Nintendo verifies GameCube housing at E3 [update 1]
And we thought the GameCube wasn't at E3 ...Thanks in part to a broken Wii title and a quick attendee, pictures have been floating around the internet that prove the Wii consoles we were seeing were just displays, and that all of the demos were being run in GameCubes. We've received numerous e-mails about the wire-cluttered image to the right of this post, but now Nintendo of America has come out and confirmed that, in fact, the Wii games were being played through GameCubes -- or, more accurately, Wii hardware embedded in a GameCube, "made specifically for the E3 show and is not the final mass-production version."
NOA's PR Manager Matt Atwood noted that "for some of the games that you've seen, the focus for them was not graphics at all," hinting that a few of the titles may seen graphical improvements. Atwood stated that the system specs are still being finalized, but that their E3 showing was "very indicative of the experience Wii will offer." Don't get your hopes up for vast technical improvements.
To be fair, the PlayStation 3's were being run off dev kits this year, and last year's Xbox 360 games were being played on Apple G5 computers.
[Thanks, kukyfrope and Jeremy]
[update 1: got a little "e"-xcited and added an extra letter to Jeremy's name -- fixed]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Jeremy @ May 19th 2006 6:29PM
It's Jeremy, and I think the controller may have been prototype also:
http://www.xgaming.com/newsletter/Wii%20Dupe.shtml
32_Footsteps @ May 19th 2006 6:32PM
Interesting... but I fear that there will be people who will make a much bigger deal out of this (like they did last year about the 360 games on G5 machines) than it really deserves.
Alkaiser @ May 19th 2006 6:34PM
The difference between Sony and everyone else...they were up front about it. (At least partway. A lot of the PSPs were running on devkit PCs, too.)
Sony had these columns of computers right in plain view of the game you were playing so you knew it was a dev kit. I don't understand why other companies take all the time to fake house the stuff when they could just be upfront about it. People only make a big deal about it if it's hidden.
Echo Box @ May 19th 2006 6:36PM
There's a huge difference running off a G5 vs running off the same platform from last generation.
JaJa_ @ May 19th 2006 6:37PM
Rumor started in an Nsider thread a while back.
Someone I know captured a frame from a HQ conference video.
Note the two orange lights and grey faceplates that look like a Gamecube.
http://pageofrandom.wordpress.com/2006/05/19/was-wii-there/
Goobers @ May 19th 2006 6:40PM
"3. There's a huge difference running off a G5 vs running off the same platform from last generation."
and who did that?
they said though the HOUSING was a GC.. the "guts" was a Wii. ie, they just needed a place to put it.
makes sense if you haven't finalized your hardware... how can you finalize a case around it?
Jeremy @ May 19th 2006 6:41PM
"The Wii hardware we exhibited at E3 2006 was made specifically for the E3 show and is not the final mass-production version. Some of this hardware was cased in Nintendo GameCube housing,"
This seems like BS to me, why would they house it in a GameCube housing instead of a PC case, or any other kind of housing you can think of. The wood displays even. Just think of the backlash of that being seen.
Metroid looked the same as GameCube to me at E3.
striderhayasa @ May 19th 2006 6:41PM
Busted! but I'm not surprised. With final dev kits going out in the near future, who would expect the Wii hardware to be final at e3. Nothing to see here, move along...
Jeremy @ May 19th 2006 6:44PM
This means they had to have the electronics boards engineered to fit into the tiny GameCube housing, why not just make it fit into the similar sized Wii housing?
Ibrahim @ May 19th 2006 6:44PM
there's a big difference between running games on last-gen hardware, and running them on next-gen hardware in a last gen shell. FUD.
Rabish12 @ May 19th 2006 6:45PM
#4: I'd think that maybe they'd put them in a Gamecube case because of the fact that they probably already have several of them, what with the Gamecube being their console and all. It was probably just cheaper to use what they had than to buy new cases (and as we all must know by now, Nintendo does enjoy things that come at a low cost).
Jaded @ May 19th 2006 6:45PM
I think this is sort of a non-issue. Unless the software doesn't run in the manner displayed, or people take this as an indication that the Wii won't make it out by the Holidays, it doesn't really matter.
If they were being played with some sort of pimped up hardware and the demos were showing stuff that couldn't end up in a game (which considering that they were probably running on inferior hardware, probably isn't the case), then there would be an issue.
SuicideNinja @ May 19th 2006 6:46PM
I wouldn't compare this situation to the others. Even if the games were running on regular Gamecubes, how does that matter? The Wii not only uses some Gamecube hardware, but it is backwards compatible with it.
It's not like they were using some uninvolved hardware to be flashy like Sony and Microsoft has done.
Seeing how this fails to be a problem, this should probably be ignored altogether.
R @ May 19th 2006 6:47PM
Personally (as a nintendo fanboy), I almost see this as a good thing. Maybe the final Wii will have a bit more edge in power then these 'Cube abominations. ~_^ (Just a bit, though.)
As for the G5/Xbox thing, I think it's the OS war irony aspect to that story that made it so popular.
Has there been anymore word on whether or not all the Sony displays were running on emulators this year or not?
voice of reason @ May 19th 2006 6:47PM
lol xbox 360 was being run by apple
Jason W @ May 19th 2006 6:48PM
They should not make a big deal out of this. Its just a case. Ive seen NES systems with a built in mini PC or Atari 2600 hand helds. What matters are the games. If they wanted to get these things out quickly its no big deal to put in what they already have. It makes me since they have alot of cube cases already.
The only thing that matters are the games and how fun they are to play.
Hiro Protagonist @ May 19th 2006 6:48PM
Can anyone say...
Red Steel times two?
Super Mario Galaxy times two?
Metroid Prime: Corruption times two?
You get my drift.
Personally, im quite happy with the graphics if they look as sleek as Mario Galaxies'.
Invader Alex @ May 19th 2006 6:52PM
but those Super Mario Gaxaly pictures were so wonderful! All hail the secrets of Nintendo!
But Wii final graphics will probabky be much better!
So yeah...
i just learn about xbox 360 running on the Apple G5 at e3 three last year. Hah Microsoft using Apple, they even know that their computers suck!
Hiro Protagonist @ May 19th 2006 6:53PM
Okay, maybe im over reacting.
They did say "made specifically for the E3 show and is not the final mass-production version." which would mean it will get better.
Maybe two times was an exageration though, sorry for being fanboy-ish.
I appologies to anyone that was offended.
idioteraser @ May 19th 2006 6:55PM
It's been known for quite a while that the final dev kits haven't been distrubted. Also the Graphics chip hasn't been finalized.
With the rumour about processor speed being 50% more then what some sites reported and the comments from Nintendo about the controllers being prototypes at E3 you can bet those games except the tech demos and wii sports will look ten times better.
Heck already the game demos showed off stuff the 360 and PS3 games have a hard time doing.
Btw Nintendo usually improves their games drastically from their E3 showing unless they say the game shown at E3 is the final one.
Sony on the other hand they spend 99% of their effort on the E3 game demos instead of the game's release.
You would be shocked at how most games change from what is shown behind closed doors at E3 then there release. We are talking marked improvements in graphics and control.
I wonder when Joystiq will mention what the Red Steel developer said on IGN insider about Red Steel at E3.
Jeewhiz you had people swearing the game informer images were touched up now people say the game looks terrible even though the game in motion looks as good as most 360 PS3 games. And those games are either released or been done on the final dev kits.
Look you don't spend five years making a graphics chip and keep everything about it a secret.
Nintendo is keeping lots of secrets. Prepare to be shocked upon release.
idioteraser @ May 19th 2006 6:57PM
Cubs bother to reread what Nintendo said. Those were dev kits not even ones at 50% of what the wii can do.
Those demos were made for E3 in other words they don't reflect what is in the current dev kits.
idioteraser @ May 19th 2006 7:00PM
No one has a final dev kit. The graphics chip hasn't been finished.
Hiro Protagonist @ May 19th 2006 7:05PM
Idioteraser is right, in all comments.
And by the way Invader Alex (#15):
Microsoft doesn't do computers. They do Operating Systems (Software).
Its quite different, thats why you could say the Xbox was a pain, using PC parts and different programming.
They improved this generation though.
Darth Pixel @ May 19th 2006 7:26PM
For a company that never lies, it surely looks like Nintendo was trying to con us.
Enycma @ May 19th 2006 7:26PM
People shouldn't be stranged by these pictures. isn't the Wii a pimped up Gamecube? I don't mind if it is, as long as the games are fun. If the graphics get better, then it's good. If they stay the same, it's also good. We all saw how SMG looked, so don't worry. At least give the Gamecube some credit, it said it's farewell in an unusual way! At least it wasn't the Xmac 360 or a PDev3 and it was running in a console that it's considrerd by many as dead.
Andir @ May 19th 2006 7:27PM
lol, I'm just having fun reading the full caps that is "CUBS-BEARS-BULLS-RULE" who is all ready to pounce when someone says something bad about his Wii..."it's cold, it shrinks when it's cold!"
Alkaiser @ May 19th 2006 7:39PM
Darth Pixel:
"Company that never lies"?
Peter Main PERSONALLY lied to me at the GameCube launch press conference. During the Q&A session, I asked if the GameCube would come bundled with two controllers, since college students/high school students don't have the most disposable income.
His official response was, "No, but you can buy a GBA and use that a second controller."
LIAR!
Back to the points, though, this is a non-issue, unless you're a dev, and power honestly concerns you. I doubt anyone else really needs to care about specs, we all just care about the games. Specs are useless until something does something with them.
Slashbunny @ May 19th 2006 7:45PM
OMG! A company is conning us because they aren't using the final hardware version!!!
Who cares what these games are running on? They are supposed to give you an idea of the final product. Noone ever claimed that they were absolutely the final version of the product. Developers developed on these platforms and were given specifications so they would function on the final hardware. What's the problem with you people? Who cares if Xbox360 games were running on non-final hardware? In this case, its even more absurd because they have already claimed that it is Wii hardware in a GameCube case. Even if it's not the final hardware of the Wii, its going to be _close_. Close enough for developers to develop for it. You realize developers can create games for these platforms despite the fact the hardware isn't finalized, right? And therefore, they are going to be running these games on non-final hardware- exactly what they would use at E3.
So if they put it in a NES case, would that mean Wii is using NES hardware?
Now if they made game demos for E3 and claimed that it would be indicative of the final version and it wasn't because they made it specifically to make it look better at E3, then perhaps they were "conning" us. But this isn't the case.
Carmine @ May 19th 2006 7:45PM
I remember Iwata made a remark a while back about how they were planning to release a peripheral that would radically extend the Gamecube's lifecycle. Maybe the original plan was to release Wii control for the Cube.
idioteraser @ May 19th 2006 7:45PM
Nintendo isn't lying like Sony has done throughout the history of the Playstation.
Numerous Nintendo comments show they are tired of getting ripped off and want to keep everything a secret as long as possible.
Various hints that have been dropped show something major with the graphics awaits.
Lets say Nintendo has a way of making HD quality graphics without HD needing to be programmed or the resources needed. That would be something you would want to keep a secret till you were confidant your competitor couldn't do it because if they delayed they would lose out.
Nintendo knows SD hasn't been tapped out. HD is a lot of resources needed to make even an incremental increase. Five years time it would be a different matter. Tools would have come out that make it not an arm and leg.
Look at the tattoed guy in Red Steel demo he looks far more human then anything Sony has on the PS3 or the 360. Get rid of the fake plastic look. Everything doesn't need to have a shiny gloss to it. Nor the people look like a cross between Michael Jackson and some plastic love doll.
idioteraser @ May 19th 2006 7:51PM
Yes the wiimote was meant for the cube however tech problems prevented that.
The demos at E3 for Nintendo were to give people and developers a sense of what the controller can do.
It wasn't about graphics but about playing. Seems like a developers caught onto that but not some bloggers or reporters.
Nick W @ May 19th 2006 7:59PM
CUBS-etc: Could you start using punctuation as well? Maybe also try not posting like a raving lunatic.
And I'm pretty sure the reason they ran the xbox demos on the Apple PowerMac was because it's the only powerful, easily attainable computer with a PowerPC G5 processor (which I believe is similar to what they were going to be using in the system).
amiga_tone @ May 19th 2006 8:42PM
Don't get me wrong but weren't the orriginal Wii dev kits made from modded Gamecubes?
Fandel @ May 19th 2006 8:52PM
Once again, this story has turned into a childish system fan-boy war.
One thing that hasn't been addressed is that if Nintendo still has yet to finalised the controller, let alone the graphics chipset, then there is almost no chance that the Wii will make it out before thanksgiving, and all of the rumors of the Wii making out in late August of September are basically squashed.
Deadpool23 @ May 19th 2006 9:10PM
@38
They can't finalize a graphics chip in 6 months? They have supposedly been working on the chip for a year and half. Of course I could be wrong but this system should be out before thanksgiving, slightly before. It would not be bright of nintendo to not get this out before one of the biggest non-gamer shopping dates of the year.
Samohtas @ May 19th 2006 9:10PM
Found this in the comments of the xbox 360 running on mac article:
Go Apple! BTW, I dont think windows would EVER be used on a mac.. that would be a downgrade in operating system.
Made me laugh ^^
Anyway, I don't care if they were running on a n64, as long as the wiimote works.
Darth Pixel @ May 19th 2006 9:10PM
Well, after E3, I posted on my blog: "Why did Nintendo release a new system? Why didn't they release the Wii controller as a GameCube accessory?"
I guess this question is even more valid now.
In any case, they should never misrepresent what they have on display. When you proudly display something that looks like your next-generation hardware and hide a GameCube under a mass of wires, one can only think they had full intention to mislead.
Nintendo's fans are funny: When PS3 games run on dev kits, it's a big laugh and a sure proof the PS3 is far from ready. When Nintendo does the same thing, they find a way to turn it into something positive.
teh_pwnerer @ May 19th 2006 9:43PM
By the way, "Why did Nintendo release a new system? Why didn't they release the Wii controller as a GameCube accessory?"
What about... it would NEVER sell? There's a whole topic on that issue here http://www.joystiq.com/2006/05/17/360-to-wii-anything-you-can-do-i-can-do-better/#comments
Unless, of course, you were just bashing nintendo :)
Fandel @ May 19th 2006 9:46PM
#39
It's not just finalizing a chipset, you also have to do hardware testing etc, not to mention that you have to finalize the chipset at least 2 months in advance so that you can ramp up production. Remember, Nintendo also needs time to manufacturer the actual system, packaging(they can't just produce millions of game consoles overnight) and distribution. So, in reality, Nintendo only has another couple of months to finalize the chipset if they want to make a mid/late November launch.
Sean @ May 19th 2006 9:56PM
Wtf mate? I tipped this to you guys one or two days ago.
Enigma @ May 19th 2006 10:05PM
Man fantards make me el oh el ... so sticking up for Nintendo and saying who care sif they use a dev kit, yet trash Sony or MSFT for doing the same in their respectful threads.
What pussies!
nootau @ May 19th 2006 10:17PM
Nintendo (and the rest of the gaming industry) has always been this way, they dont finalize hardware until around July/August. That is why Nintendo were surpised that Sony actually gave a price at E3. Because normally, just like Nintendo, Sony finalizes everything around the July after E3, and the price is released around August. Heck,if my memory serves me correctly, its even what microsoft did, following protocol.
Because Nintendo's parts are pretty much "low-end" or "mid-grade", it wont take too long to test and get the system out. Most of the components are already tested/released/off-the-self technology. Unlike say developing a brand new CPU (which microsoft and sony did), and using "bleeding-edge" untested technology (the cell chip). That takes longer to test, and in the end you will always have yield problems and massproduction problems, its just the nature of bleeding edge.
Nintendo, unless they decide to have "bleeding-edge" will get out on time. Companies tape out many different versions of their hardware, Nintendo has two months to decided if they should use the beefed up Wii and sell it for $250 or keep it the "Gamecube Plus" and release it for $199 or under. Either way, it will be out in 2006 and i'll have one.
Gausser @ May 19th 2006 10:42PM
I have to agree with some of the above comments. The PS3 and Wii are upcoming consoles. For these systems, E3 is meant to give consumers a taste of what they can expect. Why would it surprise anyone that they are running on dev kits? Same goes for the games. You can expect major changes or in some cases just fine tuning to the games presented. Personally, I think this is good news. I think the Wii looks awesome. If the graphics are improved somewhat, it's just icing on the cake.
jonat3 @ May 19th 2006 10:44PM
Interesting comments from Ubisoft:
http://boards.ign.com/nintendo_wii_lobby/b8270/117930488/p1/?1
Basically, Red Steel was running on wii hardware, but it was ported from the GC devkits to the wii devkits only 2 weeks prior to E3.
Dom @ May 19th 2006 11:16PM
I think what he REALLY means by Wii hardware is the controller functionality. If anyone remembers, prelim dev kits for Revolution/Wii are just the GC devkit with the wiimote, nunchuk, and motion bar plugging straight in to that.
I don't buy that it was full Wii hardware (processor, graphics chip etc etc) smushed into the GC.
Still good news either way, as improvement for the hardware is almost guaranteed.
shawnz @ May 19th 2006 11:18PM
17: yeah, except Microsoft doesn't make computers.
........*......... @ May 19th 2006 11:19PM
This is the type of article that truly defines a fanboy. Its so hard for them to think bad of nintendo even though they are obviously pulling a fast one. When ms did it, "oh the 360 is a piece of junk", when sony did it, "oh it only makes paninis", when nintendo does it, "well it obviously makes sense that they would house a brand new chip system in a fully sealed gamecube." (doesn't it?) Face it fanboys, even your beloved N pulls the same crap as all the rest.
RSS Feed King @ May 19th 2006 11:22PM
@ Enigma
What's funnier is that Nintendo even HAS fantards.
- FeedBoy
http://www.bigloveboards.com
Anonymous @ May 19th 2006 11:27PM
Revolution/Wii will be out by Thanksgiving, and I hope Halloween... Otherwise they will "lose retailer support."
The good news is the graphics chip is not done. This happens to be Sony's biggest problem at the moment. Nvidia has complained that the PS3 will be severely limited because they were not given enough time to work on the GPU. In fact, the GPU is not as advanced as that of the 360, making the system's overall advantage via the Cell over Xbox 360 very questionable.
Nintendo will optimize their GPU and make it the best on the market for a non-HD system. I expect to see things great and small for Nintendo's platform, and to be surprised again and again, contrary to my Sony and Microsoft expectations. That is how you build brand loyalty--delight your consumer!
While I already have an Xbox 360, the only console I really want in my living room is the Nintendo Revolution/Wii!
idioteraser @ May 19th 2006 11:44PM
Actually ATI has been working on the Hollywood chip for five years. Every detail about it so far has been kept secret. The IGN specs have been discredited by E3.
Nintendo stuff is optimized so you get far more out of it then the specs would say. Gamecube was more powerfull then the PS2 and it was about as powerfull as the XBox. If a game was built for the gamecube hardware it often looked far better then the games built for the xbox hardware.