cool concept, i wonder how effective it would be though...

Jack Thompson hosted via phone day on of the Va tradegy on fox news. To email foxnews your thoughts.. yourcomments@foxnews.com

Jack Thompson diaf

Guys -

Keep in mind as you read this that it was created as a positive way to counter Jack Thompson. Instead of cursing the darkness, you can talk to someone you love who doesn't understand games. It's our own little counter-information campaign, and we'd love any feedback you can provide.

I commend your efforts Joystiq

Well done :)

While the idea is admirable I just don't think it will ever work until people won't to actually hear and accept the truth in situations like this.

Media violence is an easy scape goat because it lends itself to citizens, and politicians in our society that really don't want to change anything. It isn't that people don't understand video games. It is that they don't want to understand them because then they don't have to share in any of them blame for societies problems.

like my post on kotaku ... we really pay to much attention to this crap. this is america gots damnit .. our pron, violence and toilet bowl humor is going nowhere regardless of what these idiots say.

lets wait for the investigation to say whats what with this individual then go from there rather than give these guys the time of day for irrational blanket diagnosis' (or is it diagnosees? hrm, all of those bad japanese translations have truncated my engrish.)

freedom costs a buck o five! besides where in starcraft does it tell you to lose it and go on a killing spree ... as usual parenting is at the core of this and I dare to say pride as well .. my wifes brother (also asian/korean) has had some very serious issues and rather than face the issue publicly the parents have (because of pride) kept the issue under the rug.

I say censor pride.

Don't get me wrong - I'm a gamer and have been one my whole life.

However, I heard a somewhat compelling argument yesterday. Just because MOST people aren't adversely affected by video games doesn't mean NO ONE is. Who's to say Cho wasn't?

All the violence in the media has almost surely desensitized everyone one of us, even though the vast majority of us still know right from wrong thanks to the positives influences in our life.

Still, it only takes one person to massacre 32 others.

In all fairness to Dr Phil, his quote is taken mildly out of context. What Dr. Phil's point was last night is that our society has a tendency to over-glamorize violence, and that when you put that tendency in our society in front of somebody who has sociopathic tendencies, they are going to snap in that fashion. He was using video games as just one example of that.

Seriously, if video games were the root of all evil, then we should be seeing a steady increase in crime in the generations, since most of the people who grew up with video games are now in their 20s to 30s.
Video games themselves don't teach the basic mechanics of violence. I play Soul Calibur 2, but I have no idea how to use a sword. I play Halo 2, but I also have no idea how to clean a gun, or how to reload most weapons besides a pistol. I play Burnout Revenge, but I've never driven past 80 mph.

If games are so good at making people become violent, how come there isn't a push to have them make us pacifistic? Oh right, because it makes us violent in the same way that Rock Music did in the 50s and Metal did in the 80s... it doesn't, it just gets blamed because it happens to be part of the violent person's lifestyle, and the "older" generation doesn't understand it at all.

I do think it's a good place to start, and I also commend Joystiq for this - talking to someone from the demographic that is under attack, realizing they're not just "strange people out there" and actually family members and friends, it's easier to see that this, like many other shootings, are the work of psychopaths who usually don't have a "why" - not video games, not books, it was because they were mentally messed up. But this is only a start I think, and while it's a good start, we should continue to do more to fight the stereotype that gamers are violent, socially inept people who look to get back at society for their problems.

-m.

Brandon: he might have been, but why censor media/art because of one deranged person? 400 years ago, a compelling performance of Hamlet may have inspired a crazy person to poison people or run a sword through them. If psychotic individuals cannot discern fantasy from reality, the problem is far larger than "video games made me do it."

"However, I heard a somewhat compelling argument yesterday. Just because MOST people aren't adversely affected by video games doesn't mean NO ONE is. Who's to say Cho wasn't?"

Agreed. You're not likely to get much of a fair shake here from other commenters (due to the nature of the site, obviously), but I don't like how some people are being so overdefensive that it actually sort of hurts their point.

The "IDIOT Thompson" article on Kotaku reeks of kneejerk reaction...the follow-up article where Thompson's points were commented on should have been the first (and probably only) thing they said about it. I was glad to see Joystiq not give it as much attention.

ignoring the issue is the worst thing we can do. the economy of making games is a tough one as it is. with a bit of political pressure and a bunch of moms saying "no you cant get any new games because theyre too violent" gaming could be reduced back to a tiny corner of culture, like it once was.

you may say you dont care, but all the money and creative minds and competition has bred the many incredible experiences that has drawn us into this world so powerfully.

its best we devise a means of defending our hobby as quickly as possible, because you know the storm will come. let us hope that this small petition is a step in the direction we need to take in order to reverse the negative campaigning against gaming, and show people that it's simply another form of art and entertainment.

@ Brandon

But video games are not the underlying cause. This kind of violence has been going on WAY before video games. What about the guy who climbed the clock tower and started shooting people. I don't know the exact year that happened, but I know it was before video games and even before the kind of violence we have in movies today. No matter what medium (violent or otherwise) is popular, we will ALWAYS have some jackass that's "just not right".

People have been violent way before there were video games, TV, Guns & Knifes. Shit look at the Aztecs. They were crazy fucks, but they must of had GTA. Violence is in our genes. There will alway be murderous people.

THIS JUST IN! LEE HARVEY OSWALD OWNED A PDP! JOHN WILKES BOOTHE ENJOYED PLAYING WITH AN ABACUS!

I am kinda wondering if there is going to be a "sequel" to Super Columbine Massacre RPG.

I think it would probably be unwise though I could see a "tribute" sequel from some "fan" making one.

I really like this idea. I think it's a smart, level headed response. It would be great if we could get a bunch of gamers to fill these out and email this to Jack Thompson, Fox News, and Dr. Phil.

Someone has previously provided an email address for fox news. I can't find a way to contact Dr. Phil without becoming a member of his site, so if someone can figure that out and post it, that would be awesome. Here is Jack Thompsons' email address: jackpeace@comcast.net.

I think it's time gamers spoke out against these accusations. If we can get this info to other gaming and tech blogs I think we could send a lot of emails.

I think this sort of thing is a good idea, but I also think that it is unfair. Movies and music have been around a long time. So has Football and Hockey. These are all violent forms of entertainment, and I don't see any of those industries starting up papers admitting anything. At the end of the day, how we enjoy ourselves are our business, as long as no one gets hurt by it. And there is no proof that video games had anything to do with the shooting, just like the fact that he being South Korean has nothing to do with it, just like him being a student has nothing to do with it. People snap. Bad things happen. This is the world. Once we start bowing to people, opening our hands to them, letting them know we are safe or not going to hurt people, then they'll just keep pushing. Another question: has anyone been pointing fingers at the gun industry? Yeah. I did't thing so...

A. Dr. Phil is an asshat who offers 10 minute solutions for problems it would take people YEARS to cure.

"I'm a nymphomaniac because I was raped by my father and later physically abused by my mother when she found out he was raping me because she thought I was trying to steal her man."
"Dr. Phil says.. stop being a nymphomaniac."

"I went to jail due to drug abuse and while I attempt to make positive changes to my life, I keep going back. There is no local rehab program and I've managed to isolate myself from everyone but my job."
"Dr. Phil says.. stop being a drug addict."

B. While I support this effort, it indicates an admittance that Cho WAS a gamer of violent means. To my knowledge, no such information has been recovered. In fact, due to the speculation Jack Thompson loves to spew, police investigators are now looking into the possibility of Jack Thompson having prior knowledge this event was going to happen.

Here is what we currently know about Cho...

1. He was very quiet, avoided eye contact, rarely spoke, would never respond to people who tried to talk to him, and wore sunglasses to avoid eye contact.

2. He wrote horrendously violent fictions and plays. Often disturbing fellow classmates. Quote one student, "he would have uses for weapons you wouldn't even think of." Because of this unspoken "meanness" (quote from one of his teachers) and a new habit of snapping photos of students with his cell phone, student attendance was going down and he was eventually thrown out of class.

And that's it. He wrote horrendously violent fiction and honestly, efforts like this don't fight the ignorance in regards to violence in video games but merely support it. After all, reaction acknowledges an action. We don't know if that action exists.

nice. Can someone format this into a really good looking pdf and host it?

It might be worth mentioning to Phil & Thomson that these kind of school shootings are virtually non-existent in the rest of the world.

A world, that is, with kids playing all the same 'violent' and 'depraved' games as the youths of America.

As Jarvis Slacks mentioned: It's a bad world and people snap.

The fact that any twenty three year old dude can walk in from the street and buy a Glock may have more to do with it than anything else.

Apparently Jack Thompson has changed his email address. So if anyone can find his new one, please post it.

I do agree that JT and Dr. Phil have no true basis for their claims, however, I am not opposed to them officially (and scientifically) exploring if playing violent video games does in fact result in going on a killing spree.

Why? First because random citizens going on killings sprees is a seriuos enough issue that we should not neglect any hypothosis! Second, so if we prove there is no connection we can end this debate once and for all and shut the JT's and Dr. Phils up permanently. First it was Heavy Metal Music, now it's video games.

The westerern way seems to be first point fingers then punish the accused. We should learn to deal with the problem and not so much focus on pointing fingers like 5 year olds.

"It might be worth mentioning to Phil & Thomson that these kind of school shootings are virtually non-existent in the rest of the world.

A world, that is, with kids playing all the same 'violent' and 'depraved' games as the youths of America."

Well, Germany had one... as did Japan. Japan is the really weird one. Teenagers tend to off themselves rather than others in THAT culture.

"The fact that any twenty three year old dude can walk in from the street and buy a Glock may have more to do with it than anything else."

Okay, let me say this. I don't like guns. I saw far too many in my life and far too much violence. So I'm not a progun guy by any means. HOWEVER! Blaming guns is a tad irresponsible. This is an American problem tried and true. Canada has nearly the same people to gun ratio as the US and where are all their gun deaths? Blaming the guns is irresponsible and just strapping blinders to the cause as large, if not larger, as blaming video games.

The problem isn't guns or video games. Poeple get picked on in school. Some get extreme amounts of it and if you mix in a bad childhood or drugs the results can be harsh. Most overcome their rage, but some fall into it. Life can be punishing. Sometimes death looks alot better than living.

Cnn had a study on serial killers and it shows that 99% of people who have the tendacies to become one only 1% follow through.

The problem never was, and never will be video games, or music, or movies, or TV.

The problem is society and parenting.

I know the difference between right and wrong. My parents taught me that. when I play halo, do I want to go do the same thing? You bet, but I go and do it with a paintball gun and some friends. Harmless fun. Parenting is the basis for someone to turn out normal. Why is is that nobody blames the parents?

Did Lee Harvey Oswald play video games? Dahmer? Hitler?

The problem never was, and never will be video games, or music, or movies, or TV.

The problem is society and parenting.

I know the difference between right and wrong. My parents taught me that. when I play halo, do I want to go do the same thing? You bet, but I go and do it with a paintball gun and some friends. Harmless fun. Parenting is the basis for someone to turn out normal. Why is is that nobody blames the parents?

Did Lee Harvey Oswald play video games? Dahmer? Hitler?

@ Mike

I agree with what you're saying, but I don't think the point of this post was to say that there are NO correlations between video games and violent behavior.

What we're fighting against is people like Jack Thompson who will immediately blame video games for tragedies like this. The solution is not to ban violent video games, it's to ID people who buy them and inform parents of the ESRB ratings.I think if parents were more careful and more involved in their children's lives, then we wouldn't have as many problems.

It's funny to watch all the loonies hop out and say there is NO connection between violent games and violence. Just like all the loonies who come out say we need to immediately ban all guns. Stop and listen to the arguments. twenty years ago, UFC was a cable only product. It was considered so violent that there were attempts at legislation to not allow those events in the US. Now its on Primetime. Does playing these games cause people to become mass murders? Absolutely not but to summarily dismiss the continued watching and participating in the killing of another and say that it has no effect is ludicrous. A society doesn't move from where a married couple on TV have to sleep in separate beds and you can't mention the word pregnant to videos where women are called bitches and ho's overnight. As a new parent, I will play games with my son but I will NOT be playing games like BF or Halo until he's much older and he has a much better understanding of the world and the consequences. Many of these comments are childish and flippant, particularly in light of what just happened at VA Tech. John Wilkes Booth may not have played with an Abacus but he certainly saw the horrors of the civil war. Whacked out killers like this just don't come out of nowhere. And yes we have freedom but it comes at a cost. As a society we should ask what is the price we are willing to pay for our freedom?

This f-ing kid had no friends. He didn't talk to anyone. He had no healthy emotional relationships with others. He was a friken paranoid psycho. People like this have no care for others or attachment to others or healthy emotions and feelings whatsoever. Shooting others and himself seemed like no big deal to him. He was getting back at them for some fantasized injuries they had caused him.

And some idiot has the audacity to suggest video games without even knowing if he played them. I watched an interview with Cho's roomates and they said all he did was IM people, work on his bike, clean, and do homework. They never mentioned any kind of gaming.

Citizens in our society like to blame things they don't understand or care for. Idiots like Jack and Phil profit off of that. Violent crime and murder rates are down 40% since DOOM came out. These jokers are trying to argue it would have been 42% had it not been for games.

Their arguments are baseless finger pointing and witch hunting. It is just as valid of an argument to say our violent crime is down because video games are teaching people the consequences of shooting something (it dies) and gives us a harmless media to act out our murderous instincts on.

The kid was a friken psycho that didn't regularly play video games. He was a depressed, paranoid, psychotic, woman stalking, sociopathic freak that liked to IM people so his crazy-ass could hide behind the computer.

@Mike,

I've stopped and listened to the arguements. The only problem is all of the arguements directly relate to Action B was cause by Item A. Societal woes are never that myoptic and it's a foolish man who believes fixing a culture is as simple as fixing a computer.

America, like it or not, is the most violent culture on the planet. We say it isn't and talk about all the peace we bring while making condescending comments about "sand monkeys" in the latest Ann Coulter hate propaganda, but we are. Look at the gun deaths in our culture versus everyone elses. To put it in the simple terms of David Bowie and Trent Reznor, "I'm Afraid Of Americans." 30,000 gun deaths last year. BUT, unlike the media, I'm willing to look at all the facts. One of the most very basic facts is that violent crime and gun deaths are on a very steady decline. In fact, the age group that has seen the largest drop has been the very same age group that has been raised on video games.

I'm not saying there isn't a real to virtual and real world violence because study after study has been denouncing that myth. But each of these studies has stated that the neglected or abused children are much more susceptable compared to children in strong family settings. But as long as we have had child psychology, this has remained a constant. These children naturally attach themselves to violent media and it just so happens video games ARE a violent media. That's the issue at it's core.

We could discuss Cho even more in this regard. As a resident alien (he had a greencard), he was raised in Washington DC and worked with his family at a dry cleaners. He hated rich people from that setting. Then he goes to a university? There is no bigger "I'm rich, bitch" environment than the social pissing contests on a major university. And THAT'S what set him off. He lived out hideously violent fantasies through his fiction before finally making it real life.

Hello Kyle,
I see you used an illustration I did for Salon magazine back in 1999 to illustrate your post. The illustration was commissioned by Salon for one-time use for a fee of $500. While I appreciate that you enjoy my work, I was not asked for permission to use the illustration, nor did I receive credit or payment. Please contact me asap to discuss payment. I'm sure it would be less expensive than having my lawyer write a cease and desist letter.
Thank you.
Octavio Diaz

Mike,

I am not quite sure what point you are attempting to make. Sure, we are a product of our environment. And I'll give you that if you just let violent games and TV raise your kids it isn't healthy. But your accusation of everyone being flipant seems a bit ironic after reading your ensuing comment.

But seriously, are you trying to argue games can have an effect by using the fact that Booth was in the Civil War? That is just plain stupid.

Comparing the mass killing of others while your friends are blown apart next to you while you piss your pants trying to reload to murder another one of your countrymen ain't even in the same universe as playing GTA or whatever. Canadians watch our TV, shoot our guns, and play our games and they don't have nearly the psycho events as this.

The fact of the matter is that games, movies, books, etc. can perhaps contribute, but things like years of being ignored, beaten, humiliated, denied manhood, and physically injured, not to mention having mental illness on top of it all is what breeds a psycho, not Halo.

My family has been shooting guns, killing animals, and fighting in wars for generations and we are all compasionate, non-violent, and sociable people. I have been playing violent games and watching R-rated programming since I was way way too young. But, I've never been in a fight, graduated college, and live with a beautiful woman who is just as compasionate towards others as I am.

But then again, I had a good family that spent many years tirelessly teaching me right and wrong and good vs. evil while simeoutaneously disciplining me and teaching me my sense of humor. It is easy for me to see the difference between fantasy and reality.

Hate to break it to you, Octavio, but likely the image will be pulled rather than pay for it's use. It's likely a mistake (like an image found on someone's gallery in yahoo photos or something) or difficult to accredit the original source given the complexity of the tubes of the interwebs. But it's doubtful they'd pay for the image.

Incidently, you'd have a much better shot contacting him through the link on his name above or sending a tip rather than the comments thread.

But as a fellow artist, the first attempt a leqal threat? Poor play, man. Very poor play. I understand protecting your property and all that shit since I've had to stop a major website from selling my artwork on T-shirts, but the first contact being a threat is actually bottom rung behavior, man.

Damn, now I feel partially retarded. The image links the original article. But regardless, they'll likely just change the image.

Sheppy,
Thank you for your comment.
I clicked on the link on his name and it just took me back to the comments area. I would've emailed him directly if I could've found an email link.

But I disagree with you that it was mistake ("Officer, I have no idea how that bag of reefer wound up in my pocket!") or that it was difficult to accredit the artist, since my credit line appears twice on the Salon page.

And since this blog apparently makes money from ads, my illustration was used for commercial purposes, which should entitle me to some financial compensation.

Well, L8R dude, gotta go swing from the bottom rung.

If video games weren't around sociopath's would need to be more creative. Video games and media just give these people a quick idea on how and where to vent their anger. If there weren't all these school shootings I would say his chances of shooting up a school would be less likely. He still may have gone to a mall, bank, or other public place.

Schools are not a happy place for a lot of people and that should be looked into. Gun control should also now be strongly considered.

"I clicked on the link on his name and it just took me back to the comments area. I would've emailed him directly if I could've found an email link."

Once upon a time, a highlighted name meant an email link. Turns out, it just takes you to a list of their contributions on this site. Regardless, I sent a tip telling them action must be taken.

"But I disagree with you that it was mistake ("Officer, I have no idea how that bag of reefer wound up in my pocket!") or that it was difficult to accredit the artist, since my credit line appears twice on the Salon page."
And I said now I feel retarded. More often than not, people threatening legal action first often jump to conclusions. The image hyperlinks the article so yeah, either compensation or removal of the image needs to be done.

"Well, L8R dude, gotta go swing from the bottom rung."

Okay, admittedly, I was an ass. Let's just put it this way, my opinions of people sending legal threats first, actualy discussion later tends to make me edgy. Especially since I only recently finished some tricky business because of a short fiction piece I finished for a class I took. Someone claimed I stole their stuff and completely rewrote it (where as I claimed the concept of greek gods toying with mortals is hardly new. In fact, it's in the original myths themselves and one needs only look as far as Aphrodite's hatred of Psyche to find the inspiration for my tragically ill executed yarn) and I only recently got that mess sorted out.

I hope this issue gets resolved to a satisfactory outcome but even when my own artwork is stolen (unless it's been intentionally modified like removing the signature), my first contact is usually along the lines, and I paraphrase here, "umm, that's my shit. What do you want to do about this?"

See, it's shit like this that's why I hate the goddamn baby boomers.

He probably went nuts and killed people BECAUSE they were such fucking idiots (And no - I'm not excusing his actions).

For the record, I happened to catch part of an interview with JT on local talk radio, and he mentioned that Cho "trained himself to kill" on Counterstrike.

But this has nothing to do with whether or not he did or didn't play video games, or did or did not purchase his weapons legally. If video games and computers and TV had never been invented, this kid would still have been born with psychotic, violent, and anti-social tendencies; even if guns had never been invented, he still would have found the means to do what he did.

America in general is a crazy and violent place, but banning guns is not the answer. Anyone who wants a gun can get one whether they are sold over the counter or not; Americans still got drunk during Prohibition and millions of Americans smoke marijuana and do other illegal drugs every day. Banning guns would only increase gun-related crimes. Law-abiding citizens need to be able to purchase guns in order to protect themselves and their loved ones from crazies and criminals. We can't pretend that America's not f'ed up.

*steps off soapbox*

Outstanding, I'm printing this out and hanging it all over campus. Thank you

"For the record, I happened to catch part of an interview with JT on local talk radio, and he mentioned that Cho "trained himself to kill" on Counterstrike."

And that's why the police want to talk to Jack Thompson. He's uncovering "facts" faster than the police are. When he was first on Fox News, as it was going down, the CS comment was in regards to the Germany shooter, who he claimed dressed up as the game character (note to jack: The game character was a military person. In this association, there are currently a huge number of dangerous "role players" in Iraq right now). Now if he's changed his comment once again to include Cho when even right now, police have not linked violent gaming to him, then it becomes a matter of "did JT have prior knowledge of the killer and the incident before it happened?"

God forbid the "insanity" of the idividual is blamed or their parents for letting an insane youth play an M rated game. It always has to be somebody profiting from pretend violence that takes the blame for real violence. Sucka fat one Dr. Phil.

Meh @ this. Where's that graph that shows the launch of the original Playstation and several games, and how violence has actually gone down since then?

I mean, that should shut the retards right up, but I never see those facts brought out anywhere.

If anything, games like counter-strike educate how to take cover for when terrorism hits your area -- for when a gunman goes wild shooting at you and everyone else.

I spent a few years running a site about games and violence before it got taken down due to some legal issues, and there is a link between an increase in violence and games. The thing people SHOULD be pressing is the fact that it's no greater than the change when people hear fast-paced music (or fight music), watch action scenes in movies, read a book with a lot of fighting, etc. Humans are influenced by what they see/do, you can't argue that; you can argue the degree by which they're influenced.

I spent most of my childhood trying to "explain" this exact sentiment to my mom. There's just no easy way to convince somebody that the bright-line difference between play/fantasy and real life is still there in your head, and that a particular activity (like gaming or watching TV/movies) is not eroding it. It's almost like a religious belief with the older generation (the one that came before video games) that this new, unknown thing must be bad for you if kids like it so much.

Excellent idea, sir! I'd love to print some of these bad boys out for the game store I work at so customers can take them home.

They used to blame comic books much in the same way back in the 30's-40's. Think about that for a second, really let it set in.

Anyone remember Pat Pulling's crusade against D&D and 'other forms of satanism'? The incredible conclusions she could come to and how she targeted ignorant parents (especially ones that didn't want to take responsibility for their bad parenting)?

As a kid who played D&D I had a miserable time trying to indulge in my favorite hobby, which is now considered harmless.

Jack Thompson is doing the exact same thing, whether it's for profit, fame or simply his own personal little psychosis, he's screwing things up for those of us who enjoy the hobby.

If we ignore people like this and don't point out their lack of facts and questionable methods from the start, they end up creating an attitude that persists for long after they've found another crusade to continue on. Anyone remember Pat Pulling? Doubtfull. Anyone heard that D&D makes you a satanist?

I say ridicule the idiot. Point out his flagrant sensationalism and manufactured facts where everyone can see it, because the moment these people are left alone they find other stupid people to infect and when you wake up the idea has already taken root without any evidence.