Ad Critic: Dungeon Siege reaches new low

This has got to be a joke...no company could be so incredibly stupid.

I imagine most people are going to shut off the game at this point, and never look at another Dungeon Siege game again.

Now if it was for a DS version of Dungeon Siege... That would be just PEACHY!

reminds me of the emails in xenosaga

Xenosaga Ep. 1 had something similar, where you would get emails about other Namco games. A sci-fi game is obviously different than a fantasy game. Getting spam email makes sense on some level.

Fantasy games are where problems arise for in-game ads, in terms of breaking the immersion.

I remember the Capcom Zelda games had a very similar thing, where after you beat one game, you had to buy the other game and enter a code in order to REALLY beat the game. Appearantly Gannon is the real final boss, but I never wanted to buy the second game to find him.

On some level it makes sense. If you buy one guy, you're likely to want a similar one. It's certainly not a bad thing to use one game to sell another. And it's not like it's dancing flash ad or something.

If you're against ads on princible, then nothing will persuade you, but if you don't mind subtle ads, this one isn't too bad.

I've never played a Dungeon siege game, and seeing this ensures that I never will. there are some instances where advertising within a media doesn't destroy immersion. But a fantasy game which is meant to immerse you in it's fantasy world having this kind of blatant advertising is not acceptable. Shows like 24 know how to do this right, and realize that in their context Apple computers and such don't take the viewer out of their suspension of disbelief. Game developers need to learn a thing or 2 about advertising, and not become the I Robot type catastrophes that need to be avoided.

@ Probot

How is this subtle? This is a character in a fantasy world trying to sell you on a PSP game. The only way it could remove your suspension of disbelief any more would be to then say "Or, click on J-Lo's ass to win a free PSP!"

I'm all about game companies findiing unique, creative ways to increase revenue, but not when it tarnishes a product I've already purchased from them. (No, I don't own this game, so that's a purely hypothetical circumstance)

Troy is right: when it's on a Nintendo platform (hello Advance Wars), it's awesome and innovative.

Subtle? With the (tm) and (R)?

How more unsubtle can you get?

Besides pop-ups, I mean.

At first glance, I got the impression that there was an in-game ad for the colbert report in Dungeon Siege!

After that, the actual in-game ad seems tame by comparison.

But yeah, this ad is poor IMO. Depening on my mood at the time I saw it, I may or may not decide to ever purchase another dungeon siege game.

Troy and stiill:

I guess I haven't played the offending Nintendo games you have, because the only game advertising I remember on my Nintendo games actually made me laugh. In Paper Mario (by Intelligent Systems) one of the little toadstools says that he really likes Fire Emblem (also by Intelligent Systems). There are also countless references to Game Boys, Game Boy Advances, and SPs, but they're usually comical. Besides, Paper Mario is supposed to be a silly almost-parody of an RPG.

It's subtle in the sense that this game is not centered around selling another game. There is no "rescue the Sony PSP(tm) from a dragon" mission. It's one guy, doesn't seem to be pivatol to the plot (though I haven't played the game). One line of dialoge in an epic RPG doesn't seem like that much of an issue to me.

Sure it does, it breaks the illusion as soon as you speak to the guy.

I'm all for in-game ads, but only if they make sense in the context of the game. Last time I checked medieval knights and dungeon dwellers don't carry PSPs.

If I was, however, fighting hordes of zombies in a mall, I wouldn't mind seeing a PSP poster in the game shop, get what I'm saying?

Splinter Cell was also guilty of this. Computers in BANKS had ads for Pandora Tomorrow and Prince of Persia on the fricking SCREEN.

Namcos guilty was guilty of this crap way before Xenosaga. In Tales of Destiny theres this one bulletin board that talks about this awesome thing called Tekken 3 , which would have bothered me more if I hadn't found it hilarious.

I realize that the entire game isn't about selling another game, but I think we're becoming to accustomed to this kind of thing. If you were watching a Lord of the Rings movie and about halfway through Frodo mentioned there being unlockable content on the DVD if you had a code from the King Kong DVD, would you be as passive about it? It would just be one line within the epic tale.

The one line bring you out of the world you're supposed to be exploring. If it doesn't mesh with the rest of the game, then it shouldn't be there. A billboard in a driving game, doesn't hurt the experience. A Fire Emblem reference in a Paper Mario game, just adds to the over-the-top absurdity the franchise already has, but in the kind of fantasy world this game creates, this can ruin the experience for some.

I guess that's just the difference between us, but I don't video games are very immersive to begin with. I've never forgotten I was playing a game. Even in games I really liked, that was never part of the criteria for why I liked them.

My opinion really doesn't matter because I had no plans on buying this game anyways. But if you don't like it and you might have considered this game, let them know.

Developer: Gas Powered Games:
http://www.gaspowered.com/contactus.php

Publisher: Take Two Interactive:
http://www.take2games.com/index.php?p=global_contacts

Psh, thats nothing. On every loading screen of the PC classic, Carmageddon, it would show an advertisement for Carmageddon *Two*. Terrible stuff really (but a very fun game).

That's one of the reasons that I couldn't play through all of even Dungeon Siege II's demo. In the very tutorial, they're yelling orders at you and in full-on voice over they're yelling crap about which key to press on your keyboard. Wow! Talk about killing immersion.

wtf is stephen colbert doing there

I'm wondering how they were supposed to handle it instead.

I'm not a game developer, but if I was I think this would break my heart to see this in a game that I created. I'm guessing somebody on the business side of things arranged this and the developers had to include it, or it was added after the fact through something like Massive. Still, if it comes down to one PSP ad, or your job, or your companies future...sometimes you don't have a choice.
I just wish sometimes that game developers, or the advertisers they contract with, would have a little sense of humor about this stuff. Why not make it an in game item, make it some kind of holy stat boosting thing...just a little psp looking kind of thing that sits in your inventory, instead of braining the player over the head with such an obvious reference. Everything is easier to swallow when it's a little tonge in cheek.

In many games there are ads for OTHER games by the same company. Why do you think Ratchet and Jak are in hot Shots Golf Fore, or there are demos for Sly at the beginning of Ratchet games?

There's a game i can't think of right now, but it takes place in an arena and Metal Gear Solid 3 and Rumble roses are advertised right on the banners.

This is probably going to either sound really stupid or really obvious, but why didn't they just include the code in the box or something. Why did it have to be in the actual game? You've already bought the game. Now you also apparently have to play through to the part where you talk to this guy in order to get the code? And I would assume that that also means that there is a similar point in the PSP game. Why couldn't they just include like a piece of paper in the game box that had the code on it, maybe even like a scratch-off thing if they wanted to be fancy about it. Then they can still advertise that there's a special feature in their "other" Dungeon Siege title, without the trauma inflicted on the unsuspecting gamer off being violently woken up from their gaming fantasy.

At least in Working Designs' translation, Cosmic Fantasy 2 had posters on walls in cities advertising Cosmic Fantasy 3.

Which we never got. Screw you Victor Ireland.

The upside to this is that the combat in the Dungeon Siege games is so easy, automated, and boring, that if you buy the PSP game you could play them both at the same time.

This isn't as bad as the Burger King in Fight Night 3, but it's close.

I'm sorry, I can't get up too much outrage; I've been seeing this kind of thing for years.

Doc Louis implored Little Mac to join the Nintendo Fun Club in Mike Tyson's Punch-Out!!

Cecil Harvey ran a shop in Secret of Evermore.

The Undernet was abuzz talkng about Boktai 2: Solar Boy Django in Mega Man Battle Network 5 (really interesting, since a Konami game was hyped in a Capcom game).

Bubsy 2 not only gave you a Nerf gun to fight with, but the instruction manual had a coupon to buy the same Nerf gun in real life.

Let's face it, video games have been blatantly shilling for other things for ages. Why should anyone start caring now?

At first I was ready to scream away at how unfair everyone was being. It's ok for Nintendo to do it cause... well their goofy. And it's ok for Sci-fi games to do it... cause they can hide it in email.

Then I sat there and reviewed over what was actually done. Cool idea horrible execution. Yeah they want you to buy the PSP game. I can't fault them for that. Having never played the game the best thing I could say is... well question I could ask is. How would you do it better? How can you hide something like that in your game?

The best I could come up with on short notice is.

The guy asks "Do you know of my secret code? If not I have another one that you can use elsewhere"

And have in the instruction manual in the back (Back in my day they use to have hints and tips back there) have a hints and tips section that explains it. Well that's all I've got.

Footsteps:

I think most have relented that in game ads are and will continue to be necessary. They can keep the price down and Hey....there may actually be something we'll be interested in! (shock) And if the ad is place intelligently, most don't have a problem with them.

What I think people are having with is in game adds that are poorly executed and break immersion because the don't make sense in the context of the game.

Specifically, adds in fantasy games we (myself included) find outright detracting from the value of the game. Fantasy is meant to transport you to a world OTHER than this one - where "the man" does not exist. Seeing something like this drags us right back to the reality we payed $50+ to escape.

In short, it is the experience we are paying for with fantasy games and this type of advertising ruins it.

Now....there are still ways to pull off ads in fantasy games. What if the NPC had some information to help a guy in ANOTHER fantasy game? You could weave something like that in seemlessly.

Anyway...quick summary:

Ads in games....admittedly necessary.

Ads in FANTASY games.....don't work.

the young ones in here probably won't remember, but there was a time when tv actually was watchable. meaning, the show/film was rarely interrupted by short commercial breaks. what do we have today? flying saucers and dinosaurs walking across the screen, advertising some feature film two month away, blatantly overlaid over the running movie. today the commercials are interrupted by the tv-shows!

as mentioned by others, in some genres it's ok, maybe even welcome (sports). but not when they're trying to sell an immersive experience.
those mad business people will always up the ante. if they see they can pull off one single advertising line in a game, and it doesn't affect sales, they'll put three lines in the next game, and so forth. and before we have all played through NSMB (which is really, really easy), we'll be wielding a bbq-double-whopper-sword-of-flame in our next RPG.

i can only encourage everybody to step up to that kind of BS in games.

while i don't mind the idea of using codes to unlock special things if you have another game in the series, it could be done a little more slickly than this...

This reminds me of the "Loom" ad in Secret of Monkey Island. There was this guy in the Scumm Bar who would tell you abt the "Loom" game in a funny sort of way. That wasnt so subtle either but it was atleast funny.

I don't understand why advertising in a fantasy game (which we should clarify to mean medieval fantasy, since most video games require some level of fantasy) would be that much worse than any other video game. Perhaps the biggest fantasy of all would be that an entire world with an economy could develop in which advertising never happened.

I mean, let's look at the real world around two thousand years ago. Most experts agree that the Romans had quite a vigorous advertising network set up, and that they even used popular gladiators as pitchmen for products in the day. I think that if the Romans could pull off cheesy things like that, then any civilization at least as advanced as the Roman empire can as well.

I think it actually requires a greater suspension of disbelief to see a world without advertisements than one with them, even if it's a fantasy world where they advertise real-world products.

Yes...

but I doubt very much the Romans billboards had codes to the PSP.

As I already said, ads can even work in fantasy games (btw, yes all games take some sort of fantasy, but I think you know I meant the "fantasy genre" which has a completely different context). The ads just need to be a bit more thought out as to make sense in the backdrop of the game.

There is a very easy solution to this problem. Simply don't talk to npc:s who have a runestone floating above their head. Atleast until you have finished the game and want those codes.