Rock Band Weekly: Nine Inch Nails three-pack

I disagree that it's a scam. I can buy a song from iTunes for a buck or I can pay two dollars and participate in the song. While I can't download the song to my iPod, I enjoy being a part of the music, even if it's just a simulator.

Well, nobody I know pays for GH songs, but I have bought close to 20 Rock Band songs for a number of reasons.

1. They're cheaper than GH
2. I can buy individual songs if I want to
3. They actually have GOOD songs

I think DLing additional songs is appealing to people because they can potentially extend the life of the game indefinitely and basically customize the track list as they see fit. If a crappy song comes out I ignore it, if a good song comes out I buy it. At some point the good (NIN, QOTSA, etc) far outweighs the bad (Fallout Boy).

When you get rock band, you'll understand. When you are doing world tour, and you've played the same 56 songs, it's nice to break in with new songs, or it's nice for parties to have songs that people know, rather than forcing everyone to play Fall out Boy with confused looks on their faces that indicate they don't know that Fall Out Boy is actually music and not rotten meat thrown at instruments.

Another thing:
You may already have the song on your Ipod or whatever (I already own most of the songs I have DL'ed in one way or another), but I can't play those songs with 3 friends in real life, so I do in Rock Band.

I respect your opinion. I still disagree. Im not sure how much either game is, including the instruments, but I think I remember them not being cheap. So to top it off, they do something like this. Not fair in my opinion. Especially if you already own the damn song. These companies just cant get enough of our money and they not only charge a lot just for a game nowadays, but they continue to try and get in our pockets afterwards, even after we supported them and bought the game.
And its almost free advertisments for them. You cant add the song to your real music library, so if you happen to like a song, some go and buy it AGAIN so they can actually listen to it in their car and what not. We consumers dont see any benefits, only continuing costs.

I'm going to be honest with you and I hope you appreciate this...

I used to play DDR. The problem with DDR is overlapping music in the collections. As an example, much of the music in the US mixes I ourchased were already in my imports from years ago. Occasionally you would get a couple new songs but it really became a matter of 1:4 ratio on new to old. And here's the bitch of it, the mixes were always $50.

Now, Rock Band features a bunch of songs by default. This is not a small game by any means. However, as someone who played those previous games and yes, even swapped between three different versions of Guitar Hero and 7 different versions of Beatmania just to mix up music selection, I found I prefer the DLC route of Rock Band. Here's why in three simple points.

-It expands the music selection within a single game. Big factor. No swapping discs to move from list to list.

-It's a great way to extend the life of a game like this rather than having three months where it's awesome and 9 months where you're waiting for Rock Band 2 for new songs.

-I'm not paying for music I don't like. Do you hate the 70's song September? I do. I would never buy it... but I did buy it with a DDR mix. Never played the song unless they forced me to. Essentially, my extended Rock Band experience is ala carte as I'm never forced to pay for music I don't like on it.

Well I respect you all feelings. If youre willing to pay then hey, go for it I suppose. Some really feel its worth it and find value in the purchases. And I wont second guess the value, to a degree. I still believe the content should be free. Im not sure who is paying who to get the songs into the game if anything. But since you cant use them with your mp3 player, they are censored, and the bands make out with free ads for their music and the developers make a killing. Then Rock Band/GH sequels will come out in a year and the cycle will start all over again, with many of the same people falling into the trap.
But hey, if you dont mind then you dont mind. I would and I will not purchase these games mainly because I cant stand getting nickle and dimed of my hard earned money. Hell, its bad enough the gov takes away a big chunk of it.

Bucfann: you pretty much summed things up when you said "I don't own the game or know much about it". I mean what else is there to say.... You're like someone telling us that we're fools for buying cars, but you've never seen a car, driving a car, ridden in a car and don't know diddly about what goes in to making a car.... yah..

jsn -

Look first off, what is there to know? You buy a game for xxx amount of dollars. Both Rock Band and GH are over 100 bucks when you add in the instruments.
The games come with so many songs. Then periodically songs are released for about 2 bucks a pop or 3 for 6. In MY OPINION, it would not be worth it to buy that game and then have to be additional songs. They could easily throw them in for free. Of course they wont do that, its too easy to get peoples money.
If people want to do that, feel free. I am just saying I wont and think more people shouldnt. Maybe then they wouldnt try and screw loyal consumers over as much.

And youre comparing this to a car? Youre an idiot.

so you're saying that the developers are making out with money, when they are basically selling a song for the same price as something like iTunes, they have to program and adjust and test all these songs too, along with the dealings of label records people probably wanting more money being slapped on it than just a buck. Plus they said in Rock Band 2 you'll be able to play all the songs you purchased for one, at least they want to make it that way. $1 for development costs and testing cost is ripping off the developer, not the customer. And if you say it should have been in the game in the first place, then you are basically say every song ever made should be in the game in the first place.

"At some point the good (NIN, QOTSA..."

lol nice one =)

You just don't get it do you? When you buy a car should the gas be free? When you buy a dvd player should you get all of your movies for free?

Who is gonna pay the artists who create the song and the people who take the time to code them into the games? If these songs were free we'd only get one a year instead of 3 a week. Shit, I'd pay ten bucks for Hotel California!

Well, jsn, I've driven a car before and I can tell you it's a freaking scam.

First, I buy the car, and then every week I'm supposed to pay for a whole bunch of gas that goes in the tank.

You heard me right, they charge me for a bunch of gas that should be free.

That's not the worst part. I already pay for heating fuel in my house in the winter, and then they expect me to pay AGAIN for the gas in my car.

I hope everyone else joins me boycotting this whole 'car' racket.

LOL this isnt a car. This is a game. You cant compare the two.
And the Artists make out even more, especially if someone doesnt own the song in their music collection. If they happen to like it, its purchased for Rock Band, and then the person may purchase it AGAIN so they can actually listen to it outside the game. At the very least they should allow you to upload the song to your personal music collection. Youre paying for it, the artists get money for it.
Question though. Let's say you do buy songs for it. If you change your Live account and what not, or sell your console, are those songs still usable for you or the person you sell your console/hard drive to?

thanks for still not seeing that the developer needs compensation for their work put into these songs. Along with the Q&A they have testing it. Along with the network they have to maintain for it. If you really want, go to remix.nin.com , CAUSE GUESS WHAT?! You can basically get all these songs in this pack for free cause Trent doesn't give a shit about what his record label makes for it. I feel sorry for all the developers, like myself, when theres fucking people complaining about additional add-ons that don't even cost as much as a bottle of water.

You guys kill me. Keep comparing it to a car. This is a game, there should be none of these reoccurring costs to keep the game fun. Especially if they charge for them like they are actual music, yet prevent you from being able to use the songs in your own collection.
The video game business doesnt make billions a year buy giving us deals. They do it through avenues like this which over all is not entirely fair to the consumer.
Im not saying anyone is an idiot or anything for making these purchases. I just think they should think twice and consider everything. To me, I think its shady. You dont have to think that. Its your money, so if you want to keep giving money every so often for a few measly songs, thats your prerogative.

"Look first off, what is there to know? You buy a game for xxx amount of dollars. Both Rock Band and GH are over 100 bucks when you add in the instruments."

Correct so far...

"The games come with so many songs. Then periodically songs are released for about 2 bucks a pop or 3 for 6. In MY OPINION, it would not be worth it to buy that game and then have to be additional songs. They could easily throw them in for free."

If the any development studio had the "add extra content" command in their API, they would license this tech out and instantly become rich. But here's the issue. Have you ever created anything on computer or.. pretty much anywhere? I'll break it down like a carpenter. Let's say you make a table and sell it for $350. Handmade table, good wood, everything. Even stained and sealed. Deluxe grade-A fucking table. And someone buys this table, enjoys it. Later on, you make some chairs. Suddenly the person who bought the table is demanding the chairs for free because they bought the table.

For Harmonix, especially, there is a lot of work that goes into the additional content. There is first either the seperation of the track or the rerecording of the aspects in a studio. Then while the artists are syncing up the animations, the programmers are testing the track, making sure it works. In the meantime, you have the designers not only programming the command charts for four different instruments, but four different difficulties as well. That's 16 different command charts... yowza. All of this work, people get paid to do this. That $170 you paid for Rock Band isn't going to hire those people for the next 15 years.

"Of course they wont do that, its too easy to get peoples money."

Were you aware Venture Brothers had to spend $15,000 for a minute and a half sequence just because they licensed a popular techno song? You assume Harmonix and Activision don't pay to use this music. But Nine Inch Nails needs their money and these companies are obligated to just shell out the money because you want the chairs thrown in for free?

"If people want to do that, feel free. I am just saying I wont and think more people shouldnt. Maybe then they wouldnt try and screw loyal consumers over as much."

You just admitted you wouldn't be doing this anyway. Your morale stance is hollow. But let me ask you a question, let's say you buy a movie ticket to see Sweeney Todd. Does this mean, because you bought the movie ticket, once it's out on DVD, they should just send you a free copy? And fuck, since we're going there, why didn't you get the free soundtrack, movie posters, trapper keeper, decoder meat pie, and Lil Todd Barber Playset for free as well?

With these expansions, you get what you pay for. No more, no less. These were not included in the original game, nor are they free for the company to make. So if you want them, you have to reimburse the companies for the money they spent to make the content available. However, the existance of this content doesn't magically destroy the usability of the original content. In fact, there is no pressure to expand your game and even when playing with people online, you can play the expanded content if the band leader bought them. There is a ton of value in that $2.

And youre comparing this to a car? Youre an idiot.

All right, Bucfann. Let's take this slow.

Every time Harmonix sells one of these DLC songs, they have to pay a royalty to the rights-holder. One gentlemen at Harmonix said that they pay iTunes rates because that what the record companies are used to. So, about 70 cents per song.

Then, Harmonix has to pay XBox Live Marketplace or PSN a 30% transaction fee for each song they sell, to cover the cost of operating the store and promoting the content. On a $2 song, that's about 65 cents per song.

That leaves about 65 cents left on the song to cover the cost of breaking down the master tracks for the song (or commissioning a cover version, if the masters aren't available), and authoring and testing the four instruments for the song.

You have stated twice that these songs should be free. That is, Harmonix is producing at least three of these songs a week, and should be giving them away regardless of the cost.

I did not major in economics, so perhaps you could explain to me exactly how they would do that?

Yes actually, you CAN compare the two. They are both goods which you, or (most likely) your parents can purchase. In order to purchase goods, and services, you need to get money which is acquired by providing goods or services to others. Such is the way of the world so get over it.

Do you seriously think there is some huge rock band/guitar hero database, that holds every single song ever made?

People actually have to work to bring the extra songs so we can play them on our console. Not to mention the licensing fees.

There is no magic box that can convert every single mp3 into a rock band/guitar hero track.

If there was, Metallica would sue the shit out of it.

I've bought all of the GH3 song packs..... which is 1 I believe.

Bucfann, I would've been with you like 6 months ago, but believe me when I say these games are addicting. They are unsuspectingly fun at first and then you find you just can't put it down all weekend. Plus they're great party games (Rock Band especially). Sure, they're expensive, but picture it this way: if I host a party and buy a karaoke machine, I just made a quick check of prices and it appears a quality karaoke machine can run me $150-300. I would also need the music to sing with obviously. Well, Rock Band is essentially karaoke with instruments plus the singing as well. And considering that the peripherals are compatible (presumably) in future installments of the games, at least you only have to buy the instruments once.

As far as add-on songs, Rock Band has done it right. They give you options every single week and you can choose to buy as much or as little as you like. But they can't all come free (though some do). People mentioned the costs of programming earlier, so I won't get into that. But it's much like DLC for other games. If I want an add-on map for a TPS, don't you typically have to purchase it? Well I'm not a huge TPS fan, but if I host a gathering with a bunch of friends once a month for some Rock Band action, I can load up with whatever selection of DLC songs over the past month that I want so the game stays fresh. Not to mention you can always play online.

If you still don't get it, perhaps you should go start off with the first GH game. Between that and a guitar controller for the PS2 you can get it at a fair price. Give it a whirl and see if you don't get into it.

Bucfann, what do you do for a living? Whatever it is, I want you to start doing it for free. What, you don't want to work for free?

Neither do the developers and the musicians who make this game possible, from the initial launch to the DLC they continue WORKING to bring us.

If Rock Band came with no music, cost the same amount, and forced you to download all the songs to play the game, you'd have a valid point. But it doesn't, and you don't.

Probably censored, since it is a T game and they did used the censored version of Radiohead's "Creep"

You CAN add it back in, however, and not be penalized. I do on Radiohead's Creep.

NIN owns your soul.

Too bad the rock is dead... now kiddos think that NIN, Nirvana, Pearl Jam and that kinda of bands is rock.


*Listening to Rainbow - Hall of the Mountain King.

It's a different kind of rock now. You cannot expect rock in the past to speak of our society in the same way contemporary artist do. Just as no one is singing Sammy Davis Jr to express their love nowadays...

And when you alienate the new because of the old, you sound like a frightened old man seeing the looming shadow of your grave.

Keep listening to MTV kiddos... I will keep listening my vynil records.

when the fuck has NIN ever been on MTV?

Fernando, I believe you should look up the Closure video or the Broken video. If they ever let that stuff on TV, and I mean all of it, I believe this world would go into a mass riot.

Coming from a grown man listening to a band called "Rainbow"? Gayest band ever! Sounds like the kind of crap you'd listen to while raping a wizard on the back of a flying pink dragon.

Congratulations EA/Harmonix, you're the first to convince me to happily buy DLC.

wtf that was not meant to be a reply to the troll...

@sicsided actually NiN has been on MTV quite frequently predominantly in the mid nineties, Closer was a HUGE hit and the video was on constantly also The Hand That Feeds ran a lot when With Teeth was released. And yes even a few tracks from Fragile were made into music Vids that MTV played, see the Perfect Drug.

Perfect Drug wasn't on Fragile. Perfect Drug was an exclusive track on the Lost Highway soundtrack.

If you dont like, you should goto

http://unspun.amazon.com/Most-Wanted-Artists-to-Be-DLC-in-Rock-Band/list/show/14562

and vote to show Harmonix exactly what we want. If we get enough people to vote it could be worthwhile.

they were never confirmed. Harmonix never responded to any of those leaks other than saying "things are subject to change". Everything else was speculation.

Right, they were never confirmed. However, if you look at that ad, these NIN songs were "penciled" in for a certain date. That is now no longer true. So, ipso facto, something has to show up on that date OTHER THAN THOSE SONGS. That was my only point.

Correction: "Late 80's white boy rap"

Anyone else know if this is a mistake?