Microsoft's updated 1080p update still needs work
by Christopher Grant 
{ Nov 30th 2006 at 1:58PM }
Just before the Tokyo Game Show, when Microsoft first announced support for 1080p, we were impressed with the sheer audacity of the addition! For all of Sony's technological one-upmanship, Microsoft had deftly removed one of the PlayStation 3's brightest tail-feathers in a single software download. Well, at least it seemed that way until a little over a month later when the update was available and Microsoft's implementation left a lot to be desired. Of course, they promised a patch to correct some issues in the update, notably the incompatibility of 1080p-over-component on televisions that supported the format. That second patch has finally arrived and, as promised, solves some of those issues. For example, the above image shows a Sony XBR3 television finally displaying 1080p content over component. So, for those users who only needed that fixed, you're on your way.
Still, despite the update's promise of "improved support for HD video output over VGA, including 1080p resolution" this blogger still encounters a significant (and certainly abnormal) amount of screen tearing while using the VGA connection, not to mention the pale, washed-out colors that have become emblematic of the 360's VGA implementation. But we're not the only ones with problems. A quick perusal of the AVS Forums thread shows some another anomalies that don't instill much confidence in Microsoft's upgraded upgrade.
We have a feeling that Microsoft will continue to tweak this feature until it works as expected; however, after two attempts we're left underwhelmed and Microsoft's magic hat trick is looking more and more like smoke and mirrors.
Read -- Major Nelson's Dashboard update announcement
Read -- AVS Forums on "improved" 1080p support
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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Jason @ Nov 30th 2006 4:03PM
After applying this update my console had the dreaded Three Blinking Lights. Now I have to send it to Texas for repair. Console had been acting odd lately, shut downs and lock ups. But now its dead.....
Anyone selling a Wii?
Ryan @ Nov 30th 2006 3:04PM
Wait so MS has added the funtionality of 1080p, realized there were problems attempted to fix them (apparently fixing at least one) and will probably continue to work on these problems until they are all fixed.
Damn it I hate companies like that! I wish MS was more like Sony then they could just tell me to be greatful they let me have a PS3 and that its my TV/Monitors fault that my image is screwed up. Now thats how you treat your customers!
James @ Nov 30th 2006 2:12PM
At least Microsoft doesn't flipflop like Sony regarding issues with the video. Is Sony going to fix the 1080i problem? Yes? No? Maybe?
crono141 @ Nov 30th 2006 2:17PM
You know what the funniest thing to me is about both MS and Sony's HD display issues?
The fact that next generation nintendo will be able to look at all their problems and solutions and be able to create an HD console with no display problems whatsoever.
I'm actually glad I don't have to deal with any of these problems this generation.
FernandoRocker @ Nov 30th 2006 2:31PM
Can Nintendo make a patch to support 720p...???
crono141 @ Nov 30th 2006 3:10PM
Dunno, its been argued that its theoretically possible, but probably not worth it. I'm not sure how much AA the Wii uses, or is capable of using. As long as the AA is good, it can stay 480p. If not, a 720p patch would be most desirable.
bird @ Nov 30th 2006 3:16PM
yeah this update still doesn't fix my 1080p problem. But like most people with 1080p tvs, it won't until they release an HDMI cable. PLEASE HDMI SOON!
Tel @ Nov 30th 2006 2:40PM
1) Where is the 'flip flopping' or 'smoke and mirrors'? They said they would have 1080p, they got 1080p. Some Sony TVs were not compatable, they said they would fix it, low and behold it's fixed.
2) 'Washed out colours' has never been a problem for my when running over VGA. Then again, I can operate the colour slider – which may be beyond the average gamer’s mental capabilities.
3)There is still screen tearing over VGA, which is a pain, but that is 50% a software issue. Gears of War never tears. And I hardly think that a little tearing over VGA equates to Microsoft's 1080p claim being 'smoke and mirrors'.
John @ Nov 30th 2006 2:40PM
hmm yeah i play my 360 via the vga monitor and the quality isnt great
well its alrite, better than my piece of crap 480i tv lol
but if they improved it id be as happy as a squid on tuesdays
lol
http://www.petitiononline.com/ps3/petition.html
ZaZeeMan @ Nov 30th 2006 2:41PM
"The fact that next generation nintendo will be able to look at all their problems and solutions and be able to create an HD console with no display problems whatsoever."
You are hilarious. This is the definition of fanboyism. Insecure with your choice of console, you choose to flame the things you wish you had, but don't. This is what insecure people do to make themselves feel better about their choice. You can enjoy your 480i/p for the next 5 years. Just enjoy what you have instead of trashing what you don't have!
This, on the other hand, is "mostly" a 1080p issue. I have not had any issues with my 360 on the 3 computer monitors and 3 HDTV's (not all my own; I'm not rich) that I have connected to, but mind you, none of them are 1080p-capable. I am perfectly fine with 720p! :) It looks amazing on my new HDTV Optoma projector, which I just got 3 days ago (FINALLY jumped onboard to HDTV). Can't wait to premanently install it.
Urbanstorm @ Nov 30th 2006 2:44PM
I own both a 360 and a PS3 and I have to say at least microsoft supports 1080i and allows you to up scale. Sony has forgotton that not everyone has a $1000+ and that there are a lot of people with 1080i TVs (including myself).
How can you support 1080p but not 1080i ?
Nij @ Nov 30th 2006 3:26PM
Joystiq writers, are you aware that your posts give the impression you're going out of your way to put a negative spin on every single thing you report? If a company is having problems, you post about how much of a disgrace they are. If gamers do something stupid, like throwing their Wiimote at a TV, you post about how Nintendo should be ashamed they allowed this to happen. And then today, Microsoft releases a new patch to the 360 dashboard to enable 1080p over component-- this is good news, I personally am thrilled about this, but your spin on it is "Microsoft's magic hat trick is looking more and more like smoke and mirrors"? Is that what it means to be a blogger-- being perpetually unhappy about everything that happens?
> @ Nov 30th 2006 2:46PM
"For example, the above image shows a Sony XBR3 television finally displaying 1080p content over component. So, for those users who only needed that fixed, you're on your way."
I have an xbr2 bravia (same as xbr3).. that image up there shows the configuration plane for VGA input, not component. Apparently 1080p via vga is now working on sony lcd panels.
Gimbal @ Nov 30th 2006 2:56PM
The VGA washed out colors, at least for me, has finally been resolved.
Some TVs will take a VGA connection as a PC, or as a video signal, or sometimes have an option for both. TVs that are expecting a 0-255 range of signal from a PC are only getting the 13-235 (or something like that) from the 360. My Sharp Aquos was set to the PC setting and looked washed out compared to component cables. Then I changed to menu setting to video over VGA and everything looked as good as component again.
My only problem now is that I have an overscan issue at this setting. Haven't checked to see if this new update changed anything though.
I wish they would just give us a freakin' digital output option already. Just give us our damn HDMI cable and be done with this mess already!
JimmyHACK @ Nov 30th 2006 2:59PM
forgot to add the part about MS originally saying that games won't use or need 1080p a year ago
B33 @ Dec 5th 2006 8:04PM
Didn't Microsoft say 1080 was unnecessary and diss Sony because the playstation 3 would support it?
It's funny how Microsoft flip-flops on everything.
crono141 @ Nov 30th 2006 3:38PM
ZaZeeMan:
Saying I'm glad I don't have to worry about HD problems is fanboyism? Saying that Next gen we won't have these problems is fanboyism?
You sure do have strange definitions of fanboyism. I got nothing to be insecure about. I get my HD gaming through my PC hooked up to my TV, and my crazy nintendo gaming through my wii. I'll get a 360 when its price and the price of its games drop. I'll get a PS3 if/when KH3, FF13, and FF7remix come out on it.
Don't be a dick.
MC Hampster @ Nov 30th 2006 4:32PM
Rather than continuing to work on a resolution that very few have, why can't Microsoft give us 1680x1050 support for VGA? This is the most common resolution for new widescreen VGA LCD monitors, and its lack of support on the 360 kind of sucks. Things still look great in other resolutions, but it would look fantastic if I could get a native resolution on my monitor.
C. Grant @ Nov 30th 2006 3:29PM
Tel:
1)I never said flip-flopping, so why quote me on it?
2)Good idea? When you disagree, make a comment about someone else's intelligence. Classy! Adjusting the color and brightness settings to their maximum on my monitor still doesn't achieve the correct result. It requires entering the service mode.
3)So screen tearing that occurs 100% of the time in Gears of War specifically, although it never appeared over component, has nothing to do with the VGA patch?
Why defend a giant corporation blindly? They promised support for 1080p and have delivered a stopgap solution that still has errors for some users. Not for you, you say? Therefore no one should complain?
Matt @ Nov 30th 2006 8:17PM
The games still aren't MADE in 1080p. And until HDMI is supported, all of 6 people will be able to have 1080p (with component). Oh, and the XBR2 and XBR3 are NOT the same tvs.
PerfectCr @ Nov 30th 2006 3:35PM
SAMSUNG 244T 24" LCD - Native Resolution 1920 x 1200 - I Select 1080p with the new "update" and IT STILL DISPLAYS A resolution of 1440 x 1050!!! WTF?! This monitor MOST DEFINITELY SUPPORTS 1920 x 1080, I've set that resolution in Windows XP MYSELF!!! I am so disappointed!!!! What's the deal?
Dave @ Nov 30th 2006 3:44PM
They have to spin everything negative or nothing negative. Why? Because the fanboys literally WORSHIP their consoles. They have to point out every flaw on every console to point out any flaw in any console or everyone goes apeshit. Ah, well. Despite their attempt at universal skepticism, I think it's clear that Sony's PS3 is looking pretty bad right now.
Mr. Khan @ Nov 30th 2006 3:45PM
I believe i stated this before, MS's patch to 1080p is as half-assed as the SIXAXIS or Photo Channel (or as half-assed as MS's HD-DVD support)
These are all examples of console features that were put in last-minute, and in the end will die a lonely death. When you try to build something merely to "1-up" the competition, you will usually wind up getting your ass burned, if all the companies just played to their strengths, this would be a happier world
J korn @ Dec 1st 2006 12:18AM
Hey tel, take your pompous ass somewhere else. Just because your tv doesn't look washed out and can adjust the colors doesn't mean everyone can. I too have the same problem with running the video signal through VGA. The screen looks like a white film is over it, even when the brightness is reduced. The colors are also not as vibrant. Microsoft needs to look into this issue, because I have heard of several other same cases of the VGA cable not being colorful. If Microsoft fixes this problem, i will be very impressed.
Lefty @ Nov 30th 2006 4:36PM
j korn
are you using the ms brand vga cable or a 3rd party one? i have hooked my 360 up to my montior, my lcd tv, qand my dlp tv in the living room and have no color issues. they all look like the component cables.
some one in the avbforums even mentions they have had lackluster quality with a 3rd party cable.
all i know is i use the vga cable from MS and my colors look great
Spence @ Dec 1st 2006 6:48AM
As a PS3 owner who loves his 1080P, all I can say is: HA HA!!
killr0y @ Nov 30th 2006 6:40PM
Don't know what to tell you, dude... Maybe get another TV? I've got two HDTV's that support 1080p and both have had top-notch visuals w/ VGA since day one of the 1080p update. Also, the author of this article is obviously being inflammatory when he suggests that this is Microsoft's 2nd attempt to get 1080p corrected. This patch was Microsoft's FIRST patch to correct 1080p. In fact, they came straight out and said it would correct SOME issues. Its nice that they were willing to release a patch to fix one of the most popular 1080p TV's (the Sony) without making those owners wait until all the other buggy TV sets have been tweaked.. But that would mean you'd have to compliment MS, which you'd never be able to swallow your pride and do once in a while.
SquirrelPhister @ Nov 30th 2006 4:55PM
J Korn:
"Just because your tv doesn't look washed out and can adjust the colors doesn't mean everyone can. I too have the same problem with running the video signal through VGA. The screen looks like a white film is over it, even when the brightness is reduced."
that sucks, but it's not a problem on the Xbox end, it's a problem with your particular TV. As many people with 360's and VGA connections can attest, the picture quality through VGA is AT LEAST as good as through component cables (I find it to be sharper)
"The colors are also not as vibrant. Microsoft needs to look into this issue, because I have heard of several other same cases of the VGA cable not being colorful. If Microsoft fixes this problem, i will be very impressed."
as was pointed out above, all of these settings can be adjusted in your TV's menu. I'm sorry if you're having trouble with it, but the settings are there for you to adjust, and if you know what you're doing you should easily be able to get top-notch images from your 360.
Joe Smith @ Nov 30th 2006 6:01PM
I am running my 720p set (yea, I am too cheap to pop for 1080p) using VGA and the colors are very crisp and vibrant. The TV I have has two setting sfor VGA input, video and text. When set for video, it looks great. No problems. I see no tearing or other problems.
I think the fact that MS is able to add features and respond to problems through small system updates is an amazingly cool thing.
Adam Michela @ Dec 1st 2006 7:41PM
FYI, I have a Sony XBR3 LCD and it does NOT accept 1080p over component as this post suggests. As an earlier commenter noted, that picture appears to show a VGA connection.
Darren Tilley @ Nov 30th 2006 9:07PM
Microsoft did not one-up Sony by adding an output resolution of 1080p. There is currently not a single Xbox game rendering at anything above 720p. Any resolution other that this is just simply upscaled, or downscaled, from 720p. They could probably support even higher resolutions over VGA, but the source image is 1280x720 right now.
Sony may not have had the most trouble-free launch in history, but they do have a number of games actually rendered in 1080p/60fps. No upscaling at all, and they even manage 2x anti-aliasing on top of that on at least one game. Microsoft can try and confuse the market by throwing around the term 1080p, but anyone with any sense will see that it's nothing more than a PR move.
Luke @ Nov 30th 2006 10:59PM
To the guy above, Darren.
What you say is true but makes me laugh. Simply this 1080p 60fps game does it look better than anything available on the 360 that plays in 720p? In fact is this game even the best looking on the PS3?
As far as I can see rendering in 1080p means very little if you don't actually end up with better results. It seems to me there is a lot of PR BS involved in 1080p on these consoles but you bought into the Sony version of it.
I want the best graphics, who cares about the numbers behind it.
Dot50cal @ Nov 30th 2006 10:32PM
Its over VGA you damn fools, thats my picture @_@ XBR3 doesnt do 1080p over component! >_< Way to read!
Tel @ Nov 30th 2006 10:46PM
@15 (C. Grant)
Firstly, I apologise for my aggressive tone.
1) You are quite correct – I apologise for misquoting you. However, specific wording aside, that was the message put forth, and I believe this point is valid.
Microsoft promised a feature, and when it didn’t work as expected they delivered a fix. That isn’t consistent with your description of a “magic hat trick” that is “looking more and more like smoke and mirrors.”
2) Yeah, I’ll admit that this was a bad call. I shouldn’t spew my personal vitriol at others. As a fellow gamer, I do feel for your pain. On the bright side, more games are coming with a pre-packaged ‘VGA’ setting.
I still think that it’s the TV/projector/screen that’s the issue. I’ve used several screens (I often take my gaming gear with me when I visit friends and family) and most have been okay. Ironically, the only problems I’ve had are with the screen being too dark.
3) The fact that Gears tears on your screen is pretty worrying. I haven’t ever seen that before. I’ll concede that I don’t know enough about the issue to argue this point.
“Why defend a giant corporation blindly? They promised support for 1080p and have delivered a stopgap solution that still has errors for some users.”
I defend them because they have treated me well. They released an upgrade, for free – when they didn’t have to. Nobody needs 1080p. Their product was doing fine without it. They didn’t release a special edition of the 360 a year latter (“Now With 1080p!”).
They (as promised) added a bonus feature that worked well and added value for many users.
They didn’t then ignore those whom were unable to use the extra feature; they followed it up and patched it to allow more users to take advantage of it.
1080p is not a requirement. It’s not written on the back of the box. But they put it in there for free and are supporting it – arguably better then the competition.
“Not for you, you say? Therefore no one should complain?”
It your 360 came missing its cables, you should complain. If it blew up and killed your cat should complain.
But Microsoft has offered a free upgrade and is trying to make it work for everyone. I’m not sure that deserves such scorn. There are plenty of other things that Microsoft has stuffed up (Backwards compatibility, not allowing standard USB devices to act as memory cards, etc). If a company doesn’t deliver as promised, fire away – but when a company ADDS value they should be commended, not berated.
The ZeroCorpse @ Dec 1st 2006 12:15AM
"Washed out colors"???
I use the VGA-HD cable specifically because the colors are so much brighter and crisp on my HDTV than when I use the component cable, especially since I can upscale DVDs with it.
Grant, I think the washed out color problem is your set, not the VGA-HD cable.
thomas_h @ Dec 1st 2006 5:37PM
i run my 360 on a dell 2007WFP 20" WS, and it looks very good @ 1360x768 even though the native of the display is 1680x1050. i use the VGA cable and i can't say that the colors are washed out or anything, it looks great. But i would love to be able to run it @ native res though.