Rare founding bros bounce, vets fill in

Who would've thought that when Nintendo let Rare go they did the right decision? Well, who other than Nintendo themselves? ;)

good riddance.

For any one to stay with a single company in this day and age, even one you helped found, for 25 years is quite an achievement. So anyone suggesting that they are leaving now because of some timing issue really doesn't know what they are talking about.

Regardless of some of the crap they put out the last few years, Rare still had a bunch of accomplishments to their name, and these two probably came out of it very rich as well.

haha, people need to use bounce more often. I dunno why, but it is comedic gold when used outside the parameters of its traditional definition.

and how do you get -1 star, Kevin. The only plausible explanation is fighting the power.

keep fighting the power, kevin.

You know why Rare aint as good as they used to be? Microsoft treat em too well.

These guys will never be as productive as they were when in the cold grip of mid 1990's Nintendo.

I heard it was like a goddamn sweatshop down there.

At least with Viva Pinata, Rare has finally produced a decent game, sales bomb or not. What was their last good game before that? The N64 Conker game? They didn't do jack on Gamecube or Xbox. (or 360, until Pinata)

May go down as one the most legendary wastes of money in this industry. Rare was totally out of gas by the time MS bought them- here's hoping the new leadership can breathe some creative fire into the place.

If I were Microsoft, I'd be REALLY pissed about buying Rare at this point.
It seems like as soon as they bought them, all of Rare's games went straight to Hell.
...although I seem to recall Donkey Kong 64 sucking hard as well..

Still...serves MS right. the absolute WORST thing that can happen to the gaming industry is a war to see who can buy out the most development studios.

I've never found Rare's early games to be anywhere near the quality that Nintendo fanboys scream about daily on the Nsider forums. As for their efforts for Microsoft, I must say that they didn't deliver any quality content aside from Viva Pinata. Perhaps fresh leadership will yield better results in the future.

Watch the langueage Please!

I wonder if their contract was up or something. did they want to leave or did MSFT want them to leave? my guess is the former.

Rare has been going down hill way before MS brought them, maybe some new leadership can revive the company. Hopefully.

Rare's early games were not that good? are you insane?
R.C. Pro-Am? Snake Rattle 'n' Roll? Wizards & Warriors?
Solar Jetman??? Captain goddamn Skyhawk????? These were all CLASSICS.

Classics that sucked aside from Captain Skyhawk. Rare has never been a fantastic developer, and maybe something good can occur now that the company's founders are gone and new blood has taken their place.

12 comments and not one mention of GoldenEye?
You people sicken me.

:P

Seriously, though.. that was probably their best game, followed by their early titles that Mode7 graciously outlined for you guys, then Conker.

I like the Xbox division of MS, but like the rest of the company, they really do seem to do weird things to any company they acquire, perhaps with the notable exception of Bungie. (Though I'd still like to see another Myth game, instead of this unfortunate fanboy-fest that is Halo)

Too bad, but there is still the other 300+ members that was there from the start.

4 years... Could it be that now all of their MS options/stocks/bonuses are fully vested? Hmmm... ;)

@ 15: "Too bad, but there is still the other 300+ members that was there from the start."

Sorry, that's just not true. The reason that many believe the quality of the games they've put out has dropped off, is that all of the key developers left. "Between 2000 and the final acquisition of Rare Ltd., more than 50 people left the company. After the acquisition was complete, at least 30 more left. Commentators have noted that Rare's first Xbox title, Grabbed by the Ghoulies, is the company's biggest flop to date."

"Key members of the GoldenEye development team left Rare soon after beginning work on Perfect Dark. Head of Software Martin Hollis was the first to leave in 1998, working at Nintendo of America on the GameCube, and in 2000 he started his own company, Zoonami. Other members such as David Doak left soon after he did and formed Free Radical Design. However prior to both of these events, Rare had already publicly lost staff from other teams."
--Wikipedia.

Honestly, I'm shocked that the brothers stayed with the company as long as they did. Rare definitely isn't the proud game developer it once was, and people no longer wait on baited breath for the next Rare game like they used to. They're not horrible, but they certainly aren't as amazing as they used to be.

donkey kong country 1 & 2, goldeneye, perfect dark

Rare has never been a fantastic developer? I was gonna let it go but I just can't. Only someone who thinks that games were invented in 1994 could possibly make that claim. Rare have a better track record than any other developer outside of Japan and that is an indisputable fact. Yes, it is.

Na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na
Na-na-na-na-na-na do the Molyneux*
Na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na
Na-na-na-na-na-na do the Molyneux


*(note, in this case, doing a Molyneux is being a british company founder leaving the company after a takeover to form a new, practically identical company minus the big IPs, not hyping a game to the point of self-destruction)

@12 and 13,

Hey I liked ALL those games EXCEPT Captain Skyhawk. Now we have to fight.

And of course, GoldenEye was the best console FPS ever. And Perfect Dark was a mighty fine last stand of console FPS gaming befro' Half-Life and CounterStrike took over on the interweb.

"Who would've thought that when Nintendo let Rare go they did the right decision?"

A lot of people did. There were some realists out there among the euophoria of the horde.

But it's just another example of how often the conventional wisdom in the game industry is proven wrong.

Jetman series = best Rare games ever.

Don't forget the work they did as Ultimate back on the ZX Spectrum (primarily) and the Commodore 64.

They were responsible for quite a number of classics.

Oh well, we'll have to wait and see what comes with the change.

How about a refreshed RC Pro-Am using Unreal Engine 3 for Live?

(For example of a game using an isometric perspective with UE3 see Monster Madness)

@7 I don't know about you,but I'm pretty sure DK64 did not suck hard.

how can all of u guys forget jetforce gemini it was one of the best games by RARE during their golden years...

Rare was on the downward slide long before Microsoft arrived. They had lost development team members responsible for Goldeneye 007 when they started Perfect Dark for the N64 and more over the years. By 2001-2002, their output greatly declined. It appeared even Nintendo lost interest in them.

Oddly, Rare continued to make games for Nintendo handhelds after the Microsoft acquisition in 2002. Even though those were perhaps contractual or games in development, I'm sure Microsoft wasn't pleased to be in that business. There was a period where Microsoft said there weren't making games for Nintendo handhelds, even though Rare continued to make Nintendo games. More employees left during the Microsoft phase.

Most of the games released for Microsoft were intended for the GameCube, which included Grabbed by Ghoulies (perhaps their least popular game), Perfect Dark Zero, and Kameo. I'm unclear if Conker was intended for the GameCube, although it was a partly recycled effort retreading early territory.

Viva Pinata is perhaps their first true Microsoft generated product, and easily their best since the acquisition. Too bad it's being marketed somewhat poorly. I think the game itself is misunderstood, even though it's pretty fun and addicting. Hopefully it'll find success.

It's unforatunate that because of the amount of money paid to purchase Rare, there was the stigma that whatever they produced had to the most amazing thing because of their previous track record, most of which occured on the N64. I'm not sure many (if any) developers could live up to that kind of hype.

I wonder if that contributed to the founders departure.

I'm guessing they start a new game company and announce they are working on a first-person shooter for the consoles =P

hey guys, viva pinata is AWESOME. i really hope it catches on and succeeds cuz its a GREAT game. i hope this isnt the fall of rare, i would HOPE they would start putting out A LOT of good games again.

btw, buy viva pinata.

Really, I hope Nintendo snaps them back up and let's them set up a new studio.
...

and then says to them, "Ok, now get to work on a new 2D Donkey Kong Country game...these rhythm games kinda suck.."

Honestly, I'm glad to see them go.

Rare did a sequence of incredible games up to Goldeneye. I personally didn't like Killer Instinct, but others liked it a lot.

Banjo-Kazooie was fantastic (yes, better than Mario 64). But Banjo-Tooie was a big letdown, making you play levels 4 times through (via seasons) and never taking you to that island or get that key out of the ice that was shown as a tester in Banjo-Kazooie.

And then all the Conker games were horrible, especially "Live and Reloaded".

To see a studio that used to do a great job turn out dreck was such a shame. And I could only blame MS. I mean that's what changed, right?

But oddly, their last game at Rare may have proved that wrong. Viva Pinata is in several ways brilliant. About 3 times in the progress of the game right when you think you have it pat, a new game mechanic is added, all new strategies unfold and you have to learn new techniques to keep going.

There is a little bit of polish missing that is so glaringly obvious because the rest of the game is so amazing. It really feels like someone just gave up on the game, or else cut it off on an artificial deadline.

If it was MS who cut if off, I can't blame them. As good as the game is, I can't see how it would make money. No kids will play it because it's too complex, and no adults will play it because it's too kiddie. I figure there's right age of kid to pick up this game while they're old enough to master it and young enough not to call it girlie.

I borrowed it off a friend and played it about 40 hours in the last 3 days. I tried to get my own copy today, but it's not available anywhere in stores. MS just doesn't seem to be making a lot of them. I guess that's just MS cutting their losses?

Put Jet Force Gemini on XBLA and world peace will be achieved at last.

Or how about you do it or I blow up Redmond you pricks, Microsoft.

What, someone left Rare? K w/ever. JFG PLZ?!?!11?!11?!

Jet Force Gemini?

Definitely one of Rare's more forgettable efforts in my eyes.

The lack of a REAL two player co-op mode is where they truly dropped the ball with that game.

And the character designs were rubbish as usual.



-Syn

I like JFG, but it's definitely yet another polarizing Rare title. It always seems like there's one group that hates "insert Rare game here" while there is another that thinks it's fine.

IMHO, since Grabbed by the Ghoulies, there hasn't been a truly bad Rare game. Conker was pretty, but revealed the massive weaknesses of the N64 hardware when it just copied the thimble-sized action areas onto the Xbox. PDZ was again pretty but bizarrely hard and slow paced (some day I'm going to figure that game out...). Kameo is a great game, but no one could figure out what kind of game it was. Viva Pinata is similarly great plus addictive, with amazing graphics, and no one can figure out who it's for again.

I have the feeling that BK3 is going to be wicked hard, with twisted pretty graphics and no one will be able to figure out who it's for, plus a lot of people will feel like it's soulless.

Something had to change over there. The teams seem to be proficient enough at this point, but there's a definite lack of something. Difficulty tweaking, artistic direction, project focus, something. I've been kind of hoping that someone new would take over Rare for a while, so it'll be interesting to see what 2008 brings (2007 will bring BK3, so 2008 is my litmus test).

Wow, the Rare hate knows no limit today.

"Grabbed by the Ghoulies" was a pretty fun family game, if somewhat simple. "Starfox Adventures" was one of the best looking Gamecube games and a darned fine Zelda clone. "Kameo" is a solid, if somewhat flawed, platformer. Viva Pinata is certainly getting good press.

Rare has had a pretty good track record, games-wise. Sales-wise, they've never really lived up to their initial expectations...but I think part of the reason that Microsoft bought them wasn't for the profits, but to have a 2nd-party developer who could make games that WEREN'T for the college-age male and might get them more 'parent cred' with some more family friendly games.

Since they left Nintendo 2nd party status, it's been "rare" that their games were any good. har har har

"And then all the Conker games were horrible, especially "Live and Reloaded"."

I never played Live and Reloaded, but the N64 one was amazing. One of the most unique and hilarious platformers ever.

"Or how about you do it or I blow up Redmond you pricks, Microsoft."

Azerael meet the FBI
FBI - Azerael.....

Without a doubt, the single-most idiotic comment ever made on this site. And I see new examples in idiocy here, every single day. But this takes the cake.

Oh, and if you "Blow up' Redmond, you'd blow up Nintendo, as well.

Is there anyone on this site with an IQ over 50?

man starfox adventures was terrible... the ONLY reason to slog through the crappy level designs and worse combat systems (not to mention inane "puzzles") was to look at the eye candy. And once the game was done and you realize that was all you did, whore out your time and patience for some freaking eye candy.... all thats left is shame.

Yeah I preordered that game, and I'm still bitter.

honavery:
Did you play Banjo-Kazooie? Conker blazed no new trails over Banjo-Kazooie except to add speech and swearing. And in return, it had a vastly inferior plot and characters, and was about 1/3rds the length.

Conker was Perfect Dark to Banjo-Kazooie's Goldeneye. Conker was a game that was pretty good, but not as good as the game it was a follow on too.

I guess I shouldn't have called it awful, not when there is Kameo out there. It is not a solid platformer. It was 3 games mashed together, while mostly just being a tech demo for the morphing mechanic and 500 orcs on screen at once. This was glaringly obvious when it was shown on E3 at the 360 announcement, and was still there in the end. Despite years of development (it was first shown on N64), it was still not even a full game when they shipped it, it was still largely a tech demo.

Mentioning that some Rare games were not very good is not Rare hate. I played about 40 hours of Viva Pinata in 3 days, it's that good. But as good as Viva Pinata might be, it doesn't make Kameo any better.

I'm with Jeff, BTW, I figured N had just made out like bandits when MS bought Rare off them. Rare had just taken a lot of money and a lot of time off Nintendo to produce Perfect Dark, a game that disappointed. To me, it already looked like the shine was off Rare, and to unload the studio at a premium price for what was now damaged goods was a great move by N.

Mode7:
If you think Rare has the best track record of any other developer outside Japan is an indisputable fact, you must not have Blizzard in your world. Blizzard has a better track record than Rare, and if you count Silicon and Synapse (Blizzard's previous name), you get Lost Vikings 1 and 2, the best puzzle platformers ever made until Mario 64 came out.

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