WoW 360 ain't gonna happen, says Blizzard
With a subscriber base of 6
million, World of Warcraft is the caliber of franchise that Microsoft is after. Well, maybe not anymore.
Blizzard COO Paul Sams has made his company's stance clear, stating today, "We do not have any plans to take
WoW to Xbox 360."Sams criticized the Xbox Live architecture for being too protected from outside influence. As such, he had his doubts about the prospect of Xbox 360 and PC gamers being able to share their experiences if a console version of WoW was ever released. However, Sams did admit that Blizzard isn't entirely opposed to developing for the Xbox 360 and believes that the MMO genre will blossom on consoles once developers overcome the limitations of the joypad.
See also: Guild Wars developer criticizes XBL business model
[Via Digg]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
bqtrain @ Mar 3rd 2006 4:58PM
"the MMO genre will blossom on consoles once developers overcome the limitations of the joypad."
I wonder if any of the Big 3 console manufacturers are focusing on this...
"Everybody's getting a Revolution." - Diggnation
obo @ Mar 3rd 2006 5:07PM
So EQ:OA with a USB keyboard just, uh, didn't happen?
SuicideNinja @ Mar 3rd 2006 5:08PM
See the comments to the linked joystiq blog entry. Most commenters were spot on.
I'll add:
Joypad? You don't have to use one. The 360 supports USB, as does the PS3. You can already use a mouse and keyboard with FFXI. However, using a controller is quite efficient for everything except for typing.
XBL is a bad model that doesn't support community? That's crap. Square's playonline is horrid, leaves you identified by a long impersonal number. XBL gives you one identity, and any features they want to add is a definite posibility. Even a non MMO like Halo2 has PLENTY of a community.
Sony's Online service isn't even a service. It's just a gateway to having a different account for each publisher and/or game. Annoying.
If an MMO was integrated with XBL properly, so what if MS gets a cut. They made a great online service that cuts out a lot of developer work. A XBL subscriber could sign in with their ONE username and agree to additional billing for MMOs. Easy = customers.
I definitely won't be playing MMOs until they are on consoles. Using a computer makes me feel like I'm at work. Even though my PC is plenty capable of gaming, I refuse to use it that way and I find it much less enjoyable. Why boot, log into Windows, launch my game, hope no software will conflict with my game, and buy new hardware every 6 months when I can pop in a disc sit down, and get playing. Only have to buy a new console every half-decade.
Zsavior @ Mar 3rd 2006 5:12PM
I find his stance healthy, honest and I really respect him for that. Computer gameing has made itself open for years to the use of joypads with mouses and key boards, but consoles have no been so supportive. The back lash originally seen when nintendo showed the revolutions controller had to be seen and documented by many computer game developers. How many people in the industry and outside of it was already harbinging nintendo dropped the ball, because it wasn't a regular game pad. Now those words are being rubbed in console gamers face and I suspect nobody will like the taste. Not that Xbox 360 Needs W.O.W, but it could have used a MMORPG of that calibur.
m3mnoch @ Mar 3rd 2006 5:14PM
it did. just. a keyboard in the living room sucks. just witness the massive success of phantasy star online.
when it comes, it'll have to be on a gamepad.
m3mnoch.
The1 @ Mar 3rd 2006 5:17PM
Watch.......
Chris @ Mar 3rd 2006 5:21PM
Yeah. the support for a KB isn't really there because a KB is pretty awkward for gaming. Then if you're using a "two hand" controller ... the KB becomes secondary ... so in order to overcome this, you need a mouse. But I guess this is where a 'revolution' type controller could overcome this ... at least in using some sort of "mouse in the air". The KB is still a bit awkward for couch play.
Chris @ Mar 3rd 2006 5:22PM
sorry, that first part is supposed to be 'awkward for CONSOLE gaming' ... missed that word.
rico @ Mar 3rd 2006 5:45PM
Thats good that they dont get it. Means less noobs asking if the can borrow gold of me
Todd @ Mar 3rd 2006 5:55PM
I have seen where Nintendo is working on voice recognition software that can detect your volume level or stress in you voice and type accordingly. Making the font larger or putting it in caps when appropriate. A microphone plugged into the Revolution remote might be the first control scheme that comes close to keyboard and mouse.
paris @ Mar 3rd 2006 5:56PM
Nintendo made a smart move in patending speech-to-text for games.
Hiro Protagonist @ Mar 3rd 2006 6:10PM
If they use it...
How many people are actually going to say L-O-L?
I know I will.
I really didn't expect to hear a different answer. I also don't expect WoW to come to the Revo (no matter how much I would like it to).
Unless they come up with a "mighty mouse" kinda thing...
truth of it @ Mar 3rd 2006 6:10PM
Controller limitations?
Yeah right, those usb ports work perfect for mouse and keyboard peripherals.
The REAL(and very valid) reason they don't want it on the 360 is because of the 360's core audience. Step into any lobby on the live service and you'll know exactly why. The immature, corrosive and pubescent enviroments that the 360 fosters is a direct result of marketing the console to 13 year olds through mtv(their primary marketing arena for the north american launch). I'm not saying all 13 year olds are gutter mouthed illiterate racist perverts; as matter of fact, a lot of this spew on the live service is from gutter mouthed illiterate racist perverts who happen to be well over the age of 18(physically only). My guess is that most of the children with more than half a brain(just like adults with the same meager sentience standard) managed to avoid the 360 like it was an aids contaminated nuclear landmine. Allowing these socially depraved and ignominous misfits who swarm the 360 populace into a game based off of complex player relationships(any mmorpgs really) is just asking for a disaster of epic proportions in relation to the rest of your already established playerbase.
OTAM @ Mar 3rd 2006 6:12PM
WoW is such a candyass game and i'm thankful it isnt coming to the 360. Now if I can only banish Final Fantasy off the Xbox i'll be a happy camper.
And for those of you who are going to say "Millions of people play WoW every single day!"
1.You're entitled to your opinion now matter how wrong it is.
2.Britney Spears has sold a total of 85 million albums and that doesnt make her any good because of numbers either.
Chachi @ Mar 3rd 2006 6:16PM
To #12: Avoiding 360 because its audience is too immature? Have you ever even PLAYED World of Warcraft? Maybe we're thinking of a different game...
Exo @ Mar 3rd 2006 6:18PM
so where are all the trolls now that were bashing ncsoft for saying the same damn thing?
truth of it @ Mar 3rd 2006 6:22PM
I have indeed(I am an ex WoW subscriber as of 2 months ago) and I have an original xbox with a now defunct live service.
Sure, by mmo standards wow is way below most other mmos when it comes to player community, largely due to it's huuuge playerbase. But you can log into WoW without being insulted, insulted(racially or sexualy) or spammed nonstop with profanity. You might be exposed to a teeny tiny bit of it and you have to put up with nonstop leeroy jenkins or chuck norris nonsense but that's apples and oranges. Comparing it to the 360 crowd would be paramount to comparing Jesus or Ghandi to Larry Flint.
Gin @ Mar 3rd 2006 6:35PM
WoW sucks Anyway
truth of it @ Mar 3rd 2006 6:35PM
Meant to say tantamount, not paramount ^^
If WoW ever hit the 360, all of the RPG servers would simultaneously implode.
Hiro Protagonist @ Mar 3rd 2006 6:36PM
Ive never had any problems with WoW.
Everyone could actually type properly there.
Im waiting for m3mnoch to say something. Hopefully he will mention something he said about NCSoft and such.
AoE @ Mar 3rd 2006 6:45PM
I wonder how many of the people complaing about the xbox live community have 360's? I understand the community on the xbox is garbage, and there's a pretty good chance that the 360 XBL experience will get there too; but at this point at least, where the hell is all of this happening? I've been playing mostly Ridge Racer and DoA 4 online, but have also played around in Full Auto, NFS, and CoD 2. With the exception of the ocassional troll, the community's generally fun to game with, and NOT immature/racist/etc. Also, just an observation, but when I bought my 360, the store I waited at had 77 360's to sell, and only two of them were purchased for teens/children, all of the rest went to 20-30-somethings... so where exactly did all of the filthy-mouthed children get thier 360s? And which games do they play? Apparently they don't play any of the games I do...
That being said, It's funny how worked up people are getting about this. Do console gamers really care if something as plodding and dull as WoW comes to console? FFIX is bad enough, I'm glad we'll be WoW-free :)
Btw, #12, I'm sorry your folks didn't get you a 360 for christmas, there's always your birthday ;)
Ashlar @ Mar 3rd 2006 7:05PM
"Also, its important to us that the entire player base is able to play together. Microsofts Xbox Live architecture is very protected from all sorts of outside influence, so shared play between 360 and PC owners would be very tough."
Er.. Square/Enix seem to not have any problems with this. FFXI is coming to the 360 in about a month, already been in Beta test for a few months now. You just have to log into Live and then log into PlayOnline. And as for the play between 360 and PC.. well, FFXI not only has that, but also play between those two as well as the PS2...across multiple continents (NA,EU,JP).
It seems it's possible to do it, Blizzard either just doesn't want to, or doesn't know how to..
Robert @ Mar 3rd 2006 7:41PM
#!2,
Are you kidding me? My god man, I have had someone beg for money, read insults left and right on general chat, see naked elves dance begging for tips, and then let's not even mention the typing skills of said people.
Penny Arcade had it right: anonymity(WWW) + regular person = "f*cktard"
kagai @ Mar 3rd 2006 7:46PM
Hmmm....Sony's PS3 will be supporting keyboard and mouse...hmmm...
AoE @ Mar 3rd 2006 7:58PM
#24, The 360 supports a keyboard (not sure about the mouse) I've already used it for a number of things, including playing FFIX and labeling soundtracks and the like... Who said the 360 doesn't support keyboards?!
Buzzbomb @ Mar 3rd 2006 8:07PM
I love it when Microsoft are given the cold shoulder.More companies should do it.Final Fantasy Online is an absolute piece of garbage that's years old and takes about 2 hours just to install the demo on the 360. Microsoft thinking it's some kind of killer game shows how out of touch they really are.Xbox 360 needs everything it can get and that includes WOW.
n00bk1ll3r @ Mar 3rd 2006 8:12PM
@12
WTF!!!, u r just some stuck up anal basterd
i bet u wanted a xbox360 but coulnt get 1 now u r jealous
wow sucks turds neway u can keep it tard
Multiplayer @ Mar 3rd 2006 9:38PM
^You just helped prove his statement about gutter mouthed illiterate 13 year olds on XBL.
scottind @ Mar 3rd 2006 9:47PM
"Final Fantasy Online is an absolute piece of garbage that's years old"
question:
how many of you have actually played FFXI(more than a month)? that being said: World or Warcraft is noobilyfull garbage simple mmorpg for kids with no story content, that doesnt hold a candle compared to FFXI, even graphically.
m3mnoch @ Mar 3rd 2006 10:42PM
bunch of stuff here.
mouse and keyboard are supported on the 360, it's just dumb in the living room. well. not for the final fantasy registration, but, that's just ass. why am i registering for a new account again? microsoft already has my information. but, i digress.
a keyboard is big and bulky and looks stupid on my coffee table. where are you going to store it? how do you play with a mouse and keyboard on your couch? you can't play unless you have a tv tray in front of you? and, they have to be wireless too. maybe some folks' living rooms are all milk crates for furniture and have random computer peripherals strung about, but mine's not.
and i suppose exo is talking about me when he says 'so where are all the trolls now that were bashing ncsoft for saying the same damn thing?' (p.s. hiro, you had to know i'd show up with a topic like this!) as soon as i saw the headline, i was sure someone would mention it.
well. here's why ncsoft (arenanet, really) are tards and the folks at blizzard are not: their reasons for not integrating with live are comletely different.
on treating their customers different:
where jeff strain was complaining about microsoft getting in between them and their customers, he's talking about you and i like we are 'property' belonging to ncsoft.
paul sams said no such thing. he is more concerned about his customers experience. he doesn't want to comprimise the well-oiled machine that is wow. he understands that you can't have a game without players. he understands that there are many other activities vying for our entertainment dollars. he understands that you take care of your players and they stay. *cough* star wars galaxies *cough*
ncsoft? 'who cares about a quality game, our customers are ours! we own j00!'
on future games:
jeff strain is discussing business models. intimating that no arenanet game would ever come to xbox live until microsoft changed their business model. blizzard, however, just isn't interested in porting and existing, very refined pc experience to a console. he specifically is talking about wow, not future games.
in fact, when he says "we may be looking at something along those lines in the future" that tells me... i dunno... that THEY ARE LOOKING AT FUTURE MMO GAMES FOR XBOX LIVE. and doing so without whining about xbox live's business model. *cough* jeff *cough*
on business models:
paul, didn't mention it, but i think that fact alone is very important to note: he didn't say that xbox live's business model was wrong for them.
xbox live is set up to facilitate episodic content rather than 3rd party subscription based content models. YET, HE STILL DIDN'T MENTION HOW THE MODEL FOR LIVE WAS 'BAD' FOR THEM.
jeff strain, however, who has an episodic content model -- which, directly mirrors xbox live's -- said live was incongruent with their needs.
does anyone actually wonder why blizzard is kicking the crap out of guild wars, despite still charging for a monthly subscription fee?
i don't.
ncsoft needs to look out for their customers first. paul sams just publicly PWNED jeff strain from a public relations standpoint -- illustrating exactly why blizzard makes great games and has a huge fanbase and why arenanet does not.
m3mnoch.
p.s. sorry it took so long for me to get back in here. came home. had dinner with the fam. put my son to bed. just got back on.
Hiro Protagonist @ Mar 3rd 2006 10:56PM
I knew you would show up eventually.
You are one of joystiqs greatest commentors.
Really doesn't matter you took so long, its a good rant.
m3mnoch @ Mar 3rd 2006 11:03PM
hey. thanks, man. i appreciate that hiro.
m3mnoch.
JT @ Mar 3rd 2006 11:30PM
The reason why WoW isn't going to console is the size of development team. They don't have enough men to work on the console project. However, why bother, they have 6m PC users. Keep releasing expansion disc for PC is enough.
FFXI is different. One, SQ/Enix already have platform-independent PlayOnline system. Two, they have more deveopers. 4 teams for doing just FF series. FF12, DoCFF7, FF11 expansion, FF11 360.
LaughingTarget @ Mar 3rd 2006 11:57PM
I believe the problem that Blizzard is not willing to tackle is keeping track of accounts. They have a account records system already set-up, and that would well likely conflict with the Live model.
For example, if a Live user had the name Apocalypse and there was an account name from a different person on WoW, it would cause a lot of grief without a significant overhaul on how accounts are handled. I think they saw that few people would want to log in a second time just to play a game, whereas FFXI is likely tieing the accounts in with the Live one to keep things smooth.
Another major hurdle is the WoW delivery method. They are frequently adding new enhancements to the game, and it has expanded quite rapidly in terms of size. I believe it increased around 2 gigs since it originally came out. Blizzard likely sees the 13 gig drive on the 360 as too much of a limiter to make their future business model viable. FFXI is also not likely going to run into this issue given that they already have made a large number of adjustments and they can easily run a different model, one where future expansions will be added onto the base game and sold, avoiding a significant use of hardware space.
A third conflict would be the pricing issue. People on Live are under the expectations that they can play their game with just one single fee, the yearly Live membership fee. Many gamers will be turned off from having to pay a second fee on top of the original. Furthermore, it is hard for Blizzard to convince Microsoft to allow them to charge a fee equal to that of the PC version because Live runs on its own dedicated network, so any money generated by Blizzard through Live is pure butter because they have a drastic drop in server maintenance charges and bandwidth charges. Gamers play on consoles because of the expense of the PC, so they tend to be a bit more budget conscious (with exeption of the individuals who paid $1,000 for the 360 on eBay back in November), so adding the extra fee on top, particularly a monthy one that is 2-3 times more expensive than Live, is not going to get a lot of new customers.
I seriously doubt it is the "complexity" of the game. World of Warcraft is a very simple game in an ease of use sense. It is the fact that Blizzard is not willing to handle various technical hurdles or fork over the expense of developing the game to work in a HD format for the 360 when it is most likely they won't be making back their investment.
NeoWolf @ Mar 4th 2006 12:11AM
"It is the fact that Blizzard is not willing to handle various technical hurdles or fork over the expense of developing the game to work in a HD format for the 360 when it is most likely they won't be making back their investment."
Rendering WoW properly for an HD format wouldn't take any work at all. Hell, it already supports pretty much any resolution and aspect ratio your monitor can throw at it. (Though how well it would render at full HD resolution with full eye candy on is another question..) Still, I think one of the reasons they're not bothering with a console port (yet at least) is that they're already busy supporting two major computing platforms as it is.
Exo @ Mar 4th 2006 1:08AM
m3mnoch. its funny how you can be so completly wrong about everything.
m3mnoch @ Mar 4th 2006 1:36AM
exo. it's funny how you make unsubstantiated statements about everything.
m3mnoch.
Eric @ Mar 4th 2006 2:14AM
It's even more funny how "portnoy" corrects others on things to make a lousy attempt to sound credible and intelligent...even though "truth of it" recognized his simple mistake and corrected himself quickly...2 posts before!
-3 stars...wonder why....Truly portnoy is a god among insects.
clee @ Mar 4th 2006 6:16AM
m3mnoch, why are you shoving words into NCsoft's mouth? You are basically glorifying Blizzard and vilifying NCsoft. What they said, at the end of the day, is the same message. They don't want to have to fit their game into the Live model. They both said the same thing. Just because NCsoft said it more crudely doesn't mean you have to be so defensive and so spiteful in your responses, just like how this dude from Blizzard has treaded carefully in his response and then you think his message is more acceptable.
"does anyone actually wonder why blizzard is kicking the crap out of guild wars, despite still charging for a monthly subscription fee?"
How is this relevant to this topic? Also, your underlying message here is that Blizzard's World of Warcraft is more successful than Guild wars because of their customer relations? Other than the fact that this has absolutely no relations to this, this is also false. There are many people who are unhappy with World of Warcraft because of the server instability issues, which has always been a major problem.
Nothing compares to World of Warcraft at the moment. You can't say because Guild Wars is less popular than World of Warcraft this makes it a failure.
100 movies, 600 tv Eps for your ipod @ Mar 4th 2006 9:48AM
Deus Ex 2?
Cross platform can really nerf a game for one or the other platform quite easily.
geves @ Mar 4th 2006 10:22AM
who cares. of course it's not happening. they already got 6 million mofos on the game. everyone on xbox live, requires a broadband connection = they could play it on their PC.
why go through all the trouble of programming a game, when you could just buy the game for your PC?
it's pointless.
IMHO: WoW sucks anyways. if your curious about the game, just cuz 6 million people play it. buy the damn PC version. and i don't recall EVER hearing about an outcry for a version on the 360. blizzard needs to shut up & quit trying to get in the news, cuz no one with a 360 wants that over priced, monthly game anyways. unless they already have it.
nice story. but personally...who cares?
Robert @ Mar 4th 2006 11:41AM
#24
I was actually talking about the immaturity of the WoW crowd and the XBL crowd. Each group has their good and bad members. No one group is any better then the other.
I've used the KB for the 360 for various things too, especially since I use it mainly for streaming content into the living room from my MCE2k5 PC in my bedroom.
slybri @ Mar 4th 2006 12:57PM
Blizzard may never make a direct port of WoW for the 360 but they would be foolish to never create Warcraft spinoff games for the consoles and portables. Perhaps an Oblivion style single player RPG set in Azeroth, maybe with multiplayer Battlegrounds.
slybri @ Mar 4th 2006 1:18PM
..oh and for the portables they could make a turn-based Warcraft RPG or maybe even a strategy game like Warcraft: Tactics. They could easily shop the license out to smaller studios and reap the rewards. Maybe even have unlockable rewards that you could use in the MMO, like they're doing with the WoW card game.
Until someone makes a keyboard/mouse that you can comfortably use while sitting on the sofa, they won't fool with porting WoW to the consoles.
Spike @ Mar 4th 2006 2:22PM
I think its all about control.
As stated and above, MMO Companies want to have a unique and direct relationship with their customers as ordained by THEM.
XBOXLive is a great online platform but one that is controlled by Microsoft.
What about payment? One would have to pay TWO monthly fees to play WOW on a console? What will be the benefit for the consumer? The same content, different?
There are many obstacles for a 3rd party MMO on a console and especially on a "close" online model like Live. But i think that all three companies will have a MMO game developed by them that will suit each console's online infrastracture. It'll be foolish not to take advantage of the growing MMO market and even Nintendo thinks thats a good idea.
Miyamoto's comments that TP will be the last Zelda as we know it, come in my mind. They wouldnt...right?
Dahkness @ Mar 4th 2006 3:12PM
Everyone bitching about Live's service. How there are immature this and that on it must not have been playing much on the 360.
Since the implementation of Gamer rep. I have never once ever had a party with a raciest, idiotic immature anything in the 5 months since I've had the system. (except for the first week building my rep) The gamer rep helps. I'm always in games with people with min 4.5 stars and they all are great.
Also little 13 year old kids, won't be able to justify another 12 bucks a month from mommy and daddy ontop of Xbox live for just 1 game. Nor do they have the expertise, patience or time (for the most part) to play a game type like an MMO.
More so to the fact I've played FFXI for about 20 days playtime in the last 3 weeks. Everyone on Hydra or Xbox 360 members, and I would say about 1/2 of them play FFXI on the PC currently or PS2 in the past. They are all nice, helpful, funny, and knowledgeable. I am glad WoW decided not to come around this year, I really rather play ffxi Or blue Dragon when it hits the market. Who wants to ride a pussy cheetah anyways when you can ride a Choc
Give it time. The people who make WoW will sell out like every other company Microsoft sets it sights on..
a london gamer @ Mar 4th 2006 9:38PM
The reason i got any of my consoles is i dont want to use a keyboard or a mouse to play games if i wanted that id use a pc so fuck games that require a kb why do you need a kb anyway xbox headset works perfectly well to let peeps know what your upto.
I say fuck blizzard if they cant see the potential 360 has got they are blind and someone else will come in and fill there shoes and make a game better than wow on 360.
Actually a few developers are working on mmorpgs for 360 that are looking great like apb,huxley it would have been real nice to have seen wow on 360 but im sure it will still kick ass without it, hmmm did someone say halo 3.
JusJus @ Mar 4th 2006 10:04PM
click....click....move....click....pickup quest object...click....click/fight....click...
WOW = mindless monkey entertainment.
Zweibel @ Mar 5th 2006 1:45AM
@49
You know, if you think about it every game is really just the same. All I can say is different strokes for different folks. No need to bash somebody because they like a game that you despise. =P
@30
I can honestly tell you that I enjoyed World of Warcraft more than Final Fantasy XI . Yes, I played the latter for more than a month. In fact, I've played a variety of MMORPGs including a few months of Everquest and nearly half a year of City of Heroes. In the end, I picked World of Warcraft because of it's rich lore (And I'm biased. WCII FTW!). Granted one can play the game from one to sixty without doing a single quest and learning about the history of Azeroth but that doesn't mean it's not there.
As for Blizzard not developing WoW for consoles, I honestly have to applaud them for this. If I had to play it on my television, how could I watch my favorite shows as I "easy mode" (Read Hunter) my way through MC/BWL/AQ? ^_^
m3mnoch @ Mar 5th 2006 1:15PM
clee.
they are not even remotely saying the same thing. here. i'll distill down for you exactly what the two different interviews are saying:
ncsoft: we won't put ANY GAME on xbox live until they change their business model because our customers are OURS and we have episodic content.
blizzard: we won't port an EXISTING GAME to xbox live because it might break it and our customers wouldn't have a good time, however, we are looking at future mmo games on xbox live.
ncsoft sux0rs because:
1) they don't know most customers follow the game, not the publisher or developer. most customers don't even know who developed their favorite game much less some random game they play. the ones who do? they follow the developer, not the publisher: take two or rockstar? microsoft or bungie? activision or id? ea or will wright (i'd say maxis, but in this instance will's name carries more weight than just about any other development house, much less any other singly named developer)?
2) they think xbox live != episodic content.
3) they think microsoft will change the business model of xbox live. if ea rolled over, yeah, i'm pretty sure microsoft could care less about 'the mighty' guild wars developer.
blizzard r0x0rs because:
1) blizzard realizes that bringing the console gamers into the mmo fold will do nothing but tighten their grip on leadership.
2) blizzard knows they have 'blizzard fans' so they don't want to comprimise that. they aren't worried at all that these 'blizzard fans' will turn into 'microsoft fans' just because of live. people appreciate content, not the delivery mechanism. developers who don't see that are stupid. (that, or they don't have a brand worth talking about. even then, they should be excited to ride on top of the xbox live branding.) it'd be like joystiq fearing an server host change would get between them and their readers. talk about completely stupid. joystiq readers will visit joystiq even if they swap isps.
blizzard fans will play blizzard games regardless of the 'pipe.'
3) blizzard all but confirmed they are making an mmo for xbox live without any 'complaints' about the xbox live BUSINESS MODEL.
"How is this relevant to this topic? Also, your underlying message here is that Blizzard's World of Warcraft is more successful than Guild wars because of their customer relations?"
first of all, nothing i said has anything to do with customer relations in an 'internal department' kind of sense. i'm talking about a company's attitude towards their customers. their 'customer relations' initiatives grow out of that. your seeing the symptom, not the disease. i'm talking about the disease.
and, it is relevent because both companies expressed how they treat their customers. that's a big difference between the two interviews -- comparing the interviews is the topic at hand.
as to blizzard kicking the crap out of ncsoft, that ties directly to their business models. meaning the whole episodic content vs. subscription services fitting or not fitting within xbox live's framework.
one would think that ncsoft would want to take advantage, in a fiercely competitive situation, of the natural episodic abilities of xbox live. they don't see that. blizzard, however, despite having an incompatible business model (separate subscription-based model. see laughing target's good stuff above.) is still making the move to the platform in the future.
ncsoft is not, despite having a highly compatible delivery strategy.
the takeaway? ncsoft makes poor decisions and is reflected by them doing poorly in the market. blizzard is about what the customers want and, by that, owns the market.
and, yes, guild wars is doing poorly in the market, despite having a million subscribers.
the reason? turnover rates.
yes. guild wars has 1 million subscribers. however, they aren't even subscribers. those subscribers have all paid for the game and get to play online for free. if those customers never buy another arenanet-made product, arenanet goes under due to support, bandwidth and network server costs.
however, if those customers keep buying arenanet products, they can keep afloat.
let's look at that.
so, assuming dollars required per year per customer (based on other successful mmo subscription rates) is about $100. technically, at $15 a month, it's $180, but, we're assuming jeff's assurance of low network requirements is accurate. which, makes sense as a technical requirement (an area in which they are outstandingly talented) based on their economic model.
anyway, for each 'subscriber' they have, they have to sell them $100 (or about 2 full games or 4 expansions assuming normal industry pricing) worth of guild wars content every year.
what does that model forget?
1) breakneck development speed required to put out 2-4 expansions or games per year. it's REALLY expensive to build that much content inside 12 months.
2) customer attrition. there are marketing and packaging costs for the expansions/games since they need to be justified as a new game instead of a server addon. especially since a subscriber who doesn't buy new content is essentially a drain on their resource.
for every expansion they put out, they will lose not only the standard attrition customers (like any other mmo) but the upgrade customers -- those who are happy just playing the original and don't feel the need to pay for an upgrade. so, the hole in the bottom of their customer funnel is really, really wide.
to compensate for that, they need to attract new customers at a larger rate than any other mmo that exists. that means they need to spend more marketing dollars and other customer acquisition costs than any other mmo.
all that added up means a low-margin, high volume business. that means, for them to be considered AS (not even more, just merely 'as') successful as wow, THEY NEED MANY MORE SUBSCRIBERS THAN WOW HAS. for them to be 'as' successful as any other mmo with 1 million subscribers, they need more than 1 million subscribers.
and, what counts as a subscriber for guild wars?
not people who play the game. a 'subscriber' for them is basically someone who has paid for an upgrade. because, if you just 'subscribe' they don't get any additional revenue from you. they need you to the buy the 2 to 4 games or expansions that they hopefully will be able to put out year in and year out.
so, when you talk about 'subscribers' in terms of guild wars, it's more like 'unit sales/2' (assuming they can even crank out that much content in the coming years) in order to compare to other more traditional mmos.
they are just treading water in a sink hole.
m3mnoch.