Chinese gold farmers documented

This is the story of the year. I wouldn't be surprised if NPR is reporting on it tomorrow.

good point, we all know it's messed up.

how about a simple link to youtube, instead of a long waiting, movie. for no reason.

maybe it's just on my side, but just link the damn movie.

sorry if it's only on my side. but i can't load a full length movie, but i can downlaod off a link faster than i can download it off this site.

Interesting. However, buying virtual gold with real money doesn't make good sense to me.

Geves, it's an embedded video. Youtube is serving it.

You'll get the same speed whether you view it here or at Youtube, because it's being delivered BY youtube to Joystiq.

Here's the link anyway:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ho5Yxe6UVv4

Bentong:

Let's assume that grinding for an hour in WoW will net you $10 in gold. It's work. It's not enjoyable.

Now let's assume that you could stay an extra hour at work tomorrow and earn $50.

In both cases, you're working one hour. Would you rather get paid $10 or $50?

If you choose to work at $50 per hour, you can buy $10 in advancement in WoW from Chinese labor and still have $40 more. So you skip an hour of WoW work and you end up $40 better off.

That's why it makes perfect logical sense.

Very interesting indeed.

What amazes me is not that this occurs, but that a game can be successful when it has elements which take hours, and are so boring and repetative that you'd rather pay someone else to do it.

On one hand you feel guilty, like youre exploiting poor people.

On the other hand these people at least have an income. If there was no such thing as goldfarming it would not change theire living conditions. It looks to me as if theire trying to get a buisness on its feet and make a honest living.

For the record ive never payed for virtual ingame goods. But blame Blizzard for this? I dont know...

Awesome. Good for the guy who's doing this in China. That's what capitalism is all about, taking money from the stupid or lazy. Arbitrage, baby, arbitrage.

who the heck makes 50 dollars an hour??? not me!

:*(

How is this taking money from the lazy or stupid, or exploiting people? No one is forcing Chinese people to play these games, and no one is forcing the Americans to buy the virtual gold. It's like a maid service (and like the comment someone made earlier): I can stay at work and work 1 more hour, or I can come home and clean my house for an hour. If I stay at work, and get X amount of money in overtime, I can pay a maid (less than X) to clean my house, resulting in a) a clean house regardless and b) (X - maid costs) extra money for me. Likewise, my boss could work his shift plus mine, but he has calculated that it is worth it to him to pay me X amount per hour so that he only has to work one shift, where presumably the cost to have me work per hour is less than the cost to have him work per hour.

It's all captialism folks.

-p-

Simple explanation: If you got paid money to just sit there and play a game all day, would you? I bet a lot of people would.

Longer explanation: What the video doesn't tell you is that the people who play at these 'sweat shops' are usually high school dropouts or college students that got bad grades and couldn't find a job. Faced with menial jobs such as sweeping the streets, cleaning public toilets, and playing games, I believe it's easy to see why so many of them pick playing games. Unfortunately, Americans can't see beyond the "Chinese gold farmer" stigma and say that ALL Chinese gamers must be farmers when this is hardly the case. Take even 1% of the gaming population in China (just the gaming population, not the entire population) and you get a HUGE number, probably more than some MMO's have subscribers. If that 1% is the amount of people who farm for money, is it right to call all or even most Chinese gamers farmers? Keep in mind China's population is 1.3 BILLION compared to the US's 295 million.

Also, a word on the exchange rate. A lot of people say these Chinese farmers are being 'exploited' because they only earn pennies in US dollars. Key word there is US dollars. Let me ask you this: can you survive on $400 a month? I have doubts whether anyone can survive on $400 for even a week unless you split rent, car, utilities, appliances, food, tax, etc... But in China, 400 RMB is enough to live in an apartment, buy yourself food and clothes, and still have enough left over to have some savings. That 400 RMB is $50 US. And that's pretty much considered dirt poor in China.

If you've ever been to China, you'd know it's a far cry from what people think of it is. It's not 1984 over there, it's not the USSR reborn. For the most part it looks almost like a city in the US, just more dirty and less orderly (a by-product of not many laws being enforced).

very insightful comments, Ranma

I've lived in Shanghai for almost 3 years now, came over here to work for Ubisoft. (who came here because they wanted cheap labor, figure that) 400 RMB a month is not enough to live decently in Shanghai, for locals I mean. At about 4000 RMB you're getting by ok, can lead a decent life, but you'd be much more comfortable at 10000 RMB.

And the vast majority of Chinese just play for fun--they play Chinese WoW, on Chinese servers.

Oh, and Shanghai is cleaner than any US city I have seen, thanks to the fact the city redundantly employs so many people to clean, sweep, and polish every inch of the city every day. Although the chaotic part was right, right of way on the streets is decided by physical mass (bus > truck > car > motorbike > bicycle > person).

Here i was expecting a flood of racist comments. On the contrary, very intelligent comments have been put up. Let's see how long it lasts though, :P.

When games make it a requirement to gain levels, items through repetitive means and there will be a commodity to be bought and resold and there will be those out there to supply what people want. This did not start with WoW. Before WoW, there were Everquest and Ultima Online. "Gold Farming" is not inherently with MMORPGs either. It was prevelent in a popular online action game called Gunbound. Items and Gold were also bought and sold. Don't think for a minute that this will end unless every online game out there ends the commerce that exists within.

Kill all these chinese gold farmers... you see them on the servers PK them they are a plague in our gaming society. Basically what they are doing is taking money from Korea and US gamers... They are just annoyance

Lots of great comments here.

This has been one of the greatest stories to emerge regarding videogames because it has actual social significance. Personally, I'm ambivalent to the whole affair, but some of the issues raised by this new kind of commerce remind me of some old problems. Most notably, the ethnic superiority of American gamers (the clientelle of these farming businesses) who demean Chinese farmers. The documentary looks as though it will be informative and worthwhile and I'm looking forward to seeing it in its entirety.

Also, as comment #7 (Jyn) mentioned, it's a wonder that something so tedious can be succesful. For the record, I've played WoW myself, liked it, but could never get into it or invest the time necessary to make the payments worth it.

i never really thought of this as exploitation. to me, the big thing is that these farmers (along with the people who are too lazy/inept to actually *gasp* play the game) ruin things for alot of people.

personally, i've watched the economy in ffxi progressively go straight down the gutter. while it's a fact that people are greedy and will put things up for sale at the highest price they think they can get away with, people who actually put in the work to earn their gil/gold/etc are a little more reserved about spending outlandish prices. but when some people get their easy money from IGE, they gladly shell it out. the prices in-game continue to rise indefinately making it increasingly harder on people who would rather actually play the game. this is all besides the fact that most of the farmers i've come across in ffxi are complete assholes, obsessivly camping mobs that drop those big ticket items and trying everything they can to get you killed if you look like competition.

and I just can't understand why anyone would pay monthly to play a game, then essentially pay someone else to play the game for them. seriously, if so much of the game is that boring for you, what's the point? are the bragging rights of having uber gear that you did no in-game work for that appealing? meh...

end-rant :P

God damn capitalists!

Now they're taken over the virtual world as well!

Finally a palce where "all men are equal"

Think again! The new slaves are cyberslaves

Is Vladimir Cole your real name? That's about the coolest sounding name ever. Every time I read it, I imagine a demonic character holding a huge flaming sword above his head and brandishing a wicked grin. If you came up with it, you should be congratulated. If not, send my compliments to your parents.

There ARE no poor WoW players. Every WoW player has a computer that cost at least $500, have a high-speed internet connection, bought a game that cost $50, pay at least $13/month, and have tons of free time on their hands.

Sorry if I don't feel sorry for the "poor WoW players" who are being taken advantage of here.

"There ARE no poor WoW players. Every WoW player has a computer that cost at least $500, have a high-speed internet connection, bought a game that cost $50, pay at least $13/month, and have tons of free time on their hands."

I'm pretty sure all of that can be purchased with a credit card. Having stuff doesn't mean you're wealthy. This is America, where a 20% interest payment on plastic craps seems like a good deal to much of the working class.

a game shouldn't have boring parts. Isn't work boring enough???

--
Spamalot
www.squatsquat.com

On my recent vacation to Paris, I chose to convert some of my US dollars into Euros. I realize that I could have gotten a job and earned some Euros after I got there, however, it made for a much more enjoyable vacation to spend the money I had already earned.

The irony is that without capitalism there would be no WoW.

I'm not sure this is about people buying their way out of not doing repetitive tasks. Gold does not give you experience. The only way this holds up is if companies will level you up while you work, or give you a pre-built character in exchange for a handsome sum.

I think it is sad that a game would have to be tainted in this way, but as with all things in life, if someone will buy it, there will be someone to sell it to them.

And of course, if you are just given something, then you haven't earned it, and your regard for it is not as much as someone who sweated to get it. But I think that MMOGs are fundamentally flawed if any aspect of playing them is a grind. Damned if I have an answer though.

WTF?! Why blame Canada? Am I missing something here?

All my fiance's cousin wanted for Christmas was a level 60 character in WoW. And he would have liked it for an hour or two and then become bored with it. It's sad really.

I can understand why some people pay for these things. They don't have time to do it, or don't want to do boring game-work when they do.

That's why I prefer games like Diablo or Phantasy Star. They have a set series of dungeons and you know about how long it takes to complete one. It's a much more streamlined experience.

You're missing a South Park joke.

First off, I have to echo the comments made by a few others: if the game is so dull that you'd rather pay someone to get stuff for you rather than get it yourself, then you probably shouldn't be playing the game in the first place.

Now, as for gold farmers themselves, people have to realize that attacking them, or pressuring the game companies to do something about them, is not going to change a thing. The farmers will keep coming back, because it means getting a check to them. As long as they have a financial incentive, they're going to keep doing it.

Honestly, if people want to stop gold farmers, they have to attack their customers. Form guilds to deal with farm customers. Figure out ways to find out who are their customers and tag them with their shameful deeds both in the game and out.

Seriously, if you stigmatize buying from farmers enough, fewer people will buy from them, and farming will be less prevalent with fewer customers.

I personaly don't care if people buy gold from gold farmers. There is obviously a market for it or places like this high tech sweat shop would never have existed. If Blizard was smart about it they would capatalize on the market. Have a gold sellers channel and charge a transfer fee.

there will always be people who buy gold and try to cheat there way to the top its a sad fact but the majority of people always try to take the easy way out.

Shadow

I have no problem with anyone buying currency in the virtual world with real world dollars. There is nothing more BORING than collecting materials to make your uber piece of gear in an MMO. The whole reason the developers make it so hard to get these materials is to keep you playing longer. People have lives that include wives, husbands, jobs, and kids. It's bad enough that you have to set aside a good 5-7 hours to get a good dungeon raid together.

"Wow" people.
There's a bunch of stuff we could hire these guys to do.
I have a couple of dvds I haven't had time to check out, a blow-up doll still in the wrapper that somebody need to de-virginize and a big pile of weed that isn't going to smoke itself.
I don't know, if I was that bored with a game, I'd find a new one. I've never played it (or any other mmorpg for that matter: almost got into PSO because I loved the originals but had problems getting the dreamcast on line), is it really that tedious?

rang rang

Tedious?

Well I guess it depends what kind of person you are. If you are just on to have fun, meet up with people, and go adventuring, then you won't really experience too much tediousness.

However, if you've been conditioned by every D&D computer game out there, then you know the object of any D&D type game is to make your experience meter increment, and to level up, and to get better weapons.

And if that is your goal, then welcome to your own personal heaven (hell?) of spending a lot of time online doing mundane things because you want that damn "Vorpal Lightning Sword of Existence" and if you are level 60 with a +10 in sword play, then you could lop the head off a dragon in one fell swoop.

Super interesting take on what we usually only read about in little snippets. Looking forward to a completed piece, although I'd like to see more explaination of what the fuck is really happening on-screen/in-game, or how long it takes to earn enough to sell, etc., as I don't play WoW. Also it would be key to talk to some people that are buying the gold and characters.

For me, These shops are analogous to jobs in data processing: repetitive and redundant, but still in demand by a market that is eager to spend money on results, rather than deal with the drudgery.

#34:

I work in data entry, and you aren't lying. If gold farming is anywhere near as tedious and boring as data entry, they deserve every penny they get.

Great analysis Vladamir. Good Post

I think the more interesting question is: How many players would Blizzard lose if they did stop farming? Think about it. There are people who don't care to do "repetive, mindless work" while playing the game (according to some of you just to make some friends. Personally, I can talk to people at work and make money for the work). But what about the people who wouldn't play through all the boring stuff? How big a percentage of the WoW population buys, and how many of them would not have created their "uber" characters if they couldn't buy stuff with real money to make the journey easier?

In the end, farming may be good for the community. I would consider it close to a walkthrough or faq for a "fun" game (ie, not repetitive, mindless work). Just because I don't use them doesn't mean that I think others shouldn't either. Or do WoW players associate buying items with real money akin to an aimbot or wallhack in a fps? Does it effect other players in a negative manner?

Lots of people seem to be "Oh noes! their paying real money for something virtual!"

Well, basically, their paying money to do well in the game and beat the competition. It would be like paying money to go to the gym to keep fit, you could just work out at home for free, but your paying for convenience. Just because its a game makes no difference, its a competition just like any other sport.

Actual Analogies to real life aren't that easy. The gym analogy would only hold water if you could pay someone to work out and then take their muscles after the fact and use them as your own.

The closest thing, I think would be if you bought a 360 off of E-Bay and had it the day after launch. Someone actually stood in line for you while you worked and you reaped the benefits.

Anyone have a better analogy? I'm sure there are tons out there.

Good point Thomas. This is just the oddest concept to me.
I've just never gotten into these because I knew I would really get addicted to them. Now I'm thinking that maybe I wouldn't; does all the cool action only happen when you've raised to crazy levels?
I've only played the old rpgs where they raise your level gradually as you play through a pretty static story. There were always a few places where you had to just kill stuff to raise levels but it never took too long to do that. Not long enough for you to think of hiring anyone to do it. I can see how there would be broader amount of levels and enemies for something open ended like wow, but those higher levels must be damn cool for people to hire dropouts to play it for them. I think I'd probably just find another game.
I noticed I just went up 2 stars. How does this happen? Did I actually provide some sort of insight into something?

The Joystiq Gods distribute the stars. They giveth and they taketh away. And they give no reason either way. They took one of mine away yesterday. After crying for several hours, I came to accept my fate and began to live again.

About WoW.

A lot of what people post makes the game sound like drudgery. The fact is that the game is closer to using crack than it is to pushing pencils in an office. MMOGs are highly addictive. I mean, people in China are literally playing themselves to death. Don't underestimate their power or risk being trapped in a virtual prison filled with annonymous griefers.

However, if you are playing purely to farm gold, I'm sure the game is a living hell.

The condition in China is saddening, but I can't sit here and cry because poor Chinese have it ruff. Isn't China the country that turned it's back on aids, denying anyone had it? If your company won't do shit to help.. sorry. Cuba could be a rich prospering company. But they want to remain b*tches. They could market their Cuban Cigars HEAVILY.

The fact is, they found a way to exploit something and make money. American do it every day.

Why did I keep saying company? COUNTRY*

Honestly, you can't put a full blame on blizzard for it. They ban hundred's of accounts a day, it's just there's too many farmers for them to keep up with. From September to November in 2005, they banned over 18,000 accounts. So at least they're making an effort to put an end to it.

Money: the best cheat code online.

I really don't have a problem with buying gold, but only if two circumstances are met:

1) The economy is inflated beyond belief.

2) The trade of in-game gold or items is explicitly condoned or ignored by the developer and moderation.


The problem is when they farm for games like FFXI. The economy was fragile even when people didn't buy gold that often. The first WHM spells you could get costed about 5k each, and the armor/weapons were way more. (For a comparison, let's say the best level 10 green weapon costs you like 15 gold on WoW a few months after the game launched.)

It's stated clearly that the trade of real money for these things are against the EULA when you sign on to PlayOnline (the client that allows you to play FFXI). The farmers and people that buy gil should be banned, and SquareEnix should devise some system to track the trade of very large ammounts of gil and compare it to the ammount of times the person has talked to the other person, and the context of the chats. It seems like a simple way of monitoring suspiscious activities. It's not intrusive unless you're doing something wrong, and if you are, you deserve the ban.

You know part of reason why blizzard bans hundred of accounts/key because that means hundred more copies of WOW will be bought + monthly fees, it make complete sense for Blizzard to ban X amount so that regular players feel that farming concerns has been somewhat addressed at the same time not banning enough to keep the farmer off perm.

Gold farming is just same as outsource, someone else from another country willing to do some job at the same quality for you that cost much less than if you do it yourself, why wouldn't anyone do it?

Tell me more about the appeal of this "egalitarian ideal". Sounds like a sour way to live to me, begrudging other people their success and dreaming of rules to stop them.

People stay in the game to try to be as high level and rich as they can. They find interesting ways to achieve their goal. Just like in real life, those with fewer ideas think it's "unfair". Big wow.

BTW Somebody ask the Chinese folks if they'd rather not have their job instead of claiming it's a sweatshop. Their alternative was WORSE or they wouldn't be there. Life must be good to have time to worry about crap like this.