Molyneux: Xbox Live 'far more impactful' than Wii waggle

Meh, I have both so no worries here.

Well if you guys want to split hairs, let's talk XBAND.

--On both SNES and Genesis
--User Profiles with Avatars and Scores
--Supported killer apps like Super Street Fighter II, Mortal Kombat and NBA Jam
--User base was
--Online Multiplayer
--Leaderboards
--IMing/email/chatting

Then there's Nintendo Satellaview in Japan and Sega Channel in America if we wanted to discuss Online content distribution. Had the N64DD succeeded commercially, Gamecube might have had a better chance at Online (because Nintendo had already created a full-fledged network for demos, user-created content, etc...).

So far, XBL is still a costly endeavor for MS. Though that isn't to say they did a good job of hanging on to its significance.

XBand was so awesome. I still have mine. I won't tell you what my name was though.

I'm not sure if I entirely agree with him. Is online gaming impactful? Definitely. More impactful than the wii remote? Too early to say, but I think, in the long run, yes as well. Is XBox Live specifically more impactful? Not at all. Online gaming was done (and done well) on PCs loooooong before Microsoft implemented the same ideas in consoles. Microsoft may have been the first to do it well on the console, but I think you'll find the majority of online gaming, especially since WoW, is done on the PC.

So you can't really compare the two without making that distinction. XBox Live is not a new idea. It's just an idea done *well*. I think a more accurate statement would be "Online gaming more impactful than Wii waggle" (I hate that term, waggle- it's nothing more than a straw man). So, double revision: "Online gaming more impactful than motion controls." Unfortunately, without mentioning Sony, Nintendo, or Microsoft, your headline isn't going to attract people, because honest, responsible journalism is unpopular, for some reason.

I think a better question here is why is Peter Molyneux even opening his mouth? He has yet to make a game that didn't completely fail on its promises. He's what Will Wright would be if Will Wright just abandoned games halfway through development and released them anyway. I also think Peter Molyneux is an arrogant prick, though, so there's that.

-Moses

And don't tell me you didn't notice the casual takeover of the entire industry. It happened years ago. You nerds like to think it started with the DS and the Wii for some reason.

The best selling game of 2006 was Madden.
The 2nd was Cars.
The 3rd was Lego Star Wars II.

Let's take a look at 2005 now.
1. Madden
2. Pokemon Emerald
3. Gran Turismo 4

Yes, the casuals have taken over.

This is okay though.

I remember a time when we were all casuals, learning how to play these newfangled games together. Then some of us got too big for our britches and started bitching and moaning about the new kids learning how to play down the street. Chill out everybody. Casuals have always owned this market.

He could be right, but we will see if Xbox720 and PS4 have motion sensing controls. Then it's the same deal with the analog stick, how every system now has at least one.

Wasn't Nintendo the first company to have an analog stick in their console? (N64).

I do agree with some of what he says, but having an online feature in a game was something that was done many years before the Xbox came out. Microsoft just put it in a nice neat package, and did a great job of marketing it.

It will come down to 4 years from now when the Xbox720 comes with sports demos and a motion sensing controller... or PS4 does the same... then you know which was more impactful. If no one uses the motion sensing controls and they all have online service like Xbox Live, then you know it was more impactful.

Personally, I think the new controls will have more impact. It's an entirely new way to experience the games.

My take:

Wii remote is doing more for gaming NOW (just look at sales charts, look at the glories heaped upon the MP3 control scheme)

But a unified online system like LIVE is definitely going to have more impact long-term, changing the interactive nature of console gaming

although motion controls and a network interface will both be essential to reach Virtual Reality (the epitome of gaming)

Theres no point having a discussion when all one person does is put his fingers in his ears and shout 'lalalalalala'.

The lag is real, I already said its not that big of a deal, but its there.

Some people prefer manual transmissions, others prefer automatic. Either way, they both take you to the same place.
Maybe y'all should stop arguing about which one is better, and just enjoy the ride.

The next Xbox might very well have motion controls but you can bet both Sony and Nintendo will have pulled their heads out of their asses and created a decent online system. How the online delay will hurt them is that once you get a collection of online friends on LIVE you're probably NEVER going to change systems. You've already collected friends who you have things in common with, people you like to game with. Why dump that for PS4 or 5 online in the future. I don't think that is something Sony or Nintedo even thought about. The motion controller should have come out decades ago as most people 30 and under are comfortable with a standard Xbox or PS3 controller. Why dumb it down now Nintendo? That said the real deal is that Nintendo is selling the hell out of the Wii!

LIVE's been around for what now, 5 years? It's had a chance to grow and mature; give the wiimote another 3 or 4 years, a chance for some true quality software to pop up (like Galaxy and Zelda Wii), and then maybe we can make an honest assessment on the kind of effect it had on the industry.

Any serious gamer, or gamers who used Sega's Activator know that the Wii waggle is full of hype. Two years ago I bought Sega's Activator for $5 bucks off ebay (even came with Street Fighter II), I had found brief enjoyment out of literaly kicking and punching in the game of Virtua Fighter for 32X but the novelty had worn off quickly. I find it surprising today people are seeing Nintendo's latest console as being innovative and that people are actually believing this will change gaming. I predict this time next year PS3 will have surpass Wii while Xbox 360 will still have the North American market lead.

Mega: What systems from the 70s had true analog control? As far as I know, they had sticks that really just corresponded to digital control. I could be wrong, though.

Anyway, I'd be interested to see if Nintendo really does copy Live. We can all agree that Live is a very good system. We can all agree that friend codes are asinine and stupid. But casual gamers don't seem to care; look at the DS, it has as many online players as the XBox (granted in a less involved capacity, I would imagine, and for free), and it uses friend codes in full effect. Once the Wii gets some more online games, I wouldn't be all that surprised to see the same. XBox Live and friend codes seem to represent the hardcore vs. casual aspects of online gaming. Of course we like XBox Live, but we also check every single box and chest in an RPG to wring all the money out of the game to buy the absolute best weapon. Casual gamers maybe just want to play against their friend, so putting in a code every once in a while, without all the leader boards and whatnot, works just fine. You guys like to call things like Wii Sports and Raving Rabbids "waggle," but they sell (very) well and people seem to like them. Maybe XBox Live and friend codes are just another example of that difference. Take that that as you well.

(On a side note, to whoever keeps saying Wii software sales are awful need only look at a sales chart to see otherwise. The Wii already has 8 games that have sold more than a million copies, Wii Play in particular closing in on 5 million, more than the XBox 360's top selling game, Gears of War. Additionally, Twilight Princess outsold the XBox 360's next best selling game, Oblivion, by a good 600,000 units, and that's *including* Oblivion's PC sales and *excluding* Twilight Princess's Gamecube sales. I excluded Wii Sports since 6+ million of its 8+ million sales are due to pack ins. Sorry, lengthy aside.)

-Moses

Until he promises to write Dungeon Keeper 3, this man has only half my respect :p

I'll be pissed off if I have to play Halo 4 the way I play Metroid Prime 3. Take that as you will.

Well, I haven't read all of the comments (because, I mean, why would I?) but niether "innovation" is technically new. Just because they were done in a popular way on the Wii and 360 doesn't mean they were actually innovative.

As mentioned, motion controls have been around long before the Wii brought them to the mainstream. Also, I seem to remember getting onto SegaNet on my Dreamcast and playing games online there, as well as getting extra downloadable content for games like Phantasy Star Online. So...yeah. Adding the ability to have a friends list doesn't make something innovative.

A GO: I helped run and watched a 66 person Halo 2 tournament yesterday, and watching that after spending about 20 hours last week on Metroid Prime 3, I'm convinced that *anyone* who thinks dual analog is a better control scheme than the wii remote done well for first person games has their head so far up their ass they could give themselves an oral enema. An analog stick, controlled by your thumb, is just inherently a worse way to control your view in 3D. You need your wrist to give you proper control, and that's why the wii remote is light years ahead of dual analog, and that's why a mouse and keyboard is even better than the wii remote. To really have the most control over your view, and to keep it all smooth instead of a series of jerky thumb movements (which is how ALL dual analog FPS games work- if you don't believe me, watch someone play one). People can bash "waggle" controls like in Twilight Princess or the minigame collections all they want, and they have a point, but Metroid Prime 3's control scheme obliterates anything for a first person game on the console, easily, and I'm getting kind of irritated that some people aren't recognizing it as such. As far as I'm concerned, it's no longer a matter of opinion, and I don't care how arrogant that makes me sound.

-Moses

I'd say that Yes, XBox Live had more impact, but it was going to come one way or another. Wii brought in something new to the table instead.

Basically, XBox Live brought us to where our current technologies would lead to, but Wii gives a sign of where to head next. Both commendable in their own right. (Now would someone please merge the two together?)

I'm still not convinced that the controls for MP3 is better than MPH, but I've yet to see the game in action. (But if I'm not wrong, it's still an updated version from the 1st generation waggle FPS controls instead of a total redoing, and I'm judging based on my belief that the said control scheme is inherently flawed.) Eitherway, I'll know when it somes out in Australia. Grr.

The Wiimote was originally develop for the Gamecube system. Since the Gamecube wasn't selling well, they decided to give it a "makeover" and re-release using an alias, Wii. Wikipedia.

Wii is not about the controller. Wii is a *brand*. Wii is not the hardware. It's not the Wiimote. It's not the Balance Board (or whatever it will be called). It's the brand. You need to step outside the small videogame circles for a while and look at the entertainment business in general. Does you mother know what Xbox Live is?

It's only more "impactful" for real gamers. Casual gamers will tolerate just about anything, due to lack of experience.

Besides, why would Nintendo want online gaming, when they can push multiplayer, which in turn increases the sale of more controllers? Why pay money to operate servers when you can make money selling a zillion accessories?

Xbox live has had very little impact so far.. its just a more polished and controlled version of PC multiplayer environments.

Where I agree that Xbox Live WILL have a pretty massive impact is in transitioning the Xbox brand from a gaming device to a set top box.

Sony will probably win the Blueray/HDDVD battle.. but xbox live is the first successful attempt at downloadable movies.. and i think that in making the xbox an online media centre its gonna be very "impactful"

I knew the Nintendo fan boys would jump on this one like flies on shit but damn! It's like 4 pages of fan boys from all camps just jerking themselves off at how awesome they think they are.

lol coming from the man that brought us Fable... I stopped believing him on the launch day