Rockstar: We 'emphatically disagree' with UK's Manhunt 2 ban

by Ludwig Kietzmann { Jun 19th 2007 at 5:25PM }

Rockstar has issued a statement in response to the BBFC's earlier decision to reject Manhunt 2 for classification and thus prohibit it from being sold in the UK. "We are disappointed with the recent decision by the British Board of Film Classification to refuse classification of Manhunt 2, said the Grand Theft Auto creator. "While we respect the authority of the classification board and will abide by the rules, we emphatically disagree with this particular decision."

Rockstar goes on to defend Manhunt 2 by pointing out that its subject matter is no different than that of "other mainstream entertainment choices for adult consumers," noting that "adult consumers who would play this game fully understand that it is fictional interactive entertainment and nothing more." A rational defense, no doubt, but perhaps one better suited to a world where only "adult consumers" would be in a position to play the game.

ELSPA earlier declared that the ban "demonstrates that we have a games ratings system in the UK that is effective," when it really seems to imply the opposite. Had game ratings been truly effective, the BBFC could have simply slapped the appropriate rating on the box and trusted adults and parents to judge the game's content accordingly. In the real world, however, the sloppy enforcement of ratings and general apathy towards content descriptors have prompted the certification body to add an extra barrier of entry, underlining a clear lack of faith in the effectiveness of its own warning labels. The ratings system should be powerful and heeded enough to handle any video game, no matter how violent it may be.

Tags: BBFC, ELSPA, Jack Thompson, JackThompson, Manhunt, Manhunt 2, Manhunt2, Rockstar

Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)

whosmav @ Jun 19th 2007 5:28PM

Censorship blows

Farseer @ Jun 19th 2007 5:39PM

Usher in the age of "Manhunt 451" in the UK.

I love Europe and enjoy talking with Europeans, but I'm sorry, it must really suck to be a British or German gamer right now.

Censorship FTL.

Platinum_Skeet @ Jun 19th 2007 5:39PM

I bet if ESRB or BBFC marked GTAIV A/O it'll still sell like hotcakes...

Anam @ Jun 19th 2007 5:40PM

"The ratings system should be powerful and heeded enough to handle any video game, no matter how violent it may be."

Exactly. Well said, Ludwig!

Sven @ Jul 9th 2007 1:41PM

"The ratings system should be powerful and heeded enough to handle any video game, no matter how violent it may be."

NOW who's not living 'in the real world'?

deaftly @ Jun 19th 2007 5:40PM

manhunt 1 sucked, 2 looks like its going down the same path

DannyJ @ Jun 19th 2007 5:40PM

I think that the ELSPA sees that if this game gets into the market it will still end up in "kids" hands even if it is rated appropriately. I don't agree with their decision but this is a problems that stems from the fact that ratings are not strictly enforced. I think if only those people in the correct age group could play the game then this sort of issue would not occur.

lucifer @ Jun 19th 2007 5:41PM

but couldnt take two just not region lock the game, and everyone import from america...

razer @ Jun 19th 2007 5:41PM

Censorship does suck.. I wonder if they would be getting the same kind of response if they had developed this game on the Xbox 360 or PS3?

I kind of think it serves them right for making a game for a console that is generally associated with children. I understand the Wii is trying to break that "only Mario kids type games" but I think this was a bit much. I would of loved to play this game on the 360 so I'm not shedding a tear for Rockstar since they denied it.. I still play Manhunt on Xbox1 when I'm in a murdering mood. =)

GaryM @ Jun 19th 2007 5:45PM

Cheap publicity from/for Rockstar.

That's so unlike them.

Jose @ Jun 19th 2007 5:52PM

@GaryM

Yes, this is totally free advertisement. Rockstar is teh genius! They have all this free advertisement for a game that won't be sold at all in the UK and won't be at most retailers in the US. Plenty of advertisement for a game that isn't fucking available, way to go T2!

... 'tard.

Player1 @ Jun 19th 2007 5:55PM

"A rational defense, no doubt, but perhaps one better suited to a world where only "adult consumers" would be in a position to play the game."

And a world where only "adult consumers" are in the position to play a dvd, or watch cable, or go on the internet? I'm not too clear on that. Why are game consoles always defaulted to being primarly for children?

JonnyBoy2U @ Jun 19th 2007 5:55PM

razer you're a tool.

You just admitted that you liked the first one. And if it were coming to the 360 I'm sure you'd be up in arms over this retarded decision. Yet because Rockstar didn't choose to put it on the 360 and its on the Wii instead you're bitching like a baby?

Seriously...grow up. This is bad news for gaming I think.

WillTheSecond @ Jun 19th 2007 5:56PM

"I love Europe and enjoy talking with Europeans, but I'm sorry, it must really suck to be a British or German gamer right now.

Censorship FTL."

It's only one game, it's the first game to be banned in a decade, and the only other game banned wasn't even banned permanently (in the UK, I don't know about the German situation).

That said, the UK PEGI system should have an equivalent to AO really, which allows the game to be sold but means it's infamous enough that many stores won't carry it. The UK rating system needs an overhaul so this doesn't happen again.

David F. @ Jun 19th 2007 6:11PM

I believe that if this game got an A/O rating and was only available online it would still sell like hotcakes because everyone would want to see what all of the hype is about. I personally loved the first Manhunt and will definitely be buying the Wii version so that i can learn how to properly strangle someone with motion gestures. Banning a game is completely ridiculous though. Please someone explain how movies like Saw and Hostel have more redeeming value than a game like Manhunt 2.

Gausser @ Jun 19th 2007 6:14PM

@Player1
You stole my comment. I guess we should ban Saw 3. Some children might see it. How about The Sopranos? Better ban it. There might be children watching. Oh and lets not forget books. Every book in the horror section should be banned. Too much killing. We can't have kids reading that!
The bottom line is this: The game should be rated Mature. After that, it is the responsibility of the parent to monitor what the child is playing, watching or reading. Games should not be different than any other medium.

Hirsbrunner @ Jun 19th 2007 6:15PM

It's "would've", or would have. Not "would of".

Sorry to be jerk-like, but that one always drives me nuts.

Matt B @ Jun 19th 2007 6:34PM

Hey minors, Europeans too, check ebay. I'll be buying them 5 at a time and putting them on ebay for you at $10 above cost.

I'll be the MH2 smuggler for you depraved folk.

Look for the ebay ID "esrbupyourass@BS.gov"

n_revolution9 @ Jun 19th 2007 6:51PM

Rockstar: We 'emphatically disagree' with UK's Manhunt 2 ban

WELL DUH!!!!

wasp2151 @ Jun 19th 2007 6:53PM

I hope Rockstar decides to take the AO rating and not try to tone thing down just to get a lower rating they should say F it and let prove we need a AO rating. Its high time that the video game companies stop being so damn afraid of the AO rating. and i am not talking sax games. i am talk violent and sax in games gust go with it.hell lets prove we Americans are the most violent people in the world. you should be afraid of Americans.

kingalekz @ Jun 19th 2007 7:00PM

Oh well, all this Manhunt 2 talk today makes it certain that this game will be banned here in Germany, too, just like its predecessor.

Lucky @ Jun 19th 2007 7:02PM

Brovo. The mission statement of a rateing bord should be to educate, not censorship! If they want it to work, then put money into educateing the public about the rateings. The parents have th right to say if there child can play this game or not!

Rob Accomando @ Jun 19th 2007 7:07PM

"Sax" games?

HaloBreaker @ Jun 19th 2007 7:19PM

Kinda funny since Rockstar London was the design team.

The_Mhor @ Jun 19th 2007 7:22PM

"The UK rating system needs an overhaul so this doesn't happen again."

What, to bring it into line with the USA's? So we can get crazy knee-jerk reactions to "Hot Coffee", or that Halo 2 "partial nudity" joke?

No thanks, our system works just fine...

Sidepocket @ Jun 19th 2007 7:38PM

@ The_Mhor

At least the games fucking come out the way they are.

Seriously, stop being a patriot and grow a spine.

Zombie3k @ Jun 19th 2007 8:45PM

The BBFC were probably bribed by the government because of the crap with Resistance and the Church. Therefore they decided to show that they still have authority by banning a violent video game. Just more beating of the chest which means the truly responsible video gamers have to suffer. Disgusting.

Snife @ Jun 19th 2007 10:02PM

We really need to get behind Rockstar and help appeal this decision, I have already emailed the BBFC at contact_the_bbfc@bbfc.co.uk and I would encourage everyone to do the same

This is not about Manhunt 2 (i'm not sure how good it will be but I was looking forward to having an adult game for my dormant Wii), this is about a non elected body making decisions which affect our freedom as adults to view what we deem acceptable and another step towards a Big Brother society.

DiRT @ Jun 19th 2007 10:56PM

"In the real world, however, the sloppy enforcement of ratings and general apathy towards content descriptors have prompted the certification body to add an extra barrier of entry, underlining a clear lack of faith in the effectiveness of its own warning labels."

In other words, the ratings don't work. You say so in your own story!

razer @ Jun 19th 2007 11:32PM

JonnyBoy2U: First off, screw you dude! Don't come in here with your weenieness(is that a word) and start name calling and adding very little to the conversation. I know you feel being anonymous provides you some protection like the wimp you are.

Second: Yes, I did like the first one! Picking and choosing what should be censored and what shouldn't does suck no matter what platform. I believe I stated that. Like it or not the Wii has more under age 18 gamers than any of the other consoles and I think Rockstar's decision to release it on this platform was a sensationalistic move. You can play a fun game of Mario and then maybe some Zelda followed by choking someone with a plastic bag while shaking your Wiimote. I do want this on the 360 and it ticks me off they didn't put it on multiple platforms. But really that is a non-issue compared to censorship in gaming but I can't help to think Rockstar asked for it (and maybe expected it).

BPM @ Jun 20th 2007 1:00AM

Razer, they DID put it on multiple platforms... It's called "Wii, PS2, and PSP."

t_m @ Jun 20th 2007 1:00AM

The BBFC rarely bans anything, and while you can't please all people all the time, it does a remarkably good job.
(we had none of the hassle with GTA or Oblivion cos they were rated correctly first time around).

Also, an 18 certificate (like AO/NC17 in US) doesn't mean kiss of death for a product over here, as shops still continue to stock them.

As for the "ratings system shouldbe respected and powerful enough to handle anything".. thats a load of rubbish. Games and movies regularly get 18 certificates in the UK, and its a perfectly acceptable certificate with none of the stigma of US ratings... but clearly they felt this game was too much even for an 18 cert.. which doesn't sound too unreasonabe based on wht i've seen so far.

Good job BBFC... ..besides, I can't see WHO this game would even appeal to, except sadists.

Gahro @ Jun 20th 2007 3:40AM

Why is everyone so up in arms about the BBFC decision. It's not like this is done on a regular basis. I mean the last game to be banned was in 97. Thats two games in the last 10 years. In the UK, no fuss over the rating for GTA, just slap an 18 sticker on it.

The USA in particular can learn some things. We have a system that works over here. I mean, even companies like WallMart are being rediculous. Why not sell AO games. In the UK, you'd get slapped with a fine if you sell to kids but adults could still get a hold on some of the more serious titles.

mor @ Jun 20th 2007 4:27AM

so i ran a google search on violence, turns out violence dates back before videogames

hmmm, i wonder what thats about

mor @ Jun 20th 2007 4:32AM

@27

there are no free countries, and we are already all live in a big brother society, mass communication has ruined the world

but on a brighter note mass communication has provided the internet :)

mike @ Jun 20th 2007 5:33AM

Hey I am eighteen and might not be able to play manhunt but at least here in the uk I can go out and buy some beers. What ever censorship you have in the US it does not seem to work based on all the highschool killings

mor @ Jun 20th 2007 5:54AM

@35

o wow.....the fact that you would trivialize human death to prove an irrelevant point is just sad

and for the record UK shootings are FAR above americans, in fact you and whales are the highest in the world, you probly had to dodge bullets writing that comment

but manhunts banning should fix that so no worrys....

Snife @ Jun 20th 2007 6:28AM

t_m : your argument is laughable imho, I dont need to be a plumber to play mario nor a hedgehog to play sonic so wanting to play manhunt does not make me a sadist. Splinter Cell involves you sneaking up behind and killing people, most games I play have death match modes where its all about killing but the point is that it is only a game. There should not be stigma associated with an 18 title but it lets me know that the content may be violent - as an adult over 18, It should then be my choice whether I want to then choose to play that game or whether i want to go play Viva Pinata.

Gahro : Censorship is wrong, whether they ban 2 games a decade or 200 games, its still censorship based on a set of individuals beliefs, if you allow this, what happens if the people at the BBFC then have a problem with religious films or think that homosexuality is wrong and shouldn't be shown........hopefully you can see where i'm going with this.

Mor : lol, so true, if i'm allowed to watch films like saw and hostel, I don't understand how a video game gets banned other than they are held to different standards as the BBFC don't understand the medium.

CNash @ Jun 20th 2007 7:52AM

@27: The BBFC have been going for almost a century now, and have banned plenty of movies over the years (and at least one game) without this much of an outcry. I'd say you're a little bit late.

That said, I do agree that the current rating system - the last major revision of which was in 1982 - needs a rethink in terms of today's society.

Snife @ Jun 20th 2007 8:43AM

CNash, the only game I am aware of them trying to ban was Carmageddon but this ruling was overturned on appeal. I'm not aware of them banning many movies recently (baring in mind films considered tame now such as exorcist and chainsaw massacre were at one time banned I think), normally they only reject a film if it could violate the Obscene Publications Act I think and even then, they advise on alterations which can be made - this is an outright ban.

The Doctor @ Jun 20th 2007 10:59AM

This is censorship plain and simple. Why so many people are defending the fact that speech is being censored to "protect" them is beyond me.

DS1O9 @ Jun 20th 2007 11:19AM

this is bullshit.

Jamie @ Jun 20th 2007 11:34AM

@ mor: "and for the record UK shootings are FAR above americans, in fact you and whales are the highest in the world, you probly had to dodge bullets writing that comment"

You have a real talent for talking complete bullshit.

"The risk of being killed by a firearm in the US is higher than in any other Western nation. Of countries outside war zones, the risk is greatest in South Africa, according to a United Nations report."

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/42811000/gif/_42811311_firearms_deaths3_203gr.gif

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/6562529.stm

In future, don't just make things up.

As for Manhunt 2, it should've been given an 18 rating. I'm sure this probably has just as much 'artistic merit' than any of the movies that have been mentioned. And also, it's the parents responsibility to make sure children don't see this kind of stuff, not the government's.

mo @ Jun 21st 2007 3:07AM

@42

http://www.tinyvital.com/BlogArchives/000220.html

http://wheelgun.blogspot.com/2007/01/crime-in-uk-versus-crime-in-us.html

these were the first ones on google.....i wonder f you skipped them because they didnt agree with you

woot @ Jun 22nd 2007 8:43PM

i think AO is a completely retarded rating. M is for ages 17 and older and AO is for ages 18 and older i dont think other than the stores which refuse to sell it, that an ao rating really differs a lot from an M rating. unless its a porn game then yes it does. but for violence between the content descriptors "intense violence" and "violence" i dont notice a difference in the violence levels.