MS defends the $179 120GB HDD

I think the point that microsoft is missing is that you can't use this harddrive other than with the 360.
With a high end external harddrive, atleast you can use it with various PC's, home systems (that can use external HD's) and gasp, a PS3...

Step 1: have over-priced proprietary larger Hard-drive.
Step 2: ????
Step 3: Mad Profit$$$$!!!

Yeah, sure. Maybe next up he can tell us why their memory cards are fairly priced. Cut it out Greenberg!

I do agree that the pricing follows the other 360 components. But I still think it's pricey for a hard drive that's pretty restrictive when it comes to backing up data.

And uh, having a MS employee defending a MS product doesn't do much for credibility's sake, y'know?

pffffft, I say.

"Microsoft requires stringent specifications for drive performance."

Right...

Hard Drive Manufacturer: "Here you go, MS, this hard drive will render the list of videos in your media blade Uber-fast, and can generate a list of XBLA games at turbo speed!"

MS: "No, Hard Drive Manufacturer, we'd really prefer a 15-20 second delay before the video list appears on the screen. Same goes for the downloaded games on the XBLA screen."

Hard Drive Manufacturer: "Oh, sure, we can do that, but it'll double the cost of the drive."

MS: "That's cool, we'll pass the cost on to our customers."

The lack of demand will force them to lower the prices. Once MS sees that we're not going to buy it at such a ridiculous price they will be forced to lower it if they want the video Marketplace to be successful. You can't expect consumers to be restricted to 14 GB of space for demos, TV shows, movies, etc.

Ha!!! Microsoft just f**ked every 360 owner who wanted a bigger hard drive. Oh wait, that includes me. /wrists

Wal-Mart clearance, baby! Cheap 20G drives will be followed by cheap 120G drives.

again are you some of you retarded do you not know how the marketplace works. You can download delete then download again for free (except movies) on any item you pay for. So you do not need a larger hard drive

when you look at it from the standpoint of "what can I buy a 120gb 2.5" drive and a USB enclosure for", then yes, it's a bit over priced. If you look at it as a stand alone proprietary product, it's not terribly over priced.

Quantum makes removable disk backup systems that use 120gb cartridges that are nothing more than 120gb 2.5" drives inside a proprietary plastic case and they charge $199 per cartridge. So Microsoft isn't doing anything anyone else in the industry does. They are charging you extra for the packaging and the ability to use it within their proprietary system.

If it was required, I could see it being a big deal, but the drive isn't required to do anything on the 360, so if you don't want it, don't buy it. Just don't blow it out of proportion.

I think that this is the last post I'm gonna make on this topic and basically it all boils down to this:

It doesn't matter what MS thinks.

It (and sadly) really doesn't even matter how it really...really is. (As in this is the best deal they can give us.)

What does matter is what We the consumer think. Not in the short run I know, but in the long run.

Sorry MS, but that is what really matters.

Sorry to sound to dramatic but I think it's time for a little reality check at MS. I think I speak for a lot of us when I say, "We'll only go w/you so far."

The End.

Also need to take into account the drive speed. I don't know if it's 5400 or 7200, but 7200 RPM drives are a bit more expensive.

MS's pricing is in line with high level high performance 120gb 2.5mm drives.

Maybe you guys should dig around to see exactly what type of drive it is.

I just bought a tiny USB powered external HDD for $109, so there are definitely cheaper ones out there.

And I don't see a real need to get a larger one yet. Unless you store a lot of the TV shows on the drive or cue up a bunch of HD content to view later, in which case I imagine it might be useful.

Anyway, someone will find a way to map any old notebook drive soon enough and we'll be able to pick them up for cheap.

Forgot to mention, if I recall correctly, MS uses SATA for the data connection. MUCH faster than USB. ;)

Since the 20gig at $100 is absurbly overpriced too, that's not much of a defense...

What people are failing to realize is that retailers will get desperate, and since the HD isn't the main component you'll be able to find them for cheaper on the internet on the likes of Amazon. I'm betting a few months after release Amazon has this drive for at least 150, which I think is a bit more realistic a price. I would have really love a 120GB for 120Bucks deal though.. but oh well.

"As [Greenberg] puts it, the $299 core becomes the $399 premium by adding a $99 hard drive."

No, it doesn't, because the core system doesn't come with a wireless controller or any of the other stuff the premium system does, or did (remote?).

"By adding a $179 hard drive to the core, you get the $479 price of the Xbox 360 Elite."

Yes, and that's all you get -- the price. No HDMI, no black finish, etc.

Um, the MS hard drive is also SELF-POWERED, which jacks up the price. I suggest you check out 120GB, SELF-POWERED, HIGH-SPEED, NON-PARTITIONED external hard drives.

I agree with Dave. Their calculations for that are wrong. Just factoring in the HDD price is why most people aren't buying the core system in the first place. "If I buy that I need to spend $100 to get the HDD anyway, so I'm better off buying the premium and getting the extras that are included."

So If I don't have a system then $80 more for an additional 100 GB, black finish and HDMI... let me think about that. If I have a premium system then $170 for a larger replacement to my HDD? No way!

The 120GB HDD make it easier to rent movies and shows over the marketplace. If you want to encourage people to do that, then you should be selling these things for $100 and dropping the price of the 20GB.

I still think they should be basically giving these away like cellular providers give away phones. All we can use them for is storing more stuff that we buy from Microsoft anyway, right? Pack them with a year of Gold... anything to offset that cost and steer customers to Marketplace.

I'm really suprised the MS guy even said anything. It's kind of salt in the wound. Yeah it's spendy...will I buy it? Of course. This is kind of similar to how Apple works...new iPod's, new products come out, etc...they are all overpriced. But there is a fine line between too much on the consumer and profitability for MS. Heck they have to make some money on this...you all understand that's how a business works right? This is not a common thing that people are going to upgrade to...especially if you don't really need it right now. It's a transitional product. If you need it you buy, if you don't need it shut up and quit whining.

Wow, can we bitch anymore please? If you don't want it, don't buy it.

Listen to the recent podcast, the hard drives require high performance and speeds so that it can cache games like Crackdown so there aren't loading screens every time you change isles. I'm sorry, but I'll pay a little more to guarantee my games all run smoothly.

Sure you can find USB drives out there, but wait, oh yeah, the 360 uses SATA connections for faster speeds. So, that's out. Also, the RPM of all the drives that a are cheaper are slower and don't perform nearly as well as the 360 hard drive. Face it, the 360 hard drive is created specifically for the 360 and you won't be able to replicate it with some POS $75 dollar external hard drive.

Minus the stuff about self powered external crap it makes sense that the Hard Drive would be $179.

Core + Hard Drive = Elite (Price)

Chew on this guys...Apple Ipods

"
Additionally, Greenberg notes that the pricing structure is consistent with the rest of the Xbox line. As he puts it, the $299 core becomes the $399 premium by adding a $99 hard drive. By adding a $179 hard drive to the core, you get the $479 price of the Xbox 360 Elite.
"

That line of logic is complete BS, because the core is lacking a number of add ons that comes standard on the elite other than the 120gig HD, namely component a/v cables, wireless controller, headset, HDMI output, etc.

A far more accurate argument would be to add the cost of the 120gig HD to the premium version, because that has all the other goodies that come with the elite. Of course, doing so adds up to $100 more than the cost of the elite ($578 v. $479), which is why nearly everyone is upset about the pricing.

Thanks Microshaft, for screwing all of your loyal early adopters of your new console, it really teaches your customers something about your plan, and don't expect as many sales in the first few years next time around, and if your reading this, fire that stooge "Major Nelson", and for anyone reading this and wondering why, listen to his pod cast about the Elite. thanks for F***ing over, whats the stat now? 10 mill customers?

I have been accused of working for Microsoft because I am such a big fan of the Xbox 360.

However, there are a few things I would like to say:

1. The $179 pricepoint of the 120GB Hard Drive is WAY overpriced!

2. The new Xbox 360 Elite uses HDMI 1.2 rather than HDMI 1.3. I have never once seen an A/V Receiver that Accepts an HDMI 1.3 signal, not even the $5,000 THX Ultra 2 certified Receivers from Denon and Onkyo. So, I don't think the HDMI 1.2 factor is a big deal.

3. Microsoft needs to make it so the Xbox 360 Core Unit includes the same Video cable the Premium unit does. Just because people are not able to connect to the Internet does not mean they do not have a Component video Standard-Definition TV. I think if Microsoft were to include the same Composite/Component combo cable the Premium system comes packed with, the Core sales would increase. Buying a Core Xbox 360, plus a Memory Card, plus a Component cable is a really bad value!

4. Microsoft needs to lower the 20GB hard drive AND the 120GB hard drive.

5. Bottom Line: This Elite unit is NOT going to sell well. This may actually hurt the overall sales of the Xbox 360. People in the past had the pride of saying, "I'm buying the best version of the Xbox 360." Now, people who are not willing to spend the extra cash on the Elite version will end up saying, "Should I buy the 'Mid-Range' 'Premium' Xbox 360 or should I spend $80 for the Elite Xbox 360, or should I just spend the extra cash on the Playstation 3 and get a Blu-ray player with it."

See the potential problems. I think the solution is Microsoft needs to make it so the Xbox 360 Elite is sold only over the Internet or in Catalog sales.

So what he is saying is that its just the price for the harddrive that determines the price figures. So the HDMI doesn't cost anything? or hdmi cable, or the other stuff the elite comes with? Interesting, so why not put it on the other if it cost nothing. I think someone didn't think before he talked. Brillent move.

Maiq is right. Certain companies have different ways of making the difference in on their products. Microsofts is accessories, Sony has the royalities of the their games. Apple likes to do the acessories thing as well. Just face it, it's how it is. I Don't plan on getting the new hard drive. 20 GBs is fine with me. Down the road maybe 2 to 3 years, I'll buy the elite, (price comes down maybe?) other then that I don't care.

It took me a while to find any tech info on the HDD other than the fact that it is a Serial ATA drive. It wasn't until I found an article at AnandTech in which they take apart a 360.

Even then there wasn't much info to go on. The 20 gig drive is a 2.5" SATA hard drive that runs at 5400 rpm. Looking around for similar drives I was unable to find a 2.5" drive from samsung, available in Canada. There were a few to be found on Ebay, but most jump up to 160 from 100 gigs. The 100 gig drives seemed to be around $120+, whilst the 160 gigers tended to be about $180.

While I agree that 179.99 for a 120 gig drive seems outrageous, I can see why. Most decent HD Enclosures I've found tend to be around the 40 dollar mark... So $140 for a laptop-sized hard drive seems like an alright price.

I don't see what all the fuss is all about... Disk storage is dead these days. Solid state medium will sooner or later take its place, granted not anytime soon. But mark my words that 5 years down the road we'll all be complaining about paying that price for a 1200 gig hard drive :P

As for people getting angry with Microsoft, deal with it. Its nothing new, the corporate screwing of consumer minds. Heck just look at the PS3... Jack Tretton's interview in EGM was hilarious to read. I'm glad the people in charge of the 360 are a heck of a lot more down to Earth than this guy is. The proof of that it the "360 loves you" campaign overseas at the European launch of the PS3.

With the added rumors of full movie downloads, I'm actually a little more upset that the drive isn't bigger. Movies take up a big chunk of space, so I can't imagine being able to get very many on to one drive.

But as Maiq the Liar put it, shut up and quit whining.

Just to help my fellow fanboys out, if anyone is trying to setup wireless support on their Xbox 360 without forking over $100 for the MS Ethernet bridge, SMC makes an even better product (Bridge/Switch/Access point all in one) for 1/3 of the price. Here are the links:

http://www.cnet.com.au/wireless/routers/0,239028894,239116690,00.htm

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833176105

While I don't like the price and prolly wouldnt buy one, MS is not completely wrong.

120gb Laptop drives (they ARE using laptop hard drives, not typical 3.5" IDE drives) run on the average of $130 retail. These are setup for the 360 with special stuff and connectors and do-dads in there, so well... the price isn't too far off from what it should be.

I'll buy it. I could care less what it costs. I might even buy two, since I have a 360 in my livingroom and one in my bedroom. And I will need the space eventually, since I download every single XBLA game that comes out :P

I found a 2.5" 120GB drive in an enclosure, powered by USB, with no effort at all. It was actually the first one I looked at.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-Details.asp?EdpNo=2244253&sku=S130-5008

Choice
Mr. Moore...stop looking at your "guns" for a moment and read this....
I can choose what bluetooth headset I want to use.
I can choose what kind of wired USB or wireless bluetooth keyboard and mouse I want to use.
I can choose to put in any SATA 2.5" hard disc that I want to use.
I can choose to what USB camera I want to use.
I can choose to put in another OS if I want to.
I can choose to watch HD "native resolution" not compressed HD.
I can choose to watch these movies on a completely digital HDMI cable not a component cable which goes from digital to analog to digital. I can have this HDMI interface without having to shell out another $480
I can choose to leave my system on 24/7 and NOT worry about it overheating and/or breaking.
I can choose to put MP3's, digital foto's, MP4's, AVC, AAC, etc. on my hard disc.
I can charge my controller without having to pay an extra $20 for a cable. (a little of subject but I wanted to throw it in)
I can choose to use WiFi without paying an extra $100.
I can choose to browse the internet on Sony's browser or on Linux using a different browser for example Opera's browser.
By having these choices I can find the lowest price or the best value or the best quality on my won and I am not stuck with using one choice of headset, hard drive, camera, etc.

So, I ask you....
Who has more choice?

Oh well, if it's $179 then it'll be £179, which works out to be roughly $320.

That's how it usually turns out here in the UK v_v

so why are people crying about it being $179 it's a $100 for 20gb i think thats a good price but i guess people are always goon bitch and moan about stuff

I just bought a 500GB external hard drive for $220. $179 for a 120GB hard drive? No thank you.

to #25: SHIT YEAH MAN THATS THE MOST SENCE I'VE HEARD IN A LONG LONG TIME