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Reader Comments (66)

Posted: Apr 11th 2008 12:22AM (Unverified) said

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If microsoft or sony want to have the wiis success all they have to do is whore themselves out to casual players and old people

Posted: Apr 11th 2008 12:47AM (Unverified) said

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Jeff Engel,

"Sony, in a seemingly obvious attempt to blunt the impact of Nintendo's newly styled controller, added motion sensitivity to their controllers before the PS3 launched."

false. Sony would have added SIXAXIS motion sensing irrespective of Nintendonald's decisions this gen. they needed many reasons to convince people to buy a $600 system and motion sensing was definitely one of them. they even patented the idea of a motion sensing controller long before Nintendonald's did.


"Wii Sports and Wii Play, ironically, probably attracted the same people that bought a PS2 just to play around with GTA."

false. the casual fan segment of GTA call the Wii kiddy and for kids and soccer moms. they wouldnt be caught dead with a Wii remote.


many of your reasons are wrong. the following are the real reasons Nintendonald's is succeeding:

1) they created a cute console with a cute name and cute remote that people, especially females, are attracted to. funny enough, the reason DS started to sell better than/outsell PSP is when Nintendo introduced the redesigned DS Lite. it is a fact that the DS Phat sold at a much slower rate worldwide than PSP until the DS Lite was introduced. even their "market expanding, disruptive" software such as Nintendogs couldnt help DS Phat outsell PSP. the early headstart of the DS Phat along with the Lite redesign helped DS outsell PSP. again, a cute-looking handheld system that females like. the same reason iPods are so popular. image and advertisement-effectiveness is everything in todays super shallow and fake world.

2) priced the DS and Wii significantly below the competition, as well as software prices.

3) launched effective ad-compaigns targeted firstly at non-gamers, secondly at casual gamers, and lastly at hardcore gamers.

4) Nintendonald's impressive software sales are a result of creating dumbed-down gameplay for their cute-looking systems that have the cute-looking Remote and Stylus (what you refer to as mature, innovative and intuitive software) for party games such as Wii Sports, Wii Play, Mario Party etc. then u have "self-improvement" DS games which dont actually improve you (as doctors have confirmed) but rather give you a sense that you arent waisting your time playing "meaningless" games. these are Brain Age, Cooking Mamma, Wii Fit etc.

lastly, M$ doesnt care one bit about Nintendo. since Nintendo deals with only games, they are not a threat to M$. even the typical Nintendo game genres arent the typical PC game genres.

M$ doesnt want to replace Xbox 360, Windows Mobile, or Zune with the PC. they just want to make sure their OS customers dont switch to PlayStations and Macs and PSPs and iPods and iTunes and PlayStation Store. their only concern is making sure Sony's PlayStation Empire doesnt affect their OS business. two big reasons people buy PCs is for work and entertainment. PS3 already lets you install Linux legally on the system and use it as a full-fledged PC with a blu-ray drive at only $400. M$ felt threatened when they realised two Sony systems(PS1 and PS2) sold over 100 million units each in hardware. this was potentially a huge threat to the M$ empire.

M$ didnt want Sony to have similar success with PS3, meaning PS3 outselling the 125 million PS2 units which outsold the 100 million PS1 units. more and more people would switch from PCs to PS3s for entertainment(games, movies, tv shows, music etc.) and even work via PS3 Linux. if Sony included Linux preinstalled on PS3, M$ would seriously flip out. they'd prolly do something crazier than what they're doing right now with Yahoo!.

Posted: Apr 11th 2008 5:52AM (Unverified) said

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I think you lost it towards the end, maybe the start also. Sony didn't add motion controller to convince anyone anything, they already believed the machine was worth price (remember, people will work more to buy the thing). Proof they added it to combat Nintendo is the lack of anything that actually makes a good use of it. It didn't need it then and it doesn't need it now, total waste.

As for the GTA comment, many people brought GTA just to play in the sandbox. I won't pretend that I even have numbers or research that says otherwise (hint, hint) however there are many casual PS2 owners who are platform independent and have gone on to buy a Wii. I won't say it's the majority or a large percentage, check out some forums and talk to people outside your group and you would see this to be the one of the cases (of many).

Your whole cute rant coupled with the DS as proof is plain wrong though. The DS, worldwide (which, really, is all that matters) has sold, continues to sell and propbably will always outsell the PSP. Yes, there was a sharp rise after the DS Lite launced but not so with the PSP Slim, maybe Sony should look in to that OR your point has no value. If your comparing week to week sales then who cares, the DS has still sold more (three times more) but this isn't a pissing contest.

You point out the cost (yes) and the advertising (yes) and the dumb games (no). It doesn't matter what we think of the games the sales prove otherwise. Hell, look at how many reviewers pretty much wrote off Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games. Picking on them for giving what the consumers want is pretty silly.

Overall though, here is when you lost the plot:

"M$ doesnt want to replace Xbox 360, Windows Mobile, or Zune with the PC. they just want to make sure their OS customers dont switch to PlayStations and Macs and PSPs and iPods and iTunes and PlayStation Store."

I will give you that they don't want people to switch to Macs but besides that fact this has zero to do with the article. MS (no dollar signs please) are actually trying to get people to switch to MS products from iPods, iTunes and PlayStation's and not the other way around. MS weren't concerned about Linux on the PS3 when making the Xbox as it didn't exist. MS weren't concerned about the PS1's 100 million units as that happened almost three and half years after the Xbox's release. MS weren't concerned about the PS2's 100 million units because that happened three days before the Xbox 360 release.

As for killing the PC as the entertainment hub, people don't want to watch movies on their PC. Using the PC as a media device connected to a TV is ok but then the PC is too bulky or "technical" for Joe Average to sit in the lounge room (never forget WAF). And seriously, PS3 Linux as a work device? Have you really tried to use Linux on the PS3 as an everyday machine? It isn't pretty.

The PS3, PS2, PS1 or even the Intellision have nothing to do with MS and the 360. It has nothing to do with the article and I have no idea how you jumped to these conclusions but sorry, your just plain wrong... about pretty much everything. Thanks for playing ;)
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Posted: Apr 11th 2008 12:51PM (Unverified) said

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to zujik: you are incorrect son.

your reply contains two-thirds incorrect information and one-third statements that i did not contradict. i will give you one example to chew on.

"Your whole cute rant coupled with the DS as proof is plain wrong though. The DS, worldwide (which, really, is all that matters) has sold, continues to sell and propbably will always outsell the PSP. Yes, there was a sharp rise after the DS Lite launced but not so with the PSP Slim, maybe Sony should look in to that OR your point has no value. If your comparing week to week sales then who cares, the DS has still sold more (three times more) but this isn't a pissing contest."


"Your whole cute rant coupled with the DS as proof is plain wrong though."

we'll see in a few minutes.


"The DS, worldwide (which, really, is all that matters) has sold, continues to sell and propbably will always outsell the PSP."

umm, so?


"Yes, there was a sharp rise after the DS Lite launced but not so with the PSP Slim, maybe Sony should look in to that OR your point has no value."

1) what did my point have to do with Sony's PSP redesign again? did i even mention my views on Sony's redesigned PSP in my original post? my views on the DS Lite redesign do not equal my views on the Sony PSP redesign, the latter of which i didnt even address in my original post.

2) DS Lite gave much more than merely a sharp rise in sales. the redesign let the DS platform consistently outsell PSP worldwide for the first time.

"If your comparing week to week sales then who cares, the DS has still sold more (three times more) but this isn't a pissing contest."

i didnt vaguely compare "week to week sales". i compared week to week sales *of the period in between PSP's launch and the launch of DS Lite* to explain my "cuteness" point. the fact is, PSP outsold DS Phat within the above mentioned time frame consistently worldwide. only when DS Lite launched did the DS platform finally consistently outsell PSP worldwide. you should also know (if you werent able to conclude from my original post) that PSP's market penetration was faster than DS Phat's market penetration since the relative launches of both systems. also bear in mind there's no ceteris paribus here: PSP hardware and software has always been significantly more expensive. despite this, and despite having a delayed European launch, i recap:

PSP relative market penetration > DS Phat relative market penetration

PSP relative worldwide sales > DS relative worldwide sales

once DS Phat was redesigned into the cute Apple-esque DS Lite, sales skyrocketed.

*insert lame post-ending line over here*
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Posted: Apr 11th 2008 1:24AM logicbus said

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Is it necessary to wrap the inline excerpts from the article in quotation marks? Shouldn't they only have quotation marks if they are excerpts from quotes?

Posted: Apr 11th 2008 3:24AM (Unverified) said

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The Wiimote is far from perfect in motion sensing. As for pointing, it rates satisfactory. Hardware is finalize. This as good as it gets. There won't be any improvement. Developers can only do so much and that's it. As for a 360 version, it will be using the latest tech. What ever plague the Wiimote, a 360 version would eliminate. It would be more precise at aiming and have better motion sensing. The 360 has far more Shooters and implicating a patch for pre-existing games would be fantastic.

Posted: Apr 11th 2008 4:55AM (Unverified) said

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One of the main things this article ignores is Live Arcade. MS is using Live Arcade as its casual platform and seems to be happy with that. I'm not saying it's the best decision or business strategy but it's different to Nintendo and "could" be a reason we see the retail games we do.

Does MS try to restrict retail games from being released that would be deemed "casual" and instead prefer them to be packaged for the Arcade? I would say not as the Arcade size limit would stop a lot of developers from porting a successful Wii or PS3 "casual" game to the 360.

Are they just not interested in selling those style of games at retail? I have no idea and would look at the commercial failure of Viva Pinata as a sign of "maybe" however this is all pure speculation and it would be wrong to jump to those conclusions.

For better or worse, the decision by MS to market the games it does seems to have pigeon holed them. Where as people can look at Nintendo's and Sony's history and success when they look at the Xbox and Xbox 360 all we see is similar stuff being released at retail on both platforms.

Ultimately though I don't think any of that matters right now, the biggest factor without doubt is price. I know friends and family who would be classed "casual" that grabbed Wii's for Christmas for two reasons. Firstly, the next console was $150 AU more plus with the Wii they got a game at the same time. Secondly, for an extra $10 AU when buying a second controller they got another game. They made their decision purely based on the cost and dollar for dollar the Wii is the best value.

In the end it appears it's three different strategies. Nintendo appears to be happy to push units as it makes money on anything it sells and to piggy back that with the DS. Sony appears to by trying to dominate the "traditional" console market and have the PS3 as the centre piece of your lounge room. Microsoft appears more interested in being the centre of your digital everything and, to me, it looks like they are using the Xbox 360 as a trojan horse to do.

Which strategy will work? Who knows as it's a totally different market right now as entertainment is changing. They are all making money and are filling their war chests for the future. I think overall MS will run out of steam first but I also think they have planned for that.

As for the casual gamer? They will play whatever is fun for the least amount of financial investment. They are the new users which will increase the total market penetration and growth. They are most likely getting involved properly or for the first time and with the price, simplicity of controls and brand name the Nintendo Wii currently seems to be the best choice.

Just a quick note to say I own all three units, play almost all of them equally and am happy either way. I also could be full of crap and on wild tangent.

Posted: Apr 11th 2008 6:54AM (Unverified) said

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MS doesn't seem to be doing to badly at retail though. The high attach rates for the console mean that a hell of a lot of games pass the million mark in sales.

In most game stores in my area, 360 games take the front of the store, and Wii games are more towards the back. (Meanwhile the "Wii - now in stock" posters still decorate the windows).
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Posted: Apr 11th 2008 5:04AM JRMG said

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I remember when I first saw the Xbox360 being played (around launch) I thought to myself that it was just like playing on a PC. That's great and all, but the PC market has always been tiny compared to consoles. Both the 360 and PS3 have become so sophisticated that they are the new age "gaming PC's". they've drifted too far away from the true essence of a video game console (what made the NES and the Atari 2600 such staples of pop culture); that is a simple box, with simple controllers, and a huge variety of games. The Wii pretends to be nothing more and nothing less than what the NES was. Sony and MS, on the other hand, cannot make true "video games". They have a mandate to make the biggest and most technological behemoth--while incorporating their other properties to bring in more cash.

In the end (and we clearly see it by the numbers) most people still would rather have a classic video game console than a 'supercomputer'.

Posted: Apr 11th 2008 7:13AM bm111 said

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Halo 3, a "hardcore" game? LOL

Posted: Apr 11th 2008 8:07AM McWeen said

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Interesting read but I assume most people who read joystiq would have made these assumptions themselves already.

Posted: Apr 11th 2008 8:33AM (Unverified) said

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I think there is one place where the Wii wins and where the PC, 360 and PS3 fail. I'm a casual gamer and I always find myself going back to my Genesis or Nes and here is why : I usually like to play 20-30 minutes when I get back from work and with PC or next Gen console games, just loading the game, watching the intro, setting stuff, loading your last save game, it takes forever. I like when you can just put the game in, power-on and you start to play in the same minute you put the game in. Baseball Star anyone ? Tecmo Super Bowl anyone ? This is where PC and next gen console fail to attract people like me, and I'm not the only one in this situation when I look around me. So this is why I think the Wii is so popular, because they advertised it as a simple console with simple games. A LOT of people don't care about 1080p games and fancy visual, we want to play good games, simple games and not wait 10 minutes before everything loads.

Posted: Apr 11th 2008 9:38AM T Newton said

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i agree with your conclusion there. i love wii myself, but i love it for games like zelda, re4, metroid, and smg, two of which have the wii remote heavily integrated into their gameplay (namely re4 and metroid), and are arguably not casual games. i think the wii remote and its pointing abilities can make action games damn fun, and i would love something like that on the 360, if they don't screw it up..

Posted: Apr 11th 2008 4:33PM (Unverified) said

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Things are exactly fine the way they are. PS3 faulting, 360 giving me 'hardcore' interests, and the Wii attracting 'casual' females into my home just to play some games.

Posted: Apr 11th 2008 2:47PM (Unverified) said

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Well put.

Posted: Apr 11th 2008 4:36PM Mr Khan said

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It's all about the software, if i've learned anything, its that

PS2 touted itself as a multimedia machine and swept the generation in straight sets, PS3 tried to do even more and is getting its clock cleaned

The difference: software

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