PS3 sales no longer hotcake-like?

@Brook

You didn't read that article past the headline did you? I quote: "Sales of the PlayStation 3 (PS3) in JAPAN have finally begun to rise". More to the point, check those numbers, 60% increase on the week before for 'over' 50,000 consoles sold. First week was 82,000 and this, the fourth week, is 50,000. Figure that weeks two and three were roughly the same at around 33,000 each based on this data. Let's be generous and add this week at another 50,000 based on production restrictions. That's a grand total of 248,000 consoles in Japan. No wonder they're still hard to find if that's all Sony have shipped in. No matter which way you flip it, for Sony to be on that sort of figure for sold consoles after a month in their home territory is not good news at all. Doubly so when you look at the Ebay prices quoted in that article which show only a (roughly) 10% (£27) markup which would tend to indicate there's not a great deal of urgency to get hold of one of these. By way of comparison most of the UK Wii Ebay deals at the moment seem to be going around the £260+ mark, an increase of 44% (£80) over retail.

I was at ebgames yesterday and they said they had receieved a shipment of 60 and 20 gig ps3 the day before but only managed to sell 1 to someone who said they wanted to sell it on ebay. They said demand has gone down and that they think everyone who wanted a PS3 had one.

Went Wii-hunting this morning at Toys'R'Us (none, and won't have any, despite the rumor of thousands shipping). They had three PS3s, all 60GB models. Circuit City next door had no Wiis, and when I asked the roaming manager, he said he had 6 PS3s, 5 of them 60GB models, and said he _couldn't_ sell them. Nobody wanted them. Gamestop had the same problem.

He did bring up something interesting, though: He said they had a shipment of 6 Wiis expected on Christmas Eve, but three were already reserved. Apparently, the previous Sunday, three people showed up at 6 a.m. and there were already too many people in line for the Wiis that were in store. So, the manager said, these three "complained to corporate" and _got vouchers for the next Wii shipment_.

Guaranteed Wiis on Christmas Eve, just for bitching. Good job, anonymous.

The PS3 is just too expensive. Parents are more likely to buy an XBOX360 or a Wii for their children, unless they have REALLY given in to their little brats bleats.

The price of a PS3 prevents it from being an impulse buy. This is one area the Wii is a winner (cheap, fun and unique).

No apparent advantages over XBOX360. Customers will view XBOX 360 games, then see the PS3 games are exactly the same and wonder why they should pay nearly another 2/3'rds for the PS3 rather than the XBOX360.

A lack of cheap 2nd hand games for the PS3 also add to the cost of ownership.

Sony have priced themselves out of the market. I'm sure it will sell, of that I have no doubt. However it will not sell as many as either the XBOX360 or the Wii, purely because of the price tag. Its dearer than either of the other two consoles combined. Its simple economics and its why everyone doesn't drive around in porches and BMW's.

Sorrow, I meant to say driving around in Porsche's. But yeah, the PS3 is just that little bit too expensive. And with a lower user base the game companies are not going to put too much effort into squeezing out the extra horsepower of the PS3 (if they can get past the difficulties surrounding the programming of the PS3).

If the PS3 consistently has a lower user base then expect a lot of XBOX360 ports to the PS3. Given the fact the XBOX360 has had a years start over the PS3 and that the XBXOX360 is considerably cheaper than PS3 I doubt the PS3 will never come close to even matching 1/2 the user base of the XBOX360 at any time.

Oh, and stop bleating you Sony fanboys. Sony is only an organisation designed to make money for its shareholders. If Sony wasn't so intent of forcing blu-ray on people you could have had your PS3's a year ago for the same price as the XBOX3360. So stop defending a company that is prepared to shaft its loyal customer base for a product that isn't gamer related. If you still want to defend Sony after the antics with blu-ray then your nothing but a gullible mug.

O man, things are definitely are not looking good for Sony...

Well i got my wii, im getting my used 360:) why wait for a price drop, get a used 360 buy the warranty baby:) and eventually ill get a PS3.WiiStation360 FTW!!

Also theres only really less than a handful of games that interest me in terms of the 360. Those games are of course Gears Of War, Lost Planet, and for right now thats about it. Dont tell me about PGR3, Ive had my fill of racing games thanks to GT5, CoD series( got it on my PC) Tom Clancy's games ( never been interested in it, they are like the 'madden' of FPS, yuck ill pass)Bioshock, doesnt seem to great, Halo, hated it since part one. For me the games I HAVE to get my 360 for are Lost Planet and Gears of War

As i have said, selling ps3 on ebay is not worth it anymore. I've showed links to ps3 auctions that have sold for massive losses. One 20Gb ps3 final bid was as low as US$355 (BTW i think he was throwing in a GBA as well). US$355 for a $500 console - thats really telling sony something.

IF you can't sell a console at retail price when there are so few available you have some serious issues.

I work at gamestop and I can tell you that wii's are out the door in 1/2 an hour on a slow day and we got 5 PS3's and it took me 2 days to sell them. I sold the last one at about 8pm the day after. PS3's sell slower than wii's there is no doubt that at least in my store. People just can't or don't want to drop 655.76 after tax sans a game. People ask about them all day but when I tell them we have them they always say "really! I didn't think I would find one!" Then I ask if they want it and they almost always say "No way! I ain't spending that kind of money on a game." It's only been a month after launch. I sold more 360's in the last week than PS3's on the days we had both. It might be that the people who want them don't shop at gamestop but that sounds a bit far fetched.

I will buy a PS3 - eventually. In the mean time if I walked into a store and saw a stack PS3s - like so many others here - I'd be surprised to actually see them and then I'd pass. I need to pick up a 1080p TV first - and that ain't happening until Q1 '07. Hooking up a PS3 - or a 360 for that matter - to my 5 years old 480p plasma would be silly. Heck, perhaps I should get a Wii ;-) Naaah...

For anybody who does plan on buying a BlueRay player (and I do), PS3 is a decent deal because hardware is at least as good as 360 - plus I get a BD for $200. But I wonder how many people think this way... Sales figures will tell soon enough - but my guess is that not too many.

If not enough ppl end up willing to drop that sort of cash on SONY's latest flagship console - they will drop the price. Because they sure as hell will NOT let the latest incarnation of their super profitable PlayStation franchise slip to second place behind... PlayStation 2! That's right. Take a look at sales data. Every month (except for one) since 360 release - PS2 has sold more units than 360. Often A LOT more. PS3's main competitor ain't 360. It's PS2. http://videogamecharts.com/page3.html

Or does SONY plan to have 2 consoles out side by side for a while? As long as one of them remains at the top, does it matter to SONY which one it is as long as they are raking in the greens from game sales?

BTW - in the random off chance anybody reading this doesn't know: SONY and Microsoft are happy to lose money on every console sold because the make cash hand over fist with games sales.

Michael

"Three units still left, they sold ONE system since yesterday afternoon, even after letting every customer know they have them in stock. Wow."

Most likely she told YOU because you looked like a gamer--not everyone.
You 'copped' the Nas album huh...?

Represent.

what is this? "slant the news to make Sony look bad, but make Microsoft and everyone else look good day"?

this is the second post i've read so far where the story has been slanted as a negative for Sony.

here's my take on this "story:"

PS3's aren't selling on the internet for inflated prices. why?

answer A: most console launches are geared towards the hardcore. the hardcore can be categorized as early adopters and fans that will browse the internet all day looking for information on their prefered console, and gobbling up any and every bit of news they can. they can also be categorized as those willing to camp outside for 3 days to get their hands on their prefered gaming device, ie, the Playstation 3.

now, taking that hardcore mentality into consideration, envision this: maybe, just maybe, that hardcore fan who peruses the internet everyday came across the numerous stories posted all over the net that say Sony has been shipping at least 30,000-50,000 PS3's to Japan and the US every week.

that hardcore fan then sees that shiny PS3 on ebay for $1000 and up, but knows that, in just a few short days, there's the possibility his favorite gaming store will be getting a few new, $500/$600 PS3s. why, then, would he grab an overpriced bundle when he can just wait, ask his local best buy on a Tuesday or some such day if they got some PS3's, and purchase one from a retailer that is guaranteed not to stiff him?

speaking of being stiffed:

answer b: keeping in mind the previous definition of a hardcore fan as an early adopter and internet peruser, i'm sure this person has come across various stories of people getting shafted on deals from ebay. for example, the poor lady who bought a "Picture of a 360," when she thought she was buying the real thing. or the guy who bought a box full of tiles and a PS2 controller when he bought a Playstation 3 online from some douchebag?

smart consumers are wary of places like ebay.

it's much safer to just be patient, wait until the store has them in stock, and hopefully luck out and snag one, or hope that the store has another preorder list you can put your name on.

extra credit: if the person waits until, say, February or March to get a PS3, not only will there be much more in stock, but some great software like Virtual Fighter 5, Splinter Cell: Double Agent, Ninja Gaiden Sigma, Motorstorm, Lair, Warhawk, Heavenly Sword and Monster Kingdom will be available, making the purchase just that more worth it, if they don't happen to dig Resistance (as great as that game is, not everybody is an FPS fan).

consumers don't get the credit they deserve. not everybody is a complete moron, and some of us are actually cautious shoppers. that's why polls and studies like this are ultimately worthless. human behavior and thought processes are too unpredictable.

all it takes is that killer title that appeals to the bigger chunk of the gaming userbase (the genre that is continuously ranked as the most popular is Action/Adventure, then RPG, then Shooter/FPS and it trickles down to the other genres from there).

bottom line, since PS3's are starting to become more plentiful in the stores, smart consumers have no reason to pay marked up prices on the internet.

this is something that the 360 didn't have last year, as, from December up through til April, there were *NO* new shipments of 360s. if you wanted one, you had to buy from that initial 360,000 units shipped on the November launch day. such is not the case with the PS3 and Wii.

speaking of the Wii, on ebay, that console is listing for roughly it's retail price and also in bundles, and they don't neccessarily have bagillions of people chomping at the bit to own them? where's the negative spin on that? where's the "Wii sales no longer hotcake-like" take on that? you'd never find that here on joystiq, that's for certain.

the real story, the one that is infinitely more interesting, is that the opportunistic jerkwads who bought PS3's on launch day to keep them out of the hands of the early adopters and make a profit are stuck with consoles that aren't selling for those marked up prices. but no, no one would ever see the situation *THAT* way...

What ebay are you looking at Figboy? The one in your imagination? Dude you need a reality check. There are around 500K ps3s around and there are around 2million Wiis around. Therefore there is far fewer ps3s then there are Wiis, thus the ps3 is a rare commodity. Why is it then that Wiis on Ebay are going for up to 60% above retail

http://cgi.ebay.com/Nintendo-Wii-Console-System-w-5-Games-Wii-Sports-NIB_W0QQitemZ270071527984QQihZ017QQcategoryZ62054QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/Nintendo-Wii-in-Hand-Ready-to-Ship-or-Local-Pickup_W0QQitemZ220063448352QQihZ012QQcategoryZ62054QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/Nintendo-Wii-Game-System_W0QQitemZ290063741007QQihZ019QQcategoryZ62054QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Wii's are going for way above retail prices so i don't know where you are getting your facts from.

On the other hand ps3s are going for huge losses (i've given 2 examples before here are some more) of up to 20% or more.

This 20Gb ps3 sold for US$475 (US$25 loss)
http://cgi.ebay.com/Sony-PS3-20-gig-system-ships-ASAP_W0QQitemZ290064297097QQihZ019QQcategoryZ62054QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

this 60gb version went for US$504 - thats a $95 loss
http://cgi.ebay.com/PS3-System-60GB-USA-version-NIB-w-receipt-IN-HAND_W0QQitemZ250064436473QQihZ015QQcategoryZ62054QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

This is a 20Gb ps3 with 6 GAMES!! only went for US$521!!
http://cgi.ebay.com/SONY-PLAYSTATION-3-PS3-6-GAMES-BLUE-RAY-HD-BONUS_W0QQitemZ250063418804QQihZ015QQcategoryZ62054QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

So i think you need to stop deluding yourself there Figboy. Nice logic but no facts to back you up. Also notice all the people here are also commenting how retailers are finding it difficult to sell the ps3s.
Face it if an object is rare and desireable then the will fetch huge profits on ebay. The ps3 is rare, but is it desirable - that is very questionable at the moment. Looking at how hard it is to sell on ebay i seriously doubt it.

Terrak, there are too many other factors to consider when taking into account these tales of unsold PS3s.

hell, i could counter that back in April, when me and my fiance were in Iowa, there were stacks of 360s sitting on the shelves in Walmart, and that was back when the 360 was still an uber hot, rare commodity, going for over $800 on ebay.
location plays a large factor in that scenario. in Fairfield (where my fiance's family hails from), there is a low number of gamers, so a gaming console isn't high up on their list of consumer neccessities, even one as hot as the 360 was back then.

here in Los Angeles, you can't find a PS3 anywhere. they sell out as soon as they get in stock. why? because, with a population of over 8 million, there are a lot more gamers than a small town or city, like Fairfield,Iowa.

thanks for your ebay links, but they still fail to show me anything. contrary to what you may think about my "delusions," i did go to ebay and look at the various prices the Wii and PS3 were going for before, posting my comment, and i didn't see anything out of the ordinary, or worth getting worked up about. the listings for the PS3 varied in price from $400 and up, with an average of about 6-8 bids per console, less on the higher priced bundles, and the Wii, going for about $400-$500, with an average of about 8-10 bids per console, with even less for the higher priced bundles.

what does it matter if the person who bought the PS3 is forced to sell it for less than what they paid for it? they had to purchase it from the store first. that is the sale that matters. the initial purchase. reselling it on ebay is to the risk and discretion of the seller. now, if it was, say, a Sony store, and no one was buying PS3s from them, that'd be a problem. but if i bought a PS3 from Best Buy for $600, then sold it on ebay, but had to sell it for $525, that's no concern to Sony, because they already got their money from the initial sale of the unit.

my best friend bought a 50" 720p set for $2300, and is selling it now for $2000. does that mean the television manufacturer is in big trouble because my buddy can't sell the TV for more than what he paid for it? of course not.

this argument is worthless and ultimately proves nothing.

most people would much rather buy an item from retail than online (especially items like this, where the seller could be anyone trying to scam you, as has been the case for a few unfortunate 360 and PS3 shoppers).

my point is that behavior is unpredictable. a console that is white hot now, could fizzle in a matter of months, and a console that is stagnating sales wise (ie, the 360 is performing...okay, but not as well as the original X Box did during the same time frame), can suddenly shoot through the roof in conjunction with a killer release.

PS3 sales are what they are now based on two things: availability and software lineup. i said so in my previous post. once those two factors are resolved (primarily the availability), sales of the console will stabilize. currently, there is too much confusion regarding whether or not stores even *HAVE* the PS3, for Sony fans to get their hands on one.

for those people that say their stores have PS3's in stock, please send those store locations my way, as i know plenty of people here in LA that can't find any at all.

anyway, software has always dictated console sales. i don't know how old you are, but the reason why the NES, SNES, PS1, and PS2 won their respective console wars was due to the software.

there are still millions of Sony fans, out of that user base of 112 million that are waiting to get their hands on a PS3. come this February on out through 2007, there are going to be some great games coming to the PS3, some exclusive, some multiplatform. *thats* when demand for the console will rise. 360 sales didn't pick up until titles like Oblivion, Dead Rising, and DOA4 came out. the PS3 has only Resistance right now, and not everyone likes FPSes.

we'll see how the numbers are after Virtual Fighter 5, Heavenly Sword, Warhawk, Tekken 6, Devil May Cry 4, Motorstorm, and a few others come out in early 2007. because to argue about it now, only a month after release, is foolish.

the Wii sells because it is $250 and comes with a free game. it's target audience is also the younger gamer, whose parents will pick it up for them as a Christmas gift.

this early on in it's life cycle, the PS3 is not meant to be a mainstream, impulse buy. the PS2 wasn't, neither was the X Box or X Box 360. they are for the hardcore. it won't be until early 2008 that the PS3 undergoes a price cut that is conducive to that shift from hardcore to mainstream. the PS2 sales didn't sell 112 million units in year one. that was spaced out over 6 years (year one was roughly 10 million. year 2 was another 10 million. they sold about 20 million or so in year 3, and continued selling a staggering ammount. it's still selling great now).

the PS3 is only $100 more than a 360, and can do everything a 360 can do, with the added benefit of having it's next gen video format built in.

if a 360 owner upgrades to HDDVD it will cost them $600.

if a PS3 owner buys the 20gig PS3 (the equivilent of the Premium 360, feature for feature plus Blue Ray drive included), it will cost them $500. do you really need the Wi Fi or Memory card slots that the $600 PS3 has? we have the 60 gig, and we don't even use the card slots. at least for now, and maybe not ever. the Core 360 has tainted the perception of dual SKUs simply because it truly was a crippled unit. the "core" PS3 can do everything the "premium" can, minus those two features i listed above.

the Premium 360 comes with a 20gig HD.
so does the 20 gig PS3.

the Premium 360 comes with a wireless controller.
so does the 20gig PS3, and with a USB cable to charge it.

the Premium 360 doesn't have Wi Fi
neither does the 20gig PS3.

the 20gig PS3 has an HDMI output.
the Premium 360 does not.

the Premium 360 has a wireless headset and remote.
the 20gig PS3 does not.

the 20gig PS3 comes with a Blu Ray drive.
the Premium 360 does not (a $200 add on is needed for this to work).

the Premium 360 has limited backwards compatibility.
the 20gig PS3 has roughly 95% backwards compatibility (we've done comparisons on our standard def TVs between titles running on a PS3, and titles running on a PS2, and there is no difference from the ones we compared).

it's all a matter of preference, and what you're looking for in a console.

if you're the type of gamer that just wants games, then go for a 360 or Wii.

but if you're the type of gamer that wants more than just that functionality for your console, $100 extra isn't too bad. we'll gladly pay that extra $50-$75 more for that video card for our PC that offers just a bit more than it's stripped down brethren, so why the sudden change here?

also, for that PS3 that sold with 6 games, looking at the picture, only two were PS3 games. the remaining four were PS2 games. a small thing, but worth noting.

also, 60% of the cost of that bundle was going to a charity. the person may not care if he breaks even or not, as the proceeds are going to a good cause (there is such a thing as good will, still). in either case, it doesn't matter what it goes for on ebay, as it's already been purchased from a retail chain. Sony doesn't lose anything on the ebay resale.

you're putting too much importance on ebay. it's good for the truly desperate gamer who wants to get his hands on the console, but like i said in my earlier post, that gamer may simply be waiting to pay a fair price for the console, and from an outlet he/she can trust implicitly.

no delusions on my part. you don't have to insult me, as i've done nothing to insult you.

Games, please.

Sony has a great portfolio of 1st and 2nd party developers. So... what's going on?

Figboy,

I think the only point people are making when citing ebay sales is that prices consoles fetch on secondary market indicate the amount of demand out there. Of course - it's not true. Ebay prices actually indicate supply / dmand balance. Not just demand.

With all the great features that PS3 has, as much as it may be worth the money (provided you actually want those features), I think SONY has stifled quite a bit of demand with the price tag perceived as high. And I think dual SKU only creates confusion. Yes, 20 gig version is great in its own right. But there is a perception that when you buy that - you end up an inferior item. So people tend to compare prices of the 60gig version to other systems. I consider myself pretty savvy consumer when it comes to electronics and I know deep inside that 20 gigversions is a much, much better deal. Yet I'm still on the fence deciding which one I will end up buying...

So. While ebay sales don't add any new units - they do show how desperate people are get their hands on any given product. With PS3 - they are not so desperate. Nor should they be - given you can actually go to a store and buy a PS3 for retail price. If you needlocations - try http://www.itrackr.com/ Granted, you will be hard pressed finding a PS3 in LA given, as you said, the population. But if you play around with different zip codes to be tracked - you will quickly find out that PS3s are no longer impossible to find and so one would have to be rather silly to pay a premium for it. Heck, it looks like ebay may actually provide some DEALS . Now that's a novel idea ;-)

Michael

figboy, thats a good, well structured argument.

you're the first to recognize that the majority of those 100 millon who bought the PS2 didn't buy it at it's full price, but after multiple rounds of discounts.

thing is, the 360 can discount at any time, including right now, and will always undercut Sony precisely because it DOESN'T have blu-ray. i bet they'll be able discount the HD-DVD player sooner than blu-ray as well. piggyback that with equal game quality, catalog and superior online and the Playstation could really suffer its first console generation loss.


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