Epic's Mark Rein pleased with Blu-ray's 'legroom'
by Ludwig Kietzmann 
{ Aug 15th 2007 at 4:56PM }
Of course, as Xbox 360 developers are wont to do, Rein applied some damage control on the Epic Games forums, explaining how disappointed he was that "folks on the internet treat any positive thing we say about one platform as some sort of critique of another platform." While ruling out the possibility of two DVDs for the eventual Xbox 360 version of Unreal Tournament 3, Rein suggested that online downloads and hard drives could sort out glaring content deficiencies between platforms.
And before you ask about mod support for Microsoft's console: "We just don't have all the answers today and it isn't our chief priority at this very moment because we already have our hands completely full shipping UT3 on PC and PS3 as well as shipping Gears of War on PC."
[Thanks, Anonymous]
Read -- "EIF: Rein's a Blu-ray fan" (GamesIndustry.Biz)
Read -- Is the 360 version limited?
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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
mr nimblewick @ Aug 15th 2007 5:00PM
It's my stated opinion that Blu-ray offers more storage room than DVD.
Night Elve @ Aug 15th 2007 5:01PM
"folks on the internet treat any positive thing we say about one platform as some sort of critique of another platform."
So true.
robert @ Aug 15th 2007 5:09PM
"folks on the internet treat any positive thing we say about one platform as some sort of critique of another platform."
actually it's more like...
"folks on the internet treat any positive thing we say about the ps3 as something negative about the ps3."
LousyNixon @ Aug 29th 2007 6:34PM
Hi I'm Mark Rein, I just found out that my mouth never stops talking and I am very annoying and I have nothing really important to say. Just STFU Mark, go make a game.
SoulBlade @ Aug 15th 2007 6:47PM
um.. his group made gears of war.. my guess from your comment is your a 360 kinda guy (or girl)... praise him for making 360 games but hate on him for actually appreciating something the ps3 offers? yea... i dont know if Rein's the one that needs to STFU.
Nixon @ Aug 15th 2007 7:32PM
Have you played GOW online blows
mccomber @ Aug 15th 2007 5:02PM
Didn't we already have this flamewar today?
cc123 @ Aug 15th 2007 5:02PM
Can the Anti-Bluray Cheerleading Squad from the Heavenly Sword sound thread please use their magical fanboy skills to spin this one?
Does Epic suck now? ;)
Maybe some of the wannabe compression experts could lend them a hand so they can fit all the maps on a DVD9.
mr nimblewick @ Aug 15th 2007 5:08PM
Ooo, I know! A big .zip file!
But really, as a dedicated Wii gamer, I have to side with the 360 on this one.
cc123 @ Aug 15th 2007 5:13PM
A big zip file *might* work if there was a guaranteed HD to install the files on. =P
mr nimblewick @ Aug 15th 2007 5:15PM
Have you seen that Cheez-it commercial with the giant wheel of cheese that rolls down the hill and hits the tiny cracker to fill it with that huge cheddar taste?
It could be just like that.
God, I love cheez-its.
Vidikron @ Aug 15th 2007 5:03PM
Pure propaganda. I've been reading comments for months from our very own astute Joystiq readers that BR is useless. Rein has no idea what he is talking about.
Silver R. Wolfe @ Aug 15th 2007 5:19PM
Yes, because the guy making the game obviously knows less than the people waiting for him to finish making the game.
pwnetheus @ Aug 15th 2007 5:31PM
@Silver R. Wolfe
http://www.sarcasmdetector.com/
hotnutz @ Aug 16th 2007 11:27PM
Astute? Are we reading the same comments from the pack of ravenous animals known as joystiq fans?
Face the facts, Microsoft stuck with last gen storage technology and rushed a console to market. They are getting what they deserve for screwing the early adopters who believed they were purchasing a product that would be good 3-4 years from the day they bought it.
ishred @ Aug 15th 2007 5:07PM
sounds like the xbox fanboys have nothing to say..but i'm sure it will be something like "but i can download all the content they can't fit on a disc".
bottom line is more space is ALWAYS better.
Zeus the God @ Aug 15th 2007 5:52PM
Bottom line: 2 DVDs are cheaper to produce than one Blu-ray disc.
Bottom line #2: PS3 is still too expensive, and Blu-ray is an expensive alternative to a small inconvenience. (a.k.a. switching discs)
SoulBlade @ Aug 15th 2007 6:55PM
blu ray's will get cheaper to produce and most devs (at least from talking to a former EA dev that i work with) tend to shy away from making games that require multiple discs because they actually take the user into account. He used the analogy about using floppies and having to swap them, etc and how it seems to be a step backwards.
Of course, you could always install stuff to a HD, but the 360 isn't guaranteed one. Bummer. But, there's still great games for it, and I doubt it will have any problems - but i really wonder how everyone's going to react if a developer comes out and says the ps3 version of some game is the best one because there's less of a problem with storage and a guaranteed HD.
joystiq will probably fold.
PinstripeBert @ Aug 16th 2007 12:56PM
Great idea for just making them download the extra content. Except: MS won't let devs give away DLC, therefore you get to pay extra (plus pay bandwidth) for what the PS3 has right on the BD.
Sloar @ Aug 15th 2007 5:15PM
I think Joystiq likes to poke at it's readers until they fight similar to Michael Vick. Seriously, it's like the Joystiq Kennel in here today.
Jake @ Aug 15th 2007 5:18PM
Yes, a game in which the PS3 version might be slightly superior. That is, assuming the graphics are on par or better than the 360 version. It sounds like they will be, though.
Bluray is on a roll today. First, the most sound ever stuffed into a game. Now, the potential for more multiplayer maps in UT3, or at least the luxury of not having to download them to the HDD.
I still think the $140 in cost would have been better used on RAM, HDD, and the GPU, but it is certainly nice to see a 3rd party take advantage of some of that leg room, even if it is just a few multimaps.
Mustang @ Aug 15th 2007 5:41PM
Ya, go bluray! See we need the extra space! Wait, wont UT3 be installed onto the HD for PS3? So technically the extra maps could be a free download or extra disc! No WAY. My head is going to explode from all this thinking.
Zeus the God @ Aug 15th 2007 5:53PM
Yeah, Sony needs all that space to put all their hot air...
SoulBlade @ Aug 15th 2007 6:57PM
let's see.. make the consumer download free maps, or ship them with the game because you can... tough call.
Dave @ Aug 15th 2007 5:23PM
I'm still hoping Microsoft changes their minds about allowing games to be put on HD-DVD as an additional option for developers.
SoulBlade @ Aug 15th 2007 7:04PM
oh the ridiculing if that ensues... now require your gamers to go out and buy the hd-dvd player to play a certain game. m$ definitely won't do that.. unless they want to take another billion dollar hit and buy everyone a HD-DVD drive ;)
Dave @ Aug 15th 2007 9:42PM
Right. Making it a requirement wouldn't be an option. I was just remarking that I wish they would allow that as an additional option if the developers/publishers wanted it. That way, you might have a single disc with all maps or a DVD with the option to download the maps.
Id's new game will be released on two DVDs for 360 and one Blu-Ray disc for PS3. If Microsoft loosened the restriction, though, and id elected to take advantage of it, those with HD-DVD drives could get the game on a single HD-DVD disc. That doesn't force anyone to buy anything. It's just an additional form of distribution.
SoulBlade @ Aug 15th 2007 10:50PM
ah interesting... im not sure m$ would do that from a business perspective since there's probably a small percentage that actually would take advantage of the hd-dvd - im not sure what the production cost of a hd-dvd game is, but im not sure m$ would want to take that hit to satisfy a small percentage of their install base.
Singard @ Aug 15th 2007 5:24PM
Is it just me, or does it seem like Mark Rein has forgotten all about the huge success Gears was for Epic on XBOX 360? Before Gears and all the marketing dollars Microsoft dumped into it, Epic had yet to have a console hit.
Normally, I could care less about the console "war," whatever that means, but I really dislike Mark Rein -- he just seems to go out of his way to take sides and alienate potential customers. Rein is obviously playing to the PS3 base, and I'm becoming less and less likely to pick up UT3 when it's finally released on 360 as a result. You don't see Ubi Soft for instance going out and taking sides -- they put the Clancy games out on both (Splinter Cell: Conviction notwithstanding), and are generally positive about both.
The reality is, UT3 is not coming out on PC on Blu-Ray -- it's coming out on DVD. Is the PC deficient because Blu-Ray hasn't taken off yet as a PC data storage format? Will the PC be getting less game because of it? Absolutely not.
This is all to excite the PS3 owners to buy UT3, and to entice 360 players into buying a PS3 because the 360 release will be so "inferior."
Rein is basically saying: "You're getting so much more than the hated 360 ever will." This seems like a counterproductive approach, especially since the 360 has a larger user-base, and that user-base buys a lot more games than the PS3's base does.
I have no doubt that he'll be front in center next March, pitching how awesome UT3 is on the XBOX 360, all of this negative talk about the 360 forgotten. Which just goes to show just how swarmy and disengenuine Epic is.
mr nimblewick @ Aug 15th 2007 5:27PM
Not to mention he blatantly ignores the Wii. Sheesh.
cc123 @ Aug 15th 2007 5:30PM
Using the PC is a very bad example. The game could come on 10 dvds and it wouldn't matter since it gets installed to the HD anyway.
Also read Mark's comment at the epic forums, he wasn't bashing the 360 your just interpreting it that way.
Nice to see I was right though, Epic sucks now. lol
DBX00 @ Aug 15th 2007 5:39PM
Did you read the post? He clearly says that he has nothing against the XBOX360 and that you can possibly get the content through downloadable content. Also, PC compression is light years ahead of the XBOX360 and regardless each game has to be optimized to run off the DVD. PC users have the luxury of a hard drive in every system, so they can compress the hell out of the maps and just 'install' them.
JL @ Aug 15th 2007 5:43PM
Round 2 *ding ding* Fight!
Oliver @ Aug 15th 2007 5:50PM
"Normally, I could care less about the console "war," whatever that means"
It seems even you Americans don't know what they mean when they "could care less". So how much less could you care about the console war? Maybe only a little less so it's actually very important to you? Maybe you could care a lot less so it's not important at all?
Patrick @ Aug 15th 2007 7:55PM
dbx how is the compression light years ahead?
can you run a whole game on there without installing it?
xXFenixKnight13Xx @ Aug 15th 2007 9:56PM
Man that was a well put post. Good shit man, good shit. I agree with you 100% on everything you just said.
Asperger Syndrome @ Aug 15th 2007 5:31PM
I demand Sony make their 832nd propriety format, redgreenbluearsehole-ray, that can hold 355 yottabytes of information, with read/write speeds of 1350 kB/s. Because all good games are a minimum of 29 petabytes. Let's all face facts Killzone 2 will be utter shite compared to Unreal Tournament 17,653.
Ihya @ Aug 15th 2007 5:31PM
Blu-ray... PS3 lasting for 10 years on the market... Already hitting upper limit for DVD for games, less than a year into the PS3 life-cycle...
Are the haters coming out of denial yet?
PinstripeBert @ Aug 16th 2007 12:59PM
Of course not.
rdj75 @ Aug 15th 2007 5:33PM
"The reality is, UT3 is not coming out on PC on Blu-Ray -- it's coming out on DVD. Is the PC deficient because Blu-Ray hasn't taken off yet as a PC data storage format? Will the PC be getting less game because of it? Absolutely not."
You made a pretty damn good point, the pc version is coming out on dvd and the pc version will have the best looking version out of the three so whats the point of talking all this bluray stuff if the pc's dvd version will be the best anyway?
cc123 @ Aug 15th 2007 5:37PM
How the hell is it a good point if games on the PC get installed to the HD?
loungemonkey @ Aug 15th 2007 5:40PM
Maybe because a PC is not a 360.
God if you can not see the huge difference a PC has compared to a 360, you need to do a little more research buck-o
rdj75 @ Aug 15th 2007 7:10PM
Thank you loungemonkey for understanding what I was saying. Unfortunately there are other jackasses in the world that don't know their elbo from their asshole.
cc123 @ Aug 15th 2007 7:35PM
err...your agreeing with Singard above who is trying to say that since the best(PC) version is coming on dvd then the bluray stuff is just hype.
He is very wrong to use that since the PC is a different kind of platform to the consoles. The media type on the PC doesn't matter so much because games get installed anyway.
So unless you were being sarcastic and I missed it, something is wrong with the "point".
rdj75 @ Aug 15th 2007 9:10PM
How can the pc not matter, its obviously just as much a game system as a ps3 or xbox360. The whole point was that it has nothing to do with bluray hype or not, its the fact that bluray is not necessary for games in that sense. Whats wrong with just playing a game I can actually install on my ps3's harddrive instead of pushing a new format, which for the most part has proven anything at all(for gaming anyway).
Why not say, to hell with bluray and instead each and every ps3 has atleast a 300gb harddrive that we can install games on using standard dvd9 format. Why should we be forced into a format war, why not just give us a choice on what we want versus what we don't want in a gaming console.
Now don't get me wrong, I can obviously see how beneficial bluray or even hd-dvd can be when it comes to other applications but primarily for gaming? thats something sony should have waited on. If the ps3 had a dvd drive with a significantly larger harddrive, the ps3 would potentially be where the wii is and the 360 would be dead last.
lawlersauce @ Aug 16th 2007 2:41AM
Uhhh...the point of having Blu-Ray is so we WOULDN'T have to have 300GB HDDs and so we DON'T have to "just install" games to the PS3. That's the luxury of a GAMING console...just pop in the game and it goes. No installing.
At the same time that is the luxury of a PC, you can install all you want because ALL PCs have HDDs unlike 360s.
And that is the point he is making. All PCs have HDDs and are almost always going to have better versions of games because there is unlimited amount of compression that can occur because you can uncompress when you install the game on the PC.
...dumbasses on joystiq...gotta love em.
pwnetheus @ Aug 15th 2007 5:35PM
The thing that worries me most about having to download those extra maps that couldn't fit on dvd for the 360 is that they'll package it as a "Map Pack" and charge us 800 points for it...
Mr Intel @ Aug 15th 2007 5:42PM
exactly
deaftly @ Aug 15th 2007 5:36PM
does no one remember multiple game disc's, space is never an issue
mr nimblewick @ Aug 15th 2007 5:42PM
Is it near my stash? Um... mustache!