Wiimote controller or Xbox Live? Which is the bigger innovation?

http://www.net4tv.com/Voice/Story.cfm?storyID=2161
http://www.cnn.com/TECH/computing/9911/10/online.consoles.idg/index.html
http://www.planetdreamcast.com/features/dc2000/
...And it's name was SegaNet.
Maybe Nintendo can Sega to rerelease SegaNet for the Wii.

People Nintendo did make all the controller innovations we see today.

Analog joysticks were crap not even capable of self centering. Nintendo refined it and made it standard. Guess what without Nintendo PS1, PS2, xbox wouldn't have any analog joysticks. Ninendo invented the modern analog joystick which has varying levels of pressure and 360-degree control. Something past analog sticks didn't have. So yes Nintendo is reponsible for the innovation of the analog stick.

After the N64 controller was shown in Japan Sony rushed back and rereleased the PS1 controller with dual analog joysticks. When rumble was shown off on the N64 Sony once again redesigned their controllers.

Rumble not really used for games. Nintendo refined it and made it work with games to make you have a more interactive expierence with the game.

D-pad yes Nintendo does own the patents on it because they came out with it for their game and watch handhelds.

Btw a number of the Game and Watch units were dual screen as well as having a clam shell.

Nintendo made wireless controllers that were actually innovative. They consumed very little battery life, they didn't overheat, they were well constructed, relatively inexpiensieve and were responisve.

Prior wireless controllers weighed as much as a brick, used Infrared meaning any reflective surface or other Infraed signal such as a tv remote would fubar the controller signal. Also it was line of sight. Battery life was such you would spend hundreds of dollars on batteries every year.

Bother to look things up. The wavebird was the first party wireless controller considered to actually be worth owning.

Notice after the gamecube wavebird the other companies announced wireless controllers would be the standard. Guess what they weren't planning to do a wireless controller until they saw the wavebird work like a charm.

So yes Nintendo is reponsible for the controllers you see today.

The intellivision used a 16 direction pad. Not a frigging d-pad. D-pads are a four directional pad. All d-pads are based on the Nintendo d-pad.

Maybe Nintendo can get Sega to rerelease a new version of SegaNet for the Wii. that's what I meant.

The man is owned by Microsoft. What did you think he would say?

Comparing Wii Controller to Xbox Live is stupid. Its like comparing chalk with cheese. Its even MORE Stupid to speculate on which if any will flop. Live is here now doing good for Microsoft. Wii isnt even out yet so nobody knows a thing apart from appearance.

Personally I think Xbox Live is great, but not innovative, more inevitable. If it wasn't Microsoft it would be someone else who'd bring gaming masses together online in the console world. Its almost like they have taken a big chunk of ideas from PC gaming and melded it all in one tidy setup.

Wii controller IS innovative in theory. I just can't wait to see how its used!

Both are neat and innovative. X-Box Live set the bar on how online console gaming should be done with it's ease of use and almagmation of the best features PC gaming had to offer. The Wii remote has the potential to bring new types of games to consoles in the same
way the DS has with handhelds (as well as offering a new way to play existing genres). Another consideration is that we still haven't seen all of it's features. So it's a little early to judge, considering MS has a four or five year head start, and controller hardware and an online service are two very different beasts anyway. Is anyone at all surprised at the response given by Moore? His job is to hype up the X-Box, and that's what he did. If Reggie was being interviewed, he'd be hyping Nintendo in the same way.

Personally I'm more interested in Nintendo's console. As much as I like what Live has to offer, I'm not much of an online gamer. I'll log on every once in a while, but I'm not the type who plays nightly and has uber-skills. The fact that Nintendo's service is free (excluding the virtual console games) and wireless is a major plus for me. I can't justify the cost of yearly Live subscription for myself, since I wouldn't use it that much. Nintendo REALLY needs to do something about those annoying friend codes though. I know why they're there, I still think they suck. :)

Microsoft and their Fanboys are pure BS

you know, my love of nintendo is rather unconditional and irrational, so i can understand somebody loving microsoft that way. i love nintendo like my cousin likes disney. now, i look at the xbox live marketplace, and what they've done is make a cheap internet experience. you pay a few bucks for a little game here and there; on a tengent, the genius part of that is that you can't figure out the math of buying something without thinking. anyhow, it's made the internet small, and dedicated to games, and optimized for it.
the wiimote is motion capture gaming. it's been done, but it's opening up the possibility to a sider set of games. in fact, every game for the system will be able to use it, a lot of genres being optimized by it, and a lot of new genres being invented for it. it seems less limited and more open, towards the future, higher and higher until the world declares shiggy king of all the world! i will be his most loyal servant. one can hope.

Post #199 from idioteraser:
"People Nintendo did make all the controller innovations we see today."

THANK YOU, idioteraser! Keeping erasing these idiotic comments against Nintendo's leagues of innovation.

To address the article:
X-Box Live is a nice service that refined online play for console players (that is until Nintendo Wi-Fi gets into the arena).
The Wii controller or Wiimote is nothing SHORT of an innovation.
That's the end of story.
And Nintendo once again as so many times before will make this controller the industry standard.
What a revolutionary company! So glad they joined the gaming biz. Gaming would not be where it is today if Nintendo wasn't here, plain and simple, & I dare ANYBODY to challenge me on that point.

For those who doubt what many posters including idioteraser has said about Nintendo being the standard maker in the gaming biz, read the following (long but informative):

=First Generation= (1972-1977)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_video_game_consoles_%28first_generation%29

~Magnavox Odyssey (1972) [1st videogame home console]
http://www.vidgame.net/PONG/odyssey.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnavox_Odyssey
[[below is the pic of the controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/PONG/magnavox/ody_cont.jpg

~Atari Darlene/PONG (1975) [one of the MANY Pong systems of the time]
http://www.vidgame.net/PONG/darlene.htm
http://www.vidgame.net/PONG/ataripong.htm
[[controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/PONG/Pongatari.JPG

~Coleco Telstar (1976) [just like Atari's build basically, clone]
http://www.vidgame.net/PONG/TELSTAR.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coleco_Telstar
[[controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/PONG/coleco/coleco_telstarsys.JPG
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Coleco_Telstar_Alpha.jpg


=Second Generation= (1977-1983)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_video_games_%28second-generation_systems%29

~Fairchild Channel F (1976) [check out the controller]
http://www.vidgame.net/fairchild/FAIRCHILD.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairchild_Channel_F
[[controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/fairchild/fairchild/chf_cont.jpg

~Atari 2600 (1977) [1st system to popularize removable cartridges instead of built-in games & standardized the infamous joystick controller design for years to come]
http://www.vidgame.net/ATARI/CX2600A.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atari_2600
[[controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/ATARI/Atari/2600_periph/2600_joy.jpg

~Magnavox Odyssey 2 (1978) [first system to have a built-in keyboard]
http://www.vidgame.net/MAGANAVOX/ody2.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnavox_Odyssey%C2%B2
[[controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/MAGANAVOX/Magnavox/o2/o2_cont.jpg
http://www.vidgame.net/MAGANAVOX/Magnavox/o2/o2_hardcont.jpg

~Mattel Intellivision (1980) [high-powered advanced system in graphics & audio being 1st 16-bit console]
http://www.vidgame.net/MATTEL/intl1.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intellivision
[[controller on side]]
http://www.vidgame.net/MATTEL/Mattel/intv1/intv1.jpg

~Atari 5200 (1982) [combining the joystick with Intellivision's design to compete; 1st analog joystick]
http://www.vidgame.net/ATARI/5200.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atari_5200
[[controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/ATARI/Atari/5200/5200_cont2.jpg

~GCE/Milton Bradley Vectrex (1982) [also with analog stick & a rectangular multibutton design though not made to fit in the hands]
http://www.vidgame.net/Milton_Bradley/vectrex.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vectrex
[[controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/Milton_Bradley/vectrex/controller.jpg

~Sega SG-1000 Mark I (1983)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SG-1000
[[controller]]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Sg1000.jpg


=Third Generation= (1983-1988)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_video_game_consoles_%28third_generation%29

~Nintendo Famicom (1983)/Nintendo Entertainment System (1985) [STANDARDIZED this design throughout the industry; a soon to be familiar refrain)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_Entertainment_System
http://www.vidgame.net/NINTENDO/FAMICOM.htm
http://www.vidgame.net/NINTENDO/NES1.html
[[controller]] (Gumpei Yokoi's Game & Watch D-Pad standard still exists with us to this very day)
http://www.vidgame.net/NINTENDO/Nintendo/famicom/famicom_cont.jpg
http://www.vidgame.net/NINTENDO/Nintendo/nes_periph/cont.jpg

~Sega SG-1000 Mark III (1985)/Sega Master System (1986) [note the controllers]
http://www.vidgame.net/SEGA/MASTERS.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sega_SG-1000_Mark_III
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sega_Master_System
[[controller]]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Sega_MarkIII_Joypad.jpg
http://www.vidgame.net/SEGA/Sega/Master_System/sms_cont.jpg

~Atari 7800 (1986) [again note the controller]
http://www.vidgame.net/ATARI/7800.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atari_7800
[[controller]]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Atari_7800_system.PNG


=Fourth Generation= (1988-1994)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_video_game_consoles_%28fourth_generation%29

~NEC PC Engine (1987)/Turbo-Grafx 16 (1989) [despite this system's superior specs, Nintendo's controller standard still remains]
http://www.vidgame.net/NEC/TG16.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TurboGrafx_16
[[controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/NEC/NEC/tg_acc/tg_cont.jpg

~Sega Mega Drive (1988)/Sega Genesis (1989) [aesthetics aside, Nintendo's standard still rules]
http://www.vidgame.net/SEGA/GEN1.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sega_Mega_Drive/Sega_Genesis
[[controller]] (Sony would do the same in the future by doubling up on existing standard)
http://www.vidgame.net/SEGA/Sega/genesis_acc/gen_3cont.jpg

~Nintendo Super Famicom (1990)/Super Nintendo Entertainment System (1991) [introducing the shoulder trigger standard AND a lesser known standard...color-coded buttons...as well as button layout)
http://www.vidgame.net/NINTENDO/SFAMICOM.htm
http://www.vidgame.net/NINTENDO/SNES1.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Nintendo_Entertainment_System
[[controller]] (this color-coding exists even today)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:SNES_800.jpg
http://www.vidgame.net/NINTENDO/Nintendo/snes_acc/2snes_cont2.jpg


=Fifth Generation= (1994-2000)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_video_game_consoles_%28fifth_generation%29

~Panasonic/Sanyo/Goldstar 3DO (1993) [this system follows SNES's trigger standard & Sega's adaptation of the old NES standard in this controller]
http://www.vidgame.net/3DO/3DO.html
http://www.vidgame.net/3DO/PANASONIC3D0.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3DO_Interactive_Multiplayer
[[controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/3DO/3DO/fz1/3DO_cont.jpg
http://www.vidgame.net/3DO/3DO/goldstar/3do_goldstarcont.jpg

~Atari Jaguar (1993) [Atari didn't know WHAT to do with themselves! Following pre-Nintendo standards like the keypad/calculator, NES's design & Sega's adaptation of that standard all at once! Whew!]
http://www.vidgame.net/ATARI/JAG.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atari_Jaguar
[[controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/ATARI/Atari/Jaguar/jaguar_cont.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Atarijaguar.jpg

~Sega Saturn (1994) [are those L/R shoulder triggers I see on there? Why yes they are! Gotta admit Sega's redoubled adaptation of the NES standard made Street Fighter 2 easier to play on their controllers]
http://www.vidgame.net/SEGA/saturn2.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sega_Saturn
[[controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/SEGA/Sega/Saturn/saturn_big.jpg
http://www.vidgame.net/SEGA/Sega/Saturn/saturn_cont.jpg

~Sony Playstation (1994) [Sony learned a lot from Nintendo in their time together & this system is proof. Like Sega going Super-Saiyan & doubling the design: TWO L's & TWO R's. Making it essentially a SUPER Super Nintendo controller; Sony DID however bring memory cards into the gameworld]
http://www.vidgame.net/SONY/psx.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_PlayStation
[[controller]] (BEFORE N64)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Playstation_Controller.jpg

~Nintendo 64 (1996) [new standard; 1st reliable analog stick with centering; hello again color-coding; later would make another standard with 'rumble pak' technology]
http://www.vidgame.net/NINTENDO/N64.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_64
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rumble_Pak
[[controller & rumble pak]]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Nintendo_64.jpg
http://www.vidgame.net/NINTENDO/Nintendo/n64_acc/n64_rumble.jpg

*The aftermath:
Sega Saturn's Nights Into Dreams analog controller (1996)
http://www.vidgame.net/SEGA/Sega/Saturn/saturn_3d.jpg

Sony Playstation's Dual Shock (1997)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Stockdual.jpg


=Sixth Generation= (2000-2005)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_video_game_consoles_%28sixth_generation%29

~Sega Dreamcast (1998) [Sega took awhile to come around but they finally fully let go of the old NES standard & got with the SNES & N64 standards even if they tried to redesign the aesthetics like they always do; but they DID have analog triggers]
http://www.vidgame.net/SEGA/DC.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sega_Dreamcast
[[controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/SEGA/Sega/dc_acc/3dc_contwt.jpg

~Sony Playstation 2 (2000) [Sony knows who really runs the biz & kept following the SNES standard with a "Shocking Duo" of N64 standards. When in doubt, double it up; have to give credit to them for putting the rumble within however]
http://www.vidgame.net/SONY/PS2.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_2
[[controller]]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Sony_Dual_Shock_2.JPG

~Nintendo Gamecube (2001) [the evolved design of the SNES/N64 standard. Sega's analog triggers are here Sony's evolution with the built-in rumble is here too. The C buttons have now become an secondary analog C-stick. Z is now by the R-trigger. Nothing too revolutionary here until the functional wireless Wavebird came along & changed the game again]
http://www.vidgame.net/NINTENDO/GAMECUBE.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_GameCube
[[controllers: original & wireless Wavebird]]
http://www.vidgame.net/NINTENDO/Nintendo/Gamecube/gcn_cont.jpg
http://www.vidgame.net/NINTENDO/Nintendo/Gamecube/gcn_wavebird.jpg

~Microsoft X-Box (2001) [brought the hard-drive into the console biz but just by looking at the controller we know who's the leader & who's the follower]
http://www.vidgame.net/MICROSOFT/XBOX.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xbox
[[controller]]
http://www.vidgame.net/MICROSOFT/microsoft/accessories/xbox_conts.jpg
http://www.vidgame.net/MICROSOFT/microsoft/accessories/xbox_jpnsmall.jpg

=Seventh Generation?= (2005-???)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_video_game_consoles_%28seventh_generation%29

~Microsoft X-Box 360 (2005) [who's your daddy?]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xbox_360
[[controller]] (wireless? like Wavebird?)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Xbox_360.jpg

~Sony Playstation 3 (2006???/2007???) [still hanging on Nintendo's old standards, eh? better hope that boomerang don't come back to haunt you]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_3
[[controller]] (wireless like Wavebird too?)
http://ps3media.ign.com/ps3/image/article/614/614736/e3-2005-playstation-3-the-controller-20060114112822893.jpg

~Nintendo Wii (2006???) [innovation incarnate]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wii
You can bet your bottom dollar that another revolution is in the making. Get ready for the new standard.
[[controller]]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:RevolutionController.jpg


Now that should finally settle that silly little argument. Whew!!
John Lucas

online gaming is online gaming and online gaming was around for the longest time.. if i can remember even the NES had some kind of online function and Dreamcast had it too, dont even start with computers thats been around forever so how is online play new? innovation = new methods, advanced, and original iono how in the world XBL is any of those.. i remember playing starcraft online bkuz online gaming is old and is nothing new putting it on a console is common sence its like putting wireless controllers on a console its like evolution not innovation.

People don't forget the Famicon differences to the NES.

And the prototype NES.
http://smbis.nescentral.com/commentary/nintendoworld.htm

It should be noted tape recorders were a form of hard drive used in many computers of that era and before.

Notice standard IR wireless controllers. It's all wireless. It was ditched because it was thought to be too intimadting to the American consumer.

It even had game editing on it. Something that the Wii is rumored to have as well due to plans for the gamecube having it being scrapped due to all the accesories one would need to buy. Accessories that are standard with the Wii.

Okay, Chris D... You type WAY too much. Plus, you're contradicting yourself.

"IS the WII MOTE innovative - ok you changed my mind guys.... oh wait.. no you didn;t -- It's not innovative. It's evolutionaly but thats different becuase that means the technolgy has been used before."

So, basically, you're saying that Xbox Live is using some new sci-fi technology called "The Internet" which has never been seen before? Internet gaming has been seen a long time ago, so you're disproving your own point.

Nintendo Wii is more innovative than Xbox Live. Period. For one, I have a 360. Xbox live is great. It comes at a price though. And as others have stated, online gaming has been done before on PC. I don't see any comparison, actually. Nintendo Wii is changing video game control as we know it, and Xbox Live gives you the outstanding ability to listen to twelve year olds cuss every other word for 10 bucks a month.

Why don't we all just calm down. Everybody is just trying to defend their favorite companies and they are forgetting what the actual debate is about. Some media guy asks a Microsoft spokesman what he thinks about a Nintendo product and the M$ guy redirects attention to his product. No surprise... thats how business works.

On the argument on which technology is more innovative, online gaming in 2000 or 3D spacial sensing controllers with tilt and awe gyros in 2006, I guess it would be a matter of opinion.

Arguments for XBOX LIVE:
-Subscription based service for multiplayer capability ($$$$)
-One of the better interfaces for connecting to the online service
-Large scale implimentation in games.

Arguments for WiiTroller
-First true motion sensing controller (light guns used shade recognition, glove used corded movement censors, gyromouse just didnt work)
-Remote like design to garner new gamers already familiar with remote like devices.
-Custom Controller cradles (ie. Gun mount, tennis racket, fishing pole) to mimic in game devices. (while not entirely new (ie. custom light guns) these are the first to use one controller but just impliment different shells).

Arguments against XBOX LIVE
-Pay to play business practices had already been in use in the MMORPG genre.
-Battle.net
-Gamespy.net
-Boneyards.net
-Lan Parties
-And most importantly of all, since it was the first successful console service, that playstation one that nobody remembers the name of (at least I dont).

Arguments against the Wiitroller (since I havent used this device, these are all speculative)
-Scepticism about the simplistic design
-Dumb Name
-Will really tire my wrist out and possibly cut into my hmm other wrist time time.
-Probably causes cancer

Arguments against arguing
-Its dumb, nobody will change their mind because all our notions are preconceived going in.

Cmon seriously now.I have all the systems, so please take that to heart. How can you say that Live is more innovative.Its not like Microsoft just got together one day and said," no one plays games online over the internet, lets make it a reality." Even if we weren't comparing to the Wii controller, I wouldn't say its revolutionary. Everything live does you can already do. Even though they are consoles they are still computers, and things like gaming, IMing each other, and downloading has been going on for years, I mean AT LEAST a decade. They were just the 1st ones of the BIG 3 to seriously commit to online gaming.And its not like its free. And its not like its free. they aren't even providing you with the connection. They charge you for live and for some downloads. To me it was common sense to do XBOX Live not a innovative revolution. And if it was truly innovative why isn't every gamer on live. Many a night I have searched other games besides Halo for fellow gamers and they are few and far between. Show me a game system that has more than one kick ass game that everyone wants to play, and I'd call that more innovative, than saying"well we are PC company with experience with the internet and online gaming, how can we intergrate this into our console?" Thats not innovation its smart.

Now for all of you who say the same thing about Nintendo's controller that it isn't innovative, I'll tell you this.All that crap they tried before didn't work. They power glove, ,virtual boy, etc. did not work. And they were coompletely different.All you Fanboys need to do some research on the controller and its functionality.Its not just a souped up light gun.The system not only detects its psotion but also where the controller is at on the 3d plane.Its knows how far or how close it is to the tv. It knows if the controller has been rotated or turned on its side.its can read how fast or slow you are moving the controller, and that just movement.There is also an unamed function they aren't letting on about.It has the same buttons you would expect, but its not like they just changed the shape and added new buttons.They have changed the functionality of how traditional controllers work.Thats whats innovative.

Now on all this I haven't seen,its all just what I have read from developers who have ACTUALLY worked on the games and the controller, and of course Nintendo itself.

My thing is IF IT WORKS, then yeah hands down no contest you'd be crazy to say Live is more innovative.If the controller doesn't do what they say it does, then post me a nasty reply.Until we all play or see it you can't say. E3 is next week and we will all see for certain just how revolutionary it is, and then maybe Wii can all enjoy games in a new way again.

Here's wat i think! Firstly, QUIT HATIN'! Just because Nintendo has made something better than the other console peoples doesn't mean u have 2 hate it! The Wii controller is a way better way to play than the Live! I mean every one knew the live wuz commin, but who thought of the wii? You can't say you had thought of it before (well maybe you can but...)! Sure they had done it be4, but not in this way>>>>> Imagine the possibilities! And in the end, the Wii will be able to do just the same as the "Live"...

the wii controller looks ok, but i've seen gimmick input devices come and go. I figure the wii controller will be more of a gimmick that older players will tire of quickly. at least we can still use gamecube controllers. virtual reality was the "awesome" way to game for a while, the powerglove and r.o.b. sucked, and for me, the "dual screen/touch screen" ds was completely underwhelming. it was ok, but wasn't the "new incredible crap-your-pants" gaming experience that nintendo acted like it was. same thing will probably happen to the wii controller. Nintendo need something to attract more interest in their consolethan more mario/zelda games, and this controller is, at least for me, a novelty made to produce hype. --which it is doing very successfully. gaming wise, i can't see myself wanting to use that thing long-term.

as far as xbox live goes, it is great.
pc users brag on pc all the time, but here is the key innovation of xbox live:

--4 players on one television screen playing online.

show me a pc game that supports 4 player split screen, so three buddies and I can all sit on the couch and play together and i'll give pc gaming more credit. even if you could name such a game, is it practical to have your pc hooked directly up to your tv? for most people it is not.

additionally, as pc fanboys are so proud to point out, they can use mouse and keyboard. well, that kinda sucks if you have friends over. xbox360 = 4 wireless controllers and one tv.

'nuff said.

Chris D, you are annoying.

Hmm to take neither side i will. For the simple fact that the Wii-mote is a damn T.V. remote with Nintendo's name on it, so it isnt as original as we all would like it to be. And X-box live isnt an original concept either. Like many already stated it does things that have been going on in the P.C. for years. SO look at it like this Nintendo's controller = TV remote. X-box live + X-box = Fancy Microsoft Computer. I'll be amazed when something ORIGINAL IS CREATED.

Hmm... what's with all the arguing anyways? It takes an overly excessive fan to argue about things like this. I am mostly a Nintendo fan. Mostly because Nintendo has been in my life ever since I can remember, the consoles are affordable, and you can't beat first party titles such as Mario, Zelda, and Metroid. With that said, other than Nintendo I only buy a console for its games, not whatever innovation their might be with the system. There are plenty of games I love on the PlayStation consoles such as the Final Fantasy series. There was not one game I ever liked on the Xbox that wasn't already available on either the GameCube or PC. I am going to get an Xbox 360 very soon (like within a week or so) and I don't even care at all whatever it offers for online gaming. Of course I do like the idea of being able to download extra content for my games and I'm really digging the thought of downloadable demos on a console. I have yet to be impressed with the PlayStation 3 except for Final Fantasy XIII. Overall I am mostly excited about the Wii because it is something new, a breath of fresh air. I will definantly get it but I will probably also get a PS3, and like I said, I'll be getting an Xbox 360 within a week or so. I am also a hardcore PC gamer, but not for online gameplay. I despise the idea of online games. I love games with good, solid single-player gameplay. The only online games I play are MMORPGs.

Basically what it all boils down to is a game console is only as good as its games. Let's look at the Nintendo DS versus the Sony PSP. The DS was initially thought of to be gimmicky and childish. Well now look at them. The PSP is far more powerful but MUCH less popular, mostly because of its bad games. Sure there are plenty of flop titles on the DS but the DS also have those hit games that the PSP can't even compare with. The PSP only has a FEW hit titles. Now look at which handheld system was more innovative. The DS with its touch screen or the boring playstation controller with a screen on it?

This is what I am trying to say, do not judge a system before you even play it (I did so with the original Xbox and was unfortunately proven to be right, but that rarely happens), and if you have played it, don't base your opinion about it from only a few games. Oh and one last thing, I have to let the minor Nintendo fanboy in me out for a minute. Nintendo invented online gaming on consoles. The very first NES had only gaming abilities, it is just that no game released in anywhere except Japan used those abilities.

P.S. - HALO IS THE MOST OVER HYPED GAME EVER! IT IS ONE OF THE MOST GENERIC FIRST PERSON SHOOTERS I HAVE EVER PLAYED AND FELT COMPLETELY UNFINISHED! ... but that's just my opinion.

And once again, like I said, I buy consoles for its games, not its controllers or its online services, though I can honestly say I am pretty excited over the Wii's controller.