Assassin's Creed 360 has superior AI, says Ubisoft producer [update 2]
by James Ransom-Wiley 
{ Sep 29th 2006 at 4:10PM }
Assassin's Creed producer Jade Raymond has let slip what she must have assumed was a minor detail, suggesting the Xbox 360 version of Ubisoft's upcoming release will boast superior crowd AI when compared to the PlayStation 3 version. She points to 360's more-capable threading technology as the reason for this slight improvement. Raymond also noted that the Xbox team is working on some special achievements for Assassin's Creed, but she did not comment on the state of PS3 "entitlements."Many had anticipated that Assassin's Creed would be one of PS3's future hits (a reason to invest in the pricey console), if not the killer app -- but that was when AC was "exclusive" to Sony's console. Will news that the Xbox 360 version is apparently "smarter" drive some console sales away from Sony and into Microsoft's corner? Will the MS camp try to market this detail to its advantage? This is an issue to watch.
[Update 1: clarified wording with regard to comment #4.]
Update 2: As described in comment #7, IGN writes: "you will actually feel for handholds." We assume this means the (Xbox 360) controller will vibrate when Altair is in position to use safe hand- and footholds. But with a lack of rumble support, how will the PS3 handle this gameplay feature?
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
reguy @ Sep 29th 2006 4:13PM
Finally a good post!!!!
niindre @ Sep 29th 2006 4:13PM
ut-oh... the sony fanboys are not going to like this post at all. No sir.
crono141 @ Sep 29th 2006 4:13PM
The Plot thickens, in this console war.
Steve @ Sep 29th 2006 4:15PM
The developer didn't say the 360 had "advanced" threading capabilities. With single-issue cores and no out-of-order completion, there is nothing advanced about the 360's threading capabilities.
PS3's SPEs are less capable when it comes to threading than a general-purpose processor is, but that doesn't mean the 360's capabilities are particularly advanced.
foobob @ Sep 29th 2006 4:17PM
the 360 version also makes your penis grow stronger. it has something to do with hyperthreading or blast processing or whatever...
Regula Oblique @ Sep 29th 2006 4:21PM
Just seems like an issue of not having enough time with the PS3 hardware to fully manipulate it, since 360 dev hardware was available way in advance its more than likely the system they started developement on. thats what they have been running all there demos on. I wouldnt put it past them if the PS3 version was not released the same day as the 360 one is.
Grant @ Sep 29th 2006 4:22PM
In IGN's preview of A.C. they mention that one of the cool features of the game is 'feeling' for holds as you climb walls.
I thought "how cool to feel the rumble as you feel a hand hold, or maybe they'll have it work so that as you start to slip the rumbling gets more powerful so you know you have to go a different direction" then realized that the PS3 couldn't do that-it has no rumble.
This game is a no brainer for the 360.
darryl @ Sep 29th 2006 4:26PM
"The hardware also allows for improved threading, which will improve even further the crowd AI."
The hardware allows for "normal" threading... the PS3 can offer the same AI if they put more effort into it. This is simply an issue with multi-platform software design. The PS3 and 360 *are* very different designs. Is it worth their extra effort to ensure the PS3 and 360 versions are identical performance wise? Probably not. You'll see many, many games on the PS3 that exhibit slight performance increases over a 360 port, and vise versa... pretty obvious, no?
Wulkar @ Sep 29th 2006 7:54PM
if AC was only going to be on the 360 i would not be playing it but i am so happy its coming to the 360.
niindre @ Sep 29th 2006 4:26PM
I think it's just the simple fact that the 360 is easier to develop on. It's well documented, and really should come as no surprise since Microsoft has always developed great tools.
modeless @ Sep 29th 2006 4:28PM
The truth comes out! I was actually expecting this; I wondered how they would possibly use the Cell's SPEs for AI. They just don't seem very suited for the task. I'm sure in the future some AI middleware will include SPE acceleration, but I am not at all surprised that early titles can't figure out how to leverage them. Extra cores, on the other hand, are straightforward to use (though not trivial).
Methane47 @ Sep 29th 2006 4:42PM
OH MY god Come on... The wording does not say the Xbox360 version is better than the PS3 version... HEre is the quote
While the PlayStation 3 and 360 versions of Assassin's Creed are virtually identical, Raymond did say that on the 360 the team is putting a special emphasis on achievements. The hardware also allows for improved threading, which will improve even further the crowd AI.
Take note This was a preview from the Event at X06.. So First of all everything would be Xbox biased.
Secondly Notice it is not implicatly stated that the 360 version has smarter AI. It says "The Hardware" ... Which hardware? Many people would upon first glance assume this was 360 hardware. Or could it have meant NEXT GEN hardware. Allows for greater AI.
KineticOnline @ Sep 29th 2006 4:31PM
Steve i believe what was meant is that the 360 in comparison to the PS3 makes the AI "smarter" because the threading in the 360 is more efficient at working with their particular AI. Its normal for games to have different speeds when being run on different machines. Its just happens that this time the 360 has the advantage with the AI, its more than likely that the PS3 has a similar advantage over the 360 in some other area of the game.
gamerx @ Sep 29th 2006 4:33PM
@ #4 Steve,
let me try explaining the post to you.
"She points to 360's more-capable threading capabilities as the reason for this slight technical improvement."
Steve, Ubisoft meant the 360 has MORE CAPABLE threading techniques than the PlayStation 3 does, oops sorry Ken i mean PLAYSTATION 3. Meaning the 360 is MORE ADVANCED than the PS3 in this regard. what part of that sentence dont u understand?
unless you work for Sony, than i can see why you wouldnt understand ;)
BklynKid @ Sep 29th 2006 4:34PM
Eat shit Playstation fanboys!
SonyBlowsGoats @ Sep 29th 2006 4:37PM
HA HA! Stick that in your pipe and smoke it Sony fanboys!
It just keeps getting better and better!
SquirrelPhister @ Sep 29th 2006 4:38PM
KineticOnline:
"its more than likely that the PS3 has a similar advantage over the 360 in some other area of the game."
'more than likely'? then surely you must have something to back this assumption up
no? well, that's okay. just keep telling yourself the PS3 is better and I'm sure it will come true some day
Anon - I - mousse @ Sep 29th 2006 4:41PM
The AI that I has compares to you superior.
Cool8man @ Sep 29th 2006 4:40PM
From Arstechnica:
"However bad off Xenon will be in that department, the PS3's Cell will probably be worse. The Cell has only one PPE to the Xenon's three, which means that developers will have to cram all their game control, AI, and physics code into at most two threads that are sharing a very narrow execution core with no instruction window. (Don't bother suggesting that the PS3 can use its SPEs for branch-intensive code, because the SPEs lack branch prediction entirely.) Furthermore, the PS3's L2 is only 512K, which is half the size of the Xenon's L2. So the PS3 doesn't get much help with branches in the cache department."
-Arstechnica
DBX00 @ Sep 29th 2006 4:41PM
I don't buy a console for a single game, so I don't really care if they haven't figured out how to utilize the hardware to make the crowd move in a certain pattern. Maybe they'll figure it out before the game is released and all of this will be pointless. I highly doubt this will sway anyone from purchasing a PS3. If they've resisted the temptation this long, they're probably not going to buy a XBOX 360 unless there is a price drop and that doesn't seem to be happening soon.
If you have an XBOX 360, be happy your getting a great game and stop trying to push sales for your console because you're scared it might start looking old in the next coming months.
Me @ Sep 29th 2006 4:43PM
Hell no Sony fanboys won't like this post cuz it makes no damn sense and the guy that wrote this is just gay !!! Your gonna say that with the 360's 3 symetrical cores, ubisoft can achieve better than AI than with the PS3's 7 cores......I smell a load of bullshit.....just get over it....the 360 does not compare to the PS3.....That's all i have to say and if you respond with some dumb shit to this let me go ahead and beat you before you post by saying your a dumbass....lmao !!! I win !!!!
Regula Oblique @ Sep 29th 2006 4:43PM
Yea that may be the Case NOW "modeless", but what will you say in another year when the PS3 hardware is unlocked and the full potential comes out to show that games look better on it than the 360, the visuals only go to a certain point on each system and they...............STOP.
I think we'll be seeing that happen to the 360 sooner than later, and then when these multiplatform games come out myself will pick the better of the bunch the same when most people bought the xbox version rather than the ps2 and gamecube version of a game.
and to all the stupid fanboy comments grow up...most of the peeps hating on the ps3 probably dont even have a 360. Me will have them all so I can have a reason to hate on them
aZn_1080p @ Sep 29th 2006 4:43PM
I wonder how big a cheque from MS Jade Raymond will be cashing for this little PR coup? Nice work M$, I hate to go back to calling you that but the recent blatant attempts at buying out and monopolizing damn near whole industry have forced my hand.
BMWM3P @ Sep 29th 2006 4:46PM
This bitch will be saying something that the PS3 is better at when she's at PS conference in october. You ms bitches need to convincing yourselves that you didn't waste 400.00, but the fact is you did.
nambit @ Sep 29th 2006 4:45PM
Man, what a bunch of spiteful fanatics. In the end, think of it all as an advancement of gaming, nothing more. Just be happy and not spiteful/childish. You get the games you want... so enjoy them and respect each other. Sigh.
KBeat @ Sep 29th 2006 4:45PM
When I first read about this I knew it would lead to some fun on Joystiq. XBox 360 threading capabilities ftw!! ;)
slestak @ Sep 29th 2006 4:47PM
Jade Raymond is hot. Just sayin'.
JPRacer @ Sep 29th 2006 4:48PM
It as been said many times. The Cell is a very capable CPU with lot of processing power, but that processing is not well suited for games. AI code is almost just branching code and this type of code runs poorly on SPEs. Cell is a bad choice for a game console.
Rim @ Sep 29th 2006 4:49PM
"The hardware also allows for improved threading, which will improve even further the crowd AI."
Seems pretty clear to me.
PS3 has less than capable threading, so the game will suffer.
Trying to say they mean all NEXT GEN hardware is just wishful thinking, and the PC hardware has quad cores and beyond.
It seems a lot of new games are starting to use an entire core just for AI now in the 360. This doesn't bode well for the PS3 if its hardware isn't up for the task.
Kirk @ Sep 29th 2006 4:51PM
Better AI here...better graphics there. YAWN...
As a future Wii owner, I'm just glad I have a 360 so I can play this great looking game. Can't wait!
Pete @ Sep 29th 2006 4:53PM
I'm really surprised at this. I remember a while back some marketing goon from Sony was saying this game's crowd AI wasn't even possible on the 360, and now the 360 is actually more adept at that very function? Sony just amazes me. They talk so much shit...Xbox 1.5, "full HD"...they are like children really.
TheEnlightened @ Sep 29th 2006 4:58PM
I was about write a comment stating all the comments that 360 and PS3 fanboys would say in response to this but they managed to beat me to it.
Oh well i suppose i'll have to make do with the Wii and PC ones:
Wii:
"I don't care about graphics or ai, it's innoative gameplay that counts"
PC:
My comp pwnzd tha 36o + pS3 gays 3 years agod.
EnderAl @ Sep 29th 2006 4:58PM
Darryl said, "You'll see many, many games on the PS3 that exhibit slight performance increases over a 360 port, and vise versa... pretty obvious, no?"
---
They might add extra content to a port, like new levels or something like that, but do they really usually increase the performance? I think not. Usually, a developer will port a popular title to a new system just to broaden the audience, and since they don't want to spend too much time on it, the port will end up performing worse because the original code wasn't optimized for the port-receiving system. In this case, the 360 receives the port, and it happens to get better peformance. That seems like a rarity to me.
To balance that out, I'd also like to say I'm interested in seeing how Oblivion performs on the PS3. There are a lot of factors that could make the port better (more memory on disc for more textures?) or worse (slower load times for Blu-Ray media).
Patrick @ Sep 29th 2006 4:57PM
Wouldn't it be a disadvantage for Ubisoft to say that about their own game? At the end of the day, they're releasing AC for both the PS3 and Xbox360, so they'd want good sales on both systems. If she's saying "the 360 AC will be better then the PS3 AC" Ubisoft are shooting themselves in the foot. Personally, i dont think you can judge anything about AC just yet, since A) This was said at a Microsoft event. B) The PS3 version is still being worked on. C) It's a Microsoft event.
But then again, I'm sure Microsoft fanboys are already wetting their pants with excitement.
SquirrelPhister @ Sep 29th 2006 5:10PM
aZn_1080p"
"I wonder how big a cheque from MS Jade Raymond will be cashing for this little PR coup? Nice work M$, I hate to go back to calling you that but the recent blatant attempts at buying out and monopolizing damn near whole industry have forced my hand."
wow, you are the most paranoid little boy on the internet. ha ha 'forced your hand' lol ha ha hhaaahahahahha
cringer8 @ Sep 29th 2006 5:00PM
Sony fanboys are the most amusing of all the fanboys. It's as if the PS3 is some sort of *top secret* hardware "puzzle" that developers have to "figure out." "Once they crack the code and unlock the 'secret' power of the PS3, then we'll see how much the 360 sucks."
LMAO. They're identical systems. Just get over it. Neither is ultimately "better" than the other. They cost the same (when all is made equal) and produce the same graphics. The 360 currently has the edge with Live, but who can say PS3's online service won't be equal? We'll see.
*Bottom Line*
The hardware in the PS3 is not fashioned from space crystals and demon blood. It's just hardware. Made today with today's technological limitations.
biohazard @ Sep 29th 2006 5:01PM
@18
Not buying hardware for a single game is indeed a good idea.
Also, I'm not trying to pimp a 360 over PS3, because it's still early in the game development cycle for both.
However, creating advanced AI especially for crowds, I believe, is very important for next gen gaming. For example: my biggest problem with GhostRecon AW, no crowds at all. Seemed kinda strange to have a nice big city and no one in it except for people shooting at me.
I personally think having large and realistic crowds of NPCs is going to be a big thing in the better next-gen games. It will definitely blur the line between game and reality, which makes for a more immersive gaming experience.
I'm not saying PS3 can't do it, I'm not saying X360 can. I'm saying I hope developers push this feature on all platforms, and if one platform does excel at this feature, and it is used to create better games, then yes, it is something that is important to me as a gamer.
B33 @ Sep 29th 2006 5:01PM
Nice one Joystiq. Not only did you alter the wording and put out yet another Sony bashing newspost, a good majority of the article came from Kotaku (nice way to rip off the article). And Kotaku is not the most reliable source out there... Either way, the differences won't be noticeable...
voodooboo @ Sep 29th 2006 5:02PM
The dev said it focktards, the dev... there is not really any point trying to spin it - this it is not subjective commentary from a blogger.
Hey I'm sure they'll the code the 'superior version' so you can flail your arms in six degrees of motion when you fall from a wall - and no doubt you'll land on the dumb fugger too stupid to move out the way.
haha!
Amir Ali @ Sep 29th 2006 5:02PM
OMGWTFBBQ!! Women don't know about computers!! She's Probably Talking about something to do with sewing.
But in all, 'seriousernessity', When someone goes to gamestop, sees These two games on the shelf side by side, (PS3 Creed, 360 Creed), They're not gonna say...
"Hmm, that dumb bitch Jade Raymond said, that the 360 has better threading, so maybbbeeee I'll get this one!!"
Not likely.
The End.
gamerx @ Sep 29th 2006 5:04PM
dont worry Sony fanboys, atleast the rest of the game will be similar, even down to the controls. oh wait...wait...oh yea thats rite, the PS3 controller doesnt even have rumble! oh snap!
so let me get this straight, Sony fanboys will have to wait for the game to be ported to the PS3, will get an inferior AI system, and no rumble! good luck with all of that!
Amir Ali @ Sep 29th 2006 5:05PM
voodooboo, hey focktard, read properly before you open your mouth and all the bats fly out of it.
Jade Raymond is NOT THE DEV, Jade Raymond IS THE PRODUCER. That is all, a dumb bitch for all anyone knows.
Get your head out of your ass.
rockintom99 @ Sep 29th 2006 5:06PM
Hey guys, guess what? These are video game consoles. They play games. Some do so better than others. Yay.
JohnDoe @ Sep 29th 2006 5:09PM
Hey rockintom99, Guess what, Your mom is a prostitute, she plays men, some men better than others. Yay.
Pete @ Sep 29th 2006 5:08PM
Who said this is a port of the PS3 version? Ubisoft concurrently develops on all platforms. The 360 version is built for the 360.
FreeCajunLove @ Sep 29th 2006 5:10PM
So why are we calling Jade Raymond a bitch?
just seems a little rude
woejilli @ Sep 29th 2006 5:13PM
The great thing about incendiary posts like this is the fanboy rage. However, I love to read it all with the idea that a huge majority of the posters are not really fanboys, rather they are paid undercover marketers waging a war of perceived fanboy fluster. Because honestly can real people get this offended. And if you are as old as some of you sound like in your posts, shouldn't you be in school most of the day?
gamerx @ Sep 29th 2006 5:14PM
hey aZn_1080p, the 360 does 1080p natively now as well.........
i hope you didnt get a heart attack.
Arroof! @ Sep 29th 2006 5:14PM
"The great thing about incendiary posts like this is the fanboy rage. However, I love to read it all with the idea that a huge majority of the posters are not really fanboys, rather they are paid undercover marketers waging a war of perceived fanboy fluster. Because honestly can real people get this offended. And if you are as old as some of you sound like in your posts, shouldn't you be in school most of the day?"
You sound like you're jerking off to the posts or something. YOU SICK F-F-F-FREAK!!
Rallion @ Sep 29th 2006 5:17PM
It's simple, really. The PS3 has lots of power, but it comes at the cost of...well, let's call it flexibility. As I understand it, if what you're doing is very dynamic, like crowd AI, that's probably not going to run as fast as you would expect. (That's a crazy generalization, but it does at least apply to AI.)
@Regula (#21) Yeah, there comes a point where developers can no longer squeeze more power out of a system. It happens. It will happen first for Wii, because it has the least power to squeeze and (more importantly) because it's basically just a more powerful GameCube. It will happen next for the 360, I won't argue with you there. But you seem to think that the fact that it will be, oh, ten years before developers are really comfortable with the PS3 is a GOOD thing. It's not. All that hardware you're investing in won't be running at top performance until that happens. And, here's the real kicker, don't expect the competition to just sit on their hands while the PS3 ramps up. Sony seems determined to make the PS3's lifecycle tremendous. They HAVE to, to justify that price. I get the impression they don't intend to launch a replacement for about ten years. You can probably expect a new Nintendo system and a new XBox in closer to five. You can bet those systems will be more powerful than the PS3 is -- and in the case of Nintendo, at least, you can bet that the total cost of the Wii and its successor will be less than one PS3.
Anybody who is serious about PC gaming (and halfway intelligent) knows that going with the top-of-the-line equipment has its advantages, but it's still a huge waste of money and you never get what you paid for.