Microsoft: better 360 sales in 08; Europe is the key
by Scott Jon Siegel 
{ Dec 20th 2007 at 8:35AM }
The statement comes as a response to the 360's lagging sales in Japan, where both the Nintendo Wii and Sony PlayStation 3 have dominated. Bell states that upcoming major releases from Japanese developers should assist the console in that region, while increasingly strong sales in Britain, France and Germany will pave the way in 2008.
Bell also took a few jabs at Nintendo during the discourse, stating that Microsoft has benefited somewhat from rampant Wii shortages, and that Nintendo first-party successes on the console have crippled opportunities for third-party developers.
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Supino @ Dec 20th 2007 8:58AM
yeah - half of us that have one now, need a new one next year. *drumhit*
Obie @ Dec 20th 2007 9:03AM
I do wonder how they will pull it off without a Halo title. Nintendo and Sony have some of their premiere titles lined up in 08. But then again, the gaming world is totally unpredictable...maybe MS can whip out the Gears sequel by the end of next year.
Necki @ Dec 20th 2007 12:10PM
Isn't "Halo wars" set to be released before the end of next year?
Obie @ Dec 20th 2007 5:32PM
I find RTS's boring personally, and giving it a lick of "Halo paint" isn't enough to sway my money, and I am sure I am not alone.
jsn @ Dec 20th 2007 9:15AM
Europe pretty much sells itself. Our games translate for them. Japan is a different monster. They don't need it to "win" this generation, but getting a foot in the door there and doing well (relatively) is key for the next generation. Japan isn't the bellweather of gaming that it has been in the past.
People act like Microsoft has played every card they had for their console and just don't have anything left in the bank as far as games go for 08.. I think they'll be surprised in the coming months..
ikiryou @ Dec 20th 2007 9:20AM
He can take cheap shots at Nintendo all he wants to, but in the end, they're the ones giving it to him deep, wide and continuously. Taste the rainbow, Jeff Bell.
Japanese Charts for the Week Ending 16th December 2007
source: http://www.vgchartz.com/japweekly.php?date=39432
jsn @ Dec 20th 2007 9:30AM
The Wii hype will fade over time. People will get tired of gamecube games with hacked up controls, typical nintendo character retreads or last decade looking games that don't even use the Wiimote. When that happens MS and Sony will be there with more capable consoles at a more attractive price. It will happen.
ikiryou @ Dec 20th 2007 9:41AM
It's not just the Wii that's dominating the gaming scene in Japan. The portable systems are making a killing, too, and that's a factor that won't be changing anytime soon. Lost Odyssey for the 360 debuted at number 6 during the week of 12.09, but dropped to a lower position than Dragon Quest IV [DS] and Monster Hunter 2 Portable[PSP] during the following week. They've got a solid chance with Kingdom Under Fire: Circle of Doom, though the outcome remains to be seen.
If MS wants to get a solid foot in the door of Japan, they'd better come up with a portable gaming solution with games which will appeal to Japanese gamers. Japanese games appeal to lots of American gamers, but the same isn't true for American games and J-gamers.
jsn @ Dec 20th 2007 9:44AM
I would just hope that they don't rush into that market willy nilly. I think they'd be better off waiting till the next gen and debuting a new console along with a new, well planned portable.
I think their japan strat is solid though. You can't go there and force yourself on them. Just slowly build the notion of quality games with them and they will eventually come to your side. As they've stated, it will take a couple of console generations to really get in.
Terry @ Dec 20th 2007 9:21AM
I want to play Xbox 360 games. But I also want a system that doesn't scratch discs or overheat or RRoD. Nobody, I mean NOBODY I know with an Xbox 360 has had a problem-free time of it. Which is a shame, because there are lots of games that rock.
If Microsoft released a radical redesign that addresses these hardware problems, I'd buy a 360 in a second.
Oh, and built in HD-DVD wouldn't hurt either.
pezman726 @ Dec 20th 2007 9:49AM
I have not had a single problem with my 360! Purchased in June of 06. they fixed the disk scratching right away, keep it in a ventilated place and it shouldn't overheat. I haven't had a RROD (I know 2 people that have) but if it does, so what, it's got a 3 year warranty!!! I hate people complaining about problems that are no longer problems (or that never really were unless you were mis-using your console, i.e. moving it around while a disk was spinning!).
Obie @ Dec 20th 2007 10:07AM
"I hate people complaining about problems that are no longer problems "
People are allowed to complain if they have a $400 product that craps out on them constantly( 3 times in my case ).
Terry @ Dec 20th 2007 10:08AM
Just last weekend I was at a friends house checking out their copy of Rock Band. While Rock Band does involve a bit of movement (standing to play guitar, hitting drum pads) in the middle of a song it suddenly crapped out. Eject the disc and it looks like someone took a can opener to it, and now 5 tracks don't work. This wasn't excessive motion or "moving" the Xbox 360 while spinning... it was just the regular amount of motion present in any room. So now I'm looking on-line cause you say the problem's been "fixed"... if by fixing you mean you have to disassemble your disc drive and insert after-market rubber pads.
And I also concede that at least Microsoft has extended the factory warranty to three years to cover RRoD. But I don't really look forward to buying a system with the expectation that I'll have to be without it for a few months within a year or two. It's not like they advance ship you a new one before you have to send your old one in... And what happens after three years? I still have every system I've ever bought over the last 30 years, and play them quite regularly. My Sega CD just bought the dust last month after FIFTEEN YEARS of faithful service. (Thank goodness my TG-16 CD is still working, I'd hate to lose 15 years of "Y's" save files... :knock on wood:) It's not like in three years 360s will be $20 at every pawn shop in town so replacing it won't be a big deal, in 3 years it will still probably be at least $250... to me that is simply not acceptable.
Reasonable people may disagree, of course. But it's not like the things I've said aren't true.
jsn @ Dec 20th 2007 10:08AM
I'm on the same side as the first follow up poster. I've had mine since launch without a single issue. Of all my friends with 360's only one has had RRoD. The rest have been completely problem free. I'd say we're running a 3-5% "issue rate" amongst my friends.
And again, it does have a 3 year warranty which IMO is a real tangible value. You don't find many electronics that offer beyond a one year warranty.
borland502 (SDF - Macross Ring) @ Dec 20th 2007 11:27AM
"And again, it does have a 3 year warranty which IMO is a real tangible value."
For a problem that quality control should have caught. If they had granted you a general warranty, yeah they might have deserved kudos. But this 3 year "blessing" is merely a device to ward off a recall. It isn't a general warranty, the offer is valid only for RRoD.
I don't quite get this reflexive blindness towards a major hardware failure. I didn't thank jeebus and Sony every time I adjusted the laser level in my PS2 for the DRE problem. I had a lot of fun with my PS2, but that doesn't excuse the defect.
Have fun with the 360; it is a fun system. But no Virginia, just because you didn't have the problem doesn't mean that 33% of all owners don't. Likewise, the disc scratching problem was due to a defective drive on a smaller fraction of consoles...not because a mass of people suddenly decided to shake their $400 device silly while playing.
A console is not your girlfriend. You need not make excuses in order to keep playing.
pezman726 @ Dec 20th 2007 11:36AM
"Just last weekend I was at a friends house checking out their copy of Rock Band. While Rock Band does involve a bit of movement (standing to play guitar, hitting drum pads) in the middle of a song it suddenly crapped out. Eject the disc and it looks like someone took a can opener to it, and now 5 tracks don't work. "
Then your friend must have a launch unit that was missing the pads on the disk drive...which would mean that IT HAS NOT RROD'd!!!! Because after that initial run, they fixed the disk drives. Now, i'm not standing by the hardware failure rate...it shouldn't be that bad. All I'm saying is if you treat it like any piece of expensive electronics, with a little care, it should last you.
Terry @ Dec 20th 2007 11:54AM
"Then your friend must have a launch unit that was missing the pads on the disk drive...which would mean that IT HAS NOT RROD'd!!!! Because after that initial run, they fixed the disk drives."
That may well be, they got it last Xmas. I'm happy to hear that at least that problem has been fixed. Honestly, I only know three people with 360s... this guy, whom I don't know much about his play habits (just met him through work a few weeks ago), my cousin who's had his for about three months now, and my fellow gamer friend who's on his third in two years.
Maybe I'll warm up to it soon. My understanding was the primary cause of RRoD was the lack of heat-dissipation space as the GPU is wedged directly under the optical drive. If that is true (and like I said, I want one of these, so I've been doing some research) there isn't much Microsoft could do short of a complete redesign. I'm hopeful that the proposed switch to a higher-nanometer trace that has been rumored to be coming soon will lower the GPU operating temperature enough for it to not be a problem... but until I start seeing multiple articles here on Joystq along the lines of "New 360's are problem free!" for a few weeks, I'm just too gun-shy. Sure I could get lucky and get a "good" unit, but it seems the odds of getting a "not so good" unit are too high for my taste. Even non-gamers know the 360 has a poor reputation for quality. I'm just saying I want some rather massive promise on the part of Microsoft that "steps have been taken" before I risk it. And even then I'm gonna wait a few more months for the supply channels to run out of the older models before I buy...
Freelance @ Dec 20th 2007 12:51PM
"Of all my friends with 360's only one has had RRoD. The rest have been completely problem free. I'd say we're running a 3-5% "issue rate" amongst my friends."
So you are saying that you have somewhere between 20 to 33 friends with 360s that you keep tabs on and only one has had a problem. I find that hard to beleive.
Speddy @ Dec 20th 2007 9:26AM
Too bad UK repair depots told MS to bugger off. And for good reason.
Dirt @ Dec 20th 2007 9:29AM
But I thought Europe was supposed to be Sonys savior!!
Hahahahahaha
Phranctoast @ Dec 20th 2007 9:47AM
Sony's selling very well in Europe. Outselling MS there... not really understanding your point.
glitched @ Dec 20th 2007 9:53AM
I think this means, he is telling us to expect a price drop that will really boost sales...?
Zsavior @ Dec 20th 2007 9:54AM
The more I see the end of the year sales the more I think PS3 might be a dark horse in this game console war. I think the same games that propelled the Xbox360 this year are going to hurt it. I been watching that GT bonus round thing and somethings they say are crap but with everything they say I am thinking of other avenues.
The fact is a lot of Xbox360 games, are excellent shooters but they seem to give the same feeling. I don't know how to put my finger on it. I want to get an xbox360 for games like ME but I don't want to play every shooter like Halo, Gears, and such. Then I went to GT just now and I saw a video game Called Valkyrie Battle field. It is a shooter, it has FPS elements and what seems to be 3rd person also, and I almost felt myself immediately want to play it.
I am not saying that American shooters are bad, or not quality. What I am saying is XBOX360 seems to be strangled with the same kind of game that kind of turns off the appeal to it, while enticing other audiences. The PS3 has Orange box(even if flawed) it has U3, but it also has games coming like FF XIII and MGS4. It is like there is room for both in that world while Xbox360 only wants one thing.
If N'Gai Coral is right, and MS tries to switch gears to take on Nintendo I don't know I feel like they will get left behind. I think the secret to MS doing well everywhere is opening up their library, towards the gamers that want both worlds, Japanese styled and Western styled games a like. Don't get me wrong it feels like MS has a lot of great games, AAA titles, it just feels like a lot of those titles are the same type of game. And while America is eating it up I don't think Japan, Europe and abroad favors it just as openly. It feels as if they are trying to push these games as what everybody wants, rather than embracing many different games and producing for everybody. But this is my opinion, MS might have a totally different plan that will work for Europe I guess all we can do is wait and see.
Obie @ Dec 20th 2007 10:09AM
Too long, did not read..lol.
Mez Jr @ Dec 20th 2007 10:31AM
I'm not sure thats the case, I think the premium (American style) shooters make it to the 360 and the reason why they seem so prevalent to you is that its probably the most popular genre on any console right now.
Just because there are more shooters on the 360 does not mean that there are less of other kinds of games.
From a hardware perspective though I think the PS3 specifically lends itself to Japanese style RPGs, since they use a lot of pre-rendered video and we all know about the Blu-Ray capacity.
jsn @ Dec 20th 2007 10:15AM
long winded... You talk that MS has all these FPS shooters and skirt the fact that Sony is trying to do the same thing. Look at their big expected titles, Haze, Killzone... MGS is different, but MS has Splinter Cell, which is MGS but better. FF will be on 360 in some form, but MS has Mass Effect and other RPG's on the way. MS has action games, platformers, etc, all coming down the pipes. They already have racing games, sports games, family games, music games...
THe notion that all the 360 has is FPS's is nonsense. Every console except the Wii (because the Wii can't handle them) has a lot of FPS's in the works and the reason for that is they're the hot type of game at the moment.
Zsavior @ Dec 20th 2007 10:37AM
Like I said before, I can't put my finger on it, but something just feels off. The WII status doesn't worry, me the people who buy the WII don't care about Xbox360 and PS3 games. But the market that is giving the Xbox360 its lead is only found in America everywhere else The Xbox360 is barely in front of the PS3 why is this?
The xbox360 has better titles, it is cheaper, it has better developed online system. Why are they barely leading in Europe and not even a blip in Japan. It has to boil down to the software, while xbox360 games are great, they aren't great for all. Flame me if you want long winded it maybe, but 2007 is their best year, and yet Sony still has chance to gain ground and surpass them. They have price point, the service, and lead so tell me what is going wrong then if it isn't the software.
Spartacus @ Dec 20th 2007 11:20AM
Zsavior,
I have the answer to that splinter in your mind... It's called brand loyalty. The PS3 is doing as well as it is because it has the words "PlayStation" plastered on the side of it.
You said it yourself- the 360 outshines the PS3 in just about every possible way as a gaming machine, but there are TONS of people who are ignorant fanboys and ignorant consumers who don't do any homework or research, they just buy something because of the brand and perceived value. The PS3 is riding on the success of the PS2, not on its own merits.
It's not that the 360 isn't doing very well- for a $350 machine, it's moving units. What is startling is that the PS3 isn't doing worse than it is considering it's abysmal marketing, bad press, lack of content and services and outrageous pricepoint (until recently). You are right, the 360 SHOULD be beating the pants off of the PS3. But I think where it feels "off" is not the 360 sales, but the PS3 sales.
Zsavior @ Dec 20th 2007 11:46AM
Thanks Spartacus and Cyro, I was wondering about Xbox360 line up in 2008 so that list helps, and Spartacus your argument makes a hell of a lot of sense I really didn't think of that side of the argument.
I think you really answered that question, I mean I just couldn't grasp what it was, but that was it. Why the hell is PS3 still doing this well. Why hasn't most people defected, that is what I was thinking. Why is this Valkyrie Battlefield game not coming to Xbox360 where more people could play it. So thanks for the response, I was really looking for an answer for the last two days now.
Cyro @ Dec 20th 2007 11:22AM
For those saying that the Xbox 360 has no games coming out in 08'. I have made up a list of the titles I am looking forward to see. The ones in Caps I believe will be good games and most probably hits.
Burnout Paradise
DArk Messiah of Might & Magic: Elements
DEVIL MAY CRY 4
LOST ODYSEEY
Supreme Commander
Battlefield: Bad Company
RAINBOW SIX VEGAS 2
Army of Two
Star Wars: The Force Unleashed
GTAIV
FABLE 2
NINJA GAIDEN 2
PROJECT OFFESET
Too Human
GEARS OF WAR 2
That doesnt look that weak. And yes I know some of them will be going out to the PS3 as well. Besides we might get MGS4 if PS3 games keep selling as bad as they are.
JJ @ Dec 20th 2007 1:33PM
actually cyro i wouldnt say PS3 games are selling bad, comparatively speaking... PS3 games re actually doing pretty good worldwide and for its install base it seems to be moving a decent amount of units.
I mean common sense would say, if it has HALF the total numbers of systems than its mainc ompetition (360) then if it sells half the total number of games, then thats a victory and i think its been doing slightly above that recently.
So its not moving overall as many units as the 360, but numbers speaking its doing the same amount of business. Which isnt bad considering its competition
maverick_saturn_626 @ Dec 20th 2007 1:46PM
Should the novelty of the Wii wear off, its PS3 Japanese will fall back onto, as well as the Europeans. For PS3 its a waiting game. PS3 only falls short because of high prices and the time taken to adjust in the market, especially with higher demand for the likes of Wii.
That doesn't mean PS3 games sell bad, just not as good as that of 360 or Wii with higher install bases. But should a knock out game release on PS3 such as MGS4, Killzone, Fifa, FF and other such titles, they would no doubt sell well. Look how well the PSP is selling, over here in Europe, the demand this year is for Wii, PSP and DS, anything else is second priority.
Funny huh? Considering PSP was classified as a no hoper a few years back, now it is directly threatening Nintendo's stranglehold over the handheld market. Not to the point Nintendo must worry that PSP could take over, but to the point that their market share in the handheld market would be AS big as it could have been thanks to that DARNED PSP.
Cyro @ Dec 20th 2007 3:31PM
@JJ:
Of Course is going to sell less than the 360 because of the install base, but nevertheless The attach rate is much lower with the PS3 than the 360 and this does not have to do with the install base.
Cyro @ Dec 20th 2007 3:31PM
@JJ:
Of Course is going to sell less than the 360 because of the install base, but nevertheless The attach rate is much lower with the PS3 than the 360 and this does not have to do with the install base.
maverick_saturn_626 @ Dec 20th 2007 4:35PM
It is? Since when? Is this to do with gaming or the console itself? Wheres the facts?
nutman @ Dec 20th 2007 12:10PM
yeah the 360 has a lot of awesome exclusive titles planned for 2008 and more are gonna be announced. Im sure there will be more than the PS3 even since theres a bigger 360 install base and 360 games have been shown to sell better.
As for the 360 in japan, its actually not doing bad. I cant think of any recent american video game console that has sold as well as the 360. Its funny though that the article says sony is "dominating" with the PS3 in japan when its really only sold a million more than the xbox 360. The "failure" has only sold a million less than the PS3.
maverick_saturn_626 @ Dec 20th 2007 1:09PM
Meh, keep your Xbox, leave us Europeans alone, you like to be unique? Then be unique :)
nick @ Dec 20th 2007 3:10PM
I would have liked to have seen Microsoft offer bigger discounts than what was made earlier this year. It was a step in the right direction, but not enough. I'd like to see another price cut in 2008.
In Japan, I'm of the mind the console should have been steeply discounted there from the very beginning. And a hardware redesign (smaller) for their market.
And the lowest end unit should come with a 20GB HD in all markets.
BLinn @ Dec 20th 2007 3:29PM
@Spartacus
You are wrong about the brand loyalty crap you just uttered.
"but there are TONS of people who are ignorant fanboys and ignorant consumers who don't do any homework or research, they just buy something because of the brand and perceived value."
Since when did choosing the PS3 over the 360 mean someone is being an ignorant fanboy? You buy a 360 with a high failure rate, you pay for online gaming, you claim you'd gladly pay for online gaming and buy another console if your current one RROD'd after your 3 year warranty and you dare call others ignorant fanboys. If i had a 360 RROD on me i'd have to send it overseas to get it fixed, i have no fear for my PS3, i like multifunctionality, i still get to play multiplatform games, i still get to play some xbox exclusives on my PC, online play is free, upcomming tittles are really cool. Considering all that i'll gladly stay an ignorant fanboy from you context.
If the 360 is your flavour then stick with it, don't go around saying stuff you know nothing of about other consoles. What would the xbox be without Halo's hype? Thats not an excuse for more sales, the 360 sold and thats what matters. Don't assume Europeans are mostly ignorant fanboys just because you have lower 360sales than the competitors, or the japanese are sony slaves. Its clear MS is missing something out if it can't properly break grounds, and from this article it looks like they have an idea what it might be.
Please stop questioning other peoples tastes, let alone insult them over it. Its just plain wrong.
Cyro @ Dec 20th 2007 3:32PM
WTF is wrong with the reply system?
BLinn @ Dec 20th 2007 3:39PM
My post would have ended up on the wrong level either way.
RPGJock @ Dec 20th 2007 6:30PM
US vs Japan in Europe?? Seem like a grudge match where their will not be much nation brand bias like here and Japan. Well except for the Wii. Ah look at the little Wii, isn't he cute.... Come on, waggle for me boy... Good boy. :P
bigsofty @ Dec 20th 2007 7:19PM
360 advertising is almost 0 in Europe ATM, so I dont really understand this silent MS uber marketing...
Christian @ Dec 21st 2007 10:27AM
I think Microsoft is setting themselves up for a beating if they bank on Europe to save their sales in 2008. The PS3 is kicking their butt in most of Europe with many European countries like France, Norway and Spain already reporting that cross platform titles sell better on the PS3 than on the Xbox360.
Sony's strong spring and summer exclusive game lineup should only strengthen this trend. If I where Microsoft I would worry more about the growing strength of the PS3 in Japan and Europe starting to affect their position in the US.