Don't they know one of the biggest reasons the PSP browser sucked initially is because it lacked these exact same features.

This browser isn't worth owning now...

Cool

There goes my dream of watching Pirate Baby on the DS that I just thought of doing.

If you're going to strip everything away, I would ask what the point is, but I guess that'd be nitpicking. A simple browser on the go for e-mail, the news or Wikipedia seems like a pretty good idea. You don't need Flash, audio, video, or PDF for any of those things.

And really, it's not like any of us are hurting for computer time. I see having a DS in your bag instead of a laptop for quick trips to get coffee for simple web browsing to make a lot of sense. We'll see.

That blows my cell is better...crappy DS

Here's a short list of sites you can't view properly without Flash:

http://www.nintendo.com/home

This sounds cool. Being optimistic about the lack of features isn't such a bad thing. Besides, the loss of those features isn't exactly a downfall - as #3 said, it's nitpicking. You can still go to Joystiq and check your Email. It's better than nothing.

Here is a short list of sites you cannot view on your XBOX 360 browser:

THE ENTIRE INTERNET

I agree with the rest, this is not good news.


AT LEAST give us Flash!!!! You can't even view Nintendo's own site without it! Jeesh...

Maybe they'll have flash support inthe future.

I would use the on-screen keyboard for text input.

I do like the option to either have the web page span both screens or to have one screen display a “zoom-in” of what you're viewing below. Opera has really made good use of all of DS's capabilities.

I'm a little surprised at the lack of PDF support. A PDF can be downsampled as a JPG and viewed just like a picture. Why can't Opera handle doing that on the server before it’s sent to my DS?

Frankly I don't use those features for about 90% of my internet usage, so I don't see it as a huge disappointment nor a surprise really. Those of you screaming, BUT NINTENDO'S SITE!?!?! Need to remember that servers redirect cell phones and ds's to separate pages specifically because of their limitations - which go beyond lack of flash, etc. Don't turn this news into an excuse to start bashing the DS, please.

I can live without video and sound. But I hope they decide to support flash, far to many of the sites I frequent rely heavily on flash.

Those of your crying about Flash probably have now idea what it takes to port it to a device like the DS. Sure it can be done, but you get into licensing issues and other things that cost money.

Personally I wll probably go ahead and pick this up at some point. The thought of having access to not only new, but Google Calendar, Gmail, etc... (of course, I'll be waiting to hear how those sites do on it) have me very excited. If no one else if going to give me PDA-like functionality on my DSL than this is my best bet.

No PDF I can see because of licensing. No video and sound I can see because of memory limitations.

No flash, however, renders 80% of the internet unviewable. Flash is a must for ANY browser beyond text only browsing

why the hell are so many people whining? this isn't meant to replace your computer, this is for quick browsing. what did you expect to do on a 256x192 screen?

8. Beautiful display of trollmanship ;)

P.S. And yes, it sucks that the browser lacks so many features now. Because unlike the PSP, in order to add those features, Nintendo would have to release a new cartrigde down the line.

"No PDF I can see because of licensing. No video and sound I can see because of memory limitations.

No flash, however, renders 80% of the internet unviewable."

You do realize that both PDF and Flash are owned by Adobe, do you not?

So why do you realize the problems with PDF support but not Flash? The fact of the matter is it's not up to Nintendo or Opera to port these things to the DS. They can't do it any more than they could port Windows to the DS. It's not their software to port.

Send some emails to Adobe if you want these features.

btw, "80%" of the internet does not use Flash. Where do you see Flash on this site, for just one example?

And since when did Nintendo ever say that the DS was a dedicated web browser device. It has always been a gaming device. Opera and Nintendo have added the functionality of web browsing because they were able to and thopught many people would like it. If they had built a web browsing device that could also play games I would understand people complaining.

And where the numbers on 80% of the internet would be unviewable without flash?????????


Furthermore, Flash and sound may have been purposely left out to prohibit people from using their DS as a flash game device which could then hurt the sales of nintendo cart games. If that is the case then I appluad Nintendo for protecting their future sales and investments while still providing teh consumers with added functionality

That comes as no surprise for me, the PSP has 32 MB of RAM and it has trouble running Flash. Now the DS with 4 MB (and Opera Expansion pack) obviously wouldn't be able to handle such advanced features on a website. However, if you just want to check out the news, write an e-mail the DS browser does the job.

> No flash, however, renders 80% of the internet unviewable. Flash is a must for ANY browser beyond text only browsing

ha, no. 80% of browsers may have flash, but the number of websites that utilize flash as an integral component is closer to 30% (at best). the majority is being used in badly animated intros or banner ads.

I dont think the DS has enough ram or cache in order to support flash ever. The PSP can support it because it has a little bit more internal memory. but in order to display those types of things it would just have to have more memory.

PDF is an open standard. Anybody can make an application that writes to/reads from a PDF file. I'm not sure about the legal status of writing Flash viewers. I'd imagine that it's in the same boat.

PDFs are often into the megabyte range. I doubt the gba cart can hold that.

Since most people actually using cell phone browsers only check email or simple websites it makes sense for Opera to do the same.

Flash is mostly used for flash games which take up a lot of space. Dialup users hate flash for instance because a flash heavy page takes a long long time to load up. Even on broadband a huge flash file can take a while if a lot of people are hitting the page at the same time.

Seriously the DS browser is for people waiting in the airport terminals who want to check their emails or some news websites or message boards but don't want to pay the five bucks to use those internet kiosks.

If you want to do flash or youtube on the go get a laptop.

@Jeff: Have you noticed the millions of Flash banners that appear randomly on your favorite websites (including Joystiq) and I'm not referring to the usability of the Flash banners, but at the "80% of the internet" remark ;)

Oh the psp browser failed because a using it sucked because of no touch screen. Using the virtual keyboard on it was a real pain as well as the mere fact you couldn't zoom in on things.

The DS browser beats the PSP browser on performance and ease of use.

Here is just one example of why they don't want to include flash:
http://www.80smusiclyrics.com/games/

That and the fact that flash is proprietary.

You mean those ad banners? Yeah real shame not to display them.

If you are familiar with alternate operating systems outside of the big two (Mac & Windows) You begin to appreciate how many things you take for granted are porprietary.

The simple fact of the matter is, you have two options when it comes to supporting flash. Pay adobe to let you port it (adobe owns it ever since they aquired macromedia), or reverse engineer it. The latter is something the opensource community has been trying to do off and on for years now and has yet to reach compatibility with current version of flash.

Flash in not an open standard. It is a nice proprietary solution, that is often handed out to mainstream platforms for free (IE PCs) but you have to pay up if you want it on your embedded platform, or alternate OS.

Personally, having spent a lot of time using Pocket Internet Explorer on a PDA anything is an improvement!

Flash is the scourge of the internet - I, and many people I know, disable it as soon as possible - FireFox even has an extension to allow this.

More important - does this do JavaScript properly? Lacking that really will cause problems with a lot of sites. Also, it would be nice if it supported Java properly too.

And finally, PDF is an open standard - anyone can create tools to read or write to it - there's quite a few about...

another thing people aren't considering is the memory requirement of flash. to do anything useful in flash on the ds would most likely bring it to a grinding halt.

Ahhh...typical fanboy. I own a PSP and a DS and by no means does the DS outshine the PSP in performance, get your facts straight. The DS is better than the PSP due to its library of quality games and innovation. But in terms of features and performance, the PSP takes the win. I love them both equally, I only wish I could have the best of both worlds in a single handheld, but that's just me daydreaming.

Personally I think Flash is what many sites hide behind who have very little content. If you can dazzle the user's eye, maybe they won't notice that there is only thirty sentences worth of content on a large page. Also I've noticed a lot of ads are using flash now. I'd like it if my screen real estate wasn't 20% wasted on ads, especially on a small screen like say...the DS.

LMAO @ the "80% of the internet depends on flash" comment.


Let's see...this browser would allow me to visit Joystick plus all of the blogs I read, all of the other gaming websites I read plus pretty much all misc websites, all of the message boards I visit....and unless there's something I'm missing it would allow me to use Ebay, Paypal and other things like that. And email. Well, pretty much everything then! I'd have to miss the odd funny internet video, but I can't say that would keep me awake at night.


I suppose it was absolutely necessary to cram a summary of all the bad points in the title? Why not a summary of the good points? Why not a combination?

How about java? Anyway I can live without flash but of course it would have been a good thing to have. I guess I could buy that for 10€ to read email, 4chan and other simple sites.

Well that sucks.
and @#8 You can View the internet on the XBox 360, if you have Windows Media Center PC. You should really know a few things before posting.

The PSP's browser is free and can be constantly updated. The DS' browser cost money and lacks features that cannot be updated easily. I wonder which one I'm going to pick?

"Here is a short list of sites you cannot view on your XBOX 360 browser:

THE ENTIRE INTERNET"

Who wants to browse the web on their home console? Who complains about not being able to on a post that has nothing to do with it in the first place? That comment is great, but heaven forbid you make a joke on a post. Then you get a negative even though it says stars are rewarded for saying something funny. WTF? I heart JR-W

Will it be able to support AJAX?

@ Miharu: Never talk about 4chan on sites other than 4chan.

"The DS browser beats the PSP browser on performance and ease of use."

And how would you know this? Do you have handson experience with the DS browser? How hard is it to enter text with a virtual keyboard and what makes you think it failed? It's a portable and believe it or not the DS browser will no make you toss your laptop either.

"The PSP's browser is free and can be constantly updated. The DS' browser cost money and lacks features that cannot be updated easily. I wonder which one I'm going to pick?"

I KNOW! YOU'RE GOING TO PICK THE PSP ONE! Clever, you are!

meanwhile, I'm going to pick the DS one, because I have a DS, and i like the touchscreenability. the browser sounds like it will be easy to use, and pretty cheap, good in case i get lost, i can stop at a mcdonalds or something and check mapquest or whatever (I don't have a cell phone)

The point of my post is actually this though: Why do you and anyone else have to bitch and moan for no reason? so the psp browser is free. Noone is forcing you to buy the ds one, it's just there if you do happen to want it. I bought my ds to play games on it, and thats what i do. however i will buy this browser because i will put it to good use. Iwata or anyone isn't coming to your house and putting a gun to your head, making you buy it, so why make a big deal about it? same with the price of the ps3 that everyone is going on about. It's expensive? well damn! don't buy it then! Just be happy that there are alternatives!

Javascript IS supported.
So Gmail and lots of other sites will have no problem.

Can't wait!!

Flash in general is overratted. The only reason I would want Flash support is to be able to browse YouTube.

I want CONTENT, and the DS Browser will support content-based sites. And $30? come on...is it really that much money? nope.

No problem for me. I just love the fact that I can use the same device I use to play great DS and GBA games to also browse the net, IM and e-mail in the palm of my hands virtually anywhere I want for less than $200. Fun!

I hope they support AJAX. I wonder which code base the Ds opera is based on, opera 8 or at least parts of the new opera 9? Also, I wonder if opera will be able to push updates for the ds browser when you connect. It seems technically feasible, and would allow for updates to include video/sound and maybe the ds demo downloads that some other blog was talking about. I hope the homebrew people can reverse engineer the memory cart and make an even better browser for the ds.

Its just like a pda browser, just on your ds. Its good for you can get directions, check email, and read/post to your blog. Its pretty cool to be able to do that on such a inexpensive device. I wonder if it'll support some sort of IM? Also its cool for a kid to have the Internet to just fool around or look up stuff. I personally can't wait for it, for I don't have a laptop right now, and to access the internet through my phone costs a fortune. Yeah its far far far from perfect, but for the price, its a pretty good deal.

If you have a DS and were kinda bummed that it didn't come with an internet browser, then I think this would be great because it seems to be the best browser a DS could have.

If you have a PSP, then why shove it in everybody's face that your browser is better? The Opera browser isn't competing with PSP's, it's simply giving DS users a chance while taking advantage of the touch screen.

Of course if you're like me and you don't own either, I can't see how having a web browser could be the ultimate decision maker to buy a portable gaming system. I browse the internet at home to explore the world without going anywhere. If I'm out of the house and exploring the world anyway, why bother with a web browser? (There are some exceptions such as if I were on a plane half of my waking life but I'm only 16)

Quit overreacting, most sites have other versions of their site that support even the most basic web browsers.

Ahem the touchscreen alows for far easier input. Also there is handwriting recognization. Previews have given the DS opera browser a great rating for what it provides. Yes these revievers admit the PSP browser tastes like ball sweat after you use the DS opera browser.

You are indeed paying for the psp browser it's added to the cost of the psp.

Without all the extra crap the psp would cost 150 bucks less.