Are Nintendo fanboys hurting the Wii's 3rd-party support? One fansite editor sounds off

That kevin cassidy fucker is a slick devil. "For many years, Nintendo had a rough time securing truly robust third party support. But back during the 8-bit and 16-bit wars, things were quite different: Sega and Nintendo were the big players, and their respective systems were cartridge-based. As time moved on, things changed drastically on all fronts, from storage, to competitors, and even subject matter. Nintendo decided to stay with the more expensive cartridges for their Nintendo 64 platform, while newcomer Sony went with much cheaper CD-based media. That change, combined with the scary prospect of competing against Nintendo's first party powerhouse franchises, produced the perfect recipe for third party disaster, resulting in ever-decreasing third party support until very recently." Nintendo tried to make a console with Sony, failed, chose to stay with cartridges. Nintendo also wanted most if not all of the profits made from that relationship with Sony. Of course, Sony wasn't having that. Sony moved on and made the playstation which looks like the Super nes in terms of its controllers. Sony wanted to exPAND media. Nintendo wants to shrink it. Sony and other companies wants to give publishers and developers more leeway in the types of games they make, Nintendo wants to seriously cripple and handicap any creative endeavors. This dickhead kevin cassidy would have you believe, like the nintendo stoolpigeon he is, that it is not nintendo's fault, no, 'cause nintendo could never do no wrong. No, never. He actually wants you, the nintendo sheep, to believe that it is YOUR fault. Although developers and publishers left en MASSE, because of nintendo trying to have total control, they want you to believe that it is YOUR fault, because the only games you could play that were of any quality were from Nintendo, and all the other developers decided not to be slaves of nintendo. So cassidy the BITCH here decides to blame YOU sheep for it. And you are sheep, 'cause in your eyes nintendo does NO wrong. They come out with the same games year after year, but it's only EA and madden that does that. No other compnay but nintendo produces original content. LOL. So he's right in saying that nintendo fans will ONLY buy nintendo product,but he's wrong in placing the blame on nintendo lemmings like himself. What the fuck can you buy when the only shit that's out is made by Nintendo, and other companies refuse to make games on a system with INFERIOR storage capacity? It's like trying to write a book on a section of toilet paper. Cartridges. Nope. Half dvd discs. Nope. Dvd-roms, finally, but the system is the smallest graphically. No. They lose 3 times straight. Are you seriously telling me that people would still buy and still have bought Nintendo if the playstation 3 was priced at $300? Are you fuckin' kiddin' me? Are you thinkin' the "success" of the Wii has to do with some port, that port being twilight princess? When has Nintendo EVER released a last generation game for a new console? It was a last generation game, being highly and heavily touted as a console seller for their new console! Are you fuckin' kiddin' me? What about all those people that had a gamecube? What then? What if you bought a gamecube component cable? What then? No backwards compatible gameplay with ANYTHING except for their cords. Their fuckin' audio video cables. Get the fuck outta here. That's nintendo's "pledge" to their customers. That's nintendo's commitment to excellence.

I can't say it enough man fuck nintendo. I used to support them since '88, but I can't do it anymore. All the games I got on gamecube,and the only one I would even BOTHER to hook up, is fuckin' resident evil 4. That that game, got no pub, on nintendo, but their same dickhead ass hypocritical fans, said eternal darkness was a good game, tells me all I need to know about nintendo fans. eternal darkness? did we play the same bullshit? That shit was the WORST, resident evil rip-off I had ever played in my life! Silicon Knights, Rare, RARE!, factor 5, all left Nintendo. Why is that? I remember Silicon Knights and factor 5 both having reasons stating that Nintendo's business strategy and policy was basically to be a "walt disney" of video games; to basically make cute cuddly video games and at the end of the day call it a day. This led them to leaving. Not to mention,as I said before, that they had a shitty platform when it came to creating the very games even nintendo wanted. Nintendo wants to have its cake and eat it too. They want to make you make games THEIR way. They are the worst thing imaginable: a game developer AND a game compnay, roled into one. Not to mention a publisher on top of that. IMagine EA making a video game machine, and they wanted you to follow a certain regimen similar to their own, and basically crank out videogames like we know they do. Well basically, "cranking" is an apt word because that's all that EA does, crank out the same franchise year after year. But what if this company had a video game system, and forced the other game publishers and developers,into this kind of practice? Do you see my point? Do you get my point now? There's more to life then basically upgraded Maddens and Lives every year. There's mroe to lfie than fuckin' a slightly altered Zelda or a "Goldeneye" Metroid (which still angers me to this fuckin' day) every year. And don't tell me that Nintendo DOESN'T release these same games every year because that's ALL they do on their handhelds. One of those zeldas for the gba or ds had like 3 or four zeldas come out in one year. One fuckin' year! FOUR. But nintendo doesn't overdoit? Ever since Metroid Prime took off Nintendo has been whoring Metroid. Metroid didn't have SHIT since Super Metroid, but once those japs found out that the white boys in the west were playin' metroid, and clamorin' for it, plus the unfortunate death of gunpei yokoi, they fuckin' goldeneyed it. The game that was sellin' even more than zelda and mario put together, THEE game that made people buy 64 singlehandedly, was the reason my beloved Metroid was turned into a goldeneye in space instead of a zelda and mario type third person game, like it should have been. If nintendo didn't have any specific-type policy, and let manufactures do what they want, and give them the PLATFORM to do what they want, we wouldn't be bitching. We'd have all these great games. but those developers left en MASSE, MASSE, there was nary a konami game to be found on 64. And the same company, which made street fighter II, which was a system seller back then for super nintedo like goldeneye wasfor the 64, is not even FOUND on your 64 console, then you have some explaining to do. It has SHIT to do with the content of a system, and everything to do with Nintendo's ignorant, and stubborn system to move on and join everybody else.

@ Mad at Nintendo

Metroid Prime was AWESOME. Have you even played it? It controls are NOTHING like other FPS. It's not even a true FPS.

*****************************

I also owned and liked TimeSplitters. I bought the Tony Hawks, the Mortal Kombats, the PSOs, the Skies of Arcadia, the Viewtiful Joes, the Resident Evils, the Splinter Cells, all that goodness. But if there is a really bad port that has had NO work put into it except for tacking on controls, then who's fault is that? The fanboys, or the developers?

Stop giving other gamers shit for buying things they actually LIKE and give the devs who haven't tried more crap to get their act together.

Where the hell do you guys get the time to write a thesis paper on this shit???

3rd Parties need to realize that if they make good games that aren't just ports with Wii controls tacked on, than they will sale well.

Why would I want to play a last-gen system? Get off your lazy asses and make brand new games for the Wii, not rehashes/ports of existing games from last gen...(I'm looking at you Ubisoft...)

You know what would help Nintendo's "kiddie" image? Not making Mario shout "WOOHOO!" and "YAHOO!" every time he jumps, stomps, scratches his butt, etc.

When 3rd parties start creating games for the Wii that push the machine limits, with good graphics, then maybe people will start buying them.

PS2 ports are getting lame and tired.

Of course Dewy's Adventure are calling it Kiddie - just look at the graphics! It doesn't take Enstein to work out why!!

3rd party developers should look in the mirror instead of pushing the blame on to others.

Thats Rawmeatcowboy to you sir.

OhJustSomeRandomGuy:

Why would you be sick of Mario? Does it hurt in your tummy every time a Mario game is released? I personally haven't bought a Mario Party game (and happy with it) since the first one, and the only Mario sports game I have is Mario Tennis for the N64. I know there are lots of Mario games released, but who cares?

The games are good, I just don't want to buy them. I can still appreciate the real Mario's (Galaxy, Sunshine, 64) and the Mario RPG's (Paper Mario and the old Mario RPG) as well as Mario Kart. We've seen Cartman in like THOUSAND South Park episodes. Has he been run to the ground? As long as he is still funny, why would we care how much episodes with him are released?

If you don't like Mario party and sports games, don't buy them, real Mario games like Mario Galaxy and Paper Mario are few and far between, and it's really the only games you should care about. Just because there are other Mario games released doesn't mean you can't appreciate the real Mario games any more!

#104

I wonder the exact same thing...

"Nintendo also wanted most if not all of the profits made from that relationship with Sony."

Nooooo...I believe it was the other way around, with Sony demanding rights and licensing to any game released for the CD system.
Jesus, at least get your 'facts' straight, you dumbass.

And see that longish key on the right side of your keyboard? The one that says 'Enter' (or possibly 'Return') on it?
USE IT!!!

The only thing I'll say about this little debate is that Mario has been around as long as Nintendo systems. If Mario wasn't first party and turned into a system whore like Solid Snake, or the Final Fantasy series then it might not seem all that bad. I mean look at FF. A couple gems stand out in my mind but they've thrown that franchise into more failed directions than Nintendo has with Mario IMO. I'll just drop a few of my favorites, Ergheiz, Kingdom Hearts, any of the 3,000 side quests/mystic adventures/crazy disposable sh*t, or I have and idea! Lets take the big yellow chicken and throw him into 8 games of his very own!!!! No, wait, I have an even better idea, lets take one part of one minigame and turn it into a character liscensed mobile phone snowboard game!!! (Never heard if that ever actually made it to the general public but it was a pathetic money making scheme none-the-less). All I'm saying is that if a character like Crash would have sustained his momentum with QUALITY games then he'd still be around for the playstation 5 when it hits and nobody would have anything to argue about, but, unfortunetly Crash crashed and burned and held no industry muscle anymore. Thats the difference with the Mario franchise, aside from the "Party" series which I cant stand, I've never been let down by a mario title.

***On a side note, I'm not riping on Erghiez or KH like it may seem, they're both awesome games and I own them anyway. I'm just pointing out that if any first party franchise from Sony or MS is still relatable and holds clout in 12 years, we'll see how many genres they end up being whored out in.

I agree, the Party series is real trash.

Before anyone throws the word "mature" around, I'd like to see it defined. The defenition I can obtain by the use of the word in these "discussions" is that it is self-contradictory.

What is maturity?

Is it a pure physical state? Can't be, much childish behavior originats by those over 18.

Is maturity the ability to distinguish reality from fantasy? If so, we've got the entire thing backwards. Children shouldn't be exposed to Mario or Pokemon because they're too fake while adults should enjoy them more as they can distinguish the difference.

Is maturity the distaste for non-realistic worlds? If so, the mature game market should also be the most stale and boring. If everything is realistic, why bother playing games to begin with?

Is maturity being grounded in reality? If so, then playing games in general is kiddy because playing games is an escape from reality.

By some defenitions, Mario Kart is far more mature than Gran Turismo because it challenges the mature mind to accept that which cannot be real. By others, Gran Turismo is the more mature title because it holds itself solidly in reality. Both are viable defenitions, yet both of them are fatally flawed and self-contradictory. Jak and Daxter, a title used as "mature" in this lengthy discussion, has the same qualities as Mario for example.

I propose that maturity is the ability to explain, without resorting to cosmetics, why a particular title doesn't appeal. Gran Turismo is not more mature than Mario Kart. It is the player whom we should be looking. A mature gamer can dislike Mario Kart, but explain that he prefers to tune engines, not attack the visuals. The immature gamer says Mario Kart is kiddy.

If properly raised, children can equally enjoy Resident Evil 4 as much as Pokemon. Equally for adults. Maturity is a state of being, not something measurable by products that are purchased.

i think that it is in part the fanboy's fault. too many of us dont give 3rd party games a chance. its easier for other consoles, mostly because all their great games come from 3rd parties... whereas ninty.. well heres a quote from an egm issue i think it was: "when a 3rd party makes a game for nintendo, its biggest competitor is nintendo"... and thats true. ninty makes great games. but so do 3rd partys. and when they try and think out of the box, we fanyboys mostly spit at it. because ninty already makes amazing games for most of the current genras (mario,metroid,zelda), 3rd parties are wise to try something new, instead of making the same thing, that ninty makes better anyway... (ie: red steel and mp3). thats not to say that games in the same genra from 3rd parties are bad, they should be looked and supported if they are worth it. but look at dewy's adventure. its new, fresh, out of the box. saying that it has "childish" graphis is stupid. what is childish about it? just because hes not cutting bodies in half doesnt mean its not an adult game. in fact its probably more adult than most bloody hack in slash. it has puzzles to solve, which most children would probably have a hard time figuring out. an adult might still be challenged, but it would be easier and more enjoyable. a bloody hack n slash any child can do. they simply need to hit a bunch of buttons. and cel shaded graphics? i love them. just because it looks 'cartoony' doesnt mean its childish. in certain games, cell shaded is needed, it gets the story accross to the gamer much better. what if dewy's adventure looked like gears of war. i garuntee it would be stupid. and take for example games like killer 7, or no more heroes... the cel shaded graphics add an extra stylized apperance to the game, in a way the unreal 3 engine could never do. theres also veiwtiful joe. would i want that to look like ghost recon advance warfighter2?? hell no.

so take at look at how your supporting ninty. are you prasing the good 3rd party games? are you saying, "yes i want more 3rd party support!". "I want a bigger library of games to choose from!". "I want new ideas that are exciting and fun to play!".

or are you saying "I dont like 3rd party support". "I want fewer games to choose from". "only ninty makes good games, all the third party games are shit"."i dont like new ideas and concepts, i am happy with the same old games".

and then ask yourself "am i helping or hindering ninty?"

we could have great games like gears of war, and tons others, if we simply showed that we wanted them.

Ah yes, the huge influx of so-called mature games. I hate to say it, but I have started to discriminate slightly against games that so proudly wear the "mature" label and attempt to use intense violence, sexuality, or (sad, pathetic attempts at) mature storylines to sell copies.

Such things do not make a game mature...in fact, I think for many of us they really dumb it down. For example, despite the fact that God of War is a very well-made game, I can't get over the feeling that they are trying waaaay to hard to make the violence over-the-top in a way that has been popular since Mortal Kombat. There are times when I think "Okay, now that is just stupid." Maybe I am missing that crucial sense of over-the-top brutality that the game supposedly has, or maybe I am just desensitized to digital violence to the point that some of it just annoys me now.

The same goes for the GTA series. The game has ridden its "mature and controversial" labels for far too long and, frankly, I havent really been impressed with anything since Vice City. The core gameplay now bores me, and the whole attitude of the game is not mature, but sophomoric and downright annoying at times.

These may be two games that are tough to pick on, seeing as they have been met with so much critical acclaim and have huge fanbases. I am sure either game could sell themselves based on smooth, tight gameplay and action (GOW) and the huge, open sandbox world (GTA), but I feel that a lot of what sells these games is right there in that "M" label.

There is a difference between "mature content" and content with maturity. Frankly, I am sooo sick of the former, and desperately wanting the latter. The problem is, as long as devs are giving consumers the former, I will not pass up a great game just because I feel that it rides too much on M content. A great game is a great game; the trends in M games just disappoint me sometimes.

@OhJustSomeRandomGuy:

thank you for proving everyone has an opinion! stop the press!

Wait! They showed this with Dewy's Adventure in the article.
The same Dewy's Adventure that is described as "players help a small droplet of water save its home from a mysterious dark force."
Let's face it, as long as developers are MAKING kiddie games, then they will continue to not sell. I've seen a ton of CRAP pumped out to Nintendo systems because they realize that children ask their parents to buy games based on the cover and not on what is inside.
See, here is a concept:
Good games sell. Bad games tank.
It doesn't ALWAYS happen that way, but that is the way it works the majority of the time.
Now, lets look at the games that will likely suck, and be kiddie, no matter what system they are on:
Barnyard
Happy Feet
The Ant Bully
Bionicle Heroes
Crash Dummy vs. the Evil D-Troit
Dewy's Adventure
Disney's Chicken Little: Ace in Action
Ice Age 2: The Meltdown
Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End
Shrek Smash and Crash Racing
Shrek the Third

I don't know ANYTHING about these titles, but based on past performance alone, I.P. licenses based on children movies SUCK on any platform. They get pushed out the door because they expect they will sell to kids who don't know any better.
But, hey, why blame the people at fault when you can blame the victims?
This is the problem, not third parties OR fanboys.

@mogbert, Dewey's Adventure isn't a license from a children's movie; it's an original I.P. from the team that made Elebits, which is heralded as having one of the earliest spot-on Wii control schemes done by a 3rd party. Sure blew the hell out of Monkey Ball, Rayman, or Red Steel in my opinion. Because Elebits was awesome, I'll at least rent Dewey's Adventure. This team at Konami is treating me right so far, so I'll treat them right so far.

And big ups are due to LaughingTarget and gst for understanding the difference between the maturity of the content in a game and the maturity of a person who plays it. I'm so sick of people deriding games for not having blood. You know what doesn't have blood? My lunch, my car, my computer, my pants. If all you want is blood, cut yourself up and find some, you immature crybabies.

I'm not recommending you boycott M-rated games, I'm recommending you boycott games that suck and try to ride the M rating as opposed to having any good gameplay or plot. There are some good M-rated games out there, but now they're diamonds in the rough thanks to the constant flow of M-rated crap. There are also really good E-rated games out there, you just gotta dodge all the Shreks and Barnyards. Same deal either way.

"The perception of the aforementioned titles is that they are simply rehashed games from last generation with motion controls tacked on"

Thats what Wii gameplay is and always will be, last gen gameplay with motion controls tacked on. And it can not do more than this due to the lack of processing power. Hideo Kojima for example has even said that

Extinction, could you please define "last gen gameplay" and "next gen gameplay" as you understand them?

If you're going to argue that the Wii is last gen gameplay and that anything else is next gen gameplay, I feel sorry for the way your brain works.

When will you people stop bickering over consoles and just play,the question is not is this game kiddy or mature but is it fun,thats why we play games in the first place for fun!I play anything that looks fun regardless of console.

@Console fanboys

you're always so busy trying to be loyal to your console and searching for fault in other consoles that you blind yourselves from seeing your own consoles promblems.Do you realy have to bite each others heads off cause sombody doesn't like your console,do you have to act so fanboyish,why can't you play games regardless of console but because
they're fun,try it you may like it!