face is development costs vs market share will DEFINE this coming generation. Which ever console yields the highest profit for developers will win. Period. power, features, etc do not matter is developers are not making money. Right now, interms of strictly the economics in terms of costs, the Ps3 is not in a pleasent spot. Unless they capture siginificant market share like the ps2. They will have a hard time attracting any developers. As for the MGS4 dev. Please show me ONE PLAYABLE Ps3 game, just one. As you know the Ps3 is launch in "4 months from now" and not a single PLAYABLE game? There is a reason can you guess what it is?

It dosen't matter...first of all, both systems have almost equal, if not undistingushable, power. PS3 has more teraflops by 1. That equates to a little more graphical power. 360 uses a completely new way of handeling graphics with this ATI card and with the embedded DRAM, which technically can't be compared to anything on the market today. A prime example of how theyre almost equal is Sony's favorite, Kojima saying, and I quote "I could have done the same exact thing with the MGS4 trailer on the 360, but I chose Playstation." Kojima has more knowledge and experience with these systems more than any of us. For him to make a statement like that shoul d be enough proof. I can't wait to see the PS3 in action, but as of now, Sony needs to step their game up and stop making mistakes (like the meltdown of the first set of development kits!?) and also their famously fantastic statements.

absolutely correct kuroshi,

The Ps3 has a theoritical peak flop count of 2 Teraflops, however, using the same methods Sony used to calculate flop performance, (Sony essentially added the total peak theorical flops together which is far from accurate. Using the same methods to calculate the 360 flops, the 360 would have a theoritical flop measurement of 4Tflops, or 2x that of the Ps3. However flops are essentially meaningless in actual performance MS doesnt use those ridiculous specs. The Ps3 truely does have twice the flops performance however only 1/3 the interger performance, essentially making a trade off, which is a poor one for gaming as REAL TIME physics (collision detection, interactive objects, etc) are reliate on interger performance. GOOD AI as well, like AI found in Elder Scrolls (Radiant AI) is also dependant on integer calcs which is why Oblivion, and to a lesser extent Condemned will not be coming to the PS3, as it simple at this stage does not have the integer performance to play these games without a serious rewrite and optimization. That is not to say high floating point ops are useless they are great for graphical effects and NONE interactive physics, such as smoke, wind simulation, and clothing simulation. So in that aspect you will see excellent graphical effects on the Ps3. HOWEVER do not celebrate yet as the 360 gpu is a nice piece of hardware. if you use STRICTLY the numbers the 360 gpu can produce a peak of 9 trillion polygons vs the Ps3s 1.5, 500mhz x 48ALUS = 9T (360) vs 550mhz x 8 Vertex shaders = 1.5T . However 360 fans dont rejoice as this figure is ONLY obtainable with zero shader units, thus the 360 triangle rendering engine limits the gpu to only 1.5T vertices (1.5T conjoined polygons, or 500 separate polygons) The 360 however then has 40 ALUs usable for shading vs the ps3 24, even though it has a higher clock by 50mhz, the Ps3 gpu cant use that to compensate for the 360 having nearly 2x the usable shader units of the ps3 gpu. I wont even bring up the fact that the Ps3 has no decent frambuffer to do 720P let alone tout 120fps dual, 1080P screens. The Ps3 using the specifications sony themselves provided, doesnt no have the power to actually do that with any decent title. I have plenty more to say but this is enough for now, just shut up people until you learn alittle about the industry.

"as many of you were keen to point out, these were pre-rendered trailers..."

"By all accounts, the PlayStation 3 absolutely should have more graphical horsepower than the Xbox 360."


This is the most retarded thing I've read in ages. I thought you had quietly "forgotten" about this post, but instead you embarrass yourselves and bring it up again.

This article begs for the return of social eugenics.

38. Woh dude.

Have you guys every thought that maybe this poll was put in place to see exactly how many fanboys there were?

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the fanboys would check out the videos on IGN and see which one was their console. Since the videos were pre-rendered and looked very similar anyway (not to mention the poor quality), they didn't really show anything about which was better. Perhaps Joystiq knew this and wanted to see how many people would still vote for their favorite console regardless of the fact that the videos were not a valid comparison. Sounds like fun to me from Joystiq's perspective. I love terrorizing fanboys.

Oh yeah, I will be buying an Xbox 360 soon. I also have plans to buy a PS3 and a Revolution when they come out. I'm an equal opportunity gamer and go where the games are. The videos looked about equal to me and I still didn't care. As long as the games look good AND ESPECIALLY PLAY WELL, I'm a happy boy.

Joystiq is not biased in this article. They made a blind poll, we all voted, the results are in. I feel as though some avid Sony fans have realized that they voted for 360, and now have to find a loophole to justify this. An Ad homenim attack seems the best way to go about it.

Joystiq is not saying that the 360 will reign supreme, they have commented that although it would be possible for the PS3 to be more impressive than the 360, at this point, we are not seeing it. As if it really mattered.

It is interesting to note that bd(formerly b) and Mark B havn't stopped by to flame bandit et alii. Normally they're all over his butt like a priest. Hmm.

"Have you guys every thought that maybe this poll was put in place to see exactly how many fanboys there were?"

I think you're giving Joystiq too much credit. They've been on an anti-Sony tear recently, posting crap like "PS3 not to come out until 2007?" (which was an MS executive's FUD) and "PS3 not to play used games?", which was obviously idiotic flamebait.

They've been doing this for a couple of months at least and there have been *a lot* of posts like this. You can dig them up for yourself.

I read Joystiq because I like the real news they post, but some of the article posters have a serious beef with Sony, and it's wearing thin. I expect fanboys in the comments section, but even though this is a blog site, I still expect a little objectivity in the choice of topics, which certainly isn't the case these days.

Joystiq needs to consider what kind of site they want to be, because it's currently edging towards an anti-Sony, pro-MS advocacy site and it's becoming really lame.

If you know your gaming history and watched the release of the PSP then you can easily understand why the xbox represetative of EUROPE said they will not receive PS3s until 2007. European releases tend to be approximately 1 year after release in japan. You being a stupid american likely refused to read the article in its entirety to get an understanding of what was ACTUALLY being said.

Anyway you have zero information or news to contribute, only an opinion based on how you "FEEL" lol.

That being said, I am an american, I like 0 over ps3 due to the potential in its development environment. To me it has much more potential for making incredible games. Thats how i feel. the Fact it profit margin will determine who wins, period. Oh, and yes the initial 360 games suck and I am far under-impressed by Call of Duty 2. the reason is that I know and have SEEN what the 360 can actually do first hand so I can tell you with certainty the stuff being created for it right now WILL make you sh*t your pants. I dont care how much you love PS3. And yes, gameplay and tech demos are two entirely different animals so dont give me no MGS4/Killzone BS. Gears of War, and Huxley are real, playable and PROVEABLE. download the trailer for the 360 huxley because yes thats what it actually looks like playing on a 360

LMAO

I don't think i have ever seen Sony fanboys jump on an article with foam comming from their mouths like this one.

Holy shit, you guys are incredible. How is it Joystiq's fault that people voted in favor of the second video? I fail to see this answer.

Its ok guys, both systems will be amazing. Don't kill yourself because people voted for the ones you love to hate.