Oh the horror! Elite to use HDMI 1.2 not 1.3

Wow.

As if paying for ludicrously expensive hard drive and dealing with restrictive data management wasn't enough, MS couldn't be bothered to use the newest version of HDMI?

Can this/will this be updated in the fall update for it or it can't be updated to 1.3?

OH NOES!!! MY HDMI'S ARE BROKEN!!!

I'll give a cookie to anyone out there that could tell the difference in a piece of audio played back between 1.2 and 1.3 HDMI.

Not worth it. HDMI is all about DRM.
I'll also give 2 cookies to anyone that can see the difference between HDMI and component.

You can still get TrueHD through HDMI 1.2 - it just has to be decoded in the player instead of the receiver. Lots of people (myself included) have an HD DVD player and can play the lossless TrueHD audio track without a problem. In fact, I don't believe that any receivers actually decode TrueHD or HD-DTS yet anyway, so it's a moot point.

I don't think this is important at all to be honest with you.

Fumble! I'll keep my current 360 and instead of getting the Elite, I'll be searching for that 20GB PS3

Yeah, none of the current media can even come close to the Amount of Gigs/sec 1.3 has over 1.2. 1.2 will be fine for at least 5 years. And by then the xbox 1080 will be out, or whatever trendy ending they put on it.

i will not buy the elite now thanks for the heads up guys!

Once we get FIOS, nothing is going to matter anyway.

We will be able to stream HD on our TV's via the web......this isn't a big deal to me.....

From what I understand the 360 can't output the better audio channels that 1.3 supports, so it really isn't a big deal.

@4 Yes, you can tell the difference if you have anything near a decent sound system. I'm not talking state of art either I'm just not talking shitty speakers and such. Also if you have a semi big HDTV you can tell the difference between component and HDMI. How do I know, because I've used players with both and can tell between them.

@5 you are correct, but there are a few receivers (very high end) right now that will decode those signals.

I think it's just sort of a slap to not have the latest version in the system. They can't blame it on it not being verified yet as 1.3 has been out for some time now.

Elite is the REAL TARD pack. Too much for a 120GB HD thats not needed at all, too much for a stupid HDMI that doesn't mean anything for 99% of the consumers.

They should focus on dropping the price of core to US$250, the Pro to US$325 and then launch the elite at US$400.

Drop the price of the 20GB to US$50 and launch the 120GB HD for US$100.

What they did was show the public that a 60GB PS3 at US$600(with HDMI 1.3+60GBHD+HiDef player) is not that expensive when compared to an Elite+HD-DVD Combo at US$680(HDMI 1.2+120GB HD+ HiDef Player).

And to those saying that people that would buy the Elite @ 480 wouldn't want a HD-DVD player, why the hell would you want a 360 with HDMI and bigger HD if you're not a videophile?

The only hope to M$ is if IPTV has a faster adoption by the market than both the hi-def discs formats but with the Fiber Optic cable internet requirement I can't place my bet on IPTV becoming really popular anywhere before 2012.

I smell shit comming from redmond when the talk comes to the Elite.

A lot of justifications for overpricing, old tech, but at the end it feels like they're messing up really big...

Regardless of how capable 1.2 might be, this is a really odd move. Bring this version out several months after the PS3, make a big deal about the HDMI... and then it's not even the latest model? It seems akin to going with USB1 instead of USB2. Sure, it works, but why do that?

Wow, this is really discouraging. I have a 360 and I wasn't going to run out and get an Elite, but this is just great fodder for the Sony Fanboys. I wasn't jumping on the "bad move by MS" bandwagon when the Elite was announced, but I think this is a bad move.

Speaking of this issue, I picked up a free Nine Inch Nails HD DVD sampler at Best Buy a couple of weeks ago in the Xbox 360 section. If I remember correctly, it mentioned in a sticker on the packaging that you need an HD DVD player or the Xbox 360 HD DVD player for it to work. So I go home and put in in my 360's HD DVD player and it sounded like crap. The audio was like 3 times too loud and was constantly clipping. I looked it up in some forum and it seems that the audio is encoded in TrueHD, which the 360 doesn't currently support. There is no menu to the DVD, so I couldn't even find a way to change the audio track. But apparently MicroSoft claimed in those same forums that they would soon support TrueHD through a patch.

So I have two questions. Does anyone have that disc and know how to change the audio tracks so it's not TrueHD. And why would they put that sampler with the 360 games when by default it plays in TrueHD which the 360 doesnt' support. I mean giving someone a sampler that will sound like crap is not a good way to market a concert dvd.

Why is it an odd move you morons. 360 can't do the more audio channels or that true audio. And why does it need the more bandwith. Its not like its going to need more at any time. You wanted HDMI and now you bitch.

In regards to a 360/Netflix deal (hi-def movie download), FIOS is not needed. Just queue up the movies you want, and they'll download in packets over the next day or two behind the scenes -- no need for uber-high fast FIOS. Once you watch your two, the next two get queued up. This is how Blockbuster and Netflix work anyway, without the wait for mail service.

". I'll give a cookie to anyone out there that could tell the difference in a piece of audio played back between 1.2 and 1.3 HDMI.

Not worth it. HDMI is all about DRM.
I'll also give 2 cookies to anyone that can see the difference between HDMI and component."

I'm not saying i can, and i wouldnt want a cookie anyway coz im diabetic...truehd means that the sound isnt compressed at all so there will be a big difference.

i could care less about HDMI. The Elite will not have the 65nm Processor, which is what I think a lot of us thought the new SKU was going to offer.

I will patiently wait. I think that within a year's time a new SKU will be offered:

65nm Processor, 120Gigs, and HDMI 1.3 or whatever is the current tech at the time.
Also, if HDDVD does not win the format war look for an external Blu-Ray in the near future.

Ah....dreams can come true.

@ djphatjive

You're right on the money with that.. people are always going to bitch about something, even if it's what they've wanted all a long.. Since the launch I've seen people saying they wished the 360 had a bigger HDD, HDMI & be black, Now MS does just that and people bitch about it.. It's just $80 more than the Premium what's the big deal? the whole HDMI 1.2 vs 1.3 is just silly and if you just wait a while longer they'll probably have the smaller CPUs in them as well.

I'm not the biggest audiophile but I've heard TrueHD 7.1 and in all honesty a quality 5.1 system sounds the same. Audio technology reached it's peek long ago.

As for picture quality, we do not have any TVs that will show a difference between HDMI 1.2 and 1.3. The later has more bandwidth and can display a wider spectrum of colors. But there is hardly any video source to test this. I also don't think games are being developed to take advantage of the wider color spectrum. People will still bitch though.

wtf kind of hardware has point releases! its either ready for market or not u dont just upgrade it by .1, i blame the idiots who buy this stuff the day its released because while theres still consumer zombies were always gunna get screwed over

I don't care much about the Elite but MS is just losing alot of my respect w/all this shit.

second rate all the way. sad that people try so hard to prove the ps3 is overpriced and the 360 is better, now the "elite" version isn't as good as the ps3 and its not even on the shelves. this is about as bad as the zune not having a clock on it. sad. way to half ass it again there MS...

Well, I privily won't be getting the Elite, since my current 360 is fine and I use VGA on a 22inch wide-screen LCD monitor so HDMI would benefit me very little or if at all. All I would really gain is a black Xbox 360, not worth buying the 360 over again and selling my old one for. Its not meant to replace old 360s anyway, its meant to be a option for a first time buyer.

I WILL be getting a bigger HDD anyway, even if it costs $179. I been wanting more storage on my 360 for quite awhile. Yea, I can always delete some things but then when I want to use them again, I have to wait forever for it to redownload, and then sometimes delete other things, it becomes a headake, especally when trying to download a HD TV show or movie. I still think the HDD should be abit cheaper though, atmost $150 (since 120GB 2.5inch SATA HDDs retail (not wholesale, which is what you get online, everything in the 360 is retail-priced) for about $130, only would be $20 more).

At least I am glad that they said they are making updates to the VGA support in the next update, I hope they also mean more resolutions. I really want it to support my monitors native resolution over VGA (which is 1680x1050), and allot of other 360 owners with similar setups have been demanding this as well. Plus, for the HDMI's auto-resolution detection, its going to have to support more resolutions anyway.

Anyway, I don't see why everyone makes a big deal over the elite. Its just another option, in fact they even said the Premium is still more than likely going to be the "mainstream option" of the 360. Its just for those buying a new 360 that want all the bells and whistles, pretty much. Ironic how people keep on demanding HDMI and a bigger HDD and once they deliver it, everyone says they don't need it or its useless, almost hypocritical.

if your tv does not support HDMI 1.3, having HDMI 1.3 will not help you. My tv supports 1.2 (and its a 720p set anyway).

I don't know why everyone humps a doorknob everytime HDMI is uttered. There's little that is superior about the technology, other than its ability to control what we watch through DRM. Why are we all running to the door to adopt a technology that restricts content and adds $50-100/cable, plus the inevitable HDMI switchbox for more inputs?

The only thing that interests me about the 360 Elite is the larger HDD, which honestly, I'm not sure I have any use for at this stage.

Their not "half assing" anything, their only doing what they can do based on the 360's hardware design. The PS3 doesn't support 1.3 features in game either, only during BluRay play. Plus, they would have to use new sound hardware, thus potentially causing problems with certain games. So using 1.2 is understandable.

Plus, did everyone really expect them to give a bigger HDD on the console for free? That's not how corporations work, I am sure if Sony did the same thing, their 120GB HDD PS3 would be like $750 or something.

Also, yes, it does come close to the 20GB PS3 but think about what more you get. You get allot more games, system with better graphics hardware (and better managed memory), ALLOT better online service with allot more available on it, plus a HDD twice the size of the $600 PS3. The only advantages the PS3 has is BluRay (which doesn't benefit gaming at all, especially with it having 2X slower read speeds than the 360's DVD drive and horrible seek times to add to that), and the $600 unit has built-in wireless (which I would only use wireless if you HAVE to, I find wireless has worse, if not far worse at times, ping times for gaming).

Personally though, I do think they should drop the prices soon on all three models of the Xbox 360. The original Xbox dropped its price a little after one year, why shouldn't the 360 follow suit? I feel gaming is starting to reflect how our economy is going downhill, since it, like everything else, has risen in price but our hourly pay at our jobs has NOT...

I have seen and heard it all. 1.3 does make a difference in color over 1.2, just as 1080p makes a sharpness difference over 1080i (assuming a 1080p TV WITH 1.3 HDMI inputs - 1080p TV is NOT enough). Similarly, with my 5.1 speakers, the difference between Dolby 5.1 / DTS and Uncompressed (available through PS3), all show differences. The uncompressed is louder without hiss or static. It is pretty clear to see and hear, but you have to be one who notices detail in the first place, which is the reason Blu and HD DVDs are not taking off. The ignorant masses were fine with VHS picture quality when you think about it. It was only the lack of rewinding tapes and poor freeze frames that pushed DVD into the force it is today. HD discs are going to take time, because with TVs that upscale and DVD players that upscale, most won't notice a difference. V is a good movie for the color/sharpness test.

HDMI 1.2 is fine. 1.3 isnt needed.Its no big deal.Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD audio arent being used in games anyway.

I'm still not getting it, but not because of the HDMI issue. No HD-DVD drive, no integrated wireless = no wantie.

If MS could include both of those, it would sell out at $600. Existing users would upgrade.

not half assing it huh? well to me, this says "even though there is better technology available, we didn't think you would need it". if this is supposed to be a high end product, it should have high end features out of the box. as far as the "more games" arguement, lets be honest here, most games on ANY system suck, especially in the first year. i think the ps3 isn't even 6 months old and a plus fore the 360 is more games? come on man. and live IS sick, but this isn't about live. this is about not going balls out on the bentley of xboxes. i'm just saying, go hard or go home. you don't have to buy it (as i've been hearing here frequently) but come on. i just feel this is typical american produced over hyped bullshit. again, sad that the greatest country in the world is once again known for putting out second rate technology...

Oh look Joystiq is pimping the p$3 yet again. Why doesn't that surprise me at all? Anyways does this really matter to the average consumer? Will I really notice a difference on an HDTV if I have 1.2 instead of 1.3?

@ 31

See MS can't really win here, because had they included all those features (i.e. WiFi, 1.3 HDMI, 120gb HDD, HD-DVD drive, etc) People would bitch about the price of it and bitch even more on how they're "copying" $ony and so-on. Think about it, people are bitching this bad over an $80 price increase on shit they asked for (HDMI, Larger HDD, Black console), Imagine how much people would bitch at a $200-$300 increase. Like I said, MS can't catch a break.

The HDMI 1.3 will be on the Xbox 360 Super Elite version. This is starting to get as bad as upgrading the graphics card in your PC.

The 360 will lose the console wars unless microsoft does something drastic to stay ahead. First of all they need to deal strongly with the issues of overheating. I could give a rats ass how much they charge for a hard drive or HDMI. What I am concerned with, is how many more times will I have to ship this peice of shit back to them to get fixed. But I don't think they will address this problem, it will take a class action law suit to force them to. And why would anyone upgrade to the elite knowing it has the same chips as the defective 360's. The only way I would ever upgrade is if it had the better chips. Also, the fact that they are even making a better chip is admitting that they put out a defective one.

Second, they need a price drop. The release of the elite and the new HD amounts to a price increase. Because those who have bought premium 20gb systems, will end up having paid $580 for the same system without HDMI.

Also, it won't be long before the PS3 has a large catalog of games too, so microsoft better tighten up.

@Tghost...
I still think $100+ is wwaaaaaayy overpriced for a 20 gig hard drive... I've seen most 320gig disks selling at or around $110 CDN max. Methinks i'll just get a HD Enclosure and use it via USB.

I completely agree with the post above that says audio has reached its peak. I too have an HD DVD player for the 360, and True HD works fine without a hitch.

I just think that at the moment, in terms of a developement level nothing seems to be the same. We're at a point where video games are able to play at high def levels, yet the majority of television and movies are no where near the same level.

"Yeah, none of the current media can even come close to the Amount of Gigs/sec 1.3 has over 1.2. 1.2 will be fine for at least 5 years. And by then the xbox 1080 will be out, or whatever trendy ending they put on it."

I totally agree with that, but by then HDMI will be as old/commonplace as Component or Coax... we'll be using S.U.H.D.F.O. (Super Ultimate High Definition via Fiber Optic) connections. Oh, and version 2.0 at that.

Its cool that all these things are being created, but I can't help but feel that in five years we'll be debating over the same issue yet again.

Perhaps it's an 'We gave you what you want but we must do this if you want it' deal.
As for me, i'm getting the stand-alone 120GB HDD

Is the optical output still supported and will there be an hdmi cable sold sepretly for 360???
ps, I dont have any cookies to give...sorrrry

Yeah, that blows. I just bought a new Samsung with HDMI v1.3 and had planned on getting a PS3 and Xbox with HDMI. I will be waiting until Xbox gets with the program. I don't care what Microsoft's reasons were for not using the newest spec. That's just another reason not to buy their stuff. I am on my 4th or 5th Xbox and have had nothing but trouble with it. I was going to give the 360 a chance once I got my new TV and I heard the new HDMI one was coming out. Now I just have another excuse to wait. Wikipedia has a great article on the differences between all the HDMI versions. I have been researching that for a few months now. People that think 1.2 is going to be around for 5 more years are full of crap. 1.3 is the new spec and it makes no sense to continue making equipment with an older spec. Samsung has three TVs coming out this month with HDMI v1.3 and all the other companies will follow. PS3 will get a push in sales from this. There are audio receivers by Sherwood Newcastle, Denon, and Marantz that are all scheduled to come out with v1.3 in the next few months. The guy that mentioned the NIN DVD being coded for v1.3 is correct. You are going to see more and more errors with these types of items if MS does not get on the 1.3 bandwagon. I originally dismissed all the "Elite not 1.3 rumors" because I thought that would be insane on MS's part, but I guess they really did screw over all their potential customers. For people interested in the HDMI, don't settle for an old spec. Wait for 1.3. Getting 1.2 is like purchasing a year or two old car for the same price as a brand new one. Anyone who knows anything about "today's" technology is not going to be purchasing a "new 360 Elite" based on an old spec. MS really screwed the pooch on this one. So disappointing.

Can't you see, MS marketing has a 6 month life now. They don't give a damm about latest tech hardware or giving you something future proof. It's about leading the consumer, give them a bigger HD and HDMI "SHHHH-dont tell them its 2 year old technology". It's like BMW or Ford building a car with a million mile warranty. You do this and they have no reason to come back for years to come.Just look at the XBOX games, they still work on new models- WHY ? because you are being lead with a carrot. Most people believe- if my old games work in it along with newer games- it must be better,,,and it is to some degree BUT-what just happened- you bought the new XBOX 360. THATS WHAT THEY WANT- stay tuned- 6 months from now you will see the rumor mill churning again...new super smaller 720 xbox with green ray drive and..STANDARD HDMI .....(1.3)