Subpoenas place other UE3 licensees in midst of Epic, Silicon Knights lawsuit
by Ross Miller 
{ Jan 24th 2008 at 12:55PM }
Said Rein to Shacknews, "I'm leaving the litigation to the lawyers but, if this is the case, I'd like to apologize to any of our licensees who Silicon Knights have inconvenienced." Should license contracts be submitted as unsealed court evidence, there is a chance the licensing fees and other trade secrets could become public record, though Epic's lawyers can move to seal court documents.
In late July, Silicon Knights filed a lawsuit against Epic Games over what it felt was inadequate support for its Unreal Engine 3 that harmed development of Too Human. Epic responded and filed a countersuit. In November, Epic's motion for dismissal was denied.
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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
samfish @ Jan 24th 2008 12:59PM
Meow meow meow meow!
TomCo @ Jan 24th 2008 1:45PM
om nom nom nom
NATO_Duke @ Jan 24th 2008 1:01PM
I would bet that the files and information they want to be kept confidential will be presented for in camera inspection by the judge - and none of it will be seen by the public. That's the standard way we all handle such matters when handling a suit. Nothing would be gained by either party by making it part of the public record.
copa @ Jan 24th 2008 1:10PM
I got $20 on the tabby.
DeltaOps101 @ Jan 24th 2008 1:16PM
We could use a few more subpoenas on the U.S. Army.
dvnt @ Jan 24th 2008 1:20PM
Companies that seem content with Epic's support are being forced to court to testify their experiences with UE3? Now these companies have to take the time, cost, and effort to go to court. Seems like SK is intent on dragging everyone down with them.
At this point, I don't care if Too Human heralds the second coming of Christ. I'm not buying their games.
flameofdoom666 @ Jan 24th 2008 1:29PM
Why would you cut your nose off to spite your face? If the game is good, you should get it, even though this whole situation is annoying.
FidliousWong @ Jan 24th 2008 2:03PM
Maybe because Dennis Dyack is pulling a Britney Spears. "It's not our fault this game sucks... you have a lost history of glitch free* and smoothly running** game releases such as Legacy of Kain: Blood Omen, Eternal Darkness, and Metal Gear Solid: Twin Snakes."
*As an affiliate of Fox News, Silicon Knights reserves the right to blatantly lie.
**We had no clue purchasing UE3 wouldn't include the "Make awesome game" command and Epic mislead us because they make awesome games.
Pretty Obvious @ Jan 24th 2008 1:25PM
I am. As far as SK's games go. They are much better in quality then anything Epic has dropped (Eternal Darkness comes to mind).
flameofdoom666 @ Jan 24th 2008 1:30PM
Eternal Darkness, and Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes were great on Gamecube. I will buy Too Human unless the reviews are horrid, which I doubt they will be.
Zootittles @ Jan 24th 2008 2:05PM
Don't forget the original Legacy of Kain, before Eidos took it over and made it a parody of what it used to be.
sheppy2.0 @ Jan 24th 2008 6:59PM
You know, I really hate to do this. I mean it, I really do, since I enjoy Silicon Knights game design ideas.
Go back and play those games mentioned. In fact, let me break something down for you.
Their true coming out game was Dark Legions. A game which many considered Copy Pasta from Archon. They lost to Warcraft in the war but you can't really judge a DOS game on performance, or rather a lack thereof so moving on.
Legacy of Kain: Blood Omen. Now I loved this game, make no mistake. But to say it was a technically well crafted game is a joke. The game constantly bogged down, audio had issues and cracking, the collision detection was pure shit, and the game itself was loaded with issues like getting hung up on geometry. The idea of the game was great, but it sure as fuck wasn't up to the quality or similar titles like Zelda or Alundra.
Eternal Darkness. once again, great game concept but it DID feature a devy of technical hiccups and issues. To ignore this fact is laughable.
Twin Snakes. no clue, never played. But I doubt Kojima would have left their usual problems fly.
Now, what are the main complaints anytime Too Human was shown? Performance issues. Now, what is the one thing Epic is usually 100% free of? Performance issues. I mean, if we're going on a company past versus company past battle on the point of the court case, there have been plenty of UE3 released games that lack performance issues.
Anticrawl @ Jan 24th 2008 8:14PM
@sheppy2.0
No offense buddy but if you picked out your favorite developer I could probably list off several reasons facts why they might not be so great and then make them sound like more of a big deal than they are. You wanna bitch about clipping? Well look at a few of the current high rated AAA titles, take COD4 for example. I found more visual glitches, technical hicups, clipping, shoddy hit detection and poorly defined objects in the first 5 minutes of playing than apparently every reviewer combined. I submitted nearly 30-50 glitch reports during the beta and the only ones they addressed were some of the out of map glitches I was using and shared with the public to the point of it being abusive. Apparently it doesn't matter in mainstream media unless it is a title that was relatively unheard of or from a small developer. Silicon Knights is a quality consistant developer and one of the few that will actually take a few risks with their games to be "new and exciting."
Ranko @ Jan 24th 2008 1:27PM
Ah,Joystiq, always with awesome pictures to back up the stories.
flameofdoom666 @ Jan 24th 2008 1:30PM
Yeps! haha
Ranus Studios @ Jan 24th 2008 2:02PM
On a relevant note, I wonder if they subpoenaed anyone from Irrational/2K Boston.
On an important note, however, that tabby is clearly going to win this bout.
ZippyDSMlee @ Jan 24th 2008 2:03PM
looking at how broken the UE3 is I can understand why they are complaining....look at all the issues GOW PC and bioshock has its no wonder one dev looked just had enough.
sheppy2.0 @ Jan 24th 2008 6:40PM
Hi, you may not know me but I'm a game engine. My task is simple. I create a unified API in which programmers can create a game. This means anything from how the engine processes the art assets to how physics are handled. I know, I know, I do sooo much. But I'm merely the building block of a game, not the game in and of itself. You see, I make it much easier for the work on a game to begin. But I am not a one size fits all. In fact, as an engine itself, many programmers will need to adapt me and fix me to suit their purposes. I am the starting step, not the finish line. Likewise, as an engine, I am always changing, always adapting to handle things I could not handle before to handling things better. Just because you saw my debut in a game like Doom 3 does not mean when I return for Quake 4, I won't run much better and faster. In fact, between years, I'm capable of sooo much more.
Nice to meet you.
Mark Methenitis @ Jan 24th 2008 2:14PM
A little Law of the Game commentary on the possible motive behind this move:
http://lawofthegame.blogspot.com/2008/01/epic-vs-skilcon-knights-saga-continues.html
Anticrawl @ Jan 24th 2008 3:00PM
They are/were suing Epic because they didn't supply Silicon Knights specifically with an update(s) that was required to be delivered per their contract. Silicon Knights dishes out a ton of money for the engine and support and when you don't follow through with your end of the bargan then you are simply wrong. I commend Silicon Knights for having the balls to stand up for something done wrong that caused a company a great deal of extra money and time for having to delay the game and eventually build their own engine because Epic wouldn't send the updates and support their way.
It's not a matter of Silicon Knights being douchebags. It's a matter of hey I paid for this and you promised under penalty of law that you would deliver at the agreed time but you didn't and all I ask for is you compensate my financial losses for you not providing said service and we can keep our contract and no legal action will be taken.
Then Epic just feels they can walk all over the people who keep them employed because they've made a name for themselves in the industry and have been successful lately. I don't see how you people can side with Epic. I am a HUGE Unreal Tournament fan and what they are getting away with is wrong. Quit feeding their ego and maybe they'll realize how much they need others to keep them on top.
The video game industry is already crooked and evil enough.
hvnlysoldr @ Jan 24th 2008 3:38PM
Why did Joystiq have to put up a picture of a cat fight? How is that relevant to the article. It's like saying Silicon Knights and Epic are the two cats fighting each other and making a commotion that everyone looks towards even though it's wrong.
NATO_Duke @ Jan 24th 2008 5:19PM
Because its funny. Frankie says relax!
Anticrawl @ Jan 24th 2008 8:06PM
Hohohoo.... It's funny because that's exactly what cat fights are like, hoho...
Ranus Studios @ Jan 24th 2008 9:01PM
Oh ho ho! It's funny because cats do not normally engage in fisticuffs as such! Oh ho!
Donald @ Jan 24th 2008 5:06PM
"Electronic Arts, 2K Boston/Australia, SOE, Square Enix, Ubisoft and the U.S. Army."
One of these things doesn't belong...
Andoru @ Jan 24th 2008 9:51PM
...Yeah, EA.
maverick_saturn_626 @ Jan 24th 2008 10:50PM
CATFIGHT!!!
ZippyDSMlee @ Jan 25th 2008 1:44AM
sheppy2.0
Meh the UT3 engine was a mess and by the time sub contractors got it even more so because it was underdeveloped and the sub contractors didn't want to take the time to make it right.
Look at D3 to Q4 a smother transitions in engine code more performance sure it had issues but with UE3...its issue after issue .
To date out of all the UE3 games I have played and tested UT3 is the most stable of the lot, and the reason for it is obvious they spent more time on it the rest are ham handed ports..