Overheard at PAX: PS3 price "is some grade-A bullsh!t"
by Christopher Grant 
{ Aug 26th 2006 at 8:15PM }
After being asked if the PlayStation 3 price would impact their decision to purchase one this fall, Jerry responded, "We've already talked about it, there's no chance we're buying a PS3 at launch. That's grade-A bullshit."The crowd erupted in applause, and bathed in their communal disdain for Sony's steep price point. The Penny Arcade guys continued explaining that their choice for next-gen gaming this fall will be the Wii60 combo platter. Of course, this echoes the sort of response we've seen both on Joystiq and the blogosphere as a whole. Maybe that's why Sony is the only one of "the big three" without a presence at PAX.
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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
B33 @ Aug 26th 2006 8:19PM
Not that big of a deal... They'll probally buy one when the price drops anyways.
Ethan @ Aug 26th 2006 8:21PM
LOL, glad I dont have to play with them on the PNP then. They can just play on live, and end up spending more money in the long run, fine with me.
Pyronite @ Aug 26th 2006 8:29PM
"They can just play on live, and end up spending more money in the long run, fine with me."
Care to explain?
striderhayasa @ Aug 26th 2006 8:32PM
Can't argue with the quote. I'll pass on PS3 at launch all together. Many a few years later I can snag on craig's list for cheap like I did when I got my PSP on the come up for cheap. Wii360..... nah, I'll pass on that too. It's Wii/PSP/DS for me come end of year. Between the three, I'm not going to care about 360 either.
Ethan @ Aug 26th 2006 8:34PM
Sure Pyronite, if you play on live, you have to pay $50 a year, if you play on PNP, its free. A consoles life span is average 6 years, so take 50 times 6, and you get $300. Add that to the $400 cost of the xbox 360, and it equals $200 more than the 20 gb PS3, and $100 more than the 60 gb PS3. Refer to clicking my name for further information.
socrates @ Aug 26th 2006 8:37PM
Ooh! Quick, do a poll of carpenters, left-handed identical twins and menopausal women so that you can fully complete the collection of polls about the PS3 from the least relevant categories of people possible! The only use for Penny Arcade is if you are on nitrous and laughing so much your face hurts, you can always just browse to their comic to solve the mirth problem.
striderhayasa @ Aug 26th 2006 8:37PM
jeez, typos galore in that last post. That's snag one on craigslist and maybe a few years later....typed a bit too fast on that one.
Also, my days of having the latest console at launch are over. I've done this for too many years and suffered through too many post-launch droughts. My heart is in the portables...that's the final frontier for me. If the Wii was the same as the 360 and the ps3 (more power but the same basic console as the others) then I'd pass on that too. I'll get the Wii because it's different and it should be cheaper by far. Great combination.
B33 @ Aug 26th 2006 8:40PM
The Penny Arcade comic isnt that hilarious either. You can get much more laughter out of Ctrl alt Del or Vgcats without the word "fuck" in every other sentence... It's interesting how two people thathave enough money to throw a huge convention can say they don't want something because of the price...
JPRacer @ Aug 27th 2006 2:01AM
Ethan, I think you'll have a big deception when Sony announce their pricing play for PNP...
Probot @ Aug 26th 2006 8:42PM
Yeah, #6, because people that generate enough fans to justify an annual convention couldn't possibly be relevant to gaming.
Hate their opinions or their comic, that's fine. But to call them irrelevant is just plain stupid.
sienar @ Aug 26th 2006 9:21PM
" Sure Pyronite, if you play on live, you have to pay $50 a year, if you play on PNP, its free. A consoles life span is average 6 years, so take 50 times 6, and you get $300. Add that to the $400 cost of the xbox 360, and it equals $200 more than the 20 gb PS3, and $100 more than the 60 gb PS3. Refer to clicking my name for further information."
I beileve sony has said that their following the same pricing model as they did with the PS2, in other word, the developer decides the cost(if any). So yes, some games could be free, but then and online rpg, like FF11 could cost 10$ a month. And really, do you think sony isn't going to try and make as much money as possible off of stuff like microtransactions, just like microsoft.
Personally, it's all 3 for me, but I dubt the PS3 will get much use outside of bragging rights for some time
B33 @ Aug 26th 2006 8:51PM
"I beileve sony has said that their following the same pricing model as they did with the PS2, in other word, the developer decides the cost(if any). So yes, some games could be free, but then and online rpg, like FF11 could cost 10$ a month. And really, do you think sony isn't going to try and make as much money as possible off of stuff like microtransactions, just like microsoft."
No. It's a unified system. Similar to Xbox Live, only free... Nothing has been mentioned about online rpgs yet.
Ethan @ Aug 26th 2006 8:59PM
Thanks B33, I was going to say that so that I could quiet this ignorant person, but I see you have beat me to the punch.
C. Grant @ Aug 26th 2006 8:59PM
B33: we know nothing about the Sony platform. Don't believe the hype.
Rask @ Aug 26th 2006 9:04PM
I'll believe that Sony will be running a Live-like system for free when they prove it at the launch.
I still thing there's no way that Sony will be offering that much bandwidth for free.
"If it's too good to be true, it probably is."
dsub @ Aug 26th 2006 9:02PM
I wish I was there. Somehow seeing and hearing thousands of gamers cheering to the sound of someone saying the PS3's price is grade A bullshit almost brings a tear of joy to my eye. It's this kind of unified and shared response that should have sony execs cringing in fear.
Eric Von Shpeel @ Aug 26th 2006 9:04PM
you would think the attendants of PAX would actually have more money to spend on things like the PS3, what with the money they save by living in their parents basement and all ;)
m4ndo @ Aug 26th 2006 9:07PM
Nobody knows anything about the ps3 online system price. So far they said it would be free but who knows what it will really be. If they can suddenly change they system specs I'm sure they can suddenly switch to a different pay system. Plus, they've obviously shown they don't really care what the consumer has to pay.
B33 @ Aug 26th 2006 9:08PM
"I wish I was there. Somehow seeing and hearing thousands of gamers cheering to the sound of someone saying the PS3's price is grade A bullshit almost brings a tear of joy to my eye. It's this kind of unified and shared response that should have sony execs cringing in fear."
You act like Sony is purposely raising the price to make more money. Their already hurting at a $500-$600 price. It's amazing how there were Sony supporters before the price was revealed, and now everybody hates Sony because of the price. Soony should have just had one bundle at $500, instead of following Microsofts crappy plan and doing two packs (very bad concept). What's the trend of having two bundle packs? It only adds to the frustration of trying to find the bundle your looking for.
Jeff @ Aug 26th 2006 9:09PM
"Hate their opinions or their comic, that's fine. But to call them irrelevant is just plain stupid."
So is it your position then, that their early disdain for the Xbox affected its sales? Because, you know, they were hatin' on that system pretty hard until they realized it was actually selling well despite them.
Karmakin @ Aug 26th 2006 9:13PM
The real concern for Sony isn't so much the main statement (although there's the probably that they really are opinion leaders for the gaming market), but the fact that such a statement was met with straight applause.
This is the uber-hardcore gaming market that you really want to buy your console from day one, to get your attach rates up. If that hardcore market passes on the PS3, then attach rates are going to suffer.
I really could see some smaller 3rd party developers closing up because of this.
B33 @ Aug 26th 2006 9:13PM
"Nobody knows anything about the ps3 online system price. So far they said it would be free but who knows what it will really be. If they can suddenly change they system specs I'm sure they can suddenly switch to a different pay system. Plus, they've obviously shown they don't really care what the consumer has to pay."
I don't remember ever seeing the System specs changing... They never officially revealed them until the past E3. And there were still some specs missing.
The online will be free. I dont see Sony coming out all of a sudden and saying "it's not free"...
Seriously, fanboys need to stop pulling that card. It's $100 more then a 360. Get over it. You spend just as much after Xbxo live and the Hard Drive. You didn't see this much complaining when the PS2 was more expensive then the Gamecube...
Karmakin @ Aug 26th 2006 9:13PM
Ack, forgot one more thing. The PA comic really isn't that funny (it's more entertaining than LOL funny), but they popularity is really based upon the fact that they're the best gaming pundits in the world IMO.
sienar @ Aug 26th 2006 9:21PM
"Thanks B33, I was going to say that so that I could quiet this ignorant person, but I see you have beat me to the punch."
The've said they have a basic system that allows users to play online for free, but it still allows the developers to decide if they wan't to charge for online play.
You see, it will be the developers paying for servers to have any extra features sony doesn't decide to support.
Overall, I'm very skeptical of their online system, since they have no real track record of an organized service. Add that to things the've royally fucked up, like sony connect, and the madness of launching such a system with a brand new console, and you'd have quite a miracle if it's superior to live.
But if sony does manage to release an online platform superir to live, and for free, then I'll be pissed at M$, but until then, I'm not gonna by into anything that's just promises and no actual demonstrations
Will @ Aug 26th 2006 9:19PM
I think Tycho and Gabe really need to rethink what they say if they think the PS3 costs too much. If they aren't buying one based on price, well, that's bullshit too. They're a site based on gaming, delivering us news based on all games in the gaming world, and if they can't afford it, there's something seriously wrong with their budget. They're spending shit tons of money outstaging Jack Thompson (a $20,000 donation, was it?), yet they won't buy themselves a $600 system?
Being a frequent reader of Penny Arcade, this opinion lowers my regard toward them. *sigh* And to think I just bought their book...
Probot @ Aug 26th 2006 9:19PM
Jeff,
The fact that they are successful means that they are saying things a lot of people agree with, and consequently, they are able to reach more people with those opinions.
Did they affect Xbox sales? Probably not, but I don't have any numbers to say one way or the other. I also don't think they'll affect PS3 sales. I'm cynical about internet opinion making a signifcant impact on any sales.
But I wouldn't use sales to judge the relevancy of anything. Just because it sells doesn't mean it's good.
And just because PA is popular doesn't mean they're right. But they are popular. That's my point.
Naaiif @ Aug 26th 2006 9:21PM
Penny Arcade is pathetic, they hate on the ps3, even the xbox when that first came out. Now that they're releasing a game, which will be "Grade a bullsh!t" just by the sound of the title, and because they will try to make a joke at every possible free moment. Even the art for the comic is crap, and im guessing they're gonna carry this on with the game so that game will look like sh!t, yet i bet they won't insult their own game, even though it won't be anywhere near as good as anything else on the other systems.
sienar @ Aug 26th 2006 9:23PM
""I wish I was there. Somehow seeing and hearing thousands of gamers cheering to the sound of someone saying the PS3's price is grade A bullshit almost brings a tear of joy to my eye. It's this kind of unified and shared response that should have sony execs cringing in fear."
You act like Sony is purposely raising the price to make more money. Their already hurting at a $500-$600 price. It's amazing how there were Sony supporters before the price was revealed, and now everybody hates Sony because of the price. Soony should have just had one bundle at $500, instead of following Microsofts crappy plan and doing two packs (very bad concept). What's the trend of having two bundle packs? It only adds to the frustration of trying to find the bundle your looking for."
Because sony was promising the moon and people assumed a reasonable price point(compared to the competition, not the hardware)
Now that there is a virtually unheard of cost, and no major exclusives for some time, people don't see a justification for the purchase(most don't give a damn about bluray)
And yes, going with 2 sku's is stupid, but it's another thing they promised they wouldn't do. Which is another reason people have become disillusioned with the Playstation Brand.
Mr BoomStick XL @ Aug 26th 2006 9:23PM
Well this type of "qoute" from these guys does not suprise me at all!! And here's food for thought....if more big name types like the PennY Arcade guy's start saying " I will not buy a PS3 because of the price" could this impact sales for Sony?? I think it just might!!
chim o death @ Aug 30th 2006 12:18PM
Ethan and B33:
While I'm certain some aspects of Sony's online service will be free, in a Game Informer E3 interview Kaz Hirai himself declined to promise 100% free online gameplay. Most take this to mean only MMORPGs from companies like Square may have charges.
But what if:
Play KIllzone 2 online: Free!
Use voice chat during Killzone 2: $5.00/year!
Ridiculous, perhaps. But Hirai himself indicated some fees, so until we know what they are EXACTLY, comparatives (Xbox Live=$50/year, PS3 online=free forever and ever) can't hold. Various fees to get the most out of the PS3 games online could hit $25 a year.
Fair disclosure: I own a 360, and feel I'm currently getting good value for my $50 a year. I've owned both PS1 and PS2, so I'm not anti-Sony on general priciples. My experiences with the PSPs online services have led me to wonder exactly how long it'll take Sony to deliver on PS3 online.
Jake @ Aug 26th 2006 9:24PM
Karmakin,
Don't worry about the attach rate of the PS3. The systems will sell out no matter the price. It is really our fault (the high price point that is). And by "our" I just mean the consumers. We're the dumb ones that buy systems on eBay at launch for $1,000. Surely it didn't surprise you all that one day the invisible hand of economics caught up.
m4ndo @ Aug 26th 2006 9:35PM
"don't remember ever seeing the System specs changing... They never officially revealed them until the past E3. And there were still some specs missing."
I think you know what I meant. And was the PS3 online platform ever officially revealed? Have we seen what you will be able to do with it? In those interface demos they always skipped over that part. If it does turn out to be free I'd be amazed simply at how much money they are willing to lose on this system.
ACE @ Aug 26th 2006 9:28PM
I wont buy the PS3 for a long time if at all. Sony has blown it for me. Their advertising is terrible, their console is huge and in my opinion ugly, their price is high, and they completly ruined the controller. I know it will be the "stronger" of the next-gen consoles, but im not going to pay 600 and some odd dollars when i am still trying to cough up 60 bucks for a 360 game every now and then. And on top of that, Im thinking the Wii might surpass my expectations. At $250 this innovative system is looking pretty good. But time will tell with the release of games which consoles i will end up with in the end. A console is determimined by its games, i think. And to me, all sony has going for it is the FF games and GTA. If those games were available for the 360, the PS3 would be nothing.
AK @ Aug 26th 2006 9:28PM
Ethan is right, $50 a year for live is ridiculous! Thats like, the cost of 1 game per year. I mean, who buys 1 game, every year? I would much rather have a (allegedly) free service, that has no control in dealing with problem players.
When people pay to use a service, they are more conscious of their behaviour.
Of course, for all we know, there may very well be a fee for ps3's online play. All we can do is wait and see.
Jake @ Aug 26th 2006 9:34PM
"and they completly ruined the controller."
Come again? They removed rumble and added tilt sensors. Does that ruin it for you? It amazes me that rumble is such a big deal to people. I feel like it's just another excuse for people to complain about the PS3. Really the rumble in the DualShock is only big in FPS's and other shooting games. Arguably, the best input device for these types of games is a mouse and keyboard. Tell me that last time you played an FPS on your PC with a keyboard and mouse that had some kind of force feedback.
Sorry for the rant. I just got slightly annoyed.
B33 @ Aug 26th 2006 9:36PM
"I wont buy the PS3 for a long time if at all. Sony has blown it for me. Their advertising is terrible, their console is huge and in my opinion ugly, their price is high, and they completly ruined the controller. I know it will be the "stronger" of the next-gen consoles, but im not going to pay 600 and some odd dollars when i am still trying to cough up 60 bucks for a 360 game every now and then. And on top of that, Im thinking the Wii might surpass my expectations. At $250 this innovative system is looking pretty good. But time will tell with the release of games which consoles i will end up with in the end. A console is determimined by its games, i think. And to me, all sony has going for it is the FF games and GTA. If those games were available for the 360, the PS3 would be nothing."
How is their advertising terrible? The console is about the same size of a 360. It's thicker, but that keeps it from falling down while it's stood up and scratching games. The Wii is a gimmick. It's a slimmed down gamecube that has a new "revolutoinizing" controller thats not very revolutionary. GTA sucks big time. The PS2 suceeded because of games like Ratchet and Clank, Jak, Sly, Devil May Cry, Metal Gear Solid, Kingdom Hearts, Final Fantasy, Burnout, Shadow of the Colossus, and many others. The PS2 didn't have to rely on one over rated FPS to suceed.
sienar @ Aug 26th 2006 9:39PM
@33
Rumble makes a difference in more than FPS games
Just look at ico
It's a feature that was dropped when it probally didn't have to be dropped, and when your paying 600 for a console, it might just piss people off
sienar @ Aug 26th 2006 9:44PM
@ 35
GTA isn't a fps, and it definetly played a big part in the ps2's success.
In fact, it played a bigger part then several of the games you mentioned, such as shadow of the colossus, sly and ratchet and clank
As for their adverising, I thought the psp nut's commercials were dumb, and then their was the ad that some people may take as racist.
The console's size not scratching the disk is a half-baked argument, and if you're going to mock the wii, then do you consider the PS3 controller to be equally bad?
AssemblyLineHuman @ Aug 26th 2006 9:52PM
Jake: Rumble is a very important aspect of games for me. I rarely use my Wavebird controller in any game because I don't like the lack of rumble.
Jake @ Aug 26th 2006 9:55PM
If Ico is the only game that really uses rumble as a key component, then I think 1 game in the past 5-6 years doesn't really make a strong argument for keeping the feature if it's going to cost you millions of dollars in fees to Immersion.
Sony is a business. They know they're going to lose money for the first couple years, so naturally they are going to try to minimize those losses.
6vx @ Aug 26th 2006 9:58PM
Ethan:
Anyone dumb enough to think these consoles will last 6 years is kidding themselves. I know you're trying to exaggerate facts to make PS3 look nice to your little fanboy eyes, but could you get over yourself?
Either PNP will suck in comparison to Live, or it will have costs. That's all there is to it.
And if you take another look at "the average console life span" you'll come to realize, like most people not living on the moon, that it's going dooooown. PCs (especially branded living-room style machines) will be taking the place of fixed-hardware consoles next cycle, because it's simply too hard to keep up.
NES -> SNES = 7
SNES -> N64 = 6
N64 -> Gamecube = 5
Xbox -> Xbox 360 = 4
I dont really have a doubt what the future looks like. I'm suprised you do.
It's sad I spent so long debunking that dumb image of yours, but here we are.
Zachary Hinchliffe @ Aug 26th 2006 10:10PM
I refrain from arguing over whether Xbox 360 or PS3 is better (I am a Nintendo person myself, so I stay out of this) OR whether these Penny Arcade people are right or wrong. I am just clarifying a statement.
I think they are buying one not because "we can't afford that much for a video game system" so much as they are saying "Sony, that's ridiculous, we won't buy one to be defiant and rub it in your face".
Nter @ Aug 26th 2006 10:16PM
Hello, I am from the internets.
You're a super Sony fanboy, B33.
Drew @ Aug 26th 2006 10:17PM
B33 said "I don't remember ever seeing the System specs changing"
Well, they did. Remember E305? Remember dual-HDMI ports, each one capable of outputting a 1080p image? Remember 3 gigabit ethernet ports? Remember 1 SKU, with the card reader and wifi included? I do, and so does Gamespot:
http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/05/16/news_6124681.html
The wikipedia entry - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_3 - lists the current specs.
Compare those two links and you'll see that the specs did indeed change.
There's also a heavily anti-Sony biased video up on YouTube - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Wzmf0ChL24 - showing the E305 press conference bits with the specs that changed.
Nter @ Aug 26th 2006 10:20PM
6vx, you're comparing two different company's consoles..
Don't you know that Microsoft is the only one of the "Big Three" to release their console the earliest?
Kenny @ Aug 26th 2006 10:23PM
Wow, whats with all the hating on Penny Arcade?
You can dislike the comics, but don't ignore their influence on the industry. That's just stupid.
Either that or people like being "nonconformists" for the sake of being "nonconformists."
6vx @ Aug 26th 2006 10:26PM
Nter:
Dont you know that each company is going to try to compete with each other, or else they'll be left behind to rot? Or do you actually think that Sony could survive on a 6 year cycle while Microsoft is pumping them out every 3 years?
Not a chance in hell.
Ethan @ Aug 26th 2006 10:27PM
6vx,funny how in all of your comparisons, you dont mention a sony console once. It has always been six years until a new console, and 10 years until support for that console ends for Sony. Sony has even stated that it will hold true for this generation of their console also. And if you think about it, you are paying $400 for a 360, that by your comoarisons, will last 4 years, that is $100 per year, not including live. Now with the PS3, which will last 6 years, is $500, so you are paying an extra $100 for 2 extra years of support.
B33 @ Aug 26th 2006 10:31PM
"GTA isn't a fps, and it definetly played a big part in the ps2's success."
I was refering to Halo.
"As for their adverising, I thought the psp nut's commercials were dumb, and then their was the ad that some people may take as racist."
So their advertising is terrible because of two ads? The supposed "racist" one wasn't even campaigned in the US. And wasnt that racist to begin with
"The console's size not scratching the disk is a half-baked argument, and if you're going to mock the wii, then do you consider the PS3 controller to be equally bad?"
I don't think motion sensitivty was the best choice for the PS3 controller...
Moogle @ Aug 26th 2006 10:33PM
If anything, I think this guaranteed that PAX will never be the same kind of event as E3. Gabe and Tycho seem to be making it pretty clear that their personalities and opinions hold sway, not the industry's dollar. This will make it easier for them to maintain control, keep the focus on the gamers. Good move overall, I think, but we'll have to see.
The PS3 price isn't such a big deal to me. I think this is just the internet echo chamber at work. It will be a shame if PS3 sales suffer because of sticker shock despite it being worth the price (if that turns out to be the case).