Spending some time with the DS browser

Was Flash really important before Youtube, Google Video et al atarted using it? Using it for esoteric navigation and site splash pages is pure wankery, and will cripple the site if the applet can't load anyway. Webdesigners who have a leaning towards making sites functional and ACCESSIBLE will avoid Flash at all costs.

It's also worth mentioning that Flash is a closed-source standard which must be licenced.

Im also skeptic on the use of instant messagers, My 2 real questions are as fallows.

1. Since Gmail works, and although this seems redundant, what about google talk? since you can use google talk within the browser.

2. 3 minutes to cnn? Now i wonder what the connection speed is for the DS

46, it had better be, or I don't know how it would survive long :)

47, very good point, and one that I think is probably the main cause of the sluggishness we see here. When localized, local sites will probably be less of a bear to load.

48, I didn't mean AJAX wouldn't be supported based on dependency on Java and Flash - I know where its roots lay. I just meant that if they hadn't bothered to include Java interactivity, they would be hard pressed to bother to include AJAX either. However, the pattern is starting to show an adversity to major proprietary software people, so who knows... if not, I'm sure there will soon be a plugin coded by a (possibly open source) third party, no?

50: And nobody complained about a lack of flash on cell phones or PDAs, as near as I can remember. Like I said before, lack of flash kind of follows the anti-proprietary pattern. I'm kind of glad, anyway... poor use of flash in badly designed web sites could cause site loads to slug tremendously or botch entirely. And I seriously doubt we're at the stage to be watching Google or YouTube videos on our DS Lites. :)

http://www.nintendo-europe.com/NOE/en/GB/news/article.do?elementId=COvq0wlxoGeCudWhk-OyNVwKg2aiiVkO

This is the english release of the ds browser. Yup nintnedo said it.

"I just meant that if they hadn't bothered to include Java interactivity, they would be hard pressed to bother to include AJAX either."

I don't know why that would be the case. Java is much more complicated and requires much more than XML. I don't expect Java to ever be on the DS browser, and I'm not holding my breath for Flash support.

caller, #11: What are you trying to prove by linking to those IGN review sites? That the DS has slightly more high-rated games (37 8+ rated compared to the PSP's 32 8+ rated)? That the PSP's list is very genre-limited to mainly sports and racing games with a few shooters?

Out of the PSP's entire list of games (not just the top-rated ones), I see only five games (six if you count Loco Roco) I would THINK about buying. Out of just the DS's games that got an 8+ score, I see 10 games I will probably buy once I have enough money to get them, and that doesn't count the six games I already own or the three games I can think of off the top of my head that I will definitely buy as soon as they come out. Sorry, I don't think I'm quite ready to "evolve and get a PSP."

Per my earlier comment, this has already been dumped to ROM by some group. Pretty useless at the moment; it does NOT work without the expansion hardware (though I'm sure it'll be emulated in some fashion soon).

i wanted flash and java support for using addictinggames.com more than google video. A lot of the simple point and click games would translate well to the DS.

My first web browsing was on a 486SX/33 laptop with 4 MB of RAM and a 640x480 passive matrix display using the Netcom browser and later Netscape. The idea of having to go back to that is cringe inducing. The DS browser cannot even remotely approach the usefulness of that old battelaxe of a machine. I'm at a complete loss as to how this DS browser would be at all useful once the novelty wears off. If the only portable device you can afford is a DS you should limit your browsing solely to education and job sites.

The PSP browser has its moments for emergencies but is mainly justified by the dirct content support from Sony. The recently added ability to handle downloads directly made a huge difference in taking it from cute but meaningless feature to a genuine contributor to the platform's value. Downloading the LocoRoco demo and others directly to the PSP was pretty nice and lays the ground for future online distribution possibilities. Unless Nintendo offers a RAM expansion cart that also features an SD card slot, there isn't much opportunity for similar application on the DS.

The one other place where the PSP browser has been kind of handy is on sites offering lengthy stories. The PSP can be a decent e-reader for that sort of thing if you use the 'fit to screen' mode to make the column width match up. The same thing just isn't as comfortably done on the DS upper screen while the lower screen is worse due to the input grid overlay. The only time I'd want to display a lot of text on the lower screen is if there was some editing capability via the stylus. A partial relief to what would otherwise be a very tedious way to generate text. (And this is coming from a Libretto 100 user.)

I have www.mail2web.com bookmarked but entering my address and password each time is painful. Something needs to be done in future firmware. I want to enter one password that enables an auto-fill function. I certainly wouldn't mind a file of a few dozen K living on my memory stick to support that. It would be a necessary compromise if Sony is adamant about not supporting USB keyboard input and cannot otherwise match the ease of touchpad virtual keyboard entry.

keep in mind people that this product is not finalized. all of these problems should be fixed by the time it comes out.

I'm being optimistic and hoping there'll be a change before the US release. Or maybe a better version will be built in in the next Nintendo handheld (I haven't bought a DS yet).

One of the big things I'll benefit from the browser, is a portal to itunes through one of the various itunes web remotes. One of the biggest features I'm waiting for. I live on the third floor of an apartment, by the time I get up the stairs, my comptuer will be playing exactly what I want to listen to for unwinding.

The stylus support looks to be pretty intuitive--freeform kanji detection is a great idea! The various zooming and reformatting options look to be pretty solid.

However since there's no audio/video/Java/Flash support, laggy viewing and (seemingly) awful load times it's definitely not something I'd consider buying (well, maybe secondhand).

Hopefully addon carts or future revisions can eventually add more functionality, but I really don't know that the DS is up to the challenge to begin with. Most websites are no longer dialup-friendly, which would probably be the optimal volume of data for the DS browser to handle smoothly.

I can confirm that Opera DS supports Javascript and AJAX, which I learned from the Opera forums. I've also heard that ebuddy and webmail both work on DS, so you can bet on having portable instant messaging. With touch-screen text input, and the ability to turn off images for significantly faster load times, this makes Opera DS one very attractive mobile browser. Especially for anyone who already owns a DS.

BTW, PSP only has very limited Flash support. You can't watch Flash video or play most/any games, so it's pretty useless. And analog text input may become second nature, but so does touch screen text input, and it's much faster and more intuitive.

I have noticed a great deal of figures being thrown around, and since i currently own both a PSP and a DS i feel i can clear a few up.

the PSP's multi media support to both music and full length video is most likely the main detrement to the DS

It can accomodate Multimedia because it is most like a PS2 processor which could handle DVDs and such

where the DS was most like a N64 it could play video bbut not DVD or CD quality

many sites which say the DS' screen fails in comparrison to the PSP's and the PSP lack of something brilliantly new like the touch screen is what makes it better

personnaly i like the big beautiful screen, and the touch screen

the touch sreen will be great for writing out URLs

PSP games can store upwards of 1.8 GB of data, while DS's are limited to 128 mb

due to the much greater size and graphical abilities of the PSP it may take a little longer to load, i have one game that takes 1.5 minutes, this is the longest i have encountered, DS is faster but i explained why above

DS carts currently (up until this browser of course) have been games only. The PSP has offered Movies Music and games, while i would never consider buying a movie i can convert for free, or pay for music i own from itunes which can be put on PSP, i guess this is still great for some people without the ability to do these things.

on the browsers:

i have used the PSP browser for some time now and i am actually fairly satisfied with it. it is a great improvement to my phone.

it can play many flash games go to www.pspjunk.com for a wealth of PSP content tht is directly downloadable or playable on PSP, DS will never be able to do this unless you buy another cartrigde with updated broser on it

psp can render images up to 10 MB in size on most occasions, although this is also dependant on the site size and cache settings, DS will have low resolution pictures due to the scrrens low resolution, and will look fairly grainy on the bottom screen due to touch overlay.

The web browser on PSP takes quite a bit of juice, and the battery lasts aout 2 hours on the web, cosidering it has a bigger battery than the DS we can only wait to see how it will fair.

The access to a hotspot will not charge you anything on either system, unless it is a pay per access (such as at a cafe or the such) and the wireless distance for the PSP i can confirm 100 feet through a house wall ie: (drywall, plaster, brick, metal siding etc) i am sure the DS will be compareable unless nintendo has not intended the range to be that long

The DS and PSP both had WiFi for playing games online, the PSP has many online games (a few of which are very good) DS has a few but this may grow over time (currently only MK:DS is worth buying) who would want to play tetris online, seriously tetris vs. soccom ? you would have to be a fanboy to pick tetris, i assure you i would love to play DS online with a good game

DS will never, on the curent card allow you to IM your friends like PSP will and cannot download anything from the web to its memmory, of which it has none lol

PSP supports tabs and has three tabs, of which you can assign a different site too

The cahce feature allows near instant rendering of pages previously visited, DS contais no such feature

PSP can accommadate a full broadband connection, while i am dissapointed that the DS can only allow 28K - 56K

this is where the difference between a page loading in under 30 seconds on the PSP (i havent come across one greater than this, i have ADSL) and the "reported" 3 minutes on DS i would not buy the browser for this sole reason, i really hope nintendo fixes this in american release for some people

if a problem ever turned up with the PSP such as the homebrew (although this was a great problem !) it could be fixed in an update, DS allows no such update

The main causes for the faults in the DS browser were that, sony had this premeditaed and thought of all theses things while nintendo tried to add it in later, which with some feature is near impposible

Verdict PSP wins the browser wars

If you have any comments or arguments about what i have said please message back or at { angeloposteraro @ gmail.com}

in correction above the site is www.pspjunk.tk sorry : )