Joystiq Podcast 041 - Army of Three edition
by Justin McElroy 
{ Mar 14th 2008 at 12:10PM }
As you probably guessed from the title, we're talking some Army of Two this week, as well as continuing to ponder the EA/Take2 merger deal. Also, we've got emails, Brushes With Fame and a fantastic story about Peter Molyneux. Oh, and the best intro evar. Peep and enjoy.
Also, on a somewhat related note, be sure to check out the Joystiq Podcast Facebook group. We're as shocked by its very existence as you are.
Also, on a somewhat related note, be sure to check out the Joystiq Podcast Facebook group. We're as shocked by its very existence as you are.
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Hosts: Chris Grant, Ludwig Kietzmann and Justin McElroy
Music: "Get Ready for Love" by Nick Cave, "Red Eye" by Ben Kweller.
See all of this week's links after the jump.
News:
EA/Take 2 continues
Notes from Take-Two's fiscal Q108 conference call
BioShock 2 due in fiscal Q4 2009 from 2K Marin
Activision files lawsuit after Gibson claims Guitar Hero patent
Harmonix suit also
Smash Bros. Brawl not working on some Wiis, Nintendo responds
360 gets Euro price drop this Friday
Sony, Microsoft 'in talks' over Xbox 360 Blu-ray drive
But no, they're not
BIG THREE:
3. Gripes and Glees: One week with Smash Bros. Brawl
2. Return to Quest Quiz: Tim Schafer
1. Dreamcast.com converted into phishing scam, Sega warns
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
D_Average @ Mar 14th 2008 12:15PM
Glad to see Ludwig's back!
James Lockwood @ Mar 14th 2008 1:29PM
It's certainly preferable to his front...
(burnnn)
D_Average @ Mar 14th 2008 1:43PM
"Thats what she said...."
Fernando Rocker @ Mar 14th 2008 1:55PM
By the way Ludwig...
When are you guys going to respon our questions from last week? =p
PojoMofo @ Mar 14th 2008 12:25PM
Downloading now on my works ridiculously slow T1 line. So I will comment in 6 hours after I enjoy the podcast.
EMaster @ Mar 14th 2008 12:57PM
itunes is not DL'ing it.
James Lockwood @ Mar 14th 2008 1:24PM
Just so I can get props - I set up the group.
Who wants to touch me?
Firtch @ Mar 14th 2008 1:30PM
It's not on iTunes or the RSS feed 'cause they haven't tagged it as a podcast yet, for some reason. Maybe it's like an early release for those of us that hound the site, then the passive readers get their podcast LATER, after we've all heard it.
Christopher Grant @ Mar 14th 2008 1:37PM
Right you are! Justin's been fired, the category has been added, thus enabling an otherwise blind iTunes to distribute it to you all. I embedded an audio player while I was at it, just for kicks.
Jayslacks @ Mar 14th 2008 1:46PM
Seriously. The best part of my Friday. Sadly.
Zertoss @ Mar 14th 2008 1:47PM
I don't think I've ever heard the phrase "can't afford" associated with Microsoft before this podcast.
darkandlong @ Mar 14th 2008 2:10PM
Listening to the podcast right now. As far as your discussion of Army of Two I think its pretty obvious you guys didn't really have a clue how to play the game:
-Can't pull off melee kills which are actually way too frequent and easy to do.
-Gave up because you died too much on easy. You actually go as far as to complain and think the game should be easier? Only the last mission is really all that challenging.
-Couldn't figure out that the guy not drawing aggro should use a low aggro/silenced weapon when flanking.
-Complain about aim/hit detection, which I personally found wasn't bad... Not the best but worked adequately depending on weapon and situation.
-Ao2 is not the first game to feature the whole "lose vision the more you get shot/injured" but for some reason this application is unacceptable?
While I will agree the plot/story is laughable and the level design isn't genius, and the camera angle when being dragged can be problematic depending on how your partner sets up.
PS - the heavily armored guys and occaisional bad buys drop grenades/sniper ammo. I think the designers intended for grenades and sniper rifles to be more of a situational thing. Oh, and weapon swapping is actually a combo of two buttons pressed at once.
Love the site, love the podcast, love the fact that you guys let other websites review the games. Its pretty obvious you guys were in fact quibbling. Ao2 is by no means a gaming masterpiece but its not nearly as bad as you guys make it out to be.
Sir Fidlious Wong (Zeon Defense Force) @ Mar 14th 2008 5:52PM
Why is it, anytime a couple podcasters do not like a game, instantly a couple peoples first reponse is "you don't know how to play it."
Always happens and never renders the peoples opinions invalid. After all, when the Lair guide went out, you didn't see a bunch of sites scream "Well fuck all, we've been doing it wrong guys... BACK TO THE REVIEW ROOM!"
Best thing about a review is that it's an opinion piece. It's to gather anothers opinions. If you just wanted to read what you agree with, write your own review and copy pasta it all over the web so you can point at it "all those guys agree with me..."
Teehee....
darkandlong @ Mar 14th 2008 6:13PM
Did you even listen to the podcast? They admitted to dying a few times then never wanting to play the game again. They then complained that easy was too hard.
Its pretty obvious they didn't play the game very much at all.
Justin McElroy @ Mar 14th 2008 9:27PM
So, does EA have good benefits, or what? You got dental?
Justin McElroy @ Mar 14th 2008 9:44PM
No, I kid, I kid. You guys may have a point, in fact, let's talk about them.
1. For the record, I didn't have a problem with melee killz.
2. We didn't play on easy, we played on the medium level. We switched it to easy and played for all of 30 seconds on that difficulty.
I have made no bones about the fact that I'm not very good at action games. And I probably should have played on easy from the beginning. But I was trying to be Mr. Tough Mercenary. So sue me.
3. Maybe using a silenced weapon would be better. But if neither of us thought of doing that, I'm going to go ahead and say it should have been explained better. But we probably would have pieced it together eventually.
4. Hit detection isn't good. You're wrong. Sorry.
5. I just thought it was an obnoxious use of it that made it too difficult.
I think we were pretty up front about the fact that they were quibbles. But they were quibbles that added up. When you play a lot of games, you get less tolerance for this sort of thing, which is why we don't do formal reviews, just our own gut impressions of them. I'd say combined we played for about three to four hours though, is that really not enough time for a game to grab us.
I'd also say though that I wish I had hit on a few more positive things while we talked about it. We had JUST finished up a game and were still in the middle of being frustrated. Again, this is why we don't do reviews on the podcast.
I can see how you'd enjoy the game. Especially if you were in a certain mood and had a friend to play with.
Also, I love you guys, thanks for taking the time to post your thoughts.
Zertoss @ Mar 14th 2008 2:12PM
Tabasco sauce in the underwear is too obvious. Use Bengay.
Archr5 @ Mar 14th 2008 3:51PM
I gotta agree with Darkandlong here, it's almost like you guys didn't play the game, or that you're really bad at figuring out games...
I'm not particularly good at 3rd person shooters... but I'm playing on professional and not dying often... not running out of ammo... and not having trouble meleeing the crap out of dudes that get too close.
Your nitpick about the controls are valid. It's dumb that i have to hit more than one button to cycle weapons, it's dumb that it's a process to swap weapons but fist-pounding is the A...
Your complaint about the camera being bad at times is valid as well... but it's a tradeoff for the cover system not being "hit X to stick to object"
Your complaints about the cross-nation play being disabled are valid, absolutely. It's just laziness on the publisher's part for not polishing the net-code.
But seriously, the aggro system is retardedly easy to figure out, each weapon has an aggro attribute for christ's sake! You can totally tell if your weapon is going to attract a ton of attention, If you can't figure that out, then you pretty much fail at figuring out game mechanics...
also your description of the damage system is completely wrong, the screen turns Red at the edges,, you learn to ignore it just like the fading gear in gears... it doesn't "go dark..."
Anyway, I payed $60 for the game and I'm not upset at all.. in fact I bought a copy for a friend as well and we've had a blast running through the missions on professional.
I like the podcast, but it really seems like you guys didn't give this a a chance at all.
Deck @ Mar 14th 2008 4:39PM
The intro was for sure the best EVAR!
As for Army of Two I don't think its that bad. Its pretty decent and co-op with a friend is pretty damn fun!
ScottG13 @ Mar 14th 2008 4:42PM
You guys are missing out on the brilliant homo-erotic satire. It may be the funniest game I've EVER played. Its clearly one huge inside joke about latent homosexuality within the frat guy mentality.
Shagittarius @ Mar 14th 2008 4:50PM
Co are you listening to this?
Donald @ Mar 14th 2008 6:12PM
Thanks for the advice, gents. Unfortunately, he already owns a Full House season set, so I think at this point homicide is my only option.
Ross Mills @ Mar 14th 2008 9:53PM
Peter Molyneux and me.
I am THE MAN!
(PS. Brush with fame!)
NPJ @ Mar 15th 2008 6:59AM
How can chris think Half Life 2 is the best game ever but not fully appreciate FEAR? Pacing issues? Hello 2 hours wandering around an antlion cave fighting silly unresponsive bugs which now have ranged just to be annoying.
The fact that the CLONE enemies aren't varied is helped by their great AI and the fun fights, as opposed to the HL2 Combat which boils down to:
Combine stands out in the open, Fire pistol clip into the combine, reload, fire another pistol clip into the combine, change weapons, fire SMG into the combine etc.
Ieatbrains @ Mar 15th 2008 8:49PM
You do realize that the European prices seems high to you because your dollar has gone down the loo right?
ApolloIV @ Mar 16th 2008 3:13PM
Justin, we still love you.
Moeez @ Mar 17th 2008 12:35AM
I was LOL'ing the whole time when Chris was being explained that Condemned 2's combat isn't a new system, it's just the same system with more depth added to it. Chris, in denial.
FEAR, the only thing going for it is the combat and shooting itself and the revolutionary enemy AI. Very fun using all the weapons, needle guns, etc. But everything else, not so great. Not as creepy or less jumpy moments as Condemned. More cheesy horror movie scares, than Condemned atmospheric scares. Bland environments, keep on repeating, the same enemies ALL the friggin' time! Ok, throw in invisible ninjas, yeah...
So Chris, don't get Condemned 2, sorry if you didn't like the 1st game. And I think "quibbles" meant minor things that annoyed you, not a list of how crap you guys are at 3rd person shooters! lol Melee works fine, dude. Pressing Right trigger to melee has been in so many other games (Freedom Fighters, Uncharted, Mass Effect, Kane and Lynch, etc.).
J @ Mar 17th 2008 4:08PM
I can has brush with fame?
Olly @ Mar 17th 2008 5:29PM
Well I guess you're not going to be playing AO2 again, but I have a tip for melee attacks (which do actually work, and are even cooler than the fist pounding!); you don't press the attack button to attack, you press the A button... Go EA's QA department!
Sweet zombie jesus that was an annoyingly bad game. I rented and played it co-op with my flatmate, that back to back stuff made us angry on the inside.
hvnlysoldr @ Mar 29th 2008 2:34PM
Cool someone has Sound Wave as their avatar.
LiK @ Mar 18th 2008 3:41PM
Ludwig, thanks for recommending Lost Odyssey. it's awesome~! btw Justin, the save points ain't that bad. the reguilar enemies ain't that hard and if you die to a boss, you spawn from a checkpoint right before the boss fight and you can try again. people who think this game is hard are WUSSES! some FF games had worst save point spots than LO.
SoxFan13 @ Mar 19th 2008 2:08PM
Podcast was grand as usual. However, when referring to Full House, I'd like a couple more mentions of Kimmy. Also, I think the next intro should be Justin doing the "Waaaaaaake Up!" from Danny Tanner's morning show "Wake Up San Francisco" followed the homeless woman's "I'm going to kill you" from GDC.
dr_Gee @ Mar 20th 2008 2:07PM
Guys I totally love the podcast. It brings me great joy to put the podcast on my ipod. You guys rock!!!! Oh, I took this picture in brawl and I made it a lolz, so i will give the link. http://mine.icanhascheezburger.com/View.aspx?ciid=796057
Funny pic. :D