Microsoft talks XBLA future, loosening download size limit
Revealed at GDC 2008, Microsoft's Community Games Initiative is set to launch later this year and will allow indie devs to submit games created using XNA Game Studio 2.0 for other Community members to review. The top-rated submissions will be made available via XBLA for all users to download.
Some other interesting tidbits from the Edry interview: MS is planning to increase the maximum file size for future XBLA releases from 150 megabytes to 350MB, although he wouldn't divulge when. (MS had already made an exception for Capcom's upcoming Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix, affording it 250MB for all its high-res 2D goodness.) Edery also confirms that MS has a "large" number of upcoming XBLA releases in its queue, and may consider more multi-release XBLA Wednesdays as a result.
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
BananaBoat @ May 20th 2008 3:05PM
With demo's in the multiple gigabyte range, it never made any sense that XBLA games needed to be so small.
Good thing they are finally realizing their error, and fixing it (Hopefully)
Fernando Rocker @ May 20th 2008 3:05PM
"MS had already made a one-time exception for Capcom's upcoming Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix, affording it 250MB for all its high-res 2D goodness."
Don't forget Bionic Commando too.
nojok3 @ May 20th 2008 4:13PM
Actually considering how there are complaints rising about the installs on PS3 hard disks for games in the GB range, I'm sure thats a major concern for Microsoft who has a majority of customers with 20GB hard drives.
ThornedVenom (Harley Quinn Defense Force) @ May 21st 2008 4:15AM
Multiple gigabytes is like an entire game which could be sold on DVD: demos are so big because even though its technically "incomplete", it still needs the majority of the final product's resources.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that XBLA games get more appealing IP-licensing fees (just like for any console) than full 360 retail ones.
Phranctoast @ May 20th 2008 3:09PM
Symphony of the night as well.
ThornedVenom (Harley Quinn Defense Force) @ May 21st 2008 4:16AM
Sorry Fernando, that comment is for BananaBoat.
This is just an example of the buggy reply system.
Benny @ May 20th 2008 3:09PM
...user-created games are "going to help [Microsoft] leapfrog the competition"...
Yes, let's do all the legwork for the multi-billion dollar corporation!
Phranctoast @ May 20th 2008 3:11PM
I wonder how much they give to the developer. XNA isn't free ya know...
LameDuck @ May 20th 2008 3:47PM
I don't think 100 bux a year is too much to develope a game on the 360 using XBLA. Also, I do believe they said that MS would foot the bill for all the approval preceedings. I can't remember where I heard that, maybe at GCD. Anyway, it is still within range of the normal human to affored.
Das @ May 20th 2008 3:49PM
@Phranctoast
I'm pretty sure the next version of XNA is free.
Raikage (LDF CRAB BATTLE!!!) @ May 20th 2008 3:09PM
Hey, this is cool for 360 owners!
Maybe they'll get some of mah WiiWare? LostWinds is very relaxing to play:D
copa @ May 20th 2008 3:09PM
This feels like PS3 Home. Microsoft keeps talking about how they are going to support this ecosystem of user-generated games, but when it comes to deliverables, everything is perpetually six months away.
I suspect they will continue to screw around with this for a while, but we won't see it really take off until the next Microsoft console.
NATO_Duke @ May 20th 2008 3:35PM
How does this sound like Home? They just announced the program a short while ago at GDC in Feb of 2008. They then put some user made games on XBLA for people to try. I think its a stretch to compare this with Home - which has been in the works a lot longer than 3 months and has had a lot more problems with the hype vs reality issues.
Hell, this is a program for letting other people make games for the XBLA anyway. I think that takes a bit more than 3 months to fully flesh out.
Vidikron (FU) @ May 20th 2008 3:48PM
@NATO
Umm... XNA development has been around a lot longer than 3 months.
NATO_Duke @ May 20th 2008 4:22PM
Yes, they have been allowing developers to make games with it longer. It still is a new development for being deployed in its current form to the 360. I don't think its anything like the Home situation.
Extinction @ May 20th 2008 9:44PM
Well Home also lets us develop games for it. Specifically in Java. And for free. So yeah, XNA is similar, only it costs $99 a year to use it
Nate @ May 20th 2008 3:11PM
350 megs? Wow, XBLA is really moving into the 21st century now....
Seriously, though, XNA is a really cool idea, and I wish Sony would do something similar, but without the stupid restrictions of the XNA. The only way to let people play your XNA game on their XBox is if both of you pay $100 a year to be part of the XNA Creator's Club, which is a bunch of BS. And this won't fix that, since I'm sure like 1 in 1000 games will actually be accepted by Microsoft. But at least Microsoft is doing *something* which is better than what Sony's doing in this arena.
Sean @ May 20th 2008 4:44PM
Actually, Microsoft has said (and it's on the XNA community site) that the rest of Live community will be allowed to play these games by the "holidays" without having to cough up the premium membership. I believe they are waiting for XNA 3.0 to be realsed before doing this.
Then, it will be up to the creator if they want to let go to the entire live community.
I also assume that a game will need to undergo community review before it let loose upon the whole of live.
Extinction @ May 20th 2008 9:44PM
Homebrew on PS3 is free via Linux, Java, Javascript and Adobe Flash. And has no space limitations. At the very least, Java and Flash are better than XNA simply due to how many people know how to code in them, and have
McWeen @ May 20th 2008 3:15PM
Do the creators that get their creations put on Xbox live get ALL if any money since they already must pay to put their work on the creators club?
PojoMofo @ May 20th 2008 3:24PM
I think I read an article that said the dev basically gets a commission, like 4 or 5 percent of the games revenue, and that MS would actually own the rights to all the games.
Das @ May 20th 2008 3:53PM
@PojoMojo
"Q: Who owns the IP rights to the game I create? Can I distribute my game on non-Microsoft services?
A: You own the IP rights to your game. However, we may provide incentives for exclusive distribution on Microsoft services. "
from the Live Community FAQ
tmacairjordan87 @ May 20th 2008 3:24PM
They need to just erase a limit altogether so better games can be made. I've got 50 arcade games but haven't downloaded one since they gave away undertow for free.
KingOfGods @ May 20th 2008 3:37PM
Core users play a small part but it's not entirely about them.
I remember reading an interview one time with the former head of XBLA (Greg something?) he stated that MS wanted a pick up and play feel. They wanted users to be able to sit and download and playing a game within minutes.
Have you ever had a few minutes and wanted to download and play a game on the PSN? It's not very fast, sometimes taking more than 30 minutes to download and install.
Shagittarius @ May 20th 2008 3:50PM
The interesting thing about download times is I've had the exact opposite experience. My 360 takes forever to download anything and the PS3 is really snappy fast.
I went to visit my friend in LA though and his 360 was faster than both my machines. I get over a MB a sec download speeds where I am so its not directly related to my bandwidth but something location base seems to determine your speeds from these 2 major services.
My friend and I both have Comcast of course.
tmacairjordan87 @ May 20th 2008 3:55PM
I have great internet speed but my ps3 couldn't download/install things any slower than it does already. My 360 was the same until one of the first dashboard updates when they increased the speed things can be downloaded.
NATO_Duke @ May 20th 2008 4:32PM
My PS3 is really slow with downloads usually as well. Drives me nuts. Yet, as you said above, I remember when it was like that on Live as well. After that update the speeds changed a lot.
PojoMofo @ May 20th 2008 3:25PM
bu-bu-bu, teh core userz!!!
Quizno @ May 20th 2008 3:30PM
Surely this fucks over Arcade and Core owners???
Also by Microsoft's own admission, XBLA sucks and is currently inferior to WiiWare and PSN. (as why else do they need to "leapfrog"
But it's OK, they are gonna leapfrog it soon, with a large boatload of shovelware..
Yippee...
Nick the Hero of Canton @ May 20th 2008 4:32PM
"what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
quickshade @ May 20th 2008 3:33PM
LOL, PS3 and Wii have nothing on 360's arcade. In fact if I remember right they told developers that were just porting classics over to fuck off because they wanted real indie games.
Britton @ May 20th 2008 3:36PM
I'm curious to know what the file size of the Penny Arcade title, being released this Wednesday, is going to be. Anyone know? Also, I heard a brush of a mention about Bionic Commando exceeding the 150MB limit -- is that true?
LameDuck @ May 20th 2008 3:51PM
It is my understanding from the release at GDC that these games can be sold over XBL and downloaded without having to pay a fee for the Creater's Club. I, and many others, can atest to this because there were 5, I believe it was 5, free game demos released over XNA during GDC.
LameDuck @ May 20th 2008 3:52PM
This comment was for Nate. Durrrrrr... I dun no hasws 2 usa repali!
nick @ May 20th 2008 4:07PM
It's about time they loosen the size limitation, in fact I'm not sure they've gone far enough, but at least it's a step in the right direction.
Kudos to Microsoft for recognizing that some DLC games will require more space.
DiRT @ May 20th 2008 5:34PM
It's about time they dropped the SEGANET model, joined the 21st century, and made Live FREE. $50 a year is a rip to play online in the first place.
LameDuck @ May 20th 2008 6:30PM
You must be new at life if you think a $50 dollar fee to support an online service that is currently kicking the shite out of it's compeditors a ripoff.
Let me tell you what a ripoff is. Paying the city $200 to LET ME fix my house before they fine me $2,000 is a ripoff. Having to pay for life saving surgery when you are flat broke is a ripoff. Paying freaking insurance is a ripoff.
Your $50 dollars goes to upkeep, development, and research. My $200 to the city goes for liqueur, hookers, and blow. If you think Sony will keep their online free, I wouldn't care to bet that you will have a rude awaking one day when they start charging for it and claiming it is for "extra services" like Home, user-created content space, and YouTube uploads.
Extinction @ May 20th 2008 9:47PM
I find $50 a year for a service that is not better than PSN, to be too costly. Live uses peer to peer where PSN uses dedicated servers. PSN gets better in-game performance. And on June 12th/MGS4, in-game XMB+Achievements. Live has no advantages
LameDuck @ May 21st 2008 12:32AM
You are forgetting that P2P servers do not get turned off when the game stops making the company monies. Also, I still do not understand this whole "dedicated is better" thing. I get great performance when I play my games on XBL and PSN. I'm beginning to think this is a line givin by people with craptastic 756k connections.
Also, Xbox Guide and achevments have nothing todo with XBL other than a way to message friends and show how big your e-penis is. What I'm talking about is better P2P tech, better in-game/cross-game communications, and more features all around. One reason Sony isn't making any money so far is, they are trying to do all this "free" stuff and keep the console cheap. Right now, Sony is taking a hit by selling a 800-1000 bux console at 500 bux and they are giving you a pricier server model for free.
Take it from someone that works in the business, P2P is cheaper and it's getting as good as, if not better, than the old dedicated model. *I personally think it's better, but I'm not going to /geek out here. Ask me on XBL or MSN.* Mark my words, Sony will NOT keep PSN free. Be it by bankruptcy, competition, or greed. PSN will not stay free.
Lets be real, Sony is digging themselves a hole and jumping in. They have not been doing so well in other ventures and they are bleeding money on the PS3. The only department they are doing any good in is PCs, and that amount along isn't enough to keep the PS3 up. I don't want to see Sony fail as much as the next guy, although I would like them to get a nice bitch-slap, but I'm not going to sit here and fool myself into thinking that all this stuff is actually free. Somewhere, someone is paying for PSN and it's development. Sony isn't making money of the PS3 or it's games, so tell me where the buck will fall when Sony gets tired of footing your internets bill. And personally, I would gladly pay them 50 bux a month too if it would mean that they would stop dicking around and get some work done on the Steam clone known as PSN.
Mull this over while you are at it. We have been promised full BC, 1080p HD, and few SKUs. Has Sony stuck to any of their promises? Hmmmmmm...
SoCoolCurt (PSN: KillaKornbread) @ May 20th 2008 6:21PM
well as a Zune owner, i can say that i am at least moderately intrigued by the XNA thing. i dont expect the Zune part to be the greatest thing even but hopefully i could end up finding something that is mildly entertaining and battery draining.
Moorio (XBL:peacebyanymeans) @ May 20th 2008 6:45PM
Hey Microsoft!
Allow Arcade games to be as big as they want to be and just put a label on a game if it requires a harddrive.
PROBLEM SOLVED!
Extinction @ May 20th 2008 9:42PM
How does this leapfrog PS3? Homebrew on PS3 is free via Linux, Java, Javascript and Adobe Flash. And has no space limitations. At the very least, Java and Flash are better than XNA simply due to how many people know how to code in them, and have.
Kujel @ May 20th 2008 10:05PM
This is nothing but good news :D
ThornedVenom (Harley Quinn Defense Force) @ May 21st 2008 4:19AM
Call me a loon, but I somehow wish that there were other options than the proprietary DRM-vicegripped (because of transfer kit heavily-priced 360 HDD.