Retail murder: ESRB rates Manhunt 2 'Adults Only'

FTM, Manhunt 2 isn't the first game to get an AO rating. There already exists 23 AO games, including the cancelled Thrill Kill, several localized Japanese H games, and uncensored PC versions of console games (Playboy the Mansion, Leisure Suit Larry, and Indigo Prophecy to name a few).

Search the ESRB by AO rating.

Why would having both M and AO discs be such a bad idea? Movies are released to DVD with rated and unrated versions ALL THE TIME. At Wal*Mart, even.

Maybe sell the AO Manhunt II exclusively through the R* store. Those of us who want the "director's cut" would know exactly how to go about getting it. I'd certainly wait a few days past release date for the genuine article. Plus, R* (and T2) would see more $$$ per unit sold than what they get from retailers.

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Why would having both M and AO discs be such a bad idea? Movies are released to DVD with rated and unrated versions ALL THE TIME. At Wal*Mart, even.
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Well, the British organization might have had a point when they said this was a game that couldn't just be censored or toned down to reduce its rating. The problem isn't with the amount of blood or screaming, it's the basic concept of the game: you hunt down people in a methodical, emotionless way, without any particular surrounding context to redeem it. Hard to fix without starting over almost from scratch.

You have a problem with the rating? Get revenge: make the AO game a smash hit. Money is key here. Transform the "kiss of death" stigma.

I hope this sets a precedence for AO games on consoles. So far, AO games have been pretty much limited to the PC, but the PC is the worst platform for AO games because it's the easiest platform for kids to download pirated AO games.

Well, the ESRB shouldn't invent an X rating for video games because AO is the X rating for video games. M is the equivalent of the R-rating. And the "unrated" DVDs out there are pretty much just for marketing; it's movies that were shooting for the R or PG-13 rating all along with a few raunchy scenes added in, but nothing that would make it unrateable. Besides, Manhunt 2 would fully deserve a prohibitive rating, because after all, it's not a mainstream game, it's aiming at a specific and informed adult audience. So why should it get a mainstream rating and sit on Wal-Mart's shelves? That makes no sense. There's a very succesful industry for this sort of borderline content (either horror or pornography) that has built itself alternative distribution channels that reach their audience without bothering anybody else too much. If developers want to release that content in video games, maybe they should work on building some alternative avenues for themselves.

I called gamestop and they said you can reserve it at that store.

Once Gamestop/EB has all the sales of manhunt go to them or amazon.com than other retailers will jump back in and watch as EB profits go way up.

GOing to reserve this game tomorrow and zelda phantom hourglass when I pick up RE4 wii edition. It's a great game, I don't care how violent it is. It's a good summer game really since nothing else to play I'll pick this up, should entertian me until Metroid Prime 3.

You just got a sale Take 2 and I never bought any of your games before.

Hopefully we'll start getting MORE AO games if this one sells good. Then we can have porn games where you can piss and shit all over a girls face. I've been waiting for that since I was a little kid.

Well, I guess I'm buying this game.
Damn. Really didn't want to, either. Oh well.


I agree that the ESRB (probably) made the right call here, though. I am, however, going to buy this as my way of rewarding retailers who have a big enough pair to sell this game.

Ok, I wasn't that interested in this game in the first place, but now that it is AO, I have to get it.

How could it not be AO??

What is the point of an AO rating if it's never given?

You guys are always complaining that people consider games for kids.. so you should be applauding that it got the correct rating.

If you want to direct your ire anywhere, aim it at retailers who refuse to stock AO games... and point out to them that the majority of gamers are now adults.

yeah, we say an AO rating wil hurt its sales, but look at all this publicity it's getting everyday...

Chris Putnam (#53) said:

"The problem isn't with the amount of blood or screaming, it's the basic concept of the game: you hunt down people in a methodical, emotionless way, without any particular surrounding context to redeem it."


Not true. You act as if there's no storyline to the game. Are you not at all familiar with the original Manhunt? The story to that game (even though I never played it) is extremely clever and intriguing.

All I can say is, the game got the big AO. SO...

Come on guys...you can figure it out...


THE FUCKING DOOR HAS BEEN THROWN OPEN FOR ROCKSTAR. They've already got the AO, TOTAL FREEDOM NOW. I'll be expecting the most depraved, horrific, gory shit imaginable, on top of the FUCKING HOTTEST COFFEE I'VE EVER SEEN. Finally a game that can utilize what the Wiimote is so clearly for.

;P

(Murder simulation and sexcapades)

This seems like a bit of a storm in a teacup if you ask me. I strongly support the equal treatment of games in the retail space, when put alongside other entertainment forms, but I don't exactly see this as a case where a game is getting a biased treatment.

Wal-Mart has a long history of prejudicial treatment towards all form of media they deem as "inappropriate". It has refused to stock all sorts of material it has problems with

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Wal-Mart#Product_selection

This might be grounds for further criticism of Wal-Mart, but it's no reason to think that it is a targeted effort at video games alone.

Having mainstream AO games, whether stocked by Wal-Mart or not, seems like a good thing to me. As many other people have commented before me, it gives the ESRB a greater legitimacy as a ratings authority.

You can object to this too on certain grounds, but only if you object to the MPAA NC-17 rating also.

The only reason I was interested in this game was for the Wii release. Not enough games for the console. Will Nintendo be forced to change their AO policy? Or can Rockstar release it unlicensed like Action Replays and whatnot are? Will be interesting. Best case scenario- Nintendo licenses it as AO and it is released. Worst case? No Wii release, that's all I care about.

Wow... somebody finally used AO for a game that contains content other than sex!

Personally, the rating wouldn't make a difference to me if it didn't affect a store's decision to stock the game.

FINALLY the ESRB rates a controversial game correctly. The AO rating should be used much more often.

I guess I really don't agree much with the average gamer anymore.

while many of you seem to argue that games and movies should be rated in the same way, the fact is that games are interactive while movies are a passive experience. yes, you can become just as immersed in Scarface the film as you can in Scarface for PS2, but you cannot pretend the experience is the same. it is the level of interactivity that causes the ESRB to recognise that a game like Manhunt 2 is not in any way appropriate for minor gamers. I'm shocked anyone would disagree. yes, it's just a game. no, it isn't really telling you to go out and snuff people out. but the violence is a bit too realistic and depraved to allow kids access to it.

and the people who object to the game being labeled AO just because that might be financially disastrous for the IP and for Rockstar by extension? well, sorry. yes, maybe some good could come of this, if it causes big-box retailers to reexamine the position of ignoring adult video games on principle. one game has to be the first.

I thought, after playing the first game, that it was a thin story stretched over headline-grabbing ultraviolence. it was kind of laughable trash, really. like a John Carpenter action movie. these people on the intertubes claiming the first was some sort of pyschological masterpiece are fucking nuts. it's a snuff title with a niche audience of violent idiots. masterpiece theater, this aint. the game isn't being censored; Rockstar are free to put it out. and the ESRB isn't taking undue steps to block its release. the AO rating was provided for some time ago, and clearly this game (like the first one, truly) seems to deserve it. so all you winners can keep posting your heinous "oh noes teh ESArby pwnd Manhunt!!1!one go Rockstars for teh winz releese it anywayz lolrambo add more violences" crap and seriously, stay away from my family and friends. if this is the sort of thing you want to put your support behind, I think I hope I don't see you guys on Live, or maybe anywhere else.

"no, it isn't really telling you to go out and snuff people out. but the violence is a bit too realistic and depraved to allow kids access to it."

OK, but the thing is, that is not your decision. You have no more right to decide what other people's kids should or should not be playing than Wal-Mart or any other store does.

On the other hand, it is up to the stores what they sell. And that remains true even though I personally find it a tad ridiculous that they wouldn't stock a game simply based on an AO rating. It's not like anybody would stop shopping at Wal-Mart because they had AO games in their cabinets.

And no, I would not let my kids play this game if i had them. My small children, that is. Which means I still find an AO (18+) rating absurd. I would much rather the game be readily available to me rather than me having to jump through hoops to obtain it. An AO rating is the next closest thing to banning this game, and the ESRB knows that. It's like the mark of death.

Note: I'm really not all that interested in Manhunt 2. Just supporting this side of the argument. It's the principal of the matter.

"you hunt down people in a methodical, emotionless way, without any particular surrounding context to redeem it."

Wrong. You are a doctor who wakes up in The Project (where horrible human experiments are going on) without any knowledge of how you got there. You have to escape alive, while "Hunters" try to kill you in the worst ways imaginable. You must trick them into the open so that you can kill them from behind in silence so that you don't get discovered.

You aren't killing innocents, you are killing killers. Kill or be killed.

I don't see the problem... but I don't think there's a big need for retailers... unless people are just that lazy. With an AO rating, I believe a good number of people would be dedicated in buying the game.

That's it! I pre-ordered on Amazon with Fedex Overnight shipping. Come on Rockstar, I'm buying :)

Rock star needs to Take the hit and put the game out as is. One of the biggest reasons why people have this crap feeling about movies is because they don't stick to their guns.

If this game is an AO product let it be an AO product believe in the content and let it stay. Now if you are only selling the game on the idea kiddies can play blood and gore as you sneak it under the radar well that is a problem now. Seriously Hardcore adult gamers need to support this game just to send a message that gaming is not just a industry to sap money from parents and kids.

@Wild Homes

"it's a snuff title with a niche audience of violent idiots."

Thanks for your generalization sir. I will proudly raise my hand as a member of this "niche audience", waiting for the release of this game while playing FFXII, Rayman Raving Rabbids, Viva Pinata and Mario Party 8 (with my wife).

If gore and sadism were only for a niche audience, we wouldn't see horror movies released each month to very decent box office performance.

In your small little world, you may not realize that some of us enjoy diversity, and have different tastes than you.

But thanks for the insults, I'm sure they help you make a lot of friends...

The deal is, this came can still be baught in America, it cannot be baught in the UK. This AO rating, while it will hurt sales, is not that big of a deal.

@ Farseer

Thats the thing. With this AO rating, many stores won't be carrying it, making it almost as bad as censorship. If stores like Wal-Mart or other video game suppliers still carried the game no matter what the rating, then that would be fine. Its just that this rating is like XXX for pornos. No movie carriers carry them, and the same thing will happen to this game.

The reason it is like censorship is because without these major game carriers selling them, a lot of people won't even be able to buy it, and the game won't be noticed.

why are people offended that this gets an AO rating? It the content appropriate for someone who is 4,8, 12, NO. An adult only rating is no different than not selling cigarettes to children. If you feel oppressed then move to another country and see what oppressed really is, hell even the EU is more censored than here. Get a grip.

Aimed at all who think we should not have a ratings system, or that the government is involved:

The government is not rating this or censoring it, PERIOD. It is a RECOMENDATION from the ESRB that is all. Companies VOLUNTARILY submit thier content to them, IT IS NOT MANDATORY. Look at most DVD releases, they have UNRATED content becasue it was not reviewed by the ESRB. Besides all of that, a lot of you say that it is the parents responsibility to keep inappropriate material away from their kids, and I agree. Do you expect a parent to KNOW EVERY THING IN A GAME!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is why the ESRB exists, parents who don't spend their days on Joystiq or other game sites might not have any clue other than a rating. This does not excuse them from actually seeing the game played once they bring it home, but certainly helps them decide what is appropriate to contemplate buying.
Some parents may be ignorant, sure, but to trash a tool designed to overcome that hurdle is idiotic IMO.

Honestly, this isn't a surprise. AO - intense violence and/or sex/nudity.

Manhunt is intense violence. I had trouble believing Manhunt got an M rating! I'm not the least bit squimish. I play plenty of violent games, but Manhunt just weirded the hell out of me. The whole game was unsettling. I can take a rocket launcher to a guy and turn him into dog food, or chainsaw a Lotus Grub in half... But ... Manhunt just felt wrong the whole time.

Whether you like them or not the ESRB is keeping direct government oversight off of the industry's back. Without them it WOULD be illegal to buy certain games. They are going a good job.

Did they cave to political pressures? Who knows? We didn't make or rate the game so its really not for us to say. We've seen screenshots and gameplay footage, that's about it. It just might deserve this rating.

I agree this will be a watershed moment in video gaming ratings and that's why the ESRB made the right call here, it is completely up to Rockstar how well they want this game to sell. Its up to the retailer what products they will carry and there has to be some compromise here.

Why not release 2 versions, an M one that all stores everywhere will sell happily and an AO version that they can sell direct through their site and retailers who agree to sell this game.

"Look at most DVD releases, they have UNRATED content becasue it was not reviewed by the ESRB."

Well. The ESRB actually doesn't, to my knowledge, review DVDs. But other than that..

@83

I stand corrected it is the MPAA, but this is a similar idea in terms of scope and overall goal. I think you caught my drift.

NOTE TO GAME RETAILERS:

I *will* purchase this game. I am an adult, in my 30s, and I absolutely have the right to make this purchase without censorship. Whichever retailer carries this game and gives me the FREEDOM to purchase it will have my video game business from that point onward.

Any retailer who does not carry this game due to the AO rating will lose ALL my video game business- Accessories, games, consoles-- Everything will be purchased from the retailers who opt to allow me to purchase this game from them.

This IS a line in the sand. It's a line that says "I won't do business with any company that thinks they know better than me what's good for me."

I'm dead serious. I already don't do business with several retailers due to their policies regarding M-rated games, NC-17 movies, and explicit music.

I advise all gamers to follow suit. This is the point where Best Buy, Circuit City, Gamestop/EBGames, and others show us why they're the place to go for our gaming needs. We're the reason they even exist. If they don't respect the customers, then the customers SHOULD leave.

Wow We should seriously go on strike i think its retarded that people can be restriceted of forms of media......i mean come on now ,for instance im 15 and theres violence all in my life i mean What kind of movie/music/game would an abused,raped and traumitized girl listen to? hmmm defintly not something all the rating shit reccomends for real though i would actually go on strike about this because i honestly belive that its retarded because everytime i want to buy an m rated game or watch an r rated movie my parents have to be with me trust me they Dont Care.......not trying to make it seem like im a child that just runs about doing as i want, i have a conscience and feelings im just more mature and compettive for my age. i honestly would go on strike with alot of you really cool people because regardless or not i know that everyone relizes that americas government is influenced by the few retards that ruin it for us all and they have to see that....... just look at that one guy jack thomson ... it seems as though his idea of those old ladies who bought gta for there grandchildren was set up ....wouldnt you not buy it for your grandchildren if the store people told you that it wasnt appropriate for your kids??????

FUCK JACK THOMPSON! I'M GONNA KILL HIM "MANHUNT" STYLE! BETTER HIDE FUCKER!!!!!!!!!! >:O

"FUCK THE ESRB AND THEIR RETARDED RATINGS SYSTEM.

And any teen or young adult who asks me to buy this game for them WILL MOST CERTAINLY GET IT NO QUESTIONS ASKED."

I suppose you'll be buying 14 year olds bottles of vodka next?

Clair, your post is run on sentences filled with poor grammar and spelling. You don't even write like you're mature enough to play this game.

What's with everyone crying about censorship? Nothing has been censored, it's just received a severe (and fair) rating. Sure it might be a little bit more difficult to get your hands on the game, but if you really really want to stab people in the face with shards of glass, I'm sure you'll find a way. Personally, I'm not squeemish when it comes to violent videogames, but I feel that children shouldn't be playing these kinds of games and I feel that the M rating still allows lots of kids to get their hands on this stuff. The AO rating will allow people who really want the game to be able to get it, but it will also make it that much harder for kids to get the game. I seriously don't see the problem.