First off, don't get me wrong, I love my gamecube, its my favorite last gen system. HOWEVER, third parties got burned many times when making games for it because they didn't sell nearly as well as on other platforms. Nevermind the reasons, this is just the way it was in many cases (not all). This is, I think, the main reasons publishers and devs have been conservative on Wii. Once bitten........

Add to that the fact that nintendo has gone dark for most of the past year, (barring E3) and you can see why publishers/devs have not had alot of incentive to move in that direction.

Yes, I think the Wii looks very exciting. I really hope it succeeds but based on history, you can't blame companies for taking a "wait-n-see" approach to it. Likewise, with the 360, you have a product that is already released, the sales numbers are relatively solid, and consumer reaction tends to be positive overall. This is a much safer and predictable platform to work on. Maybe the Wii will be a great success and maybe it will fizzle. In business, you have to make decisions. These decisions are typically based on predicting where the market is headed. The future of the 360 is must more predictable than that of the Wii. If the Wii comes out strong this holiday season and makes not only sells out, but also has a strong attach rate and continues to garner very positive press, I think you will see a spike in developer support. I think there are alot of ideas out there floating around and once the Wii proves itself, there will be an explosion of software. The same thing happened with the DS. Everyone was calling out gimmick, PSP will make it roadkill etc. But once it hit the market and started to get good press, everybody wanted on board.

This may or may not be the case with the Wii, but certainly, I think it is the intention of Nintendo to duplicate the successful model of the DS. I guess we'll see how well that model translates from handheld to console.

It's a chicken and the egg construct then, isn't it? Nintendo will be hurt in sales because there are no third party games but there will be no high sales until there are third party games, right?

I think the Nintendo DS worked quite well without major third party support. I recognize that some of the system's best games are third party (Phoenix Wright, etc), but the AAA-titles are Nintendo properties.

If you bristle at that example, though, consider the launch of the PS2. I only remember Tekken Tag Tournament and Fantavision being the only games available for a bit.

If the Wii comes out for Christmas as the "hot new tech toy" for $200 and familiess are in their living rooms playing simple tennis and home run derbys, I think Nintendo will be doing okay.

I think Wii Sports, Wii Music, and any other motion-oriented party games will do much more to push units at the outset that Red Steel-esque FPS games.

I'm just glad we have Nintendo doing something different this time around.

You can only blame publishers for being short-sighted.

E3 was an eye-opener. Everyone knew Nintendo was doing something different with the controller. But I think the best "Oh shit" moment was when Sony put motion sensing abilities into their controller, thereby complementing the Wii's control scheme. Now publishers who think they can use this in the PS3 realize they can take it bounds and leaps further on the Wii.

The one publisher I am severely disappointed in is Lucasarts. They should've had a star wars title for the Wii launch. Anyone who is anyone immediately thought of sword fighting and saber fighting when the Wii's controls were revealed. Lucasarts could've made a killing this holiday season. Ah well ... their loss. They'll have one out next year and curse themselves for waiting so long.

I'm tempted to believe Midway's VP's reasoning on this one. In my estimation, Nintendo held Wii specs back with the intent of giving third party developers a distinct disadvantage in the race to get games out in time for the big holiday season. They are gambling on the fact that all the pre-release buzz about how their system is changing the way we play games will move the units. Then, the fact that there are few 3rd party titles, plays right into their hands as folks will have to buy Nintendo published games (which I'm sure will be solid as they've had the specs since day one). I'm simply speculating here, but with strong initial console sales, the 3rd party developers will have no choice to bump up production. If Nintendo really can carry the load in the beginning (with a little assistance from folks like Ubisoft), they'll make out like bandits.

I love Nintendo for the most part but God DAMN, they are simply too secretive for my liking. I say that not as a fanboy who's just itching to know everything about Nintendo, I say it as someone who sees (from this very article) how this much secrecy could affect Nintendo negatively.

I mean, sheesh, why wait until *September* to announce the release date and pricing. We already know the plans of the other two systems. Sure they may change their price (well the 360 anyway) after hearing of Nintendo's, but I highly doubt it. Those are the two biggest things people are waiting for (price and release date). Throw us a bone here and announce it. I'm not asking for your 'final secret' or whatever. I'm not asking for launch titles. I'm asking for the two most obvious pieces of information.

"So is Nintendo staying quiet on Wii to blame for the lack of third-party launch titles, or the GameCube's poor performance which influenced publishers to make a more conservative business decision?"

As Deon Sanders would say, "Both".

Once bitten twice shy. I think the only reason they have as much NOW as they do is because the DS has done so well. The DS is there ONLY evidence that this "disruption" campaign has any merrit. And because of the DS's success and the positive vibe after E3, developers are listening again.......just too late for Christmas.

But that might not be a bad thing.

This will give those developers plenty of time to learn how to program for the controller in GOOD ways rather than gimmicky ways. It will also help them feel as though they don't have to release rushed, crap titles for the holidays and give the Wii's innovation a bad name.

"No one is going to make money but Ubi-Soft"?

Um, what? They're acting like Red Steel is the only third party game. There are games from Sega, Square-Enix, and EA all at launch that look more promising than Red Steel, to be quite honest. And there are also games from THQ and other companies that don't look as promising, but they're there.

Ubi-soft isn't the only company with launch or first gen titles.

This is one of those things that I think is going to really hurt Nintendo and is going to possibly knock them out of this race. If the Wii has little third party support up front and are not able to deliver significant, quality titles at launch then people will go to the Xbox 360.

After all the Xbox 360 will have like over 100 + games by the Wii comes out. Supposedly the Xbox 360 has sold 5,000,000 units by June 1, 2006 according to Peter Moore. It is now almost the end of July so that number is now probably closer 5,500,000 worldwide... maybe more.

I can see a parent this Christmas Season.

Parent: Which console has more games?

EB Games associate: The Xbox 360

Parent: Is it just that the Xbox 360 is an older- weaker system?

EB Games: No actually the Xbox 360 is about 10 times as powerful as the Wii.

Parent: Which one has sold more?

EB Games: Well the Wii is new so it has naturally sold less. However the 360 has sold about 9,000,000 units already.

Parent: Wow. Well I dont want to take a risk with the Wii I will go ahead and get the Xbox 360. It has more games and is only $100.00 more(Barring there not being a price drop).

I think the Wii may be doomed with the lack of third party titles. The Xbox 360 just has all the games it seems like

Do we all forget that Sony already blatantly stole a part of the Wii despite Nintendo's secrecy?

But yeah, I think the fact that Gamecube third party games didn't sell at all has more to do with the bad support. No one could have expected the extremely positive reception (thanks in part to Sony shooting themselves in the foot), and indeed, even now, no one knows if third party games will sell on it.
Developing for it is still a gamble, unless you are Nintendo and have games that are guaranteed to sell well.

It does seem as though publishers may be out this holiday, but that is nothing new. The main problem with Nintendo is not the Wii, but their business policy. nintendo, no matter what position they maintain in the coming console generation will always make money.They made money off the Gamecube, but the 3rd parties do not. Out of all the console manufacturers they have the strongest software group, and they do all they can to protect that part of their business.most 3rd parties will be behind the curve on Wii implementation compared to Nintendo for quite some time.I think that alone may keep the 3rd party games gimmicky for at least their 1st iterations.

I think it is pretty obvious why these companies are wary to begin their own production for the Wii. Everyone knows that Wii sports/gimmicky motion launch titles, Zelda, and the downloads are going to sell this system. Zelda and old games for the hardcore fans and Wii sports/motion titles for those just getting interested. I mean christ, my girlfriend doesn't really like vid games anymore but wants a Wii because she can get all her favorite old super Nintendo games (Tetris Attacks anyone?).

What worries me the most is that with previous motion sensing technologies, they begin to feel gimmicky after a few times. I've noticed that because they aren't "real" (meaning we don't get force feedback from say hitting a tennis ball) they tend to get boring and you notice they aren't super amazing after a while. I mean look at VR. That never took off...partly because it was so expensive, but also because it wasn't the real experience people were looking for. I really hope this doesn't happen because the Wii is one of the best ideas to hit the industry since the freaking analog stick.

I'm excited for Nintendo because of their idea but I'm also worried because I would hate to see such an amazing company go the way of Sega because their idea didn't take off....which it should damn it.

somehow, "I told you so" just doesn't quite cut it.

This is what happens when you play the "super top secret" game and wait until the last minute to unveil your product. My guess is alot of third party launch titles won't be done either, because nintendo will stay mum about the release date until 30 days prior.

At # 8,

Ok, so looking at your handle I don't know if I should even bother replying, so I'll keep it short and sweet. Most consumers don't ask the kind of questions you are asking. Parents that aren't tech savvy are most likely going to pick based on budget, not which one can process better graphics or has a bigger library.

Just because nintendo wasn't issuing public press releases doesn't mean they weren't talking to the publishers. As has already been said ubisoft, square-enix, and sega seemed to be able to develop games what was everybody elses problem? Maybe they wrote off the Wii too early and are backtracking now?

nintendo is talking 20 games before christmas, 6-8 of these will be 1st party games. Nintendo's 1st party games are consistantly among the best. There isn't a video game executive anywhere who wouldn't trade his game development staff for nintendo's.

The Wii isn't going to suffer the lack of support. and if it takes off EVERYBODY'S going to line up for the priviledge of making games for the Wii.

This entire page makes me roffel, roffel. The ad is roffel, the comments are roffel, the article is roffel, my face is roffel, the copyright is roffel.

So it's *publishers* that will miss the boat if the Wii sells well?

And exactly why are people going to be buying the Wii if there are no games available for it that they want to play?

The industry was not caught "flat-footed". There is a well-deserved wariness on the part of publishers about Nintendo consoles, and I don't believe the Wii is going to sell as well as some of these guys think it is. Now, maybe they're right and I'm wrong, but I guarantee I have been around this industry a lot longer than this "hedge fund manager" who's quoted above.

Were all these publishers caught "flat-footed" when the Dreamcast had such a great E3 showing in 1999 and 2000? We all know the ending to that story. The fact of the matter is E3 showings are meaningless. What matters what happens in the marketplace afterwards. And Nintendo's recent history is doing nothing to encourage third-party publishers to jump on board - which in turn is not going to do much to encourage customers to buy their console.

That's not to say the Wii won't sell well initially to early adopters... just as the GameCube did. The issue will be sustaining and building on that launch, which I'm not convinced is really going to happen. Especially not if all anyone has to play are tennis games and the same Zelda you can play on the GameCube and the occasional Mario title every 4 years.

The Wii controller may be innovative, but a lot of third-party publishers just aren't ready for innovation. The DS has proven that. The only question is whether the Wii can survive - as the DS has - on basically first-party games and the odd decent third-party title here and there. The question is *not* whether third-party publishers can survive without the Wii.

In regard to #8,

That is probably the worst hypothetical dialogue that I have ever seen. The standard parent will either already know which system their kid wants or ask questions like "Which one has Mario?" or "Which one do boys like?" or while holding a DVD player ask "Does this one play video games?" I sincerely doubt a significant number of parents are going to base their decisions on number of games or systems sold.

I think this unability to see the future will come back to haunt some developers. They develop ps3 games and boom PS3 is a horrible failure, most people don't buy many games at all so the games they worked so hard to make so damn pretty is now collecting dust. They lost millions of dollars assuming Sony would remain on top, its their own fault.

You don't see EA bitching about Wii they are making some very cool games with the time they got. I am buying Madden for Wii when I never bought madden before.

They got burnt on Cube because they wanted to get burned. WHy would I pay money for a baseball game on my cube that requried me to buy 5 memory cards? I rather not even bother.

Namco sold more copies of Soul Calibur 2 on gamecube but when 3 was released it didn't even come on on gamecube.

So what are Nintendo gamers suppost to do? Buy crappy 3rd party games? no or buy a 3rd party game and than be burned by the sequel not coming to that system.

developers bias against NIntendo is something they need to rethink. Ubisoft will have Rayman out in launch window Mario could of been their but they didn't care. NOw mario will not be their and looks like Rayman may be a massive hit with the kid crowd.

whatever stupid 3rd parties will have more time to make some killer 2nd generation wii games now. Sega, EA, Ubisoft don't give me excuses they give me games .

Guys, pay attention, the article is about the publishers losing out, not Nintendo. Nintendo will be fine. They have enough launch titles to carry them through the holidays. Publishers post E3 are regretting not having games available at launch. Long term, this is great news.

"Parents that aren't tech savvy are most likely going to pick based on budget, not which one can process better graphics or has a bigger library"

I think that everyone is forgetting that parents aren't idiots anymore. We are getting into the generation of parents that grew up playing videogames consoles like Nintendo, SNES, Genesis, Playstation, the Xbox, PS2, and they will wind up playing alongside their kids. Everyone uses a computer at some point in time and people basically know the difference in performance between a shitty and good computer. Now, I am not saying they know the specs of the machine but they can tell the difference in performance. They will be asking questions if they are going to be dropping hundreds and maybe thousands of dollars on these machines

I think we should all get our heads out of our asses and give the parents and consumers some credit. I am 29 and half of my friends have kids and all of them have at least one console at home.

Dear WII-GONNA-LOSE-BADLYOH-NOOO! commentator #8, I would gladgly appreciate that you keep your fantasies to yourself, next time you are masturbating... Don't you have any kind of self-respect???

I think many people are reading this wrong. It doesn't say that Wii doesn't have much 3rd party support, it says that Wii won't have many 3rd party titles this Christmas. I'm sure the developers are currently producing games for the Wii console, they just won't have them ready for Christmas.

The comment "everyone got caught flat-footed" implies that "everyone" is now regretting not having a Wii title ready for Christmas, or that they had no idea Wii would be so cool/popular/whatever. If they were still iffy on supporting Wii they would just say things like "we're taking a wait and see approach." They waited, they saw, and now they're behind on the next hot item.

If Xbox 360 was a hot topic last year (I'd say hot item but there were none to sell), imagine a cheaper, sleeker, more family-friendly console that won't be plagued by as many supply problems. Parents might actually have enough money to get a few games with the thing.

It's more than shortsightedness on the part of publishers though.

Nintendo pulled essentially the same shenanigans with GameCube, they made their significant announcements late, and while internal dev teams had been working on the hardware for quite some time, they only started handing out dev kits well under a year before release of the console.

There were a couple close third parties that had enough information to start development before that, but not enough.

But everyone does this (except Microsoft, although they had a bit of that this time around too). Often, the real parameters of final hardware can't be determined until actual production of final units starts, and the first party guys are too involved developing launch titles to clean up their tools and make them usable by external developers (when they intend to share at all).

SEGA was very good about sharing work from their own teams with external companies as well, particularly when you're talking about the Saturn and Dreamcast.

Dr. Tubesteak, I would say younger parents might care, but your forgetting that Videogames are still FAR from mainstream. The majority of people buying this holiday season will be looking at price and whatever their kids tell them to get. Also, have you ever asked a question to someone working in electronics at Target/Walmart/K-Mart (hell, EB/Best Buy/Gamestop even!), the clerks at retail outlets are usually LESS savvy and knowledgeable than the customer.

(Sigh)... What is this Joystiq? is this some kind of new slashdot where every article bashing sony and praising Nintendo Rolls?

Of course publishers were afraid! the real world is not the internerd where our fearless Ninty Fanboys dominate, the Gamecube got a terrible reception WORLD WIDE (except in Japan although not by much) is not even sold in some countries any more did you knew that?

A lot of publishers are still cautious about the Wii not only because of Nintendo's bad home console record (n64 and Gamecube), also because:

a) features (and forces) a completely new controller we dont know if its going to really work or not.

b) it uses technology which is already considered obsolete in next gen consoles.

c) Titles have to be exclusive, or designed first for the Wii in mind (due to reasons A and B) so if you expend a million bucks in a title and the it happens to flunk, congratulations! you are screwed! you can only port the damn game with considerable changes! (more money expent)

d) Nintendo STILL has a rather large and dominating "E" oriented developers list, meaning: most of their games are rated "E" (including their own) and that detracts "T" and "M" oriented publishers, (most) teens which are by far the largest console consumers and (most) adults out of buying Nintendo's consoles. (world wide)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wii_games

Red Steel is a great idea, its a shame it will be a terrible game due to the Wii low specs and lack of experience in the controller (mark my words on that!)

That's the reasons why other developers were cautious BEFORE plumeting into developing a full game in the console. crap! even LucasArts and they know a LightSaber game is a slam dunk! (and they do have the money to burn!)

@ 17,

For a Dr. you sure don't understand a qualifying statement based on context. Did you not see my first statement? "Parents that aren't tech savvy" I am 28 years old and have a 1 year old that can already manipulate a 360 controller, but in my circle of friends, I am definitely the gamer. Most of the other parents I know aren't gamers and wouldn't know the difference between a GameCube or a GameBoy.

I think this article is BS. Sure it's looking like third parties could have made some money if they made a launch title for Wii.
Nintendo showed almost 30 games at E3 if they manage to get 10 or more for launch they will have a great launch lineup. It is normal for third parties lag behind first party release and the select few who have been giving priority access to devkits. I see this article as just an analysis needing something to write about.
The challenge for Wii will not be the number of games at launch, but showing consumer that the Wii-mote is better for playing games. The big unknown is how quickly Nintendo can get mass-market consumers buying their system.
k

"...many publishers were reluctant to develop first generation titles for Nintendo's upcoming Wii."

A smart business decision.

Well, I think that the people who did decide to take a chance this time around are going to be rewarded. This is due mainly to the fact that the launch is going to be much, much better this time around. Not only is the system unique (which will sell a lot of units) but the launch lineup is far better than the GameCube's, which will provide the system with a nice lift.

Not to mention the fact that, unlike with GameCube, a Mario game is already far into production (one that looks good this time) as well as a Smash Bros. coming likely sometime early in '07. All those things should help Nintendo keep it's momento going nicely for at least a year. And whoever goes along with them is going to benefit.

Publishers are full of bull.

It wasn't E3 2006 were they got there first insights, Nintendo showed the controller at TGS in 2005, well over a year before Christmas 2006.

Did they offer detailed specs? No, but they provided plenty of info regardless. Nintendo demonstated the gameplay mechanics via video, further the size of the machine was known since E3 2005. From that information alone developers could guide their development efforts to have something ready by Christmas if they wanted to. It was just laziness for their part.

The Wii may still fail, at that point these same guys will be touting they knew it would fail all along. Its just business as usual.

"a lackluster GameCube performance in terms of meeting sales and financial expectations,"

Are you serious? If we are saying that the psp may be dead, what with it shipping 17 million units, and nintendo ds has sold 20 million units, I mean we can farely say that when the ps2 has shipped over 100 million units, and the gamecube has only sold 20 milllion units, the gamecube is DEAD.
Needless to say having one good game for a whole year (resi 4) and most likely one good game this year (zelda) we can safely say publishers have given up on gamecube and it is dead and buried, and even been pissed on.

You know whats also funny there is only 6 TITLES confirmed for release on the wii. That is 6 whole titles, and what is worse is that the zelda game is counted with that, so really its only 5 new games. Wow and I thought ps3 was doing poor what with its 17 CONFIRMED launch titles, and nedless to say 360 had more than 5 games released on launch. whats worse is that the gamecube had 20 launch titles, and the wii is gonna have 5. wow. But what about over the horizon yeah? ONLY 20 tiltles CONFIRMED for 2007. That is a joke, and you know whats also funny is that wii fans talk as if the wii is guaranteed to do well, with no games to buy i can see people rushing to get one, my mom tells me all the time she will start gaming when a console dosent have games, it looks like nintendo's disruption campaign is really working!!

Whats funny is that in the 10 best selling games for gamecube only one of them is a third party game, and it was a LAUNCH title, man o man, you can not blame publishers at all.


whats also funny is how wii fans shrug off the lack of any of the best selling games of last genration and still belive they are gonna win.

there is no halo, no gta, no grand turismo, no final fantasy 13, no metal gear solid, no kingdom hearts, and no pro evolution soccer/winning eleven, no splinter cell, and no half life 2/3. You think people are gonna stop buying these games and get wii sports instead? :D

These are not only the best selling games of this genration but they are the best selling games in several diffrent regions, locking in each market, and you no what the wii dosent have a single one of them.

you may fool yourselves but i can tell you this now that when there is not a gta on your console, you have lost europe and amaerica GURANTEED. and like how the 360 can not win the market without japan, nintendo can not win the console war with only japan. And nedless to say japan loves its final fantasy and grand turismo (just so you know grand turismo has been the best selling game for 2 GENERATIONS of gaming, wow.)

But of course the wii appeals to this whole new market of non gamers right? well lets see what happens when, 'shock horrow' non gamers carry on NON GAMING. Have you ever reasoned that non gamers dont care how the pad is, they dont want to play games.

And how many non gamers do you possibly think will start gaming, 50 million, 40, million even 30 million non gamers will start gaming? and they will all want the wii? That is dellusional, but dont worry i mean the wii is cheap, i mean that means it will sell shit loads after all the gamecube did................Oh wait, its dead. oops.
____________________________________________________
Here are the links for all of my rant so non of you try say its not true and dellude yourselves further.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_selling_games
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ps3
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/wii

And type in gamecube to wikipedia, to find out it had 20 launch tiles and how much it sold.

ENJOY

@ clo1_2000,

Look, I'm not stating that all parents are all of a sudden tech gurus, I'm saying that they are not as stupid as some would make them out to be. If your friends don't know anything about what is on the market who do you think they are going to ask? probably you, because you have user based knowledge. Then you can give them an informed (and maybe biased) opinion, or they can always just go on a site like this and read everyone bickering at one another.

Bottom line is that the information is out there for people who are uninformed to go get it, and I believe they will due to the prices on the systems. My point was - "They will be asking questions if they are going to be dropping hundreds and maybe thousands of dollars on these machines." I never once stated who they would be asking or if they would receive the proper guidance.

NEXT UP FOR THE JAVELIN EVENT: THE KID IN THE PICTURE.

I think this was a good article. I do not blame the 3rd parties. The wii(wow great name) is a kiddie system plain and simple. Nintendo will always be a kiddie system because thats what it does best. I can already hear the excuses the nintendo fanboys will make when the wii is revealed as a gimmick.
"um we had no 3rd party support" "yeah ea made a half ass try, they didnt take advantage of the GREAT technology" "um i bet you the wii 2 will have even better controls in 3d space"
Dear nintendo, yes your machine will sellout come this holiday but if you expect the casual gamer(ie moms, girls, punk rockers and grandparents) to help you win this time all i can say is good luck.

meh. publishers played it safe, and it's their problem that they'll lose out this season.

Remember, Wii's SDK's are almost identical to the gamecube's--if not gamecube SDKs themselves. It couldn't have been hard for a publisher to call up nintendo and say "we want to release a game on the Code Name: Revolution, can you assist us".


...as they say in auto racing: "To stand still is to fall backwards".

I'd like to take a poll of the anti-Nintendo people who post on Joystiq and find out a few things:

(a) Preferred console
(b) Preferred games on said console
(c) Reason for liking said console
(d) Reason for hating Nintendo
(e) Do you have big-boy hair yet?

Seriously, you guys need to get a grip. And as for the "Why doesn't Joystiq show good news for the PS3" question, show me an article you'd like to see published on Joystiq where the industry says that Sony isn't making horrible, horrible mistakes.

@23.

A game that's rated E doesn't necessarily mean it's only for kids.

I rest my case.

Oh, and a game rated M, isn't necessarily meant for mature people. Lots of Mature rated games are played by immature people.

I knew plenty of information about Wii prior to E3 (including that some third-parties were developing on GameCube kits), so I'm not sure what any third-party could possibly be complaining about.

Parent: Is it just that the Xbox 360 is an older- weaker system?
EB Games: No actually the Xbox 360 is about 10 times as powerful as the Wii.

The lesson learned is never believe anything an EB Games employee tells you, because they're probably just making stuff up.

Come on... TEN TIMES as powerful? Common sense would suggest that the 360 would have to have a price about ten times as high. And since its price is only 1.5 to 2x that of the Wii, it's reasonable to predict that the Xbox 360 is no more than twice as powerful as Nintendo's new console. For whatever that's worth.

Besides which, I thought Nintendo made "kiddy consoles"? Why would a parent buy anything BUT a Nintendo for a child, am I right?

whats [sic] also funny is how wii [sic] fans shrug off the lack of any of the best selling games of last genration [sic] and still belive [sic] they are gonna win.

What's funny is how fanboys of EVERY brand think that the performance of the previous generation is relevant to the next generation. Just because PS2 did well and Gamecube did poorly last time around, does not suggest PS3 will do will and Wii will do poorly this time around.

For Sega, the Master System was a failure but the Genesis was a success. You would not have predicted that.
For Atari, the 2600 VCS was a success, but the 5200 and 7800 were horrible failures. You would not have predicted that.
For Nintendo themselves, the SNES was a success but the N64 was a relative failure. You would not have predicted that.
So don't put too much faith in historical data when making your predictions now.

Sorry a number of third party titles actually sold more on the gamecube then on the ps2 or xbox.

Soul Calibur 2 gamecube was the best selling as was Bloodrayne.

Lego Star Wars sold like gangbusters on the Gamecube.

Quite a number of gamecube multiplatform did sell considerbly well. If the porters did a good job. That is the issue. Third parties have to put out good game versions to get good or great sells on a Nintendo platform.

Third party platforms have been spoiled by the PS1 and PS2 where garbage would sell well because it was on a sony platform.

There is not six confirmed titles. There is over 20 titles. Dozens of developers have confirmed projects for the Wii but have not announced them.

Midway and other developers had plenty of oppurtunity to realize the potential of the wii. Just like the DS the Wii had bitchslapped them because they have no idea on unique gameplay expierences.

The number of unique third party titles on the WIi outnumbers the ones on the PS3 and Xbox 360.

Most of the PS3 titles are going to show on the wii and 360.

(a) Preferred console
PS2

(b) Preferred games on said console
Ratchet and Clank, Gitaroo Man, Rez, Jak and Daxter, and Gran Turismo.

(c) Reason for liking said console
Great exclusives, great 3rd party selection, the best variety of games, and odd Japanese games not available on Xbox or Gamecube.

(d) Reason for hating Nintendo
I don't hate them, I just have huge doubts about Wii. Why? The control scheme. I don't know how well it will work. I'll have to give it a shot for myself in order to decide.

(e) Do you have big-boy hair yet?
Yes.
Yes.

"You know whats also funny there is only 6 TITLES confirmed for release on the wii. "

really? hmm let's see.

1 Red Steel
2 Rayman Raving Rabbids
3 Metroid Prime 3: Corruption
4 Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: The Crystal Bearers
5 Excite Truck
6 Dragon Quest Swords
7 Call of Duty 3
8 Super Monkey Ball: Banana Blitz
9 SpongeBob SquarePants: Creature from the Krusty Krab
10 Madden NFL 07
11 The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess
12 Wii Sports
13 Tony Hawk's Downhill Jam
14 Trauma Center: Second Opinion
15 Super Mario galaxy
16 Super Smash Brothers
17 Elebits
18 Pokemon
19 WarioWare:Smooth Moves
20 Project H.A.M.M.E.R.
21 Fire Emblem
22 Disaster Day of Crisis
23 Final Furlong
24 Dragon Ball Z
25 Bleach
26 One Piece
27 Sonic Wild Fire
28 Necro-Nesia
29 Bomberman
30 Marvel: Ulatimate Alliance
31 Need for Spped:Underground
32 The Godfather
33 Tiger Woods
34 Harry Potter


This is not including the VC games nor is it including stuff like Sadness or the already confirmed Resident Evil game that is exclusive to the Wii. Yeah but i see your point 34 is close to 6 games so maybe it isn't that far off.

"You know whats also funny there is only 6 TITLES confirmed for release on the wii. "

o_O

But they had 20 playable demos at e3... were 14 of them fake?

Seriously though, there are to be 20 or so at launch. And there are more than that confirmed. Go to www.ign.com to see the masterlist.

@Tony:

I really wasn't talking to you - I was talking to the guys named "PS3 needs good press" and "WII-GONNA-LOSE-BADLYOH-NOOO!" and "The truth hurts....if your a nintendo fanboy".

People who make reasoned arguments about why they dislike the Wii or prefer another console are fine by me. But people who just bash a company because they want to flex their e-peen frustrate me. But then again, I'm probably just feeding trolls...

I used to work for Visual Concepts back in the NFL 2K4 2K5 days. They reason they stopped GC games was over media. We had to ship ISO's to redmond washington to have them shipped back down on GC media so we could test a build a waste of time and resources. It slowed development which lagged behind the PS2 adn XBOX. It's sales just did not justify it.

First, I don’t say this very often, but whoever gave "The truth hurts....if your a Nintendo fanboy" a minus star deserves a cookie. I just... couldn’t even read it... *shudder*.

Anyway, while not being able to capitalize on the Christmas rush this year might be bad for the publishers, I think it might be good for the console over all. Nintendo has said that they want to keep a constant stream of must have titles coming out for at least the first 6 months. This is an excellent way to achieve that. Nintendo is using two of their big three franchises with the launch, Metroid and Zelda. Mario should come out soon after, probably in January-March (just for the sake of argument). After Mario, the only known really big game we have information on from Nintendo would be SSBB. After that, we are in the dark.

If the 3rd party developer's big tittles start kicking in after the first big 1st and 2nd party wave has passed, Nintendo may be able to ride the momentum into their next big wave of titles. If they time it right, we may get a constant stream for not just 6 months, but a good year or two.

I haven't reed all the post here so i might say something someone already said... but Developers weren't in the black until E3, nintendo showed basicly all important aspects of Wii last year in september, that's where they showcased how the games would play, which kind of tech the wii would have and the accesory scheme, and on E3 last year they basicly said that they were going to have content for download and development would be almost the same as with the gamecube.

The only aspects they didn't let be known were the control speaker, the nuncuck acelerometer and the wii connect24. So I think developers having a year to at least prepare their games was good enough for launch games.

-Falsoman et al.

I think they are more talking about the fact that developers were caught off guard by how popular the Wii has become. They knew most of the specs, they just didn't expect the gigantic public opinion boost.

#31 haha, cute

Polls and hype seem to be on the up and up for Wii. Current gamers are interested in the "something new" factor and party games (i.e. with real people, in your house), and I've seen a pretty good amount of press in non-gaming magazines, newspapers, and online media that might generate interest for the general public, at least in the U.S. Those DS demos in NYC and Arizona and whatnot are not only helping generate hype for the DS, but improving positive brand recognition for Nintendo as a company, which could also help Wii come this fall. All in all I see a lot of potential, for non-gamers as a low risk first or re-entry into console gaming and for current gamers as a second console or the cheaper choice (ex: me). So the Wii will probably do pretty well this xmas and in 07, as long as the games keep flowing. And yeah, some 3rd parties probably did miss out on some easy sales this fall, though I wouldn't entirly blame them for caution, for reasons already mentioned above (though the CG didn't do *that* bad, you'd think the 'cube killed some of these guys parents or something).

A strong launch isn't even that important for long term success, as the DS and PS2 have already proven, and Nintendo is at least capable of providing strong long term support for a platform with quality 3rd party titles, a la DS.

#15. "And Nintendo's recent history is doing nothing to encourage third-party publishers to jump on board - which in turn is not going to do much to encourage customers to buy their console."(Jeff)

I think that's a gross exaggeration, as atleast Nintendo's substantially lower costs for development kits open the door for people with knowledge and creativity to get an actual console kit at a price much more affordable. One scenario I can easily think of would be excelling graduates and grad students of computer science, graphic design, etc. forming companies amongst their peers/colleagues and developing small, but innovative and original games for the Virtual Console, perhaps sponsored by their university. Such development wouldn't need a publisher for distribution, as the game is simply paid for and downloaded.