Turok devs blame delay on PS3 version
by Scott Jon Siegel 
{ Feb 10th 2008 at 2:30PM }
Josh Holmes, VP and studio manager at Propaganda, tells Canada.com that lead development of Turok took place on the Xbox 360, due to the console's easy compatibility with the Unreal Engine 3. Though the Xbox 360 version was finished on schedule, the PS3 version took a bit more finagling to get it "up to the standard of the 360 version."
X3F points out that Propaganda's difficulties stem somewhat from the sub-par PS3 port of Unreal Engine 3, which also led to Silicon Knights' lawsuit against Epic.
[Via X3F]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
TheGuy @ Feb 10th 2008 2:35PM
*Puts on flame suit*
rom @ Feb 10th 2008 2:45PM
OMG!!! That was the last suit!!
NOOOOOOOO!!!!
*Bursts into flames*
Ghen @ Feb 10th 2008 3:34PM
Um.. The original developed system was done first, and the port took longer? I don't see how thats a PS3 problem. Be kinda hard for the port to be done first, or even on the same week.
WhoMe @ Feb 10th 2008 4:26PM
And what do they blame the mediocrity on?
It's their own fault anyways, everyone knows you should start development for the PS3 and then port it over to the 360.
Also Silicon Knights' lawsuit against Epic wasn't because of the PS3 compatibility, damn it get it right Scott.
bigsofty @ Feb 10th 2008 5:27PM
Damn the PS3 sucks... maybe one day it will catch up with the mighty 360! :D
Anonim @ Feb 10th 2008 7:09PM
Port still suxxs
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/848/848783p3.html
"Sadly, Turok is yet another game that stumbles making the leap from the 360 to the PS3. Although the game plays identically, the visuals -- which were alright-but-not-good on the Xbox -- are worse on the PS3. As in the 360 edition, you'll walk up to ledges and trees that have really sharp edges, characters in cutscenes occasionally have an aura of shine around them -- they all look like the light of the Lord is being emitted from their bodies -- and textures pop in all the time. PS3-centric problems include more screen tearing, framerate drops, and textures that look even more fugly. This isn't the worst looking game of all time, of course. There are plenty of times you'll blow a dinosaur into tiny bits or take out a few guards with the bow and think the game looks fine, but then there are those times when it'll look like the jungle floor is painted or an attacking dino is a robot."
bobartig @ Feb 10th 2008 8:05PM
@WhoMe: If you start on PS3, PORTING it to X360 is easier, NOT the entire development process.
Leading on PS3 means the ENTIRE project takes more work, but the port is easier, meaning it is easier to stay on schedule, but the entire schedule is longer and more costly. This is throwing out the baby with the bathwater. It means making less titles, and its even harder to get approval for projects, etc. etc. and is top-down more difficult to do.
If you've got a seasonal title, like EA Madden yearly-roster-update, it could justify leading on PS3 because launch timing is so critical to sales performance, or beating 2k out with your NBA game. Launch delays are known to be deadly on sales numbers, so being as 'safe' as possible pays off here.
Leading on X360 means the entire development is faster/cheaper, but the port to PS3 is potentially a bitch, which introduces a relatively large unknown near the end, which can throw off your launch date. If your project can bear risk of delay, or your experience managing cross platform releases leads you to believe that there won't be port problems, this is the better way to go, because your entire game will cost less.
Raikage (Wii FC 5508 0487 4434 0992) @ Feb 10th 2008 2:36PM
Wait, crappy games are delayed?
BADUM TSSS
Tiptup300 @ Feb 10th 2008 6:59PM
Its only the PS3's fault because they didnt code the game properly. I'm sure some of you will say "IT WRKS ON 360 HOWS IT COD'D BADDD", well because they didnt code it dynamically. It should take full use of all the processors, this would also make the 360 version better. So to sum it all up, when coding games, try to code it so that it would work on every console, dont work on one console then at the end be like "O WAIT GUYZ, WE HAZ TO REDO DUH CODEZ"
Fernando Rocker @ Feb 10th 2008 2:37PM
Must. Resist. Bashing.
Raikage (Wii FC 5508 0487 4434 0992) @ Feb 10th 2008 2:43PM
PS3 can't handle all that black!!! Or teh dynosarz! Cell cayn't render teh nife sparklz!
Sums it up pretty good I think... No need to bash Fernando.
*Waits for itouchmyselfcuznoonelovesme*
JakubK666 @ Feb 10th 2008 3:10PM
More news like that and our good old Fernando is going to snap.You'll probably take out your AK47,load up on RPG's and storm Sony's HQ :P
qo_op @ Feb 10th 2008 3:15PM
This game is complete shit, him blaming the ps3 for his shortcomings is nothing but pure comic relief. I could see if he blamed the ps3 for something like, eating his baby.
JakubK666 @ Feb 10th 2008 4:10PM
Yeah but what if GTA IV gets delayed?
I'm pretty sure half of Joystiq would donate money to buy Fernando an M16 as a farewell gift. But then again who would provide us comic relief?
x silence x @ Feb 10th 2008 4:53PM
Wasn't GTAIV already delayed because of the PS3?
hey alex @ Feb 10th 2008 6:54PM
Uh, yeah, GTAIV already delayed presumably because of the PS3 version.
why not the LS2/LS7? @ Feb 11th 2008 3:14AM
Must. Resist. Bashing. Fernando.
And BTW, insiders at several game mags got a look at GTA IV many months before it was to be released (the first time), and it wasn't ready for prime time on 360 or PS3.
Perhaps what they're trying to say is that if they only had to release for one platform they might have been able to do it on time. But you're interpreting their comments to mean that the 360 version was ready and had to be delayed solely to wait for the PS3 version to catch up, it's just not true.
copres @ Feb 11th 2008 1:10PM
"And BTW, insiders at several game mags got a look at GTA IV many months before it was to be released (the first time), and it wasn't ready for prime time on 360 or PS3"
actually, they played the 360 version. it was unfinished, but it was the only version that was playable
B3astofthe3ast @ Feb 10th 2008 2:39PM
Considering UT3 on PS3 runs great and looks amazing, I don't think its a bad port of thd UE3....maybe epic is keeping certain tools to themselves in order to have there own unreal games look better...
FidliousWong @ Feb 10th 2008 2:42PM
That's not it. Epic keeps nothing except in game assets from licensees. And even those, they are more than generous. See Unreal Editor 3.5...
Fernando Rocker @ Feb 10th 2008 2:49PM
It doesnt look any better than Gears of War... a one year old game.
DWells55 @ Feb 10th 2008 2:59PM
I can't speak for the PS3 version, but on PC UT3 looks noticeably better than Gears of War. And on top of that, it actually has color.
Grimmus @ Feb 10th 2008 3:02PM
Fix: "...in order to have there own..." should read "in order to have their own...".
qo_op @ Feb 10th 2008 3:03PM
Dont blame your lack of creativity and now sales on the ps3. Your game wouldnt have sold even at the launch of either console. What the big question here is, when are developers finally going to stop coding for the ps3 like they are coding for the 360. That's when we'll start to see the power of the ps3. I.E look at killzone 2, Gran Turismo 5, Uncharted and Final Fantasy XIII, all looking better than anything that anyone has done on any console all because they started on the PS3.
Mal F4cti0n @ Feb 10th 2008 3:58PM
qo_op,
Did you seriously just ack us to look at cut scenes for games that haven't been released yet to see how the Unreal's engine works on the PS3?
I also like your comment;
"This game is complete shit, him blaming the ps3 for his shortcomings is nothing but pure comic relief. I could see if he blamed the ps3 for something like, eating his baby."
He wasn't blaming his shortcomings on the PS3, all he was doing was blaming the delay of the game on the PS3. I don't think he was looking for an excuse as to why his game sucks.
B3astofthe3ast @ Feb 10th 2008 4:26PM
@ Fernando...
Your ignorance sometimes baffles me. Gears of War was released one year into the 360 life, and it was being developed ONLY for the 360. UT3 was released a year into the PS3s life, and not only does it look slightly better, but they were developing the PC version at the same time. Both games were released a year into each consoles lifespan, so you can't compare them in terms of age. In fact, its amazing that infinity ward was able to get CoD4 on Ps3 to be equivelent to the 360 version, despite the fact that they've developed on the 360 before, and that it was there first PS3 game.
qo_op @ Feb 10th 2008 4:36PM
@ Mal, the only game that hasnt shows us complete "gameplay" is FFXIII and that's questionable because in the TGS trailer there are a few parts that could and may be actually be gameplay scenes. Also, the inability for his team to get the ps3 version "up to par" with the 360 version would qualify as his "shortcoming".
Vegnagun bwf @ Feb 10th 2008 10:22PM
Keeping certain tools to their selves? Epic conspiracy confirmed?
David @ Feb 11th 2008 8:12PM
COD4 was identical on both system because Activision said already that they put their BEST programmers, developers, etc on the PS3 version while the 360 had the rest of the team.
Honestly, i think they can't blame on the PS3 for delay of Turok, coz why the hell don't they just release the 360 version when it was ready? They would sell much more copies and since shooters are more popular on the 360, owners of xbox would embrace Turok much more than now.
FidliousWong @ Feb 10th 2008 2:40PM
So it took a while to get the PS3 version up to the quality of the 360 version... yet both versions severely lack quality...
Irony...
Liam @ Feb 10th 2008 2:45PM
Maybe they had to divert resources from one version to the other.
Fernando Rocker @ Feb 10th 2008 2:46PM
Sheppy
PS3 version of Dead Space is going to have the same quality as the 360 version.
The developers are saying that they are not going to downgrade the 360 just to make both versio equally... so they are struggling to make the PS3 version looks closer to the 360 version.
Theres definitely a problem with the PS3.
Raikage (Wii FC 5508 0487 4434 0992) @ Feb 10th 2008 2:51PM
Probably because the 360 is so easy because they have used it so long , basically being a PC.
The PS3 is something new, it's gonna take a while to get used to, and some determination. I'm pretty sure they will at some time be able to do some amazing things with it, some that the 360 may not be able to do... give it time.
Now why the 360=PC doesn't translate to the Wii=GC is beyond me...
FidliousWong @ Feb 10th 2008 2:52PM
Or there is a definate problem with this developer. Find one site which has praised this game. Frankly, I lost hope the moment they made this statement...
"We want players to enjoy using the knife."
Anyone who has played previous Turok games KNOWS that melee is not where the fun is. Revolver shotguns, Scorpian Missile Launchers, Cerebral Bores, Exploding Arrows, Miniguns.... no knives in there anywhere.
And what is the central complaint about this game? Lack of fun and the fact that KNIVES are the most effective weapon to the point where using guns is pointless. If they were going to go that route, why not just copy Riddick? Would have made a much better game.
As for whether or not something is wrong with the PS3, well, depends. Seriously. Some developers have had little issue and stepped up to the challenge, even getting better performance on the console. Other companies work hard to make them equal. Other companies just throw the "what the fuck" sign up and hope people buy a shitty port then complain when people don't.
You get what you put in.
Zoesch @ Feb 10th 2008 9:04PM
Raikage, are you Fernando's left nut by any chance? There's no idiotic statement from Fernando that you don't follow with yours in a promptly manner.
Also, about Dead Space, the developer said that they wanted both versions equal so the PS3 was taking the lead, not that they were "downgrading" the 360 version, it's not as if they're porting to the Wii ;)
name123 @ Feb 10th 2008 2:41PM
Too bad it didn't stop it altogether.
vidGuy @ Feb 10th 2008 2:42PM
Whether it's true or not, I think the news here is that the PS3 has pretty much become the catch-all scapegoat of the industry. Whether there's a really problem with the console and its coding or not, Sony can't be happy about the constant crap that gets blamed on the PS3. I wonder if they have tried to silence developers on this.
Raikage (Wii FC 5508 0487 4434 0992) @ Feb 10th 2008 2:46PM
The PS3 killed my family, skinned my pets alive, slapped my grandmother, and burned my house down and the near-by orphanage....
Jeff @ Feb 10th 2008 2:49PM
You sure it wasn't a 360 that burned down the house and the orphanage? :D
Raikage (Wii FC 5508 0487 4434 0992) @ Feb 10th 2008 2:53PM
Actually it, and the Wii tried their best to save some of the children... The PC was busy downloading DS games...
/spin
Liam @ Feb 10th 2008 2:43PM
I see the PS3 following a similar path to the PS2; developers calling it a complete dog to work with for most of its life, then people gradually work it out. Towards the end of its life, devs will get the best out if it. I don't think this is exactly a strategy of sorts... but I reckon that's the pattern.
jorojoserojas @ Feb 10th 2008 2:50PM
Luckily, some games out now/coming soon are showing a lot of progress and promise. I don't think we'll have to wait too long until the PS3 truly proves to be a great gaming machine.
B1gC72 - PSN: KillaKornbread @ Feb 10th 2008 3:26PM
yea i think Liam is right. the same programming nightmare happened with the PS2 at first and look how it turned out. maybe this generation, with Sony getting their arrogant asses handed to them, they might try to make the PS4 a little easier on developers since they ARE the ones that are eventually going to make you money.
Turok is still just an average/below average game anyway on the 360 and PS3 so they obviously didnt delay it enough to put the fun part in.
Anticrawl @ Feb 10th 2008 4:09PM
The reason it was a nightmare to program for were to bottlenecks in the systems design. They tried to over compensate with the PS3 and didn't notice they were actually creating a worse bottleneck in it's design. The PS3 is technically superior, but it's inferior design coupled with the fact that the OS takes up 13% of all proccesing power proves that the PS3 will never be able to catch up to the 360 in performance unless Sony updates the console's system hog of an OS and get it to match the 360's 3-4% performance usage. You have all these nifty features on the PS3 and they are great, but it has to take away from something and unfortunatly it takes away from raw power and it's overall potential.
Anticrawl @ Feb 10th 2008 4:44PM
It is a sad truth though, sad that Sony spent the time to build a powerful reliable machine with so many different features, standard hard drive and high capacity discs only to have it bite them in the ass becacause they missed the big picture. It is like when the Soviet Union had all their top scientist figure out when their greatest harvest would be, they planted so much, manufactured thousands of brand new tractors and harvesting equipment and by the time it was ready to harvest they realized the forgot to invest in oil and it eventually lead to famine and the inevitable collapse of the Soviet Union.
As a techie it is hard to justify the PS3 and it's price when you weigh out your options. I love my PS3 but I'm bitter towards Sony for adding in all these worthless features that I have other devices for and putting a beafy OS on it.
*Damn reply system*
hotnutz @ Feb 10th 2008 9:30PM
so why aren't the devs who create good quality games for the PS3 blaming it? Makes me wonder who's really at fault here - Ratchet & Clank, Heavenly Sword, Uncharted are all fantastic games (HS was 6-7 hours long but it was quality). Why aren't those devs saying that the PS3 is garbage like the developers for these crap remakes that keep coming out (you hear me Turok?)
why not the LS2/LS7? @ Feb 11th 2008 3:29AM
Anticrawl:
Interesting argument except for the fact that PS3 already caught up to the 360 in performance. Yes, not on all games, but the fact that good devs have been able to produce games like Uncharted shows the the limitations don't preclude matching or exceeding 360's performance.
What really needs to happen here is developers (and fans) need to concentrate less on pissing, moaning and making a big stink over small stuff and concentrate on writing and enjoying good games. Stop spending so much time placing blame and instead just spend the time making it right.
RatBoy @ Feb 10th 2008 2:47PM
So who are they blaming for the mediocre gameplay?
B1gC72 - PSN: KillaKornbread @ Feb 10th 2008 3:30PM
and thats the million dollar question right there.
im sure it will end up being the PS3's fault though somehow through rampant fanboy reasoning.
DCBlack @ Feb 10th 2008 7:50PM
I imagine that Sony execs were indifferent to this claim when they learned it was coming from the Turok devs.