Rumor: new, cheaper Xbox 360 this holiday

For those that don't know, in business or economic writing, cost ALWAYS refers to the cost to the producer, while price ALWAYS refers to the price at retail.

So, Thomas, that does refer to the cost of production MS incurs.

I bet they'll bundle the HD-DVD drive with the 360s so that the 'premium' 360 with the HD-DVD drive is just below the or at the 'core' ps3's price. That way, the xbox360 will be the cheapest option for anyone who wants to watch high definition movies.

Darth Pixel,

Sadly I have to admit that you're right.
I've invested over $1000.00 canadian so far in my 360 (2nd controller, LiveGold, 4 AAA games, + tax).

And what am I playing right now? I'm replaying God of War.
It's been so much hype over so little interesting stuff.
Sad.

The problem with reducing the _price_ further is that Microsoft runs the risk of being seen as the inferior product. Regardless of everyone's intricate gamer knowledge on the board, most people who will be buying these systems don't know anything about CPU's or GPU's or even Ghz. They'll look at the price, and see the PS3 is $200 more expensive and think, "Hmm, it must be better". To reduce the price on the 360, Microsoft runs the risk of going too low. Don't think that's something to worry about? Everyone I've talked to who doesn't know the details of the systems has so far assumed that the PS3 is way more powerful than the 360 based on price alone.

There is no reason for Microsoft to cut the price of the 360. As Peter Moore already said, Microsoft got their price cut when Sony announced the PS3 price. There's no point in them going deeper into the hole to possibly sell a few more units. And they don't want to run the risk of being seen as too cheap (see the Gamecube).

ok #47, they still talked about dropping the "PRICE"...."The source told Britxbox that the PRICE cut would be the result of a "new" and "cheaper to manufacture" version of Xbox 360"

Fanboys crack me up. They claim the Xbox 360 isnt selling good. Guys the only reason why the Xbox 360 sales aren't through the roof is because they have not been able to meet demand. NOT BECAUSE PEOPLE DONT WANT IT! EVERYBODY WANTS IT!

So stop hating the system like you are going to make a difference.

Darth Pixel said:

"Xbox 360, only 3 games worth talking about:

1. The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion
2. Tom Clancy's Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter
3. Call of Duty 2

Those are the only games that scored more than 90% at Game Rankings."

Well, let's be fair about this. Three games with a 90% or higher rating in the first seven months of life of the console is two more than the PS2 had in the first nine months of its life. (I just picked the PS2 b/c it had the most games.)

Don't have time to look up other consoles, but I'd say based on this, the Xbox 360 is doing OK, quality of games-wise. And as an Xbox 360 owner, I can assure you there's more to talk about than just those three games, one of which I don't even own.

I sort of belatedly realized my post could be misconstrued as fanboy-based bashing. What I meant to say is that judging the quality of a system by the games that are available seven months from launch is foolhardy. The PS2 came out in Japan in March of 2000. By the end of the year, the only game rated higher than 90% was SSX Tricky. Today, the PS2 is considered by many to have the most must-play games of any system, despite inferior tech specs.

So for the Xbox 360 to only have three games with a 90% or higher rating isn't really so bad. I remember selling my SNES after a few months b/c I didn't feel like there were enough good games. Later, of course, I wanted it back.

As for games worth talking about, I'd say Oblivion, COD2, GR:AW, Burnout Revenge, Perfect Dark Zero (multiplayer only; do not buy this game if your console is offline), Table Tennis, PGR3, Condemned: Criminal Origins, Geometry Wars, Outpost Kaloki X, Marble Blast, Hexic and Uno are all worth talking about, and that's just off the top of my head.

Bologna. Ain't gonna happen. They are not going to spend the huge bucks to retool for a cheaper box. It would make more sense to simply lower the cost of the current model. Don't you just love web rumors?

WEe - that $1000 Canadian is what, $50 real money? Sorry, I've just no respect for Loonie currency... :)

Darth Pixel - calling the Xbox 360 a sales flop is ... I can't even BEGIN to describe how dumb that sounds. Close to 4 million consoles sold worldwide by now, the closest competition STILL having even WORSE heat issues than the 360 did.

Anyway, if anyone would actually READ the article linked, it says, "If they hit their targets, the Microsoft would be able to cut the costs of its console in the autumn of 2006." Guess what? That's when Microsoft has planned from DAY ONE that the 360 would reach it's break even point, where after this they WOULD start making a profit on a per console basis.

This is nothing new - this was mentioned several months ago, that by the end of the first year, the 360 would be profitable on a per console basis. The only thing that's happened is that some people think that as soon as they start making a profit that they ought to lower their sales price.

NOW - whether or not the price SHOULD drop is a good point of discussion. Realistically Sony should sell the hell out of the PS3 this holiday, if they can actually get it together. So should Wii - and so will the 360. It's the season for mass consumerism, so you KNOW that there will be sales.

However, the AUDIENCE for the sales is what's going to matter. The hard core gamers are going to buy a PS3 even if they have to cut off their left arm to do so - we all know that. (You know who you are!) But what's going to hurt is this: PS3 comes out at $600, you buy an extra controller for $50, two games for $120, and you're at $770 USD - and you only get to pick from 8 titles for your two. (Shades of 360 launch complaints!) Sonny says he wants a PS3 - Mom adds it up - 360 for $400, extra controller for $50, two games for $120 - and there are over 90 360 specific titles to choose from - so now they only spend $570. Mom can also pick up the wireless racing wheel and the camera as well, and STILL have spent less on the 360 - and given junior more.

Sure, there are consoles in the stores right now. Supply has finally caught up with demand - and guess what? In four of the five stores I went in, they said they sell out of them EVERY single week still yet.

The thing is the 360 is selling far worse then the xbox did in the same time period.

When your ytd for your sequel product does what your original did in the first week of it's release then you know you have a huge problem.

Yes Japan is important a huge number of Japanese game developers make games Western audiences eat up in droves. Heck you got tons of people that think Capcom is an American developer.

As for supply shelves are stocked full in Japan and other places. Why do you think MSoft wants to open in India and China? It's not simple expansion it's because the three major markets aren't buying the 360 like they should.

Region coding on the 360 was a huge mistake as well as rushing it out the door.

Peter Moore has admitted several mistakes in the 360 launch when Msoft said those things were in fact strengths when the 360 launched.

@57

Send me some of what you are smoking. If Xbox 360 were flying off of the shelves their sales figures of May would not show a decline, would they?

All 3 of my local Fry's have piles of Xbox 360 for sale.

I made a little spot on 3 boxes at the bottom of each pile. I went back to the stores twice during the past 4 weeks. The boxes I marked are still there. You can try this little experiment yourself.

4M units sold worldwide is an optimistic estimate, since it was 1.7M in the US at the end of May. But that's not the point...the point is sell-through performance.
Selling 4M consoles in 9 months and then nothing for 3 months is not an option for success.
All statistics show that Xbox 360 is not doing as well as Xbox did in the past.

Finally, there is no way the Xbox division will break even in November...absolutely no way.

In July of last year, Microsoft's Home & Entertainment division had a quarterly operating loss of $179 million.

In January of this year (2006), Microsoft's Home and Entertainment division reported a quarterly operating loss of $293 million.

In April of this year (2006), Microsoft's Home and Entertainment division reported a quarterly operating loss of $388 million.

As you can tell, their losses are getting bigger and bigger...let's see what they report for their quarter ending this month and let's see how it compares to the $179 million loss they reported last year during the same quarter.

This is a nice rumor, but what does it say about the Xbox? You are 100.00 dollars cheaper than your competitor if you have no interest in Blu-ray, you stil do not break even on hardware,have not benn out a year yet, and yet you are contemplating a price drop already? Does Sony scare you that much? You came out the gate fast, had some good games in March (Oblivion, GRAW), and have hit the summer lull. Sales have slowed dramatically, but is it the price of the system, price of the games, the games themselves, very few Xbox fans, or a combination of the three? With Sony being more expensive this holiday they should be able to sell them at 399, but we will see.

What they should do is kill the Core kit, change the price of the premium to the price of the core, and create a new package with a built HD-DVD player for the same price as the current premimum system.

I doubt there will be much change to the retail pricing before the second quarter of 2007.

As some might recall, Chartered Semiconductor has annouced that they will be producing a die shrink of the Xbox 360 CPU at 65 nm. Supposing good yields, this means a substantially lower cost per chip and reduce power/cooling requirements. That in turn means not only a direct reduction in cost but also an opportunity to reduce the cost of the power/ and cooling hardware currently used. A similar die shrink to the GPU would have more of the same benefits. The GDDR3 RAM will eventually get a dies shrink, too.

Unlike the original Xbox, this is how consumer electronics is supposed to work.

It should be remembered that there is a lot of other activities in the Mcirosoft Home and Entertainment Division than the game console business. The console software is the only part that consistently produces positive revenue, so taken entirely on their own the Xbox and Xbox 360 losses aren't nearly as bed as people are inclined to believe.

It would reduce bad PR for the Xbox 360 if it were entirely separated from Microsoft's other business in the division but the people responsible for those would scream bloody murder if exposed to such scrutiny. Sony had a similar situation a few years ago. The Playstation business was at times the sole source of net revenue, so they rolled it back into the main company to make the quarterly reports look better. A casual observer would see what appeared to be good profits for Sony when it was really just profits for one part of the company and big losses everywhere else. Taken on its own, the Playstation business is far more profitable than when looking at Sony as a whole.

"30. The Xbox name itself should go down as one of the biggest technological flops of the century. It might have been in a small percentage of households and sold, but it lost 4 billion dollars and it's tanking even further.

I do own an Xbox and a 360. The only game I own so far is Halo2 and GeometryWars. See my drift?"


LMAO kevin.
way to go sony fanboy. So you don't feel screwed with betamax, minidisc, umd, memory stick, atrac, soon-to-be beta-ray, DVD+R, SACD, etc. wait, what do they all have in common? oh yeah, it's Sony trying to create their own format to collect royalties, and what happened? all of them flopped. (except DVD+R)

I do own a PS2 and a PS3. The only game I own so far is (wait, what's a ps2 game without any xbox/gamecube counterpart?? hum, let's assume final fantasy) final fantasy 7 and some blu-ray movie. See my drift?"

Well, the Xbox did drop 33% from $299US to $199US only 6 months after it launched even though the company was losing money even at $299.

I'd say that a 25% price drop from $399US to $299US ($299 to $224 for Core) a year after launch following cost saving manufacturing changes is certainly within the realm of possibility for the 360 AND would make it quite competitive versus both the PS3 and the Wii come the holiday season...

It should also be noted that there are less tangible sources of income from the 360. For example, I chose to upgrade from Windows 2000 to Windows XP for the Media Extender capabilities (I own a little over 2000 cds which I converted to wma on my pc) and if Vista adds some extra useful functionality I would certainly consider another upgrade. I also think that the Xbox property has positively affected the public perception of Microsoft as a company which would be difficult to assign a value to...

I highly doubt Microsoft will lower the price, They have lost so much from this launch its ridicculous... plus HALO 2 IS STILL 30 BUCKS! WHATS UP WITH THAT? GREEDY!

#46 "GRAW and COD 2 lag like Hell on Xbox Live". Have you played COD 2 since the updates? Yes there was quite a bit of lag before but now I have not been in a single game where there was noticeable lag. Maybe you have a crappy connection? As for GRAW I don't play that game because it makes me sea sick with that freaking over the shoulder or first person "bouncy cam". (Is there a way to turn off the "bounce" I haven't found a way to. PDZ lets you turn off the "bounce".)

Yeah, Darth Pixel, you seem to just be flaming.

I'm not as actively in love with Oblivion as much as I was, but it's still a fucking great game, and I didn't have any framerate issues. If you're talking about the "on-the-fly loading lag" that happens when you go trasping through the forests, that's common and not as big a deal as you make it out to be. I've messed with Oblivion on my PC recently cause I did some massive upgrading and wanted to see what it could do, and with my awesome new rig there's still 'loading on the fly' studders or whatever you want to call it. Don't act like it's a 'fault of the 360', because its really not.

I've played through COD2 on my 360 with no framerate issues, and even though there WAS some latency (lag) issues with COD over live, thats not FRAMERATE issues, as you tried to convey, and that issue was fixed. GRAW is a fucking great game, and I've had no issues playing it on live. What's your connection like? Got too many torrents going or something? Maybe you need to secure your wireless network so the guys next door can't steal your bandwidth? j/k The only real framerate issues I've seen is with Quake 4, which I honestly can't explain at all. Bad port, I guess, but its not because the '360 sucks and can't run it'.

No, whatever your issues are, they're not everyone's issues. Please stop making blanket statements 'This has issues because the hardwares faulty, or this table is really a mountain goat'. Make your opinions and voice them as such... but don't state them as if they're facts. I also think anyone who wants to find issues or not like a product can do that no problem because they WANT to not like it, but they need to come to terms that their preferred product often has the same issues. This is called bias. I think you're one of those people. You've set out to not like MS and the xbox/x360, and you so don't. Good for you, heres a cookie.

I think you guys can argue all you want, but I think you'll find MS is in this console thing for the long haul. Fighting it with the weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth won't stop it.

Plus, the competition is good for all of us. Learn to love the choices, not bash them without reason.

MS isn't even making profit of the 360 right now so i don't see why they would bother dropping the price. They have already said they wouldn't even though they would like to when the ps3 comes out. There still trying to make up for the xbox 1 and they can't they won't drop the price for a while now.