Xbox 360 can support HDMI, but will it?

Every HD set-top box on the market today has a DVI or HDMI port except for the XBox 360. I can't take the HD-DVD drive or the prospect 1080p games seriously until an HDMI cable for the XBox 360 is realeased. Sony added an HDMI for the $499 model of PS3 ( annouced at TGS '06 ). What is Microsoft waiting for? 1080p support without HDMI output is meaningless as far as I am concerned.

Why is 1080p without HDMI meaningless? A huge number of native 1080p displays can accept it over their VGA input, and a few can take it over component, too.

Is it because you're paranoid about ICT? It seems pretty unlikely that Microsoft would create an HD-DVD add-on without having a "protected" output unless they were certain the studios wouldn't drop ICT in the near future.

Most displays, also, don't have more than one or two HDMI or DVI+HDCP ports, anyway. Most coming out now have two, but I suspect the vast majority of already-sold HDTVs have, at best, one HDCP-capable input. So what goes there? Your upconverting dvd player? Your set top box? Your Xbox 360? Your PS3?

Do the studios really believe people are willing to drop another $150 on an HDMI switch? Do they think the early HDTV adopters, those with only component inputs, are worth alienating? I don't think so. I would be shocked if ICT went into widespread use before 2012, if ever.

My 1080p HDTV has one HDMI input, one 1080p-capable VGA input, and one incapable component input. Why should I waste the HDMI port on a 360 when I, currently, have no reason to?

You can blather about the benefits of skipping the D->A and A->D conversions, or about the benefits of HDMI 1.3 and 48-bit color, of which no displays out today can take advantage, but I just don't buy it.

The number of people out there with 1080p displays, expressed as a percentage of Microsoft or Sony's userbase, is so ridiculously low that this whole debate is remarkably stupid, and there is virtually no benefit to 1080p over 1080i when it comes to HD-DVDs/Blu-ray.

It's such a stupid pissing contest.

I have a 720p set, so I genuinely don't care. That said, my 720p set has a VGA connection. Is it really that rare in higher-end sets?

And can anyone explain if the MS VGA cables include real digital sound output, in either toslink or coax?

why link to digg and not the true source.

using digg as the source is like using wikipedia as a source on a term paper.

FINALLY someone from Microsoft confirms the 360 is capable of supporting HDMI if they decide to do so. For months people have been saying there's no possible way, while others have been saying the box is flexible enough to support the interface, but it's up to Microsoft to allow it.

My brother has a hdtv with sky hd and he says the picture is better through component as aposed to hdmi...

Uh, we did link to the source dish. The "Read" link right beneath the via link, the image itself, and the "Microsoft says" link in the body itself.

The Via link is where we found the item in question. It's true that many blogs have no idea what a via link is for, so I'll let you know. Via, Latin, "by way of." The IGN link is experiencing some popularity on digg right now, so we via it. Same as we via anything we find on another site. It's just good blogging etiquette.

Awesome response Ed. That's what it seems like to me, a pissing contest. No one cared about it a couple weeks ago, and now it's important.

Re: HDMI and VGA. It's my understanding that not every HD television has VGA, especially if they already have HDMI. As for multiple HDMI inputs, many, if not all, higher end recievers all have multiple HDMI ports on them now.

Dyer,

On most TVs the difference between Component and HDMI are not visible. The reason HDMI would be important for the 360 is the ability to pass a 1080p signal. Component can pass 1080p, but relatively no TVs accept 1080p through component, however for the most part all TVs that can accept 1080p signals are able to receive the it through HDMI.

My 720p set looks great through VGA, but honestly... not as good as component. If the X360 would upscale over component, I would put my VGA cable away for good (aside from the occasional LAN party, a monitor is easier to move around).

I only have DVI on my TV, how will this affect me?

Everyone, please stop spreading FALSE information!
Read Ed's post carefully.

All 1080p displays with VGA ports CAN support 1080p content over the VGA port.

Very few can support 1080p over the component port, but almost all can support 1080i over component.

The necessity of HDMI (and DVI) is the ability to display 1080p HD-DVDs with HDCP copy protection enabled. HDMI has HDCP built in on ALL displays. DVI has HDCP built it only if the manufacturer specifies it is built in.

VGA and component have NO HDCP copy protection, so if you try to watch an HDCP-protected HD-DVD over the VGA or component cable hooked up to a 1080p display, the movie will be downscaled to probably 720p or even lower (not sure).

"Have we gone from "1080p, who cares?" to "give us our damned HDMI cable so we can experience true HD"?"

Not I... I've got a 1080i TV that is big enough, and was enough of an expense that it's not getting replaced until it breaks or is really outdated... considering how many 1080p TVs exist in the wild right now 1080p is more of a bullet-point for the boxes of both consoles than anything; but then we're also at the beginning of the generation; I'm sure it'll be a different story in a few years.

If you have a LCD set that is 1080p capable and it doesn't support VGA then your the fool for buying it. Its a bloody computer monitor with a tv unit added. And if you really want it that badly just use a converter or adapter

Jason,
"All 1080p displays with VGA ports CAN support 1080p content over the VGA port."

This is completely false. Few RP HDTVs can display 1080p over VGA

Proof: Sony KDS-60A2000
Max VGA Resolution 1360 x 68
http://www.sonystyle.com/intershoproot/eCS/Store/en/documents/specifications/KDSA2000.pdf

"I only have DVI on my TV, how will this affect me?"

Your TV most likely doesnt support 1080p, however if Microsoft came out with a HDMI cable and you wanted to use a digital connection you could purchase a HDMI -> DVI adapter.

Hey Mark, the MS VGA cable has the same digital out that the normal MS Component cables have. I'm using them right now.

My 51" HDTV doesn't have HDMI. It doesn't have DVI or SVGA either. It only has component. I wasn't aware of HDCP until a month after I bought the TV or I would have gone with future-proofing. I could buy another TV with the support, but why should I have to? Is it worth it? No, is my findings.

One room mate has a 26" LCD HDTV and another has a 32" CRT HDTV. Both have HDMI, and they use it.

The HDMI difference in either of their respective setups wasn't very impressive for the cost of those cables. I obtained about the same amount of difference just going with Monster Component Cables (which I picked up for a fraction of the regular cost in a bundle on ebay).

Component will look better to some because everything will not appear as jagged. An analog signal results in a slightly softer picture. Digital connections can actually be too sharp. LCDs seem to accentuate this problem as well.

My TV only supports up to 720p/1080i, and doesn't have a VGA Input (Only HDMI and component)
I'm considering buying the VGA cable, and a VGA to HDMI adapter (If such a thing exists, if not I'll be buying a VGA to DVI adapter, and use it with the DVI to HDMI adapter I already own for my media center PC) just because I really like the idea of the 360 HD-DVD Player upconverting my DVD's.
If this doesn't work, I don't really care 'cause I'll still be able to watch my HD-DVD's at 1080i over component.

Since they CAN implement hmdi on the 360's i guess my question is HOW would they do so?

New boxes with hdmi plugs on the back? Or would it just be a new(expensive)proprietary plug? Anyone in the know on this?

Oh and just to chime in on the 1080p over VGA issue very few 1080p monitors allow full def thru the VGA port. Interestingly the new XBR LCoS Projection Sonys, actually WILL allow full 1080p over VGA. Which makes me wonder if my next tv purchase, which was going to be the kds-a2000 should be stalled of in view of its more expensive big brother.

Yes, it does matter. Of the many 1080p native screens, if they even have 1080p input (many don't, even though they are 1080p native), they only do it through either HDMI or VGA, unfortunetly, my a2000 doesnt accept it through VGA, only HDMI, and hardly ANY 1080p sets accept it through component, mine included. So yes, its a big deal. I was so excited about this announcement, but I will get zero benifets from it. You _still_ cant upscale via component, only VGA, and you can only output 1080p from the HD-DVD via vga only... I thought it was rather mad of microsoft not to have a digital output, and even madder to say "there isnt a market for it." So please, hurry up! I want HDMI!

My 42in westinghouse 1080p lcd display has hdmi, dvi, vga, and component... it can take 1080p over component too... It kicks all forms of ass in this respect. If you bought a display that has limited inputs - that's your fault for lack of research/forsight.

@22 david tam

It's my fault I bought my HDTV before they decided to implement HDMI and start selling boogeyman fears of HDCP? When I bought my HDTV, there was ZERO discussion in any market of this being a possibility in the future. My HDTV doesn't have HDMI, but it does have DVI (non HDCP) and component, as well as VGA. There was no "lack of research/foresight" on my part. There was simply NO OPTION AT THE TIME.

And guess what? People like me are in the MAJORITY of HDTV owners. Every one of us early adopters will be REALLY pissed off if the studios use any of the copy protection schemes that lock us out. We paid thousands for our rigs, only to be spat upon by the studios? IT WON'T FLY. People will complain so much that the studios will change their mind- Why would they cut off the people who supported HDTV from the early days? WE are the ones who get this technology to become mainstream.

I quite enjoy movies upscaled over VGA. They look fabulous. The HD-DVDs ought to look pretty damn good, too.

If you're nitpicking over having HDMI on YOUR television, and wanting that negligible difference gained from HDMI (over VGA), then I'd say YOU are the one who didn't have enough research and foresight to realize that the MOST COMMON technology is the one that gets used- NOT the bleeding edge.

Networks don't (and won't) broadcast in 1080p. The gains of 1080p are minor, at best, and absolutely pointless if your HDTV is smaller than 60". The only things to gain from 1080p are computers displayed over HDTV, and high def movies. Perhaps 1 in 20 video games might be 1080p native, too. That's not worth it to most people.

I don't think I have to tell you that the people who own 60"+ HDTVs purchased within the past six months are outnumbered by EVERY OTHER HDTV OWNER that entered the market prior to the launch of HDMI and HDCP threats.

Yes I want a frickin HDMI port/Cable already!!!!

It isn't anything to do with 1080p for me, but I have 2xhdmi sockets on my mid-range 32" HD TV (1080i) and I want to use them! I already use a hdmi DVD player to good effect and I would love to hook the box up with HDMI also... main reason? I get some sort of interference on the component leads (subtle but visible on dark scenes) and HDMI offers that last extra bit of clarity/cleaness of the signal.

Come on MS release the damn cable already and stop teasing. ;)

Note that every time Microsoft talks about their "solution", they never specifically say "New cable for existing 360's". They simply state that HDMI can be supported on the 360.

My guess is that MS would have to release a hardware revision to do it, which is why nobody is getting into specifics. If they said now that HDMI would require buying another 360, they'd see sales drop from people holding out for the new revision.

16. "I only have DVI on my TV, how will this affect me?"

Your TV most likely doesnt support 1080p, however if Microsoft came out with a HDMI cable and you wanted to use a digital connection you could purchase a HDMI -> DVI adapter.



If my TV doesn't support 1080p why would I want to use that cable DVI, what would be the advantage over component that I have now?

For the record... composite, component, VGA and DVI-a are all analogue signals.

DVI-d and HDMI are digital... there is no simple converter that will convert from analogue to digital.

(DVI-i is analong and digital)

I dont have a 1080p set...
I want one.
That group of people are not supported in many posted "Facts"
"Facts" being BS that you read on the internet then later quote as fact on a Fanboy site.

Micosoft and fanboys downplay the immportance of 1080p because the 360 does not have it. Never admit weakness.

Here are the FACTS:

Microsoft previously said that Sony is the company who insists on all of the copyright laws for movies, so if Sony was going to release a Playstation 3 without HDMI, then that means Sony would not enforce those copyright laws in the future. As a result, Microsoft said that the Xbox 360 HD-DVD player would not include HDMI, because there was no need.

However, Sony has now made it so the Playstation 3 includes an HDMI cable for Blu-ray movies in both of the Playstation 3. This means that if Sony wanted to, they could enforce much stricter copyright laws with Blu-ray movies. As a result, Microsoft seems to be in a position where it would be a mistake to release the HD-DVD drive without an HDMI cable.

The HD-DVD copyright laws are not quite as strict as the Blu-ray copyright laws, but the simple fact that Microsoft made it clear that they were watching Sony, and if both versions of PS3 had HDMI output, then the Xbox 360 HD-DVD drive would also have an HDMI output.

Many HDTVs are capable of receiving signals up to 1080p with Component cables.

Sony does not yet make an HDTV that can accept a 1080p signal with a Component cable. Not even Sony's new 2006 high-end HDTVs that cost over $4,000 accept a 1080p signal through Component cables. Sony definitely is NOT the leader of TV technology anymore. In the 90's, Sony made great TVs, but Sony completely dropped the ball over the last decade with HDTV technology.

Samsung is one of the companies that DOES make a lot of HDTVs capable of receiving a 1080p signal with Component cables.

For example, HDTV models HL-S5687W, HL-S6187W, HL-S5679W, all accept 1080p signals with Component cables.

I believe Samsung is the number one maker of HDTVs at this point in time. Samsung's new LED (Light Emitting Diodes) HDTVs are the future of HDTVs.

Anyways, I think Microsoft should include an HDMI output with the HD-DVD drive for the Xbox 360.

But, even if they don't, if you buy a quality 1080p HDTV, you can still use a Component cable to see 1080p signals...just make sure you don't buy a Sony HDTV.

"Samsung's new LED (Light Emitting Diodes) HDTVs are the future of HDTVs."

The reviews of the Samsung LEDs have been mediocre at best. To declare any technology involving DLP as "the future of HDTV" is completely ignorant. The Samsung TVs appeal to some people while LCD/LCOS technology, Sony or other, appeals to others.

Just don't post nonsense, while bashing a technology that you have most likely spent little to no time personally evaluating.

The only reason im concerned is simply because of this. I have an hdmi, and component on my hdtv. No vga. Never cared before but now I have the HD-DVD drive. I really enjoy watching the hd-dvd movies, but frankly feel RIPPED OFF that it wont upconvert my old dvds simply because I dont have a vga port.

I feel like im only getting half of the benefit of my hd-dvd drive.

I also really dont understand Microsoft being so stubborn in releasing the hdmi cable. If we cant upscale through component, and many simply DONT have the vga cable then WHY not release it?
People will be forced to buy it to get full use of the hd-dvd player so what is the hold up? Does microsoft simply not care much about thier customers? Not a great way to treat us now that the next gen wars have started eh?

"Samsung's new LED (Light Emitting Diodes) HDTVs are the future of HDTVs."

Look up SED television technology. I think that is more likely to be the technology of the future.

http://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/sed-tv.htm

"VGA and component have NO HDCP copy protection, so if you try to watch an HDCP-protected HD-DVD over the VGA or component cable hooked up to a 1080p display, the movie will be downscaled to probably 720p or even lower (not sure)."

In responce... Unless the HD-DVD movies I have been watching on my xbox 360 don't have the copy protection, they show at 1080P over my VGA cable, but are downgraded to 1080i if I watch them over the component cable. My TV is capable of accepting the 1080P signal through component so I know that is not the reason it is downgraded.