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Reader Comments (39)

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 7:55PM (Unverified) said

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Did anyone think the original PA comic was in support of Dyack/the game industry?

Thus making Dyack's "response"... kind of a dick move? :/

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 7:54PM hvnlysoldr said

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Super Smash Bros. Brawl

Posted: Mar 24th 2007 2:47AM (Unverified) said

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pWned!

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 7:57PM (Unverified) said

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Yeah, I don't think he got the idea that they were commenting on the pressure involved, and not calling his game shitty. Although, I did kinda laugh at the modded strip.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 7:58PM (Unverified) said

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@ 2. I was thinking the same thing, I don't see how PA's comic was an attack at Dyack... what a dick.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 7:59PM (Unverified) said

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I never understood why PA thought it would be a good idea to start making games. Just because they are a talented duo (in the realm of comics) that love the medium does not mean they were meant to create games. It would be like Roger Ebert deciding to make his own film about trials, tribulations and struggles with obesity. And the title, "On the Rain-Slick Precipice of Darkness" is ANOTHER turn off, more of that Tycho I'm-wordy-for-the-sake-of-being-wordy bullshit. Yeah man, I can whip out a dictionary anytime I want to impress the ladies at the local library too...

On the other hand (pun intended), what is up with the last panel of that comic? Why the hell is Denis Dyack's arm in a bucket of ice? He was either whacking off to online porn, PE or his own creations...each reality more disturbing than the last...

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 8:15PM (Unverified) said

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His arm in the bucket is reminiscent of one of his blog posts, called "The Ice Bucket." But anyway, before this blows up like everywhere else, Denis is just poking fun. I'm pretty sure he has some history with at least one of the guys from PA. Nothing more than a friendly jab.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 8:27PM (Unverified) said

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I don't know Dennis Dyack at all, but I am really turned off from anything he's involved in by this point...

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 8:24PM AoE said

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Yeah, if you look at just the comic they posted vs his, he does come off as a dick... But Tycho being Tycho also spoke a lot of crap when Too Human was at E3... so turnabout is fair play IMO. At the same time it doesn't save Dennis from being labeled (in my mind at least) a whiny prick, regardless.

In answer to Ludwig's question, I wish we weren't shown games until they were closer to being out-the-door than they seem to be. When was the last time you saw a trailer for a movie where they hadn't finished compositing the scenes? Even if you're showing product before it's ready to go... what you're showing should be as close as possible to finished product. It's unfair of Dennis to complain about the press when it's his company that chose to show half-baked crap instead of nothing at all. The same is true of Penny Arcade. I can understand being excited about a new product you're working on, but honestly it serves no one to show half-baked goods and assure us that "When it's done, this cake will be beautiful." First impressions count for a lot, and both of those games gave a pretty crappy one.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 8:31PM Dracula Jones said

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Fuck Denis Dyack. I listened to the EGM Live podcast he was on. He is so far up his own asshole that I don't think he'll ever find his way out. I really felt bad for the guys at EGM. They were forced to defend their jobs while he berated them for an hour because they gave Too Human an absolutely deserved negative preview.

That comic would be more appropriate if it was three panels of Denis Dyack sniffing his own farts and ending every sentence in a question mark?

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 8:35PM JonahFalcon said

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" It would be like Roger Ebert deciding to make his own film about trials, tribulations and struggles with obesity."

He wrote a film about his obsession over big breasts. :)

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 8:39PM (Unverified) said

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You guys do realize that Roger Ebert wrote the screenplay for the 1970 flick "Beyond The Valley of The Dolls," right?

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 8:43PM (Unverified) said

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If an underwelming showing at E3 put pressure on Denis Dyack and his team to make a better product... that's all that matters. Why do you guys care about the guy so much. Do you know all the Developers behind the scenes of the games you buy? Are you a fan of Bill Gates and Peter Moore as well? Because your hard earned dollar can be going to any number of of people that (in some people's eyes) care jerks and you'd be none the wiser.


All that matters is that Too Human gets the treatment it decserves and that us gamers (or 360 owners cause it is exclusive) get another great title to add to the ever growing list of great titles. The end.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 8:50PM (Unverified) said

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Chad, you're right. I don't want to hear Dyack, or Jaffe, or Cliffy B talking about their search for existentialism through the story of their games EVER.
I just want to play the games.

It's not like the stories rea really vaulted treasures anyway... they are mostly afterthoughts to gameplay and visuals. (or seemingly so)

at the end of the day I just want to play a game... I could care less if Dyack prides himself on his memorization of Nietzsche and don't want to hear about it.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 8:52PM erh said

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In the case of Penny Arcade, I think it’s good that they showed their game. Maybe the reaction will knock some sense into those two. I mean... a 3D game? It does not leverage their skill as cartoonists, what possessed them to think they were capable of making a 3D game? Hopefully the poor reaction to the trailer will make them re-evaluate their plan, and they’ll stick to what they are good at.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 8:53PM (Unverified) said

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@5

His hand is in a bucket of ice (I think) because he's been taking so much heat from the Too Human trailer. I actually found that aspect of the strip pretty funny.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 8:56PM (Unverified) said

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Oh no wait the bucket is there because the first part of Too Human came from a "very cold place". Next time I'll read the damn post.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 8:59PM (Unverified) said

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I dunno- I saw Dyack's strip as in completely good fun. From what the Tycho guy has written in the past, I thought the two were on good terms.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 9:08PM Rallion said

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Technically speaking, Penny Arcade is not 'making a game.' A development studio is, while they provide a huge amount of creative input. (Gabe draws concept art for everything, Tycho actually writes all the dialogue.)

Anyhow, yeah, I kinda thought this well before this came up, but Dyack is a dick. He seems like the kind of person who expects to be worshiped for his creations, and he's pissed because that isn't happening. He HAS work on some damn good stuff in the past, sure (Eternal Darkness), but he thinks that earns him some kind of...I don't know...godhood?

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 9:10PM Demaar said

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The bucket of ice is there because he can handle the pain better than an average person. It's a metaphor that requires a story from when he was an athlete to understand the context. Read his blog here: http://blogs.ign.com/silicon-knights/2007/01/25/44648/

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 9:20PM watership said

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umm Dennis isn't attacking penny-arcade, he's just commiserating with them.


Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 9:40PM Cabcru said

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He's definitely gone from "Yeah, okay, fair point," to "Okay, shut up about it, you're just being a dick now," imo.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 9:48PM (Unverified) said

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We gave Denis a pretty nice comic I thought after his comments about showing games early. It really made sense to us. We thought about what it would be like if we had to show every comic strip we did to people before we were finished. It was a scary thought and the comic was really our way of supporting him and other developers.

He's certainly right that a lot of people didn't like the 3D stuff in our trailer. I happen to be one of them. All I can say is that we'll keep working on it and hopefully make something cool.

I know some people wonder why we even decided to make a game. Honestly why wouldn't we. I mean I think it's every gamers dream to make a game of their own right? I wish I had a better reason, honestly we just thought it would be fun.

It might suck but that's a risk we take every time we make something. All we can do, all we've ever done is try to make the best stuff we can. If the game does suck I promise we'll be the first people to tell you;)

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 10:37PM (Unverified) said

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I think that developers should not show POS at any event and think they'll get away with it. If S|K didn't have a non-POS Too Human demo, then why even go there. Produce something worth taking to the show and then go. I can almost bet that someone told Dennis Dyack and company that their Too Human footage was POS but they went ahead with it anyway and messed around and displayed it. What were they expecting, kudos for making Eternal Darkness?.Get Real. I'll take jaw dropping or even just interesting footage anyday instead of POS footage just to show something. You see Denis, POS footage/Demo is anti-hype as kriptonite is to Supahman. Nah I mean!

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 10:21PM Bluebrake said

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"I know some people wonder why we even decided to make a game. Honestly why wouldn't we. I mean I think it's every gamers dream to make a game of their own right? I wish I had a better reason, honestly we just thought it would be fun."

That's what I'm thinking... who says they don't understand why PA is making a game? Honestly, if any of you had the opportunity, wouldn't you jump on it in an instant?

Anyway, I didn't think Dyack's comic was bad... I mean, it wasn't very funny, but it seemed to be done all in good fun.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 11:16PM (Unverified) said

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Critics making their movie? Haven't you guys heard of Jean Luc Godard?

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 10:44PM (Unverified) said

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Gabe,

Just wanted to comment on this...

"He's certainly right that a lot of people didn't like the 3D stuff in our trailer. I happen to be one of them. All I can say is that we'll keep working on it and hopefully make something cool."

If you didn't like the 3D stuff shown in the PA trailer, why show it off? I'm under the impression that the two of you have a lot of control over what has been going on with that game. Hasn't there been a time in development where the two of you thought "This 3D stuff isn't working" or even trying out a different, more stylized look?

And I'm sure the 3D guys on the PA game team are now home in bed crying after reading that comment. Regardless, best of luck.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 10:44PM kabes said

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It's a friendly jab. And the previous PA comic isn't the only time PA has brought up Too Human on their site so don't think this is simply a response to that.

It's just a friendly nudge. Anyone thinking otherwise is simply a drama queen.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 11:23PM (Unverified) said

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Phil- Well we chose to show it because at the time we thought it was important to make sure people knew the game would be in 3D. We all knew what we had was early but we decided to show it anyway. What's that saying about hindsight?

I have absolute faith in the 3D guys. They really are pros and I think they'll be able to pull this off. They still have a lot of effects to add and getting the cell shading in there will be huge. I can say I don't like what's on the screen right now because they don't want the game to look that way either. This is just the phase it's in right now. I think the models are strong we just need to keep working on it.

This is all new for us. I'm not worried about it. At the end of the day we'll have a game and people will like it or they won't. Nothing I say can change that.

Posted: Mar 23rd 2007 11:45PM Bluebrake said

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I remember a couple years back somebody was working on an independent PA fighting game, and if I recall right the models in that looked really good. I can't find any links now, of course... I have no idea what happened to that project.

To me that says that 3D can work here, even without cel-shading. Some cartoon art styles really don't transfer to 3D well (e.g. Matt Groening's stuff looks awful), but I'm confident that PA's style can. It's just a matter of time and the desire to do it. Sounds to me like these guys have got both.

Posted: Mar 24th 2007 2:12AM (Unverified) said

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"I'll take jaw dropping or even just interesting footage anyday instead of POS footage just to show something."

That's not the choice that anyone's making. No sane person wants to give a bad preview. Ultimately it would be a choice between a bad preview and no preview. The people making games don't always have the luxury of choosing. That's just the way the industry works right now.

Posted: Mar 24th 2007 2:25AM (Unverified) said

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Dyack sucks. Nobody has heard of him until PA name-drops him in a sympathetic light and he goes and lampoons them in an unfunny manner.

Posted: Mar 24th 2007 2:34AM (Unverified) said

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We do see pre-release stuff where they haven't finished compositing shots. Not in trailers (which would be the equivalent of game demos, not of the kind of previews Dyack is railing against). Behind the scenes stuff on TV put out to hype the release, early showing at cons, backstage photos in magazines... then there's test screenings done for focus groups with temporary effects or soundtracks put in.
Hell, I routinely see script reviews up on websites for the big budget summer blockbusters.

Dyack's comparison just isn't a very good one. And its completely unrealistic for the games industry--especially for a first party developer.

Posted: Mar 24th 2007 3:55AM PlatinumSkeet said

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He's digging into a can of frozen grapes I guess... Talked about it from his podcast interview...

Posted: Mar 24th 2007 4:04AM milkham said

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the bucket is there for a move called "the stranger" go look it up on urbandictionary.com

Posted: Mar 24th 2007 10:07AM (Unverified) said

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George Broussard must laughing so hard out there in vaporware limbo all screaming "NOW YOU SEE THE WISDOM IN IT BEING DONE WHEN IT'S DONE, YOU FOOLS"!!!! MUHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

Posted: Mar 24th 2007 12:46PM JimJim said

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@Dave: I found the original PA comic absolutely gaming industry supportive... but hey, everybody has an opinion.

Posted: Mar 24th 2007 1:27PM (Unverified) said

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I never liked PA. I don't understand why they are so popular. Surely I can't be the first person to...oh...I see.

Finally, a strip featuring Gabe and Tycho that induced even a chuckle from this weary-eyed gamer and site-surfer!

Posted: Mar 24th 2007 4:26PM (Unverified) said

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Zaki wrote: "Critics making their movie? Haven't you guys heard of Jean Luc Godard?"

Wasn't he a starship captain?




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