Spike Lee movie criticizes game violence
by Christopher Grant 
{ Apr 12th 2006 at 5:15PM }
Spike Lee used video games in his
latest thriller, Inside Man, not for previsualization but
as a way of critiquing gangsta glamor and the apathy towards violence. We all know the best way to criticize violence
right? All together now:Make something even more violent!
In an article on the film's machinima* at BackStage.com, it's revealed that "in the case of Inside Man's game, which uses Rock Star Games' Grand Theft Auto as a point of reference, Lee insisted on storyboarding a custom-made scene rather than building off of an existing game. He wanted to depict a scenario that was even more grotesquely violent than any game already on the market."
Lee is hoping that the scene -- which involves putting a hand grenade in a character's mouth -- doesn't get duplicated in a future game not because he's afraid of getting cut out, rather, because he's upset by the level of violence in games. Lee explains, "I just hope people understand that is an absolute statement about my horror at how violent these games that young kids play are, and also the infatuation with violence and gangsta rap among the black community. It's not a real game, but it's not that far-fetched from the games that are being sold."
Alright, Spike, we know you mean well. Regardless of whether or not we think ascribing blame for inner-city violence on the level of violence in video games is responsible, you're crazy if you think this little vignette is more grotesque than "any game already on the market!" Did you ever play Eternal Champions?
*Since this scene was not created using a game engine, the article's use of the term "machinima" is inaccurate. This is simply computer animation designed to resemble video games, as opposed to video games being manipulated to emulate traditional film-making techniques.
[Via Game Politics]
Get a WordPress.com Blog
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Chris @ Apr 12th 2006 5:24PM
for the last time...
THEY GIVE YOU A NICE BIG AGE RATING ON THE BOX!!!!!!!!
if anyone can understand this is someone who makes films.
Randall Fitzgerald @ Apr 12th 2006 5:29PM
Reminds me of how Tupac said that rapping about the worst things he could think of was his way of helping people to see that they're bad.
WHOOPS! We're glorifying it. My bad.
fawazr @ Apr 12th 2006 5:43PM
That's right, THEY GIVE YOU A NICE BIG AGE RATING ON THE BOX!!!!!!!! and then proceed to sell those games to minors who manage to save up 50 bucks. It's really easy to say these games have absolutely no effect on children and ill-adapted adults when you don't actually see the results. Working with teenagers all day, I actually do see the results, so I'm less inclined to side with profit-driven game companies that pander to a violence-addicted culture.
Brian L @ Apr 12th 2006 5:44PM
Wow - Gene Simmons had a hand grenade shoved in his mouth in Wanted Dead or Alive (with Rutger Hauer)....hope that doesn't get replicated in future movies...
chess pieces @ Apr 12th 2006 5:45PM
Damn that those teenagers and their 'Doom' game.
EzPz @ Apr 12th 2006 5:46PM
Can't you shove a grenade in a zombie's mouth in the RE GC remake? I might be mistaken, but I thought I remember that you could. Even so, I guess doing that to a zombie is different.
Sloopydrew @ Apr 12th 2006 5:52PM
Spike Lee is a hypocrite and he's not doing the right thing. He's also just trying to keep the box-office going on his newest film. Remember when he called for a boycott of The Phantom Menace, because Jar Jar Binks' character showed George Lucas to be a racist?
jon again @ Apr 12th 2006 5:57PM
According to Spike Lee, isn't "doing the right thing" burning down Danny Aiello's pizza place for not having enough black celebrity’s pictures on the wall.
dsub @ Apr 12th 2006 6:00PM
I saw this movie, and the scene with the game was more comical than anything because it is so over the top.
the scene involves some sort of a drug deal, in which the deal goes wrong, and the game starts flashing on the screen "fuck that nigga up" or something of the sorts. The character then puts a grenade in the guys mouth and blood literally flies EVERYWHERE. The game is on a PSP in the movie. It really was so over the top that everyone in the theatre laughed when I saw it.
embassy @ Apr 12th 2006 6:01PM
jon again...i think u need to change that statement to " not having ANY black celebrities on the wall" ..
and if i remember correctly...spike wasnt celebrating that moment as a positive action in the film
nice try tho.
Pixelantes Anonymous @ Apr 12th 2006 6:04PM
I thought the scene with the boy playing an ultra-violent game with no supervision whatsoever from his dad, who otherwise was characterised as a "good dad", was just the perfect sign of times. The freakin' bank robber had more interest in what the boy was playing than his dad.
But, hey, calling for parents to be more responsible is not in these days, so I can understand how nobody else, incl. apparently Spike Lee, sees it that way.
jon again @ Apr 12th 2006 6:15PM
Revised statement: "It's totally awesome and ok to burn down Danny Aiello's pizza place for not having ANY black celebrity’s pictures on the wall."
Sorry Embassy, obviously there's some hyperbole there, but that part always drove me nuts.
Jason Westhaver @ Apr 12th 2006 6:17PM
Press the suicide key in Postal 2 and your character shove a grenade in his mouth to end it all. Sorry Spike Lee, but your violent moment was done ages ago. it's old news.
zorg45 @ Apr 12th 2006 6:20PM
This is funny, particularly because shoving a grenade in someone's mouth and watching them run around before exploding was one of the quick kills in The Punisher last year. Way to be on top of things, Spike.
embassy @ Apr 12th 2006 6:22PM
once again jon..again, spikes not glorifying that scene...so i dont see wat your point is..
Owns @ Apr 12th 2006 6:31PM
"That's right, THEY GIVE YOU A NICE BIG AGE RATING ON THE BOX!!!!!!!! and then proceed to sell those games to minors who manage to save up 50 bucks. It's really easy to say these games have absolutely no effect on children and ill-adapted adults when you don't actually see the results. Working with teenagers all day, I actually do see the results, so I'm less inclined to side with profit-driven game companies that pander to a violence-addicted culture."
So you're going to side with more censorship which will eventually lead to games being outlawed? That makes MUCH more sense. After games are outlawed maybe they'll move onto movies and music. This argument is ridiculous...for the last time PARENTS need to be involved in their kids lives. IF they don't pay attention, and IF the kids are already screwed up, then I could see this being dangerous. Those kids shouldn't be playing ANY kind of games anyway. They should get help before they hurt themselves or someone else, and the parents should be turned over to social services for neglecting thier children.
rudimentalist @ Apr 12th 2006 7:05PM
Spike Lee seems to have more of a problem with GANG violence than regular violence, and I think that's justified. The fact that this was gang related. But then he went and said "games kids are playing" and that's not gonna make game developers reconsider what they're putting in, but it's gonna make censorship get tougher, the more that idea is proliferated. Despite his intent. The right thing would have been to withhold that comment and just let the image speak for itself.
I'm pretty sure the message of Do the Right Thing was "Do the Right Thing, which is not burn down the pizza place just cause they get mad about your Public Enemy song". That would be the wrong thing, which you are seeing take place so you know to do the right thing.
The_Predator @ Apr 12th 2006 7:10PM
"the scene involves some sort of a drug deal, in which the deal goes wrong, and the game starts flashing on the screen "fuck that nigga up" or something of the sorts."
Hahaha thats fucking brilliant, I can't wait for 'Inside Man: The Game' thats going to be awesome.
---
Bart: "Disembowler IV": the game where condemned criminals dig at each other with rusty hooks."
xen0side @ Apr 12th 2006 7:13PM
As a black person I saw that scene a lot differently then I think everyone else saw it. I think everyone is viewing it as some kind of attack on video games, I saw it as an attack on the glorification on black on black violence. The scene had a black kid playing as a drug dealer killing his fellow black person for no reason, then the kid quotes 50 cent and says "get rich or die trying". Spike was simply using video games as an example of how black on black violence is glorified to young black kids like the one in the movie. I think it was meant to be a statement on how a lot of young black kids have nothing but Sambo's such as 50 Cent to look up to as role models.
Eirik @ Apr 12th 2006 7:40PM
#19 please....
why make this out to be a racial issue? It seems all Spike Lee does is cry wolf(i.e. racism) at anything and everyone. And because of you skin colour you experienced something different than the white man in the seat beside you? no... the cultuar differences did that(if you even did experience something else than the white man next to you, which I doubt. Since the point of degenerating youth due to poor rolemodels is all over the place).
Perhaps you have a child or a brother who looks up to these people in a similar fashion. if so, you can relate, but not due to your skin. if you seriously feel that skin differanciates people you are generalizing and dangerously close to racism.
cultural differences!=racism.
Conn @ Apr 12th 2006 7:41PM
You guys are overreacting. I saw the scene in Inside Man and didn't think of it as an anti-video-game message, but rather a poke at Grand Theft Auto.
C. Grant @ Apr 12th 2006 7:42PM
Agreed xen0side, I just think his example is a little simplistic, and a little reductive. I know what he was really trying to criticize (gangsta glamor and the apathy towards violence) but I think his statements about the violence in games is a little much.
Just like his new (violent) movie isn't meant for kids, games like GTA aren't either. There is an implicit irony in using an example to criticize analogous content.
Zsavior @ Apr 12th 2006 7:59PM
One. Jon the scene with the Pizza shop being burned down was supposed to signify how real racism effects the common man. Danny Aiello's pizza shop was burned down to save Mr Aiello's life and the life of his family. The Danny Aiello's shop had Itallian celebrities pictures up to show that he had the same pride in his people as Radio Raheme had in his. When the cops killed a black man for the sheer hell of it then left, the scene was supposed to depcit the fact that true racism is not about black or white but about hate. The cop didn't turn and try to help Danny Aiello or his business, but instead ran to save his own life leaving Danny Aiello to take the blame.
The scene was supposed to depict that fact that sometimes people take there anger out on the innocent instead of seeing the real injustice in the world. People tend to attack what is diffent and can't understand or sympathize with it so it is automatically wrong or evil. Rather than Understanding that Danny Aiello was a value to the neighborhood and loved the community, the people looked at his skin color and ultimately demonized him and his place of business just to vent their rage and anger against the injustice they just witnessed and felt helpless against. THIS BRINGS ME TO THE POINT THAT SPIKE LEE IS BEING A HORRIBLE IDIOT AND BLANTANT HYPOCRIT.
HE choses a media device in which he neither understands nor cares to understand, and begins to demonize it with out proper investigation of what the messages is (if any) is trying to send from these games. The basic fact is games like GTA: San Andreas, 25 to Life were made for adults, and are rated for adutls. What more would you like these companies to do to stop children from obtaining these games? The hypocrisy comes from the fact that the same can be and has been said about movies. Yet I remember way back when Malcom X came out Spike Lee wanted Chidren to stay home from school to go watch his adapotation or The civil rights activist life. Should when then judge how much he really cares about the messages children get from media?
Seriously Mr Lee Shame On you. You just made an embarassment out of yourself and for what? As a movie director, he should know better than anybody not to judge media, and the pitfalls of censorship. He should also know better than anyone that blaming the injustice of society on the powerless and misunderstood is no answer at all. I guess money really does change a man. If he really thinks you can blame the use of gang violence in every day life on videogames, then his cultural views have been horribly warped since he did "DO THE RIGHT THING".
Phil @ Apr 12th 2006 8:00PM
First he said it HIMSELF that it was all about how violent videogames are (video games with big ratings all over them while movies have HIDDEN ratings).
But I wonder what will happen now if someone actually copy the actions depicted in the MOVIE. Will they blame movies now? Or us crazy nerd white kids with too much money to do drugs and rob stores as we stay home and play video games? Wait, that was from ANOTHER study about how the game industry is for rich white kids.
jaemz @ Apr 12th 2006 8:22PM
I wonder if he will personally make sure kids don't get into his movie...
Sorry Spike, you sound like another player blaming the game.
The Jerk @ Apr 12th 2006 8:28PM
Funny how Koreans move into the same neighborhoods,
play the same videogames and yet don't slaughter each other.
puh_fifer @ Apr 12th 2006 10:15PM
I really have absolutely no respect for Spike Lee. He spoke at my first college (ESU) about 3 years ago and revealed himself as nothing but an egotistical racist. All he did was talk about how white people are so evil and then trashed Quentin Tarantino.
Shagi @ Apr 12th 2006 10:44PM
Heres an idea...why doesn't spike lee complain about the level of violence in rap music, or movies, or videos...oh yeah, beacuse hes got a big market to lose by criticizing those markets...just remember kids violence is ok as long as its only a problem in places where your bottom line doesn't come from.
Spike Lee use to be a really visionary guy...but either he's lost his mind, sold out, or just got too old...IS THIS TOO LOUD FOR YOU SPIKE?
AnimalTaglits @ Apr 12th 2006 11:13PM
Hey Shagi, read the article again, he does complain about that.
Maybe this message wasn't directed towards anyone but inner city kids who think GTA:SA is a gift from God, and not people like you and me who have a better taste in games.
ck @ Apr 12th 2006 11:21PM
This comment section is ridiculous.
"HE choses a media device in which he neither understands nor cares to understand, and begins to demonize it with out proper investigation of what the messages is (if any) is trying to send from these games. The basic fact is games like GTA: San Andreas, 25 to Life were made for adults, and are rated for adutls." -ZSavior
Made for adults? Are you serious? GTA and most other violent video games are marketed towards TEENAGE kids and college kids. NOT adults. These games are not made for adults, they're made by adults for kids to cash in on this 'get rich or die tryin' craze. Check your spelling, too. Your argument goes out the door when I cannot comprehend your comment.
"First he said it HIMSELF that it was all about how violent videogames are (video games with big ratings all over them while movies have HIDDEN ratings)."
-Phil
Huh? Hidden ratings? Everytime I go to the theater I see the ratings plastered everywhere. When I rent/buy a game, the rating is put in a corner on the box mixed in with all the legal mumbo jumbo.
"Funny how Koreans move into the same neighborhoods,
play the same videogames and yet don't slaughter each other." -The Jerk
That is the most ignorant statement on this comment section. You're just stereotyping Koreans and Blacks and basically saying it's the black community's fault? WTF?
Spike Lee was just making an observation about black violence and the glorification of thug life. I saw the movie. Yeah, it was a funny scene, but poignant at the same time. I work at Blockbuster and it's insane how many parents have rented GTA or Hitman for their 10 or 12 year old. I tell the parents about the game and less than half take it back. This gangsta life glorification is rampant all over the media, it's just that Lee chose to depict it through a video game (I'm sure he could have said more about it in our culture about the music and movies, if given the chance), which affects more kids than adults and parents aren't dealing with this nor is the video game industry. Sure there is a ESRB rating, but most parents don't know what it is or that it is even there.
Hopefully this fad will be just that: a fad. And just because there has been violent games before doesn't mean there wasn't a problem before. I'm not saying that violence in entertainment leads to real violence, but it only increases our stereotypes of the black community and how desensitized we are to REAL violence. We don't need censors, we just need to depict violence in a real way and have an open dialogue with our kids about these issues.
WedgeTalon @ Apr 12th 2006 11:24PM
If this sort of violent expression is OK in movies, then why is it not ok in video games, Mr Lee?
Zsavior @ Apr 13th 2006 1:12AM
I don't know if anybody else will answer you back CK but I got sometime and you have gotten my attention. Sorry for my grammar but it seems you comprehended what I had to say just fine. Second I notice when people don't have much to say in defense they try to disregard anything the poster has to say by pointing at grammar, just an observation. Maybe my grammar is just that horrible but some how you were able to decipher my caveman scribbling.
Now as for your post, lets see why don't we post what you say and have you explain it, I don't believe in discounting what people say Instead, I rather examine it and see if it has any meaning in its own context.
"Spike Lee was just making an observation about black violence and the glorification of thug life. I saw the movie. Yeah, it was a funny scene, but poignant at the same time. I work at Blockbuster and it's insane how many parents have rented GTA or Hitman for their 10 or 12 year old. I tell the parents about the game and less than half take it back. This gangsta life glorification is rampant all over the media, it's just that Lee chose to depict it through a video game (I'm sure he could have said more about it in our culture about the music and movies, if given the chance), which affects more kids than adults and parents aren't dealing with this nor is the video game industry. Sure there is a ESRB rating, but most parents don't know what it is or that it is even there." -Ck
Here is what is really ridiculous, after Blantanly saying you notify parents on what they are buying for their kids. After saying how insane it is that they still rent the game, you go on to defend Spike Lee's assessment of video games and videogame culture. Cigerettes, Alchol, Guns, Violent Movies are all part of American culture and are all marketd toward children, but once parents are educated on what is and is not for a minor it is up to them to police their actions. By your own words parents are informed by you on what this media contains and still they decided to pick it up. So what is your argument? That because you are uninformed you are allowed to poison a childs mind or break the law as much as you want becaus nobody physically stops you? Or are you saying that even if you are informed, a parent shouldn't have to make the decision on what their child should or should not see?
His claim is that videogame Violence, Glorifies and desensitizes children to violence, but these games were never made for children to play nor were they bought by the minors, they were purchased by an adult. If anything by your own account shows that adults are the ones desensitizing their kids by not caring what media they show to them. If the adults are desensitized how do expect them to raise their children?
Next Working at block buster how does that validate anything of what MR LEE is saying? One if I read what you said correctly you wrote, wait here I will paste it.
"Made for adults? Are you serious? GTA and most other violent video games are marketed towards TEENAGE kids and college kids. NOT adults. These games are not made for adults, they're made by adults for kids to cash in on this 'get rich or die tryin' craze" -CK
So Spike Lee Creates a violent scene to top all Violent scenes, by your own account ONLY KIDS WILL SEE IT! One, as you said even when informed parents will still buy the kids the game. Two, also by your own account the game is only marketed towards minors or teenagers so it will never reach its intended target market. So by you and Mr Lee's idea I guess I should go outside and start mowing down inner city inhabitants with chainsaws, shots guns, and an armored tank division, because something that over the top will stop all violence.
Also WHAT THE HELL IS A "COLLEGE KID"! So now we remove all blame don't we. I don't know if you ever been or go to college, and it doesn't matter to me if you haven't. What does matter to me is that the statement tries to take blame away from full grown adults ,and place it on an industry that creates entertainment. A "COLLEGE KID" is an adult who is just attending a higher education school or university, many of which who have part time jobs. It isn't animal house, so I have no idea what the hell that statement meant. Matter of fact I am glad you said that because in college they teach you analytical thinking, rationalizing right from wrong through thought and reasoning. To me I think that is the perfect type of person to market a game like "GTA: San ANdreas" and "25 to Life" to.
Last and My favorite.
"Sure there is a ESRB rating, but most parents don't know what it is or that it is even there." -Ck
Equivalent to "HEY Sure my kid like knives and Martial arts but I can't stop him every time he gets some cutlery in his hands and feel the need to be the Last Samurai!"
If a child goes into sports, if they are interested in movies, hell if they want to go by a friends house a parent is supposed to ask questions. I don't see why when it comes to gaming everyone acts as if Parents are suddenly illiterate or dyslexic, and can't read the letters on a box or do their homework on the subject. We remove all blame from the parents, and blame the develoeprs, the companies, the disturbutors, for an act that would take ten seconds by either going online watching T.V. Or Looking on the back or front of the bloody BOX! If your kid brought home pills would you allow them just to pop them in their mouth with out reading the lable? Hell We check halloween candy, better than we do the media our children watch today. Would you LIke the Videogame Industry to shape the Boxes into giants "M"s Or "T"s like a bad seasme street episode, or would you rather the Parents trying something original and try being informed in their childrens lives? Matter of fact if they started doing that maybe they will find the guns their children are carrying, and just maybe...maybe with out fire arms they won't be able to shoot at each other! JUST A THOUGHT.
But you work at block buster so I guess you are positive on how these kids are being raised, and if videogames are their babysitters, and if their parents give a damn about their lives past seeing a report card. I bet you know if they are being bullied, and if videogames are an outlet, or if these kids have friends and just like to play around before they go to soccer practice. You know all that, Right from behind the counter.
BOT @ Apr 13th 2006 1:21AM
"Lee is hoping that the scene -- which involves putting a hand grenade in a character's mouth --" haha, bullshit they had that ever since there was violent games. use the quick kill option with the grenade in the 'punisher' and ur character will shove a grenade into the bad guys mouth, he'll run off and his head will explode. That game came out what two years ago?
MosquitoControl @ Apr 13th 2006 2:19AM
Some have already mentioned this, but see the movie before you judge.
While the movie featured a very violent game, the commentary was more on parenting. Spike didn't say violent games are bad, he said parents should be more hands on and know what their children are doing.
The point of the scene wasn't the game, it was that the father didn't supervise the kid and let him play the game.
Piaras Kelly @ Apr 13th 2006 3:05AM
Spike Lee has actually done this before, with much more critical effect, in his film Clockers, where a young child who plays a similar game for the duration of the film, ends up killing another character in the movie.
I don't think it's necessarily a criticism of video game violence, but more so highlighting the problem that violence is becoming so accepted in our soceity that parents willingly or ignorantly let their children play games that are unsuitable for them.
In the case of Clockers, you'd be more likely to blame the negative influence of the child's peers on the murder than the video game, but as usual those with their own agenda will come out and say how video games are corrupting society, thereby revealing their own ignorance.
ck @ Apr 13th 2006 8:05AM
Zsavior,
You made some good points and arguments. I'm not here to talk on my pedestal and point the finger. Nor do I think I'm better than everyone else for working at Blockbuster. I'm sorry if I offended you because I work there.
I don't understand some of your comments and logic, though. What does parents not knowing the rating have to do with the equivalent of kids being violent, acting out The Last Samurai? How will only kids see Inside Man, by my account? And a college kid is a demographic marketed by several industries, just to let you know.
I am just trying to make an observation that violence in our society is not all of the parents' fault, nor is it the entertainment industry's fault. We are all to blame. There is nothing wrong with violence. But Mr. Lee was trying to point out, simply, that the glorification of violence, especially in video games, has gotten out of hand. I agree.
And I should be able to discredit your argument if you cannot take the time to look back at what your wrote and correct your spelling errors and grammar because it comes off as a knee-jerk reaction to the post or comment and not something well thought out.
ck @ Apr 13th 2006 8:10AM
*look back at what you wrote
Martin @ Apr 13th 2006 8:52AM
Ok first of all, using the videogame in the movie was showing the fathers lack of attention to what the kid was up to. Sure videogames don't make people violent, but if there is a kid, and all the kid knows is what happens in the games and has no parental figure to guide him/her, then the game could ultimately make an impression on the kid's decisions in life. This is a call to parents.
Now everyone saying the ESRB, yeah whatever!!!. It is the punk kids at retail stores who let kids buy the stuff that make this all a problem. If only the people who were meant to play the games were able to get their hands on them, there never would have been any of these debates and problems. And I have witnessed retailers selling to kids just to look cool and not be a bad guy.
Finally, The scene in do the right thing where he burns down the pizza place, was not because there were no black people on the wall, it was because everyone in the area wanted to kill the shop owner, and the only way to nonviolently make the people feel like the one kid dying was paid for was by burning down the pizza place. This action calmed the people because 1, they got to take something from them, but 2, they realized how irrational they were being because the pizza place and the family that ran it was part of the neighborhood and part of their lives, and family.
RocketSeason @ Apr 13th 2006 9:58AM
Wow, Lots of good comments. I'll keep mine short.
There is a big difference between the type of violence shown in games like "Eternal Champions" and games like "Grand Theft Auto 3"
The diffrence: One is cartoon violence, the other is simulated acts of violence against innocent people and Law enforcement officials.
I am not saying that GTA is the cause of violence, But it certainly doesn't help the situation any.
doom3 @ Apr 13th 2006 11:28AM
He's just pissed because he didn't make crash or hustle and flow or atl. It's not the games that make kids bad it's seeing a drug dealer in your community make more money than a doctor... Then the means to how they got there... I mean every one wants the fast solution and there is none. There are real reason to why there is so much violence and video games is just a reaction to those real reasons.... I don't think it's up to media to change the world other wise religious books should stop wars right? Untill you walk around in a force feild you will always have violence.
jason @ Apr 13th 2006 1:10PM
38 (Martin) - Now everyone saying the ESRB, yeah whatever!!!. It is the punk kids at retail stores who let kids buy the stuff that make this all a problem. If only the people who were meant to play the games were able to get their hands on them, there never would have been any of these debates and problems. And I have witnessed retailers selling to kids just to look cool and not be a bad guy.
Well, they should be fired then. If I could've done what I wanted at TRU when I used to work there, I wouldn't have sold an M rated game to a kid, regardless of whether their mommy said that "little Jimmy just loves shooting hookers!".
In the past, most violent games either sucked (Night Trap, Friday the 13th (NES)) or were ugly as hell due to graphic limitations, and therefor not grotesque. However, with the advances in graphics, we've gotten to the point in the last few console cycles (PS1/Saturn to present day) where graphics can match and/or exceed movies, and now suddenly they're underfire because you're allowed to do anything you want (from helping a town to fight off vampires to shooting police in the face). Does this mean videogames are evil? No. It means that people are fucked up, and only the ones who can deal with that fact should be able to play these games.
If you're running around Oblivion burning people alive for laughs, then thats no problem. If you suddenly run out to the local WalMart and start lighting people on fire because "zomg, it wuz cool in teh game!", someone should've stopped you from playing that game in the first place, because obviously your grasp on reality is lacking.
We shouldn't be policing what other people play. I have no right to tell little Jimmy that shooting hookers in a game is bad. Because its not. Shooting hookers in REAL LIFE is bad. But mommy and/or daddy needs to get that message across, and maybe put down the Red Book/stop watching Sports Center and read the back of the damn box and make an educated decision for their child, instead of passing the blame off on someone else.
Zsavior @ Apr 13th 2006 3:39PM
I am not going to say if what I wrote is incomprehensible you don't have a valid point in discounting it. Also I agree with you when you say we are to blame. You are right comparing Last Samurai having an impact on a childs reactions as compared to a videogame Like GTA is much different. The only problem I do have is, take a director like Spike Lee someones work whose personally I have respected, because he choose to do what he felt was important rather than what society or mainstream hollywood viewed important.
Well you take Spike Lee and you have him make a comment on an already very one sided debate with politicians, entertainers, and parents all demonizing videogames rather than trying to understand the society we live in that views this type of entertainment enjoyable. To me it is kind of like the same people during the fifties that said Rock&Roll would lead to the downfall of society, with underage pregnancy, violence, rebellion, and all sorts of wild accusations that just aren't true prove by we see today. Is Rock&Roll blameless no it did give inspiration to those who were already heading down a certain path, but not every road built by ROck&ROll was paved by the devil, and this is my problem with the way Mr Lee describes his scene.
Whether the scene in the movie depicts a fathers inability to raise his son correctly, Spike Lee points towards videogames rather than real Social, and Political reason for gang warfare in urban city life. Your ideas about an open dialogue is true, but will that ever happen if we continue to treat videogames, as the gateway drug towards violence? Did the protest against ROck&Roll stop teenage pregnancy, or did it just draw attention away from the real social issues at hand?
Also I am sincerely sorry if some of the things I have posted are grammatically imcomprehensible. See sometimes when I read these topics it makes my blood boil, and I am typing in a rage. So rather than making sure everything I write is correct I am just trying to hold my thoughts together with out imploding. Not saying you directly angered me I mean the topic in general. I do agree the violence in or society is gloried and heinous, what I can't agree with is vilifying one type of media because it is the new kid on the block. We have to come to some sort of conclusion as to why parents can't sit down with the children, why do we find reliving acts of depravity fun, we have to start asking why the lack of consequence actually exsist in these actions, with out just placing the blame all in one place.
ck @ Apr 13th 2006 5:42PM
ZSavior, I totally agree with everything you say. It's everywhere in our society. The good thing is there are places like this where people will see good debates/discussions about these important topics. Video games do get a bad rep and people really need to take a look at media as a whole and what communities and families are doing to prevent these stereotypes and problems. I wish I had some answers, but at least people are talking about this, and I think one good thing Mr. Lee did in his quote was let us talk about it more open-mindedly.
But props to Joystiq for putting up relevant video game news that is more than just "Sweet new Revolution/PS3 details" or "Such and such is delayed" than most other gaming sites.
The Jerk @ Apr 14th 2006 1:23PM
"Funny how Koreans move into the same neighborhoods,
play the same videogames and yet don't slaughter each other." -The Jerk
"That is the most ignorant statement on this comment section. You're just stereotyping Koreans and Blacks and basically saying it's the black community's fault? WTF?" -ck
What is so ignorant about it? Koreans have much lower crime rates than blacks. It's not a stereotype, it's a fact.
Madster @ Apr 14th 2006 4:44PM
Everyone talks about hookers in GTA.
I ask, how do you spot them? I'm having trouble finding any.
And that's not because I want to kill one, you sick bastard, it's because I want some fun. And money. Coz they pay me.
See, I drove them around to their johns and took care of the ones that got violent. And took a cut.
But then, the ones who don't play it don't even know you can do that. Or that you can play a fireman or drive an ambulance and rescue people. Or that there's a strong anti-drug theme troughout all the game.
No, the media just likes to bludgeon hookers.
Sick f'ers. Then they highlight the murders at 11.
And everyone watches.
PS: Around here, you go to college around age 18. That makes "college kid" an oximoron, as there are no kids in college, only adults.
John Eaglet @ May 1st 2006 4:52AM
I have to say...all this "GTA defending" is absolutely pathetic
I'll admit that GTA is an enjoyable game, but lets not depict as some sort of herald against censorship that must be saved from the grubby hands of evil movie directors, repubblicans, and televangelists.
Rockstar games is making MILLIONS on these games. The whole "GTA Franchise" is estimated at a Billion dollars plus.
And why? Two reasons: 1 - The game is well made and enjoyable 2 - (probably more important) it raises controversy at a shocking rate
Controversy sells, and rockstar knows this only too well. Rockstar has offended Italians, Haitians, cubans, african-american, hispanic etc...
Why? Because it's easy to do so. It's easy to offend ethnic minorities when you're scottish!
And what for? For money, nothing more. All that "anti-capitalism" commentary on the GTA radio stations is quite ironic when you consider that GTA is the very Avatar of Capitalism itself.
Spike Lee has a point actually, you can hate him all you want (and many do, he certaintly isn't a likeable person) but he is saying something very valid for the black comunity. I repeat: The BLACK comunity...not your suburban WASP comunity, but urban BLACK.
His message isn't intended for caucasians at all. So go on playing GTA all you like, feel good about "making a statement by blowing gangsta's head off", get all hot and bothered whenever someone dares to feel offended by GTA's INTENTIONALLY OFFENSIVE MATERIAL and continue pumping cash into Rockstars scottish-checkered pockets.
Spike Lee is attacking the glorification of black gang violence. A glorification promoted not only by video games but also by rap music and consumer goods. If anyone of you has ever seen Spike Lee's excellent film "Bamboozled" you know exactly what he is talking about (By the way, the "Da Bomb" beverage appears at the end of the "inside man", in the hands of the sleeping man on the couch).
White people glorifying violent gang culture to sell products to blacks.
This is why Spike Lee is offended (and rightly so) by San Andreas.
Comment number 19 had an excellent point, by the way. Of course, it was in favour of "censoring our holy game" so you all jumped on him...well, theres nothing to worry: GTA makes so much money that it will never be taken off the shelves, believe me: Money talks, and Rockstar games has enough money to keep themselves in the stores. Alongside legions of idiotic gamers ready to take up their arms and fight to the death in favour of Rockstar Game's (and Take 2' s, lets not forget) great investment.
Good work kids: Buy, play, die, never criticize. You're excellent consumers.