Vicious Engine envisions creative Wii FPS controls

Essentially, only the nunchuk is used for camera and movement. The top joystick moves and strafes your character, while left and right rotations trigger the accelerometer and rotate the characters perspective left and right and a forward / back roll with cause the camera to look down / up, respectively. In play testing the control scheme, using the accelerometer control to move the camera feels awkward, and the rotations seem to move in 15 degree spurts (as opposed to fluid movement). After a few minutes, however, the movement became more intuitive.
With the simplification of movement in one hand, the other hand (and, more importantly, the infrared motion sensor) is free to control whatever -- sword-fighting or off-of-middle cursor positioning. Level Designer Bryan West told us, rather bemused, that with how the control scripts are implemented in the engine that even he could build a game with what's available.
Visually, the engine looked slightly better than Red Steel, especially the character model we saw. West talked with us and lamented about the common trend of ignoring Wii's graphical capability and simply upscaling textures used for PSP titles. We're assuming, then, that we won't be seeing the same issue with Alien Syndrome, a PSP and Wii title using the Vicious Engine. West also told us that they are working on a Wii game internally that involves the Vicious Engine but cannot currently discuss at this time.





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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Je2037 @ Mar 8th 2007 9:16AM
Hey Joystiq, so how well can you aim with this scheme, and what do they do for quick turnaround?
Kendrick @ Mar 8th 2007 9:20AM
Hold the phone. Alien Syndrome, the Sega title? That's a game that would rock quite a bit in 3D. Did Sega license the engine for that, or is this an unrelated game with the same name?
Myke @ Mar 8th 2007 9:21AM
Ok, anyone who's knowledgable about the systems specs please help me out. What makes it so easy to use PSP games as Wii ports? I mean I know the Wii isn't as powerful and I've heard all the Cube 1.5 arguements till my ears bleed, but I'm still not understanding the PSP to Wii link. Is the structure similar or what? No fanboy "Cuz Da wI1 is juz az pow3rfuls as an Handh3ld!11!!" responses please, just a couple of educated guesses would be nice.
Slaziman @ Mar 8th 2007 9:26AM
@Myke
I'm guessing the structure of the CPU/GPU is similar? Who am I kidding, I honestly have no idea. Maybe they are to lazy to port a WHOLE* PS2 game, or want to rush a product fast to ride the Wii money train.
*sarcasm
@Topic
Sounds cool. I just hope it doesn't feel "tacked on". But what's wrong with using the control scheme of KB/M, pointer to move camera and analog stick to strafe?
Myke @ Mar 8th 2007 9:33AM
A game, by definition, is a means to have fun. If he wants to develop a game as an artform, he needs to take responsibility for it. Resident Evil 4 is a work of art and it came out for Gamecube 1.0, so it's not Nintendo's fault for his lack of creativity IMO.
Slaziman @ Mar 8th 2007 9:38AM
Thanks Jack of no Brains, for your post full of totally unrelated FUD. I don't care if you spread your FUD, but at least do it in the appropriate topic goddammit. How offtopic do you want to get just to spread FUD?
Stylus @ Mar 8th 2007 9:43AM
I've been wondering why no one has done this yet. I was thinking that strafing should be handled with the accelerometer, and the camera movement handled with the analog stick. Then for a quick 180 you hit the z button. Then as they plan, the wiimote is free for other actions such as aiming, and sword fighting.
Ken @ Mar 8th 2007 9:41AM
@Jack of no Trades
http://crystaltips.typepad.com/wonderland/2005/03/burn_the_house_.html
Chris Hecker rants about Microsoft and Sony too. Just last year. His opinion is null. And he has no reason to talk... He's working for EA. :P
And we get it. You don't like the Wii. Please.. For the love of everything sane, stop talking. You're a very insecure anti-nintendo fanboy, if you need to continuously come into pro-nintendo threads and post useless information about the topic.
@topic
Sounds good. I do wish they'd give the traditional Mouse/Keyboard control scheme a shot. Oh well, maybe it's not as responsive? Oh well.
Author X @ Mar 8th 2007 9:51AM
Ooh, I really like the idea of this control scheme. I really like the idea of having the aiming and camera control seperate, and that seems like a good way to accomplish it.
idioteraser @ Mar 8th 2007 9:53AM
Ah number nine reread. The joystick is used for strafing. Tilting the nunchuck is used for camera control. The thing is for a fast paced fps that would actually be bad.
Red Steel if you took the time to learn the limits you could actually move quite fast. You had to learn how far to move the wii mote to the side to get the character to look spin around. Move too fast and your character and your character would spin around in circles. It was far faster then a dual analog but not as fast as a mouse.
james @ Mar 8th 2007 10:01AM
Not many new FPS will be being made for the PS2 right now.
Other games of this nature will be made for the PS3 or 360. Therefore if a company wants to make a game multiformat, it has to do all the HD stuff, or it could just release it for the two consoles who are not as powerful as the 360 or PS3.
ConstyXIV @ Mar 8th 2007 10:07AM
@3 and 4
I really don't have clue where the "PSP to Wii" bit came from. The architectures are totally seperate. PSP runs on a platform called MIPS, usually found in cell phones and other mobile equipment nowdays. The Wii uses PowerPC, which is the same architecture used in IBM's servers and, until recently, the Macs, as well as the GameCube (hence the GCN1.5 allegations). Also, Cell (PS3) and Xenon (X360) are derived from PowerPC. The GPU in th PSP is a custom Sony job, while Nintendo uses a variant of ATI(now AMD)'s Radeon platform for their GPU.
Psaakyrn @ Mar 8th 2007 10:14AM
So, someone FINALLY gets this idea. Or as I like to call it, the "modified HL2 Arcade control system".
Seriously, if you've seen how the HL2 arcade controls work, you'd know how this works as well.
In fact, I'd like to see if anyone gets the "bright" idea to patent this, cause I'll gladly argue this to be obvious. (or at least, obvious to me..)
ConstyXIV @ Mar 8th 2007 10:23AM
@15 Psaakyrn
Would you care to enlighten us on this "HL2 Arcade" control system? Links and video would be appreciated
Jack of No Trades @ Mar 8th 2007 10:26AM
@ Wruh roh!, Slaziman, Ken
Its true. Just look at the Vicous Engine. Nintendo fans are so naïve. Even when the facts hit them square in the nose they still can't see it. You must be troubled inside to know that you will never experience great games without PS3/360.
Virtua Fanboy @ Mar 8th 2007 10:28AM
@ Ken
"And we get it. You don't like the Wii. Please.. For the love of everything sane, stop talking. You're a very insecure anti-nintendo fanboy, if you need to continuously come into pro-nintendo threads and post useless information about the topic."
Hey dumbshit, this is Joystiq.com not (insert system name)fanboy.com. People can say whatever the hell they want.
Sorry but this is not a pro-Nintendo thread. It's an anti-Sony thread. /sarcasm lol. This is (supposed) to be a anything goes kind of thread.
Brad @ Mar 8th 2007 10:53PM
If this guy is such an "artist" why can't he create art with anything. An artist can paint a picture with watercolors or oil-based paint, but both pictures are still considered art. You have to work within the limitations of your tools. A great artist can do more with less.
Crono @ Mar 8th 2007 10:39AM
Coincidentally, I was thinking about writing a GlovePIE script for PC that would control FPS this way. The only problem is that PC FPS don't have a reticle you can move independantly of the camera.
theLoneYoshi @ Mar 8th 2007 10:39AM
"West talked with us and lamented about the common trend of ignoring Wii's graphical capability and simply upscaling textures used for PSP titles."
All I have to say is... It's about time... Seriously, I'm tired of seeing Gamecube-capable titles on the Wii, LET ME SEE WHAT THAT EXTRA HORSEPOWER CAN DO!!
And... I don't know about those FPS controls... but maybe it works in the long run. I'm not going to shoot it down because even though it sounds weird, I've never tried it.
arrrgh @ Mar 8th 2007 10:45AM
Jack off No Trades
"Even when the facts hit them square in the nose they still can't see it. You must be troubled inside to know that you will never experience great games without PS3/360."
Well then what the hell have I been playing?! I guess my Wii system is different than yours? Oh...you've never played it? Why is that not surprising
Ken @ Mar 8th 2007 10:47AM
@Virtua Fanboy
I realize that this isn't (insert console)fanboy.com.
I just think it's pretty shitty of him to come into every "OH shi, positive stuff about the Wii!" thread and just post something that has NOTHING to do with the topic?
If you think that it's alright for him to do so, then you sir are the dumbshit.
Sparky @ Mar 8th 2007 10:49AM
Huh. The only rational conclusion one can reach from the hatred of all thing Wii, is that for some reason Sony fanboys are very insecure.
I've played all consoles, and while the PC is still my gaming instrument of choice, the Wii is a close second. No other console can deliver the instant playability of the Wii. Just point and click. It's like a wireless mouse for your TV. If you've never played a Wii, pick one up, and you'll understand.
That said, I'm not thrilled about this Vicious Engine control scheme. Why is the camera movement a part of the Nunchuk? Why not use the Remote as a mouse for Camera movement as well?
And, yes, as someone pointed out make a frickin' turn around button.
The Wii offers the best non-PC gameplay around. For the last time, Graphics do not equal great games. It's about ease of play and having fun.
'Nuff said.
Number One @ Mar 8th 2007 10:54AM
@ 17, You twit.
It still amazes me that people still ride the Mindless Troll Train. I dare you to make an intelligent comment. Fucktarts like you give video gaming a bad name. But its not your fault, you've been programmed. Faulty programming but programmed you were none the less. When someone can be so blind as to make a comment supporting "PS3/360", considering that 80 percent of the games coming out for either machine will be shared, it makes my skin crawl.
@ Virtua Fanboy
This thread was filed under Nintendo Wii and GDC. Get your shit straight, bitch.
Jack of No Trades @ Mar 8th 2007 10:55AM
@ Ken
Hey wait a second buddy. I don't go into every Wii thread and post negative stuff. Its only only in the threads that piss me off deeply.
Why? I will tell you!
Its because Nintendo promised that the Wii would be a revolution in gaming and it turned out to be a half ass console with tacked on controls that makes games feel worse.
Sparky @ Mar 8th 2007 10:58AM
Jack, your comments would carry more weight if they had anything to do with the actual topic.
What specifically makes you think the Viscious Engine control scheme is any worse than the control scheme in most console first person shooters?
Myke @ Mar 8th 2007 10:59AM
Jack, that of course is your opinion. It's not fact, and the sales numbers and demand for the Wii prove that. So please fall back in line and stop trying to pawn your personal feelings and the thoughts of one lowly game dev, as factual information. Thanks for playing.
Ken @ Mar 8th 2007 10:59AM
@25
Though you say you don't go into Wii threads and post negative stuff, I could probably (but wont, because it's a waste of my time) go through every Wii news thread and find your name somewhere in there giving people shit.
It's not Nintendo's fault that developers are taking their sweet time making "new and innovative" ways to use the controller. I thought Warioware was amazing, and (I've played parts of it already) Metroid Prime 3 is amazing.
You can't bash a console in its first year. I've realized that already. I bashed the 360 to no end when it first came out. But now I own one. And I'm happy with it.
Short answer: Give it time. Stop being so angry at a company. It sounds like Nintendo broke into your house one night and raped your mother. You're waaaay too hostile towards Nintendo bro. Relax, and play some video games. :)
Jack of No Trades @ Mar 8th 2007 11:02AM
@ Number Two
"I dare you to make an intelligent comment."
Ok, I will. The Wii suck as a gaming console.
"When someone can be so blind as to make a comment supporting "PS3/360", considering that 80 percent of the games coming out for either machine will be shared, it makes my skin crawl."
80% of the games comming out on the Wii are Gamecube/PS2 titles. It just makes my skin crawl.
Makaveli @ Mar 11th 2007 5:15PM
I'll hold my breath about that control scheme since I think Metroid will set the standard. The reason PSP to Wii ports are popular is simply that PS2 to Gamecube ports happened all the time, but those systems are getting phased out. The PSP and the Wii will be left as the two supported systems without high def graphics, so they can share the same look easily. Financially, it's smart to port a PSP game to the Wii and just change the controls, plus it's cheap since developers should be able to take their old PS2->Gamecube tools and use them for new PSP->Wii games.
jman @ Mar 8th 2007 11:07AM
@ Jacko
Are you saying you would rather look at a pretty picture than play a fun game????
Number One @ Mar 8th 2007 11:12AM
@ 28
Wow... Just.. wow... You, sir, are a gentleman.
Jake @ Mar 8th 2007 11:14AM
I don't consider any of the current software on the wii except zelda, which i own on gc, to be killer or must-have in any way. I can't even stand playing a lot of it. But I don't go flaming the wii in every thread like jack. Seriously, dude, get a life. Play some games or something.
On topic, from the beginning I've thought the wiimote could be a very fun shooter control. So far, I've been disappointed. And lack of online is killer when it comes to shooters. But I still have confidence that the system will one day have a must-have shooter with online vs/coop.
It just seems like the controller could be so damn fun for a shooter. Something really fast-paced where you are whipping the crosshairs around and blasting away, often half blindly. I've only played red steel for wii shooters, and was thoroughly disappointed to be honest. Maybe Vicious will be the first to get it right.
Jack of No Trades @ Mar 8th 2007 11:15AM
@ Are you saying you would rather look at a pretty picture than play a fun game????
Just because a game looks pretty iy doesn't mean its not fun.
Okami is beautiful to look at and play. Same with Gears. Look up Eternal Sonata. That game looks very beautiful.
Swinging a tacky controller around a room doesn't make a game fun either.
Ken @ Mar 8th 2007 11:19AM
@Jake
Have you tried Red Steel's multiplayer? Minus the bugs, it's actually pretty fun.
Just hard to find 3 other people that are decent at the game. It takes about 45 minutes to get used to the controls lol...
Man, so much hope for that game too.
jman @ Mar 8th 2007 11:20AM
@ Jacko
Ok i was just making sure...oh and didn't like okami or gears for that matter..but i see your point..
Slaziman @ Mar 8th 2007 11:24AM
At this point it's hard to say if the "tacked on"-ness of Wii games is inherent to the Wiimote, or the fault of lazy programmers. I'm not sure which one it is, but I think it's to early to judge the Wii. If in one year the games still feel tacked on, then I'll even join the Wii flaming bandwagon.
Daniel @ Mar 8th 2007 11:25AM
Wow there's too many flaming flamers on joystiq today.
The Wii is a solid system; low price, decent graphics, excellent control setup, and fun games.
If you want mindblowing graphics, buy a good video card or an Xbox 360 or a PS3 for more money.
I just want a Dual Wiimote FPS. That'd be kickass.
That and Metroid Prime 3.
remember me @ Mar 8th 2007 11:32AM
the sad truth is that developers will always take the least path of resistance. I understand why people bash the wii, And yes i have one. Nintendo made people believe that once you got this controller in your hand you'd never look back....which is just not true, which is a bad thing. With all their eggs in one basket they could easily trap themselves in a corner. And sales dont reflect anything but good marketing so please stop useing that as a defense. I mean how many RAZR have been sold. yea it looks nice but thats about it. the buttons are flats so text messaging is annoying at best and the battery life isnt that great either. Same with the ipod.....Your forced to use itunes, you download a song and its only good on that computer and ipod. but hey millions bought it though. is it the best NO but everyone knows what it is as opposed to other players.
Slaziman @ Mar 8th 2007 11:43AM
It's true, the Wii is underwhelming right now. I'll admit it. Still, what's the use of spreading FUD and making people feel bad about their purchase? At this point the Wii could be a huge success (in terms of games not sales), or it could fail dramatically. Me thinks it's too early to judge it, but yes, the Wii, all the way up to Q2, is underwhelming.
Jack of No Trades @ Mar 8th 2007 11:43AM
@ remember me
*stands and applauds while screaming "hell yes"*
Icarus @ Mar 8th 2007 11:47AM
Wait for Metroid Prime 3 to set the standard for Wii fps controls. Until then just keep bashing the Wii.
F1ghter @ Mar 8th 2007 11:51AM
Don't feed the troll, and it will go away. Haven't you guys learned by now? With all of the defending going on, the Wii fanboys are just as bad as the trolls. Just don't respond, *especially* when the trolling is BLATANT! Ignoring is the *only* possible way to make things better.
I, for one, would like to at least try this new control setup. It sounds difficult to me, but it could be interesting, depending on how well it is implemented.
F1ghter @ Mar 8th 2007 11:52AM
Don't feed the troll, and it will go away. Haven't you guys learned by now? With all of the defending going on, the Wii fanboys are just as bad as the trolls. Just don't respond, *especially* when the trolling is BLATANT! Ignoring is the *only* possible way to make things better.
I, for one, would like to at least try this new control setup. It sounds difficult to me, but it could be interesting, depending on how well it is implemented.
Sparky @ Mar 8th 2007 11:52AM
To be clear, I agree the Wii is not perfect. However, I would argue no Console was/is perfect - especially the first few months of release!
The fact remains, despite the bad ports, the tacked on controls, and the less than stellar graphics, the Wii STILL has better controls than any other console. Period.
Hopefully, it will get better. I see no reason to denounce the Wii just because of a few bad games. The potential is obvious. I won't be surprised if MS and Sony eventually make their controllers more "Wii-like."
Hell, Sony already tacked on it's crappy six-axis motion controller, so they obviously feel there's a market there to be exploited.
F1ghter @ Mar 8th 2007 11:52AM
darn, tricked by the faulty comment submission...
Darkness @ Mar 8th 2007 12:01PM
@Remember me...
I see what you mean, but I don't agree. I have been enjoying the Wii and in some cases I can't go back to the old way. For example, I can't go back to playing Halo. I tried to go back and finally beat the game, but I can't handle it anymore. After playing Call of Duty 3, Elebits, and Red Steel, I think the old way is worse for controling those kinds of games. After playing SSX Blur, I can't go back to playing SSX the old way. Especially since I always had trouble doing Uber tricks in the old games. My girlfriend rocked at the tricks, but I just couldn't get the hang of it. With Blur, I can do Uber tricks at will.
So to some it may be an underwhelming experience, but for others, that's not the case. If you don't like the games, there are other choices. As a multi system owner myself, I go where the fun games are and right now they're on the Wii for me.
Oh, and you shouldn't generalize about why people like those items. It's not simply about the masses. I enjoyed iTunes LONG before it was mainstream. You may not like those products and that's fine, however just think that there are people out there who genuinely like them. I still can't see why people like Linux or even Windows, but people do. I don't knock their opinion for liking them either.
J @ Mar 8th 2007 12:08PM
@ 8
Thank god someone has sense. Turn around should be left or right on the analog. Straffe could be lean left or right with the nunchuck as I think that would be alot more intuitive. THis control scheme will remove the need to use the very center fo the screen asd an aiming point and will allow for real "gun like" aiming although not one to one. If you walk into a room with a gun and look straight ahead you could still shoot to your left and right using your peripheral vision. This brings that idea a little bit closer. Or at least you could shoot and have full motion which is something the keyboard cant emulate too well. I guess the strafe thing could get annoying if you couldn't get a good center of balance but I assume you could have it strafe after tilting it a certain amount of degrees. We will just have to see.
Evan @ Mar 8th 2007 12:10PM
@Myke "What makes it so easy to use PSP games as Wii ports?"
There are two modern low-level graphics libraries on which game engines are built: OpenGL and DirectX. These are essentually the interfaces between the software and the GPU.
The PSP, PS2, PS3, N64, GC, Wii, and DS all use the OpenGL graphics library, while the XBox and XBox 360 uses DirectX. The low-level function calls do to things like send geometry to the GPU are more similiar between the N64 and PS3, than between the PS3 and 360! (Obviously the PS3 supports functions that the N64 does not, however rendering code for the N64 should theotically run on a PS3 with only minor changes!)
Sparky @ Mar 8th 2007 12:19PM
#47 "J" -
I see your point, but it must be noted you cannot have true peripheral vision on a standard monitor or TV screen.
My priority is a bit different: I'd rather be able to run one way, while looking another, not something that sounds possible in this control scheme (unless I'm mis-reading?).
It seems silly not to have your camera linked to your targeting system - you're never going to need to look in one direction, and fire in another (as opposed to moving in one direction, while looking in another).
Sparky @ Mar 8th 2007 12:25PM
"Essentially, only the nunchuk is used for camera and movement. The top joystick moves and strafes your character, while left and right rotations trigger the accelerometer and rotate the characters perspective left and right and a forward / back roll with cause the camera to look down / up, respectively."
Hmmm, Looks like a did misread it. For some reason I thought you had to hold down the buttons and then use the joystick for the camera, I missed the whole moving the nunchuk up and down to look up and down.
This is something I would need hands-on to see if it works or not.