Demo disks are dumb, doomed, Dodo-like

If we are to ditch hard copies of games ie. games on discs. We need the option to burn the game on a disc for backups. HDDs crash suddenly and unexpected and it would suck to loose your entire game collection because of a faulty HDD.

Kinda like when I downloaded HL2 from Steam b/c I felt guilty about getting it off a warez dump. When I lost interest in it for a few months, I misplaced all the purchase info, had my HDD cleaned, and couldn't remember which card I used to purchase it with.

No, I don't think we'll see the end of games on physical media for some time to come. Servers go down, content gets scrabbled, but I still have my trusty disc of Christmas NiGHTS in my top drawer. Also, I travel every once in a while, and I'd hate to not be able to play games just because I can't find a reliable access point.

hahaha nice "revolution"...fueling the N-Game.

Your going to be charged with inciting a riot.

it is a nice thought to remove discs, but i think there will still be one more generation after this with discs before we see them phased out completely. They better keep a good system to store information on servers, so crashed hard drives can be replaced. And for those who like to keep very extensive collections, it may be better if hard drives were easily removed from the system so full hard drives would not need to have games deleted. Also, then the days of bringing games to friends houses or second hand games will be gone, because there will nothing to transfer, and usernames will probably be limited to a machine to prevent the sharing of usernames to steal downloads. There are still many problems in the way of downloaded games on consoles. but in the generation after this current one with the revolution and ps3, i still forsee the use of hard media

And then let's dump all those store owners, workers, builders, etc. Because why let anyone but the biggest corporate monsters take a slice of the pie?

We NEED demo discs or downloads for the PSP.

I thing there should be more demos, as there are a lot of games i want to buy but i'm just not sure about them.

They could even make a bumper demo disc with every game's demo on it and sell it at points of sale for £1. I'd buy that.

I thought when they said the PSP would have wifi and infrastructure that there'd be demo downloads a plenty. I haven't seen one.

I don't think we should get rid of demo disks just yet. They serve a purpose. Yes, you can download demos off the internet whenever you wish, however not everybody always has access to the internet or broadband which is usually needed to do so.

For instance, I'm serving in Iraq right now & I live for the next Xbox Magazine so that I can get my dose of demos. Just remember that not everyone in the world is as fortunate as the tech savvy.

Eh...I think it should be a situational thing really. I think demo disk disk distribution (say that three times fast) should be downsized in favor of Internet downloads, but not vanquished altogether; every person who owns a next-gen system isn't going to be hooked up to the Internet, after all.

As for getting rid of physical media for full games...well...I'm not so sure about that, but it would be nice to be able to flip on a console and choose what game you want to play from a menu instead of having to deal with CDs and their frailty.

whats with Joystiq and their constent wanting to download all their games rather then buy them? Downloading of games rather then the purchase of a physical medium will never happen until they invent a cheape affordable minmum 500GB hard drive (and im talking this generation, not next generations where games will be 20+ GB in which you will want 1-2 Terabyte hard drives). Then you need a method to portableize your hard drive so you can bring it over to a friends house. And all that doesent even mention how they would solve game distribution for non-online players, or what to do when your hard drive crashes while your on a 2 week vacation at your cottage without internet.

You go have fun Joystiq with Bill gates and store an entire 3 games on your HDDs. I think im gonna stick with a physical medium for now, and next gen, and most likely the next gen after that.

As for demos not needed a medium, this is true. I dont even think they make PC demos on cds and DVds anymore? Arnt they all released online? Its just a matter of time until OXM drops its demo disks since they are not needed and those demos should all be released on marketplace.

I might accept this if I had FIOS but there is no way in hell i'm doing it on 1.5mb down(how big are some of the demos on xbox live?), and only for demos. For real(full) games I want a hard copy, a want a nice little amaray case with nice little cover art, I want to open that case and have a real disc with real art on the disc, I don't want to hear this bs about "but maybe you can burn a backup", f**k that, if I wanted to look at cd-rs in generic cases i'd just download games now.

The need for hard copies, or quickly replacable backups are important. The thing about iTunes, that's really terrible, is that you can only download a song once (and pay for it), I mean really, if I want to download a song again, I should not have to pay for it again.

With CDs however, if I lose a ripped mp3 on my computer, I can just plug in the CD again and rip it again. Same for demo disks.

Demos and hard copies of games will really become obsolete with superfast fibre-wire connections for all, until then, we'll have to settle with hard copies for backups.

If you download a lot of .. um.. games.. large ones, illegaly, that is, you'll find yourself making CD-Rs of the games since you don't want to spend another 4 days waiting for a torrent to complete. Or 4 hours, whatever.

THE NEED FOR HARD COPY REPLACEMENT IS IMPERATIVE.

Merits of game DVDs aside (I like them too)...

Downloadable demos are lovely (and generate less waste) but damn, have you seen the 360's Burnout Legends demo? Just under 600MB and for that you get ONE track! The rest of it is a long, boring, terribly-voiced-over trailer. Urgh. If I wanted a trailer I would have downloaded a trailer, not a demo - there's no excuse for bundling them like that. Not everyone has great broadband.

The demo level is damn good fun though :) Hi-def Burnout is great!

hmm no physical medium eh?
won`t happen if it does it will cause mass unemployment on a worldwide scale as there would be no need for high street retailers or factories to manafacture discs,packaging etc.. also most c&vg magazines woukd die as it`s the demo disc that most people want off them anyway.
also softco`s would lose some revenue from the gamers who don`t have internet access and finally everyone i know wants to actually OWN the games in a physical way they like to see what they get for the hard earned money they have spent. i know i was annoyed when i bought HL2 gold and did not recieve a disc copy just a guide and a stupid hat(cheap b******s).

The biggest argument to me for NOT ditching disks is retro gaming. What if I want to play Half Life 2 and Steam no longer supports it? I can't, without downloading an illegally hacked copy.

As other people have said, what if my DSL goes down or god forbid I can't afford to keep it anymore? Should I be punished by not being able to reinstall my games? Of course not.

You might argue I can backup onto CD/DVD but how many of us HAVE done that but then discovered that the disk has failed? CD/DVD has a far more limited lifespan, they can fail in as little as a few months if they are bad media despite verifying as 100% when you originally burnt it. Pressed disks however can last for years and if your copy broke you can LEGALLY buy a second-hand copy. If however you are relying on backups and yours breaks its ILLEGAL to buy a copy off a friend or anywhere other than the publisher - who might not support that game anymore (I actually had that happen with a game I had on the Amiga).

No, ditching actual media is NOT a good idea. Sure having all games on a hard drive is good, but you should always be able to have a hard pressed reliable original disk to reinstall if everything goes south.

Incidentally, I think demo disks are still useful. I very rarely download PC demos because they are so big so its only if I already have a hunch I will like a game that I download a demo. However if I have a demo disk I will try ANY game regardless of if I think I like it or not - so demo disks are definately useful. However I only ever got them from magazine coverdisks and I do not think they are worth the price of the magazine anymore, if they were £1 or sent for free I would probably own more PC games by now.

I have to agree with Number 1. If you honestly think that digital distribution is a good idea, then you must have never had a hard drive crash on you. I'd much rather have the games to physically hold in my hands. If you had posted this nine days later it would have been amusing. But since you appear to be serious it makes me seriously rethink using Joystiq as a news source.

Never underestimate the bandwidth of a truck filled with HD-DVDs.

You know, I have to say that I still enjoy my OXM Demo Discs. Why?? Because a) I don't have to waste time downloading demos; b) I don't have to waste hard drive space downloading demos; c) OXM did a very good job w/ their points system and unlocking locked content; d) I like the locked content: stuff you can't get on XBL Marketplace

"like so many cookies after a rough ride at the amusement park."

What are you talking about? That analogy makes no sense to me.

I think it was a bad simile for things that make you feel sick.

Digital distribution takes away our rights. If you download a game:

- If your HD crashes, you'lll need to re-download all of your games (which could take days if you have lots of games, and you may be charged to re-download them by the manufacturer)
- If you don't have access to broadband, you're out of luck
- If your connection goes down, you might not be able to play your downloaded games
- You can no longer trade games with your friends
- You can no longer sell your used games or buy used games. Every game you buy will have to be brand new.

The same goes for digital music and movies. If you don't have a physical copy of what you've purchased, you're trading your rights for convenience.

I don't think I've ever seen a blog post where every single reader commenting disagreed with the original blogger. At least not until this one.

Vladimir vs. the World?

Sadly, Vlad will end up victorious, at least as far as digital distribution goes. The industry will make sure of it, as it puts all the power in their gargantuan, greedy hands. *Shudder*

#6 I know it sounds evil but is inevitable, eventually it will happen. The way digital media is acquired is changing and there is nothing we can do, is a side effect of civilization and technology.
Take IPOD for example, CD players look dumb now in days, and a girl wouldn’t date you if they see you with a walkman(cassettes). Movies on demand, do you know how many Blockbuster stored are closing just because people can download movies or rent them online and have them shipped.
As people start getting more bandwidth at home. Everything will be over IP. Movies, games, music, phones. Heck is a lot cheaper, I know you will still be able to go and pay more at a store for something you can download without and effort but I know you wont.

And when it comes to hard copies, who needs them! Is like Xbox live once you pay for a game using your account downloading the same game on another Xbox 360 is not a problem using the same account. I know there are lots of people that like having physical things of everything which is why some people still use cash and not a debit card.
But if you think about it, I think is better to buy a license to play a game and being able to download it every time you need to then to buy a Disk which doesn’t last a long time specially with kids handling them and having to buy another one.

I believe we'll never see a day when things are just moved over the internet. Stores like Best Buy, Gamestop, and the electronics section in Wal-Mart would be gone or greatly reduced in size.

People will always want to be able to hold their DVD, CD, ect in their hands. What do most people I know do when they download music? Burn it to a CD as soon as they can. Why is this? Who knows. Maybe people like the fact that they can see it, touch it, taste it, and touch it some more.

I do see things going away from moving parts. I predict that one day stuff will come full circle and we'll be using what Nintendo did long ago, flash drives. They're getting smaller in size but bigger in memory.

I download game demos fairly frequently, but only for games I'm already excited about. I don't feel like wasting time and bandwidth on game demos for some title I've never heard of.

HOWEVER, I install and play just about every demo that ships with my PC Gamer sub each month. The demos on those disks have introduced me to several games I never would have tried otherwise.

Yeah, get rid of demo discs because downloading isn't annoying...

http://www.joystiq.com/2006/03/07/still-downloading-downloading-downloading-xbox-360-ann/

Everytime I read something like this I just laugh and wonder how the writer could be so short sighted. Yes, being able to download demos is nice, but it is certainly no replacement for having demos on a physical media. Broadband penetration in the US is only at around 60%, and there's a LOT of gamers that live in remote, rural areas that can't get it even if they want it. Even then, a lot of so-called broadband connections are crappy 128k connections that are fine for web surfing but painfully slow for downloading 300mb demos. On top of that, the hard drives in consoles aren't all that large (esp. the 360), and unless people are happy with downloading, playing right then, and deleting, there's going to be a demand for a more permanent storage. And as for full fledge games, we're nowhere NEAR ready for digital-delivery only. Not even on the PC, where hard drives are large and cheap. With games regularly being 5gb+, that's just too big, even for fast broadband, to put up with when buying a DVD is so much quicker, more convenient, and above all, permanent. Sure, you'll always have people who like digital downloads, and that's fine, but there's a LOT of people not ready for that yet who prefer a physical media. Even in the music world, where songs/albums are relatively painless and quick downloads, there's still a demand for physical media. In conclusion, we're not there yet, and we won't be for quite a while. Broadband is going to have to get much faster, storage capacity on our devices bigger, and even then there's still advantages to a permanent physical media.

I agree that demo discs are a thing of the past and should definitely go away for PCs, Macs, PSP and Xbox360. Unfortunately, the rest of the consoles rely on demo discs for distribution so for the majority of current gen hardware, the demo disc(and optical media in general) is necessary.

The days of physical media for next gen systems are not necessarily over either, nor will they be for some time. If it weren't for the evolution of HiDef content and gaming, there would be no need for an optical drive and systems would be cheaper, have lower hardware failure rates and games would be cheaper.

Unfortunately, 2 of the 3 next gen systems are requiring all games to support HiDef gaming and do not have hard drives big enough to support digital gaming distribution. The 20 gig drive in the Xbox360 will soon need to be replaced with a much larger one as more and more downloadable games and content becomes available. The PS3's 60 Gig HDD will offer more storage, but if Sony offers users downloadable music, movies and content for games, the same thing will happen.

Also, as developers begin to utilize the system's full potentional, games will begin to use more and more disc space. This will(in turn) make downloadable demos for these games larger.

This is making a mountain out of a molehill. Demo discs for consoles I actually own are a welcome item in my mailbox or a local store. They serve a real purpose and are generally sent to a targeted audience. I wouldn't mind receiving more.

If you want to take about a landfill stuffing menace, consider AOL. In the past ten years I've gotten more useless CDs in the mail from them than from all of the console makers and third party publishers combined. We're talking about hundreds of CDs and recently little boxes encasing the CD instead of just shipping them shrinkwrapped to a bit of cardboard.

Back in the old days they sent floppies that could be reused. Back then my email signature read "I have enough 3.5" floppies. When will AOL send me ZIP disks?"
If they were using ZIPs back when they were $10 each I'd have gone to some trouble to stay on the mailing list. Instead, no amount of asking to be remove has ever slowed down the flood of useless shiny coasters.

The game industry is evolving away from excessive printing of demo discs on its own. As the average home gains higher bandwidth for downloading demos direct to their consoles the marketing departments will naturally make smaller quatities of the demo discs until some give it up entirely or reserve it for events like E3. The discs bundled with magazine typically cover a good size array of different titles, so those are far less wasteful, especially since they're limited a group of paying customers rather than a hit or miss mailing list. The magazine discs will remain long after freebie giveaway discs by mail or in stores have gone away. They represent real value for the buyer for long after.

The real offender in CD pollution is AOL. By sheer volume they make everything else minor. On the game demo side, it's a problem that doesn't need solving. It simply goes away as conditions change in favor of other marketing techniques.

There will come a day when you bring home a new console, hook it up to your home's network and are able to start up your subscription and have the game of your choice ready to play within an hour of first opening the box. But a lot of infrastructure needs to come together before that become a reality. It's at least a decade off before it becomes the primary way console games are distributed. We'll live through a lot of inbetween stages on the way to that. One of the last things to go will be factory produced games sold at retail outlets. The method is simply too effective and too well established to make obsolete any time soon.

demo discs will never be obselete because demos in that form is more convenient to some people. as not everyone will want or has the bandwidth or even has their console online to allow them to download the demos

Some of you live in such remote areas where an IPOD is not known? It can be argue that many people still do not have a computer in order to add song to their IPOD. The same way, lots of people can argue not everyone have broadband in order to download games instead of getting a Disk. I agree that this process can take a while but don't underestimate how fast technology is moving... considering the fact that since the 90's roughly 10 years we have gone from 14K modems (probably less) to 2MB+ at home!
Now about 50 percent of 360 owners thus far are using Xbox Live... so, if companies can save money making CDs to send demos or sale games and users can save money downloading games then why not. If a company can reduce the # of Disk they have to making it available to those that live away from civilization where not even satellite internet can reach, then I don’t see any problem. By the way IPOD users usually don't be burning every song they get on CD's unless they want to listen to it in a CD player, or give it to another person which is not legal. Remember you are paying for the right to use the content/game/song not the CD. Conceptually there is no difference between a CD, Hard Drive, tape they are all containers to hold data. Eventually people will realize is not the container that matters but what’s in it.

Two magazines I subscribe to (Maximum PC & PC Gamer) both ship demo discs with the magazine each month and my subscription costs some more to get them. I never use them and toss them out. If there is soemthing I want to play as a demo I'll download it and not wait for the magazine to come in the mail.

There is a disagreement in consumers about which side they are on. Either you are for or against digital distribution. Hence there will be the option for either. On PC you can either go to the store and buy the game on disc right now, or download it at home. The only way digital distribution will "take over" is if everyone goes to it and makes the physical medium impractical to produce at a profit. Hence where CDs are at right now.

With digital distribution of music, it's starting to cost more to produce a million CDs and distribute them when nobody is buying them because they all bought the music online (or stole it). So it's not really a decision that they can make. It's the choice of the consumer. As far as me personally, there are still issues with digital distribution I do not like, and refuse to buy them because of some of the restrictions they impose.

People still get demo CD's for the PC in a lot of gaming magazines, some demo's that are exclusive. It is more of the ease of getting a disc and installing like 5 or 6 at once, than looking for them on the net and downloading a big file.

Demo discs serve a purpose and will not go away anytime soon. Even if digital distribution is or becomes more common publishers will still use physical delivery to differentiate their games and to get them in our hands quickly and exclusively. Once all of the consoles are online and we have thousands of game demos available to us, new games will get lost in the sea of demos available for download, and the only way to get exclusive delivery will still be to send or hand out demos.

I also agree with the majority of the posts before me, I want physical media for many reasons; backup, bragging rights, easy archive, future playback, and for the browsing/shopping experience.

If you know anyone proclaiming that physical delivery of music, movies, or games is going to disappear anytime soon. I suggest reminding them of radio which didn't destroy physical delivery of music. The Internet which didn't destroy the book industry, or home video which didn't destroy the theatrical industry. New delivery of media supplements the old, many times it even promotes and encourages further use of the old delivery model. And established distribution models die slow and hard.

I would also like to say that publishers should enhance demo discs with special features to encourage users like "Afroloop" who posted above not to throw away the demos. Users start to throw things away when the experience becomes predictable and the discs are dominated by B quality game demos. DVD-Video demos discs can contain audio/video features such as interviews with game developers, famous gaming tournament matches, exclusive video game hints, tips, and tricks, game reviews, free mini games or retro games, and much more.

I work for a leading PC magazine in the UK so this subject is quite significant to me. More so, I am also the disc editor for the magazine.

I can't really speak for the US but I have several years of experience working on many different UK magazine titles. Traditionally demo discs have been vehicle to help promote magazine sales however the Internet and broadband has had a large effect in making demo disc content largely redundant at least in the PC magazine market where very few exclusive demos feature on discs before being online.

Of course there are many people who don't have broadband and swear by discs, but as Spock once said "The needs of many out way the needs of the few". It is really only a matter of time before demo discs and even some magazines will disappear due to the Internet taking their place in providing the same material.

This kind of make my career a bit finite but the reality is the Internet is having many effects evolving many ways we gather information and shop, demos discs of course being a fairly insignificant speck of dust in the scheme of things, but it's an example of it's effect.

The only thing that would make sense is offering game downloads as an OPTION as opposed to buying the physical media. Microsoft, Macromedia, Adobe, etc. all have to deal with piracy but I've never heard them threaten to do away with the ability of the consumer to buy a physical copy of their product. EB needs a reality check as they have been the biggest promoter of this idea.

JEG
http://www.replaystation.com

People have been saying this for years. A few years ago, people were saying, "When we have gigabyte hard drives, we won't need CD-R's anymore." Hard drives will never be as inexpensive as optical media, we will always have some type of removeable disk. It's the same reason we have hard drives and not just flash memory - hard drives are slower and louder, but cheaper. Removeable optical media is slower and less convenient than hard drives, but it is and will always be cheaper.