Xbox BC not a priority, says Moore
In a 180-degree turn from statements made over the past year, it would appear Microsoft is starting to back away from their previous commitment to make "every Xbox game work on the 360." According to Xbox chief Peter Moore, "Nobody is concerned anymore about backwards compatibility. We under promised and over delivered on that." While Moore acknowledges there are still more Xbox compatibility updates on the way, he went on to say he was "stunned" that his team has been able to make hundreds of Xbox titles compatible with the Xbox 360. At last check, fan favorites Panzer Dragoon Orta, Soul Calibur 2, and the Kingdom Under Fire series were still absent from the official list, but you can still play Drake of the 99 Dragons!
If original Xbox games are to be made available over the Xbox Live service, how many of you would be willing to buy them (again)?
See also: The Engadget & Joystiq E3 Interview: Peter Moore
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
Indiana Jones @ Jun 1st 2006 12:49PM
Peter moore trying to cover his ass. They already LIED about b/c and its frankly a pathetic b/c line up. At least the guys at Sony and Nintendo have brains in their heads and realise that the 5 years that you own a console you build up a collection of games that you dont want to become obsolete.
Pretty Obvious @ Jun 1st 2006 12:51PM
Personally I really couldnt care about BC. I bought a 360 to play 360 games. Out with the old and in with the new.
Only game I have ever returned to playing after getting a 360 was Halo 2 and thats really all they needed to do.
Bobby @ Jun 1st 2006 12:51PM
i dont think it should be a priority. if i own a 360, i'd play 360 games on it. Makes use out of your old xbox.
at least he's honest... @ Jun 1st 2006 12:53PM
The Xbox 360 backwards compatibility is a joke.
I have about 3 games that work with the BC. And at last check only one worked well.
Pathetic. MS should remove this from their marketing claims.
I honestly get the feeling J Allard kinda made up BC on the fly, writing a check MS couldn't cash. But still, they got behind it in marketing, they should get behind it on delivering.
Stil no Psychonauts. Only one of the 007 titles. No Mechassault. No PGR2 (PGR3 can't hold PGR2's jock, in terms of depth). No Rallisport Challenge 2. No Full Spectrum Warrior.
But I can play Frogger Beyond.
Bart Lee @ Jun 1st 2006 12:54PM
Looks like Microsoft wants to beat Sony in every facet, including boneheaded comments by senior management. Um, if you claimed to be working towards full b/c and now aren't, I hardly call that over-delivering. Nevertheless, Microsoft remains woefully behind in the boneheaded comments by senior management department. Sony is the clear leader.
Justin @ Jun 1st 2006 12:56PM
I want Mercenariessssss! =(
xbox_lurker @ Jun 1st 2006 12:56PM
How do you "over-deliver" when one of the most popular Xbox exclusives, Panzer Dragoon Orta, is still not supported??
Talk about patting yourseleves on the back for under-achieving. Typical MS doublespeak.
Matt Paprocki @ Jun 1st 2006 12:59PM
#1: How exactly do your old games become "obsolete?" If you have games, you obviously have the system to play them on. What's the problem?
Canadian Geese @ Jun 1st 2006 1:00PM
I have to disagree with Peter Moore on this. I don't care so much about backwards compatibility but I know people who do. If anything, MS over-promised and under-delivered.
On a similar note, I expect Sony to follow in these footsteps as well. Sony is starting to discover (as MS has) that each game will require emulation software to run the games. This eats up valuable space on the hard drive. Sony, though it may have a larger hard drive, has a much larger library of games. The amount of space needed to store this emulation software will be pretty substantial.
My suggestion: Create the emulation software for their entire library, but give the user the option to download only the emulation software for the games he/she chooses. I'll probably shoot an email over to Major Nelson and see what he thinks...
David C @ Jun 1st 2006 1:01PM
I have never cared much about backwards compatibility either. I actually do noy know anyone who really played PS1 games after the PS2 came out and the only game I play on my Xbox 360 that is from the first Xbox is Halo. I just do not see it as that big of a deal.
SuMizzle @ Jun 1st 2006 1:01PM
Backwards compatibility IS a viable offering for the next gen consoles and only porting the easily coded, shitty games is beyond lame. It is too soon to bunch the PS3 into the same league as Nintendo, seeing how they too are using software emulation (like the 360) for BC. While I only have 2 of my 8 Xbox1 games won't play (Conker and Ultimate Spiderman), I sure wish they would. Regardless, I won't be buying any Xbox1 games anyways, so the point is mute.
Thomas Crymes @ Jun 1st 2006 1:03PM
I'm not sure MS ever declared 100% backwark compatibility as a goal. All I remember them saying is that they were going to try to get the best selling games for the XBox work on the 360. It's the kind of nebulous goal that can be declared met at any given time.
If someone knows of a quote from an MS exec that says that their goal is 100% BC, I'd like to see it.
digi @ Jun 1st 2006 1:03PM
I still have my xbox, and all my savegames are on the HDD, i don't know why I'd start playing them from scratch again on my 360. I couldn't care less about BC
Austin @ Jun 1st 2006 1:03PM
I dont know what the big deal is because i will still own my original system. Luckly my girlfriend still has her original NES (in perfect working order i might add) and nobody gets snotty with nintendo for not letting us play mario64 on gamecube. If you sell off your old system its your own fault not M$.
Cage @ Jun 1st 2006 1:04PM
This site must not have many american gamers if one of the most popular Xbox exclusives is Panzer Dragoon Orta. Dont remember that one. Fact is the only game they needed to make backwards compatible was Halo 2. After that...go buy a new game! Unlike the PS2 to the PS1, the 360 is designed for MUCH BETTER GRAPHICS. If you want old graphic games play your old console still and dont buy a new one. Backwards compatability = overrated.
benjamin @ Jun 1st 2006 1:05PM
If backwards compatiblity didn't turn out to be a selling point for the 360, which it obviously hasn't, there really is no point in MS continuing to attempt to improve it.
Backwards compatibility in a new console destroys incentive for late adopters to pick up an inexpensive current gen console. So if that b/c isn't selling 360s, why would they continue to support it given that it may actually be decreasing sales of original xboxs which they've promised to continue supporting for a while still?
Martin @ Jun 1st 2006 1:06PM
SuMizzle, the phrase is "the point is moot." Just an FYI.
As for the B/C issue, there are a crapload of games for the original Xbox that I'd love to buy and be able to play on a 360 when I get one. Not everyone that bought a 360 had the original.
GlitchCog @ Jun 1st 2006 1:07PM
If he's "stunned" at how great they're doing so far on Xbox backwards compatibility, I wonder how he feels about Sony and Nintendo both being 100% backwards compatible this generation.
Flabbergasted? Positively awestruck? Riveted into a state of pure amazement?
Prof-KOS @ Jun 1st 2006 1:08PM
"We under promised and over delivered on that."
I had to read that statement 3 times before it clicked because it makes no sense. If you promised ful BC and delivered something far short of that you didn't 'over deliver'. That's among the more idiotic statements I've heard them make.
Frankly, I don't know that it is important. If they'd managed to get their first and second party games going and then left it alone and not mentioned it again it would have passed under the radar. The thing that's so dumb about the comment is that no one has clamored for it recently, there has been no noise that I've heard, but they bring it up in negative way themselves. If someone asks a question about BC, just say 'There are new BC updates coming'. If they'd done that it would have been fine.
martin @ Jun 1st 2006 1:08PM
# 7. Some people did't own an XBOX but bought a 360 (some). They may want to try some of the older games. The other thing, M$ is hoping to sell more systems this time. Those people who never owned an XBOX may want to play some of the older games. Therefore, they wouldn't have the system to play those games on.
Tom @ Jun 1st 2006 1:08PM
Just make psychonauts and be done with the BC after that.
amog @ Jun 1st 2006 1:10PM
How is backwards compatibility not something gamers want? Isn't the most highly anticipated Xbox 360 game to come out this quarter Street Fighter 2: Hyper Fighting? Methinks gamers like playing their old games. Hell, with nothing coming out soon I've started playing Final Fantasy Tactics again. Though there arne't many PS2 games that I'm into, I keep coming back to it so I can play old PSX games.
On the other hand, there aren't that many games on the Xbox that I would like to play again. So meh... who cares about 360 BC.
student @ Jun 1st 2006 1:12PM
I agree with Martin. A big motivation for me to get an Xbox 360 is that I would be able to play all the games I missed last generation from owning the other two consoles. Likewise, while many of you seem to be big on "ooo just go for the new games with the great graphics" not all of us want to lay down 60 dollars for every game we want to buy. Sure, I'd pick up say Oblivion but in addition, I wouldn't mind picking up a few original titles that are significantly cheaper and still solid games.
I hope backwards compatibility isn't thrown asunder :(.
Canadian Geese @ Jun 1st 2006 1:14PM
Here is information on what MS promised (from a credible site)...
http://money.cnn.com/2005/05/16/technology/personaltech/e3_microsoft/
Derbeste @ Jun 1st 2006 1:15PM
Reasons for BC:
1) Never had the original Xbox and you want to buy and play some of the games as the Xbox 360 line-up is still small by comparison
2) You sold or traded in your original Xbox to make some money for that expensive 360.
3) You may WANT to sell your Xbox in the future.
4) Your TV does not have enough input ports to handle all your electronic devices and switching cables from Xbox to Xbox 360 is a hassle.
5) Space reasons. Having a million consoles down there just looks tacky.
6) and not least. Because MS promised they would have it. If you can't deliver what you say you can, you lose consumer confidence.
And I agree, to say you "over-delivered" when you did not achieve what you said you would is insulting to our intelligence.
Marketers are worse than politicians.
riffgod @ Jun 1st 2006 1:16PM
MS, you owe me some money. I never owned the original xbox. In anticipation of my xbox 360 purchase I purchased about 5 games, because one feature was backwards compatibility. I got was one of the first people to get an xbox 360 and at that time, none of those 5 games played in my machine. Now that we have had all of these updates, 1 title now works. What am I supposed to do with these other games that I purchased and won't be playable on my 360. Purchase an original xbox to play them on, I won't make that mistake again. MS keep your promises and if you can't, then don't make promises. Now I have to wait for a worthwhile title to come out before I can use my xbox 360 as anything more than my primary dvd player. This is such crap.
On the up side for Sony, this could help their cause.
Josh @ Jun 1st 2006 1:19PM
SuMizzle (#8), so which systems use software emulation for BC? 360 and PS3? Because I'm sure Nintendo would not do that, and I don't think Sony is doing it either...
Scott @ Jun 1st 2006 1:21PM
I only played Halo1 and 2 on my 360. I also tried Forza to see how bad it looked in comparison to PGR3. Without a way to transfer saved game files, BC is pointless. Why the hell would I play Forza alll over again on my 360 when I still have an origional xbox? BC is just a gimmick for kids to get their parents to buy them a system: if mom can just buy the system and doesn't have to buy any games she will be more likely to buy it for her kid. but the reality is that the kid won't want to play his old games and the mom will end up buying the new ones anyway. MS knew this, thats why they announced it and now gotten rid of increased support because nobody cares anymore. If you really cared, you wouldn't have sold your origional xbox. or you'd spend $50 for a used on on ebay.
On another note, I wish they would have backwards compatibility for the damn controllers like PS did with the PS2. I hate spending over $40 so my cheapass friends can play along.
Adam @ Jun 1st 2006 1:22PM
I just want MVP Baseball and I'll be happy. . .why should I have to pay $60 for an inferior product? Thanks M$ !!
benjamin @ Jun 1st 2006 1:22PM
Good point, amog.
Lot's of us think old games still rock. I have good, old-fashioned Duck Hunk competitions every time my family gets together. I also play Galaga on a GBA cart on my DS just about every freakin' day! I can see a definite benefit in making 100% of the xbox1 library b/c for 360.
If MS wants any of those to become classics b/c could only be a good thing. I have an xbox1 and plan on getting a 360 eventually. I really don't know that I want both of those space-consuming consoles around but I don't want to trash (sell) my old games either. Like I said before, I don't know whether it's a good business decision for MS to pour time and money into 360 b/c but as a gamer, I wish they would.
Matt Paprocki @ Jun 1st 2006 1:22PM
If you didn't buy an original Xbox by now, there obviously weren't many games you wanted to play in the first place. Wait for a price drop on the original console and snag one. You've waited this long.
As for the multiple systems/hook-ups, by a $10 switch box, maybe even cheaper.
brian @ Jun 1st 2006 1:23PM
street fighter 2 is an xbox live arcade game, not a 360 game. here is a shocker. go buy an xbox if you wanna play your old games....or and i know this is a big on....just play your old games on the console they were made for. microsoft is pushing so much stuff to gamers. in the form of marketplace, arcade, awesome game (prey in july !!) and all people do is whine about being able to play 2 or 3 old xbox games. you obviously dont understand the difficulty in bringing intel and nvidia coded games to the power pc/ati architecture
Cage @ Jun 1st 2006 1:23PM
Nice link Canadian Geese. 100% BC was not promised. Just in case people dont see your link...
http://money.cnn.com/2005/05/16/technology/personaltech/e3_microsoft/
Cage @ Jun 1st 2006 1:23PM
Nice link Canadian Geese. 100% BC was not promised. Just in case people dont see your link...
http://money.cnn.com/2005/05/16/technology/personaltech/e3_microsoft/
Scott @ Jun 1st 2006 1:29PM
What a PR blunder though. All they had to say was "We are still working on BC" and just released 1 game a year to avoid being called liars. On one side, they are at least being honset about discontinuing work on it.
logikil @ Jun 1st 2006 1:30PM
So this is the one place where MS and Peter Moore have let me down with the 360. I think Peter's statement that no one cares is dead wrong. I've had an xbox since day one and have a collection of about 60 games. It was my favorite console before picking up the 360. I don't want to toss my library, and dont have much in the way of room to keep the OG Xbox around. Making the original library work should remain a priority. I mean i would love to pop in PD Oorta, Chronicles of Riddick, SC2, Gunvalkyrie, etc.
As for buying the games again....No way. I bought most of those games at the release prices, not a chance i will buy them again.
J Ron @ Jun 1st 2006 1:32PM
Who cares if they ever make another xbox1 game run on the 360, Barbie Horse Adventures is all I need anyways.
Prof-KOS @ Jun 1st 2006 1:34PM
Cage - "Our goal is to make them all compatible," said David Hufford, Xbox Group product manager,
-from the article you just linked
Maybe not a promise, but it's pretty close. If you don't want people to expect it, don't mention it.
miannone @ Jun 1st 2006 1:35PM
I definitely hope they continue updating their bc list. I dont care if it ever gets 100% complete, but there are a lot of great games that are not on it.
I do not own an original Xbox, but do have a 360. I picked up a few titles (after reviewing the BC list) that I think are really good (Ninja Gaiden Black, Halo 2, Jade Empire). There are more original Xbox titles that I'd love to get if they could be played on the 360 (ex. Psychonauts).
In response to a comment benjamin made. I think it definitely would be in MS's best interest to expand the BC list. People who own 360's wont go out and buy an original Xbox, but I doubt MS makes much money off the console sale (if any), they make all of their moeny off of the game sales. If the games were playable on two different consoles then they would definietly sell better. Especially considering people like me who would buy them who dont have an original Xbox.
The ZeroCorpse @ Jun 1st 2006 1:35PM
Another reason for BC:
The 360 supports playing on a VGA monitor natively, while the Xbox does not (NATIVELY, guys) and I'd like to play my games while my significant other is tying up the HDTV.
I can understand them skipping most of the recent EA sports titles, and the titles that are on both platforms, but staples like MechAssault, Spider-Man 2, and X-Men Legends 1 & 2 should all be playable.
On the other hand, I'm grateful for the ones that are BC right now. I'm playing Simpsons Hit & Run on my 360, and I picked up Crimson Skies for $5.00 and have had a ball with that one, and of course, I'm eternally grateful that Star Wars Battlefront 2 is now BC.
I think if summer is going to be dry, as usual, for new releases, then they could at least make some of the big hits on Xbox compatible with the 360. Especially since they've stopped shipping Xbox units!
SuicideNinja @ Jun 1st 2006 1:37PM
I still have an Xbox, so I'm not too worried about it. BC is nice, but is a low priority. I never really played PSX games on my PS2.
It makes me wonder how many titles will fall off the PS3's BC list. They are using emulation software instead of including the old chips on the new board, just like Microsoft is doing.
I'm sure there will be better BC with the PS3, but I'd hope they'd just concentrate on the flagship PS2 titles. There are a lot of crappy PS2 games. A lot. PSX games are over with, so they shouldn't even worry about those.
james f. @ Jun 1st 2006 1:43PM
four words about bc: LEGO FREEKIN' STAR WARS!!!
Pedro @ Jun 1st 2006 1:45PM
The BC list should change to the BS list. Just like microsoft, make your new stuff uncompatible with your old stuff. 360 owners who want BC can forget about it, microsoft is killing the xbox. Just keep buying into microsoft BS.
GalileoAce @ Jun 1st 2006 1:46PM
Backwards compatibility is great for when you first buy that new console. That way you can use your old library of games while slowly building up a new one.
Eventually B.C. becomes irrelevant when you've got a nice library established. Of course there are exceptions to that.
powerpig @ Jun 1st 2006 1:47PM
As another poster mentioned... what good is backwards compatibility if you can't bring over your saved games? And why in the bloody hell would I want to purchase last-generation games for a next-generation console, anyways? It makes no sense.
Backwards compatibility on any console has never been anything more than a marketing gimmick. It's there to make you feel as though your previous investment is protected when you move up to a new model. That's a load of feel-good crap, though. You purchase a NEW console to play NEW games. And that's what you'll want to do 95% of the time.
The only exception I see to this rule are games that have an active online component, such as Halo 2. And Microsoft did deliver compatibility for that game.
GunForHire @ Jun 1st 2006 1:49PM
I still can't play Shenmue 2 or JSRF. Where's my BC update Petey-Pants?
Cage @ Jun 1st 2006 1:51PM
"Our goal is to make them all compatible," said David Hufford, Xbox Group product manager, "but for now we're only committing to the top-selling games."
We're not defining a number, nor a list at this point," said Hufford. "We're sort of saying 'stand by, stay tuned, and we'll tell you down the road what games will be backward compatible.' And it will be an evolving list as time goes by – so we'll continue adding to it."
Please use the whole quote Prof-KOS. Dont see where they "promised 100% bc". "Maybe not a promise, but its pretty close". Now THAT is a comment. THAT is somethin a politician would say. MS is still working on bc. In his statements I dont see where he says that they have flat out abandoned it. I would think people would have more to say about these statements from Phil Harrison.
http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2006/06/01/phil-harrison-the-playstation-3-will-kill-pc/
andrain @ Jun 1st 2006 1:52PM
I find it interesting that (not that I would ever do this) with the recent firmware hack for the 360 all XBox games become instantly playable. Maybe MS should invest about 1000 us to learn from the creators of the hack and give up a little on "emulating" so the security settings remain intact.
Cage @ Jun 1st 2006 1:52PM
"Our goal is to make them all compatible," said David Hufford, Xbox Group product manager, "but for now we're only committing to the top-selling games."
We're not defining a number, nor a list at this point," said Hufford. "We're sort of saying 'stand by, stay tuned, and we'll tell you down the road what games will be backward compatible.' And it will be an evolving list as time goes by – so we'll continue adding to it."
Please use the whole quote Prof-KOS. Dont see where they "promised 100% bc". "Maybe not a promise, but its pretty close". Now THAT is a comment. THAT is somethin a politician would say. MS is still working on bc. In his statements I dont see where he says that they have flat out abandoned it. I would think people would have more to say about these statements from Phil Harrison.
http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2006/06/01/phil-harrison-the-playstation-3-will-kill-pc/
Jack Flash @ Jun 1st 2006 1:57PM
I'm a playstation fanboy, but don't see the big deal. I never played a ps gam on the ps2, nor do I see me playing a ps2 title on the ps3- which I'll own after a price drop. Also I don't remember MS promising that all games would be bc, just that they would try. Well they've tried. I'm sure most 360 owners would rather have their resources focusing on new titles.
I think nintendo is the only one who really can tout this feature; when one gets a strange urge to play contra, super mario bro.s, or an older Zelda version on occasion. I left out MT's Punch out etc.