Broken cogs in Gears of War multiplayer [update 1]
The ranked matching system in Gears of War smells more rank than we originally thought. Gamer Andy have outlined a multitude of methods cheaters are employing to undermine the game.As it is easy to find your friend's game in a list of hosted servers, you can always join a team -- or, worse yet, join the other side's team and sabotage it. The host can wait until all his friends are on the server before starting the game -- in fact, the host can start the game whenever he chooses, regardless of whether or not everyone has clicked on "Ready."
Want more? How about abusing the Execution mode by leaving all opponents "bleeding out" forever while you keep shooting down one guy? In execution, players bleed out forever, and you can continuously earn points by shooting down the last guy, letting him revive, and destroy again ad infinitum. Imagine being stuck on the losing end of a 4v2 when all 5 players are in the same "clan:" if you leave, that's a lot of negative feedback.
Most of this can be fixed in an upcoming patch which has been promised by an Epic Games forum moderator; let's hope they've been listening.
[Via Xbox 360 Fanboy]
[Update 1: Incorrectly misattributed to Xbox 360 Fanboy, when primary source was Gamer Andy. Fixed.]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Scott E @ Nov 13th 2006 3:33PM
Microsoft needs to do something about this. They need to create a standard requirement for all games to have a party system.
I'm reposting most of what I said on 360fanboy:
The lobby in Halo 2 makes it much more enjoyable to get into a game. How does truskill have any effect if I am allowed to select the server I want to play on anyway???
And seriously why show the host's name on the server list? or even let players select their teams in ranked matches??? Any idiot can see that people will exploit this as much as they can.
I don't really care about the ranked matches anyway, but they should at least implement a party system like halo 2 for the player matches.... Its hard as hell to get a group of 3 of your friends playing together against different people all night.
Epic: I want to get three of my buddies together in a lobby and then jump from match to match. All without any kind of displayed rank or leaderboards. Just use the HIDDEN truskill system to match us up. I just want to play the damn game with my friends!!!!
ill trooper @ Nov 13th 2006 3:34PM
Not to mention that 4-on-4 is never gonna dethrone Halo2... How is it Bungie has layed out the map, had a successful run for the last 2 years, and companies still can't (pardon the wordplay) 'match' it?
pattyblades @ Nov 13th 2006 3:39PM
ummm, like why was there no emergence day coverage yesterday, you hyped it but never said anything about yesterday so wats up?
David @ Nov 13th 2006 3:40PM
those things are all true, but I played all day yesterday and never ran into anything worse than people dropping.
Frankly, most people don't care enough about their "points" to warrant downing a person over and over again for an hour.
Also, I believe that if a person is on your friends list they are not able to join a ranked game on the opposing team from you. They can join on your team, but not the other.
Mal F4cti0n @ Nov 13th 2006 3:41PM
Actually in Execution when you "bleed out" you revive. So you can't leave people to "bleed out" indefinitely as they will revive at some point and get up and kill you. I don't think the host can set the bleed out time in ranked matches....but I don't know.
But yes, we are all well aware of looking for your friend's hosted game to play with them in ranked matches.
I don't really care. I just play the ranked matches trying to get curb stomps, head shots, chainsaw kills in order to get the achievements. I die a lot trying to get those kills even though an enemy is right near by who I know will kill me as I am curb stomping someone. If someone wants to cheat and curb stomp all their friends over and over until they get to 100 or 10,000, well I feel they are only cheating themselves because then they are not playing the game.
The game is super-sweet, crazy-go-nuts cool!
Paul @ Nov 13th 2006 3:43PM
Something has to be done about multi-player balancing as well- the large majority of games i have been in people are playing it like halo (run around shooting at eachother) rather than playing it tactically as it seems it was meant to be. It seems more fire downrange seems to be more effective than well placed shots.
Mal F4cti0n @ Nov 13th 2006 3:44PM
Epic is not the problem. MS tied their hands that you cannot go into ranked matches with your friends. Which is stupid. I think the Halo 2 system had it the best. Less chance of people exploiting. You can join a match with three of your friends and you will be matched up against equally skilled people. Now though, your friend can join the other team and in private chat help him win the game. Stupid.
And does anyone else keep on getting dropped? I think it is because the game fills up or the host drops the game, but it should reawl-time update cuz that is annoying when it happens.
Mark @ Nov 13th 2006 3:44PM
Word of advice to every developer: COPY HALO 2!!!! Make everything based on parties and matchmaking-I have a feeling that enough people will be playing Gears to support a matchmaking feature and it is REALLY annoying that Bungie is still the only company that has done this!
Scott @ Nov 13th 2006 3:45PM
If you build it, they will cheat.
Intentless @ Nov 13th 2006 3:48PM
wasn't halo 2's matchmaking hailed as being a revolution in online match finding? Supposed to become the standard? What happened to that? So many games would have benefitted from that... I would have played Gears yesterday if I could have played with my friend wihtout having to hunt for them...
faboo @ Nov 13th 2006 3:59PM
i think they should impelement both party and single player match. i like the idea of rank matches, but they need place the players on random teams. i'm not sure if it's implemented, but it would be nice to play ranked games against with similar skill levels only. i found it annoying playing with/against people who are way to advance then i am. the games aren't fun.
having the option of ranked team match games would be great! as i it would be awesome to play with people i met during the non ranked games. instead of individual skill, you would have team skill (an average of each individual player). that way your team can match up with similar skill level.
what newbie would want to play against a high ranked player? skill levels would help alot.
David LaMont @ Nov 13th 2006 4:00PM
The original article is here:
http://www.gamerandy.com/archives/2006/11/gears_of_war_av.shtml
Marty @ Nov 13th 2006 4:06PM
I think 4 on 4 is fine, it's good for tactics, and you don't have to have tons of players online to make it fun. I really do hope they fix these issues though, as well as the all-too-frequent "disconnected from host" dialog. I spent 20 minutes trying to get into a ranked game last night, eventually just settling for a normal non-ranked game after I couldn't connect to anyone else.
These are small annoyances though, in the face of an otherwise incredible game.
Gamer Andy @ Nov 13th 2006 4:10PM
Little Credit, Joystiq?
I wrote this article yesterday and emailed you the link then... I'm a little puzzled why you're crediting your subsidiary 360fanboy blog, when you know very well it's a GamerAndy.com story
http://www.gamerandy.com/archives/2006/11/gears_of_war_av.shtml
Firegirl @ Nov 13th 2006 4:13PM
So far, I haven't seen any of this bad behavior in playing online. The worst I have witnessed is incredibly uneven teams that don't get balanced out. But, thanks to this wonderful article, I will expect to see more of this behavior online!
Mr Blonde @ Nov 13th 2006 4:17PM
I still can't figure out why Bungie doesn't package up their online component and sell it to other companies, just like you can buy the Unreal Engine.
Ross Miller @ Nov 13th 2006 4:29PM
Gamer Andy staff (though every single one of you has already received an e-mail to the same sentiment) --
It was an honest mistake. I never noticed the original Gamer Andy tip, read about Xbox 360 Fanboy piece without noticing the read link, and ran with it. I erred, but I can assure you there are no malicious intentions. Personally, I'm just a spacey college student who does not get paid because we get a few extra hits on some sister site.
I'm sorry for the anger, which I understand, but I assure you it was nothing to screw the little guy.
SymetriX @ Nov 13th 2006 4:32PM
I played over the weekend and didn't run into any problems. I'm guessing a lot others didn't either since they're just copying and pasting a story from GamerAndy and talking about other games.
Either way, I think other than improving match making so you can join games with friends, and fixing a couple things that some people *could* exploit, the game plays great online.
Animus @ Nov 13th 2006 4:32PM
just so you guys know, Epic was told that they cannot use Matchmaking in Gears by MS... I believe MS doesn't want any company to use MM, unless it's Bungie/Halo3. It was in recent interview with Cliffy... lemme see if I can find it.
SickNic @ Nov 13th 2006 4:35PM
Yeah, some jackass was hosting a ranked match last night and would tell everyone who entered the lobby to leave because he was waiting for friends. I asked him why he didn't just start a private match but he wouldn't answer me. Ranked matches are not there for you to play with your friends...
Mr. Khan @ Nov 13th 2006 4:56PM
@ Scott E
Very few companies have ever found the right balance between Freedom, Security, and Cost in an Online environment
You can take LIVE which is relatively low-cost and has a lot of freedoms and many exploitable loopholes
Nintendo WFC with few freedoms, but its free and largely secure (except when dealing with actual CHEATERS, but thats a different tale)
Or something like FFXI, which costs $150/yr., but has many options and is INSANELY secure (seriously, Square Enix is waaaay to strict with that game)
Personally, i think the system in Metroid Prime Hunters was close to perfect (if only they had lobbies and the ability to chat with rivals, then it would have been)
Chalk up Epic as another company that failed to come up with a perfect Online play system, that's all (and i said Imperfect, not sucky, don't go crazy)
DWells55 @ Nov 13th 2006 5:12PM
@7. Mal F4cti0n
"Epic is not the problem. MS tied their hands that you cannot go into ranked matches with your friends. "
------------------------------------------------------
Not the truth. Epic misinterpreted the Microsoft policies for 360 and made a lousy system. They then turned around to blame Microsoft, the company that has been giving them everything they needed to make the game. A lead Bungie (Halo 2/3) representative, Achronos, and a couple devs from Volition (Saints Row) confirmed that Epic was wrong. Just take a look at Saints Row's MatchMaking system - it works really well.
Epic completely mauled the MatchMaking system. So many people on their forums got pissed off and made well stated complaints (myself being one of them), but they chose to ignore everyon and do their piece of crap system which is easily exploitable as opposed to Halo 2's. I've already had the misfortune of playing against 4 organized people on the other team vs my team of 4 randoms and what I expect was one saboteur. It sucked.
Marty @ Nov 13th 2006 5:13PM
I don't think that's really possible, Mr Blonde. Online components are proprietary to the game's engine, and to the game's needs.
That said, I think Epic did a fine job with their multiplayer coding. I hardly ever see the game lag or jump around. Epic has a LOT of online coding experience under their belt at this point, so I don't think they really need help from Bungie (no offense to them).
187 @ Nov 13th 2006 5:36PM
#1 and #8, I totally agree. I put part of the blame on MS for not taking the Halo 2 party/matchmaking system and creating hooks for developers to incorporate the same thing in 360 games. Since the hooks aren't there, I put the other part of the blame on Epic. They have played Halo 2. They have to know that the party/matchmaking systems are a key ingredient to the replay-ability of Halo 2. They should have included it. Not having a party system or matchmaking seems archaic in comparison to a 2 year old game.
While we're at it, how about letting us save our custom games (different weapon sets) and/or change those weapon sets (or for that matter the map) while in the lobby. Right now, I can host a private game with my friends that cycles through the maps, but I can't change any options without creating a new lobby.
Also, please add support for guests. I tried to set up a multi-player game and have two friends on the same Xbox join me and they couldn't because only one of them had a Gold account. If the game supported guests, they could have jumped right in.
On a positive note, the single-player/co-op sets the bar for an interactive experience. They are great. And the multiplayer is a lot of fun, too. If it is possible to fix the minor annoyances with the lack of a party/matchmaking system, this game will have a lot of replay value.
mmmike @ Nov 13th 2006 5:48PM
#24, I was under the impression that GOW did indeed support guests.
GamerEdie @ Nov 13th 2006 5:57PM
Thanks for the proper credit, Ross, even in retrospect.
Nice save and very much appreciated.
Hannibal @ Nov 13th 2006 6:03PM
Umm...the last bit about execution isn't a problem at all. If you bleed out in execution, you revive. Not only that, but it would be completely dumb to leave a guy down with someone left who could easily revive them. Also, a lot of the other problems will be at least somewhat remedied with the increased players with each Gears copy sold.
Eric Von Shpeel @ Nov 13th 2006 6:27PM
every single fu*king 360 game seems to need a patch to play online, the xbox fanboys say that Xbox Live will beat out the PSnetwork despite paying for it but all Sony need to do is make sure you can play the fu*king games online day 1 and they have trumped MS at their own game
Scott E @ Nov 13th 2006 6:45PM
"28. every single fu*king 360 game seems to need a patch to play online, the xbox fanboys say that Xbox Live will beat out the PSnetwork despite paying for it but all Sony need to do is make sure you can play the fu*king games online day 1 and they have trumped MS at their own game"
I agree 100% that Microsoft needs to step it up to avoid being embarrassed.
But- Gears of War plays wonderfully online. My only gripe is that the interface could have been more user friendly. Such as, why after every ranked match does it throw you back to the main menu??? not even the multiplayer menu. But thats pretty much the worst thing to say about this game, its really that good otherwise.
Microsoft needs to make the lobby system standard for any 'player match'- I couldn't care less about rank. Each game should have a unified experience on xbox live so the user can pick up a new game and be familiar with how the online system works.
Willie G. @ Nov 13th 2006 7:24PM
Listen, its just a game. If you can't handle being beat, then don't play. All I know is that My team is pretty much unstoppable, and no we're not a clan. Just people who met up online. We own so hard that people leave our games. But uh...stop complaining.
Scott E @ Nov 13th 2006 7:30PM
Listen, its just a game. If you can't handle being beat, then don't play. All I know is that My team is pretty much unstoppable, and no we're not a clan. Just people who met up online. We own so hard that people leave our games. But uh...stop complaining.
See thats just the problem. You aren't wining fairly though. You are playing 4 people who have never played together before. All I ask is that they give me a chance to get a team together to play other teams. Then I won't mind losing.
Russell @ Nov 13th 2006 8:13PM
You know, I haven't experienced any of this because so far I've only played in unranked matches. What are ranked matches anyhow? Is that when you get put on the worldwide leaderboards?
Giant Food Monster @ Nov 13th 2006 8:23PM
I just don't understand why they set ranked matches up the way they did. I mean i should just hit a button with a party and choose either warzone, execution, or assassination. Its garbage to hear people talking over their mics on the phone to their pals getting them into a room together in ranked match. Why can you choose a side. I keep getting kicked out of rooms and it sucks
Player matches with friends are where it is at.
yuppy @ Nov 14th 2006 12:36AM
you really have to be bad at this game to let someone down; then let u revive; then down u again.
None of those cheats are a real problem.
The only thing I want is friends in ranked rooms
Bladev1 @ Nov 14th 2006 1:40AM
First, Halo 2 has the best matchmaking. Second, everyone is complaining about cheaters, what about glitches, has anyone had the problem where you can talk and hear the original 4 you joined with, but if people start dropping out and you get new people, you can’t hear them but they can hear you, wtf, patches ftw.
John D. @ Nov 15th 2006 7:09PM
Actually, in execution when you revive yourself you can't control your character for the first couple of seconds, but you're still vulnerable to enemy fire. So if you're the last guy on your team and someone downs you, they can just wait till you revive and then down you again while you're standing up.
I had a jackhole do that to me yesterday, but it was in a player match so I was like ",Dude what the hell are you doing?" I had to quit the game because he wouldn't stop.
EihBeir @ Nov 16th 2006 7:28PM
Problems like this don't bother me when a game launches...provided the developer patches them.
I'm glad to see Epic working on a fix for all this stuff.
DalenEX @ Nov 18th 2006 10:38PM
well they are using an unreal engine...and that how unreal connects to games, by having the user find a host...
keene oh @ Nov 22nd 2006 5:52PM
Has anybody else been having the "connection to host has been lost" message when trying to connect to co-op games as well as rnaked multiplayer games?
I would love to experience these cheats and problems with finding your friends online but i can't even get close.
I hope the patch that epic are working on sorts all these problems out.
The campaign is fantastic but too short to keep you interested in this game.
Kris @ Jan 15th 2007 3:44PM
Why is Halo 2 matchmaking the exception and not the standard? Besides playing with your friends, it put all players into one pool to make matches instead of
2 people in this game 3 in this game 1 in this game. The players are to spread out. Epic, please your game is too good to not show it the online love it deserves. People are not playing the campaign over and over that put you on top of live. Just make it like Halo 2. Take thier matchmaking. please.