Metareview (UK Edition) -- Metal Gear Solid 4 (PS3)
by Justin McElroy 
{ Jun 10th 2008 at 4:00PM }
- IGN (99/100): "If you've ever loved any one of the Metal Gear games, or any moments from the series, there will come a moment when MGS 4 will send your spirits soaring. If you've loved them all, well then there'll be many, many more. It's a masterpiece."
- PSM3 UK (95/100): "Will you enjoy it? Yes, definitely, but while most hardcore fans will adore it, a tiny minority may be left slightly deflated by the weight of their expectations, despite the game's unarguable quality."
- Edge Magazine (80/100): "MGS4 is not the game it could have been; nor is it the game it would have been had the series grown with the benefit of hindsight; nor is it the game it should have been if you believed that early trailer. But it is faithful to its fans, its premise and its heart, delivering an experience that is, in so many ways, without equal."
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
Fanboy @ Jun 10th 2008 4:04PM
Meh, I'd rather have a 360
ThePerfectCompanion @ Jun 10th 2008 4:10PM
LOL get ready...
Vegeta (aka Ska Oreo) @ Jun 10th 2008 4:30PM
wait what's that sound. It sounds like some kind of buzzing coming this-
OH MY FUCKING GOD IT'S THE SDF!!! RUN!!
bigsofty @ Jun 10th 2008 6:01PM
Yay! 5 mins of play followed by 15 minutes of CGI crap... great fun... not!
Jakka @ Jun 10th 2008 6:21PM
OH MY GOD! NO, NOT MY COPY OF HALO 3, NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
eNrique @ Jun 11th 2008 1:41AM
instead of a 360, it seems that you'd rather have a half -star
Fanboy @ Jun 10th 2008 9:24PM
@ eNrique
More like a half "heart" dip-shit
why not the LS2LS7? @ Jun 10th 2008 4:05PM
Wow, Edge sure didn't fall for that whole "10 is the new 8.5" thing.
I read the review, and it mostly seems to cut it down for having too many cutscenes. Is that a valid criticism of an MGS game? If you got to #4 and didn't expect big cutscenes, you weren't paying much attention.
Xav de Matos @ Jun 10th 2008 4:12PM
I love MGS with a passion but I don't think it can get a free pass for doing annoying things JUST because it's MGS.
It's like GTA, it almost feels like people are afraid of saying anything bad about either series, or Halo in most cases.
tmacairjordan87 @ Jun 10th 2008 4:13PM
Exactly you can't punish a game for doing something it has done forever, a trademark if you will. No one punishes GTA for doing what it's good at, no punishes nintendo games for doing what they're good at, and no one punishes artsy games like bioshock and ico for being..well..artsy.
It's what gives a game its identity and what helps set them apart from similar games of that genre.
acefondu @ Jun 10th 2008 4:16PM
That Edge review sucked. Not just for the score, but for not giving valid reasons for it. When has long cut-scenes been a reason to lower a score? He doesn't even make that a reason either, he simply mentions it instead of scolding it. The review is very unclear as to why the game got an 8/10 and yet we "have little choice but to salute it." What is that about? I don't salute 8/10 games that's for sure.
TwEE @ Jun 10th 2008 4:21PM
Holyshit you're such a hypocrite tmacairjordan87.. Wow....
Unless I've mistaken you for another tmacairjordan87 who haunts every Nintendo post.
elmersglue @ Jun 10th 2008 4:31PM
I think the reason it got an 8/10, if i understood the review correctly, is that it's undoubtedly superior in what it does right, but the game is sort of tedious. For instance, you're amazed at the beauty of the graphics and art direction, the complexity of the story, and the elaborately gorgeous cutscenes, but once you get through with it, you don't ever wanna play it again.
I'm also getting the impression from most of these reviews that if you haven't played MGS in the past, then this game will confuse the shit out of you. Which isn't surprising, but worth pointing out to people who are interested in buying it for the sake of having one of the few "must haves" so far. It probably won't be as enjoyable to a newcomer than to a long time fan of the series.
tmacairjordan87 @ Jun 10th 2008 4:36PM
What I meant goes with professional reviewing, and not a random person's opinion like mine. I do not have to sit down and give a non-biased review for a company. These guys clearly went in and said "I don't like long cutscenes, and even though the other 3 MGS games had long cutscenes, I'm gonna give it a lower score just because I don't like them". That's fine if it's someone like me saying it who has no influence on anyone, but not for a "professional" company.
why not the LS2LS7? @ Jun 10th 2008 4:38PM
Xav:
Who says cutscenes are annoying? Not long-time MGS buyers.
I find them annoying, which is why I haven't bought any of them.
But having a reviewer bitch about MGS having cutscenes would be like having a reviewer mark Halo 3 down for being an FPS.
tmacairjordan87 @ Jun 10th 2008 4:42PM
An even better example that I just thought of. If I was a movie reviewer I would undoubtedly have to watch movies that I despise, but a big rule of reviewing movies or anything really is judge it for what it's trying to be, not what you want it to be. That's what an unbiased review is supposed to be. If you want MY personal opinion then yes I don't like nintendo games or Bioshock, but no one's coming to me for a review.
samfish @ Jun 10th 2008 4:51PM
"Exactly you can't punish a game for doing something it has done forever, a trademark if you will. No one punishes GTA for doing what it's good at, no punishes nintendo games for doing what they're good at, and no one punishes artsy games like bioshock and ico for being..well..artsy."
Apples and oranges.
With cutscenes, you're talking about something that was used mostly in the PS1 days as a way to tell the story. But some 12 or so years later, the concept of looooong cutscenes is antiquated. MGS cutscenes are arguably something of a gameplay mechanic and if said mechanic is outdated, it's fair game for criticism.
That isn't really a style in the way a Mario game is bright and cheery or Bioshock or Ico are atmospheric.
The problem is that reviewers are reviewing MGS4 because they all seem to have prior experience with the previous ones. That's obvious from reading the reviews. I suspect, however, that if you gave MGS4 to someone who isn't familiar with the series, that it would have a more down-to-Earth score, a la the Edge review. I don't know if it would be an 8/10, but I sure as Hell don't think it'd be like the fawning reviews we've seen from the fanboy press.
It's also fair to cut MGS4 down based on having to have played the previous games to really appreciate it, which I believe the Edge review (and others) noted. There are exceptions, of course, like planned trilogies that usually end with a 'To Be Continued'. But most people, I recall, were taken by surprise when they learned MGS4 would be the last one, supposedly.
So if someone didn't play MGS3, are they going to understand what's happening in 4? I know that's one of the pitfalls of having a continuity, but at some point, you have to draw a line between having accessibility and a lack thereof.
tmacairjordan87 @ Jun 10th 2008 4:57PM
And one more thing Twee, I've cut my trolling of nintendo back a lot and haven't said anything bad about them for at least a few weeks. So give me a little credit.
arrrgh @ Jun 10th 2008 5:00PM
T H A N K. . . Y O U
SAMFISH!!!
shit...it's not that cutscenes are BAD. But couldn't they have JUST WORKED THE PLOT INTO THE GAME? We are no longer at a point in gaming tech where we need prerendered cinematics to tell the story with all the beauty of a hollywood blockbuster. We can now have that IN-GAME.
Maybe that was just too much innovation for the first entry into the next gen?
colinbell @ Jun 10th 2008 5:13PM
"the concept of looooong cutscenes is antiquated."
That is exactly the kind of BS thats the problem here. Are you saying that a platformer with absolutely NO story (Mario galaxy) is not antiquated? Doesnt the same hold for a shooter with 8-year old gameplay mechanics and a laughable kill-the-aliens story (Halo 3)
My problem with EDGE is that they didnt have the balls to give those two titles lower than 10. Being stringent with scores is good - being inconsistent is not.
why not the LS2LS7? @ Jun 10th 2008 5:22PM
Did someone find a new way to tell stories when I wasn't looking? One that doesn't use cutscenes? Cause last I checked, all the games with stories (HL2, Halo, BioShock, you name it) still tell the story with cutscenes that play out without you driving them.
Given that no one writes massively branching stories, the stories have to be told with scripted sections, and that's how everyone does it.
Halo 3 gets full marks for having done almost nothing since Halo 2 except improve the graphics, and Halo 2 did little but add internet play. Mario Galaxy is ust Mario 128 and did great. MGS4 shouldn't be treated differently.
samfish @ Jun 10th 2008 5:22PM
I personally don't think a lack of story or a cliché story should hamper a review, generally (unless it's REALLY cliché). Although with the way so many games are trying to be movies, I can understand if someone sees differently.
I certainly think it's fair to hold Halo 3 to the antiquated standard, though. A lot of people eventually came to realize, it seems to me, that it WASN'T the second coming of Jesus and that Halo 3, like MGS4 apparently, was essentially fan service.
So, no – I don't think it's fair to compare MGS4's antiquated cutscene shtick with Mario Galaxy's lack of story or Halo's cliche story.
browntown @ Jun 10th 2008 5:22PM
They gave the same score to gears and bioshock so its inline with those games, though they gave halo 3 a 10. I don't know if there was a payoff or they really liked the swag bags, but i don't htink halo deserved a 10, like bioshock didn't even get close?
Ethan @ Jun 10th 2008 5:36PM
Edge's scores can be a little funny, but the article will always tell me if the game's right for me. Though I did think 8 sounded about right with the article.
Noshino @ Jun 10th 2008 5:41PM
"For instance, you're amazed at the beauty of the graphics and art direction, the complexity of the story, and the elaborately gorgeous cutscenes, but once you get through with it, you don't ever wanna play it again."
For what I have seen, there is actually a lot of replayability (Can't say much, scared of banhamer :() they are just bullshitting, they just want to give a lower score to get more attention, and it has worked...
"MGS cutscenes are arguably something of a gameplay mechanic and if said mechanic is outdated, it's fair game for criticism."
Have you seen the cutscenes? Those are not something that you can add to actual gameplay.
"I suspect, however, that if you gave MGS4 to someone who isn't familiar with the series, that it would have a more down-to-Earth score, a la the Edge review."
The same can be said about many other games, do you want me to point them out?
"It's also fair to cut MGS4 down based on having to have played the previous games to really appreciate it, which I believe the Edge review (and others) noted"
Isn't it the same with any story driven game?...
Either way, they somewhat fixed that problem by allowing you to see flashbacks so that you can be reminded or know bits of what is going on
"So if someone didn't play MGS3, are they going to understand what's happening in 4? I know that's one of the pitfalls of having a continuity, but at some point, you have to draw a line between having accessibility and a lack thereof. "
Are you going to understand what is going on SW Episode 6 if you haven't watched any of the previous ones? what about the Godfather 2, would you know what is going on?
Like you stated, that is one of the disadvantages of continuity, but like I mentioned, Kojima did an outstanding job to fix that by giving you the option to see this flashbacks.
samfish, its cool dude, I don't know whether you have a PS3 or even going to play this game, and if you are not, you should really look up information about it, as it is quite fascinating...
NATO_Duke @ Jun 10th 2008 5:50PM
Noshino, once in a while, for the sake of credibility - take a criticism of something in your Sony only universe and let it slide a bit. They aren't going to mail you gold for your rants.
You are one defensive excuse making machine.
RPGJock @ Jun 10th 2008 6:08PM
@ the Edge controversy
I don't know, if the cut scenes are anything like MGS2, especially toward the end when (SPOILER ALERT DON"T READ UNLESS YOU FINISHED MGS2)
E.E. dies and Otacon goes into his soliloquy about his dead sister, you can end up missing that he admits to sleeping with his step mother trying get past the cut scenes. So from there on, you don't want to skip the cut scenes but then you're getting half hour speeches about freedom and being controlled, and people having the right to free speech and information vs censorship and the control of information that can be harmful.
Then you find out why Soldius is trying to free us from this Matrix type grip of the Patriots but we end up stopping him because he will destroy Manhattan and expose the Patriots, causing chaos but liberation for the secret society. Its like what the hell are you trying preaching to me Kojima, I am not as smart as you. Should I believe to not to believe or fight against those who wants us to be free from control??
My head hurts from thinking about that ending, wondering if you should skip or watch it. And if you made it to the end of this post, did you like someone ranting at you for a long time, wonder if it will end soon and if this had any baring on anything. Imagine that for forty five minutes straight and you can see why someone would ding it for that.
I'm just saying...
Mr.ESC @ Jun 10th 2008 6:47PM
You may be wondering why I’m posting this but I’m just here to extend the epic wall of text being formed here by adding my own text that could be or not downvoted or upvoted but in most cases will remain in 2 hearts. Is anyone really going to read every word written in this column? I mean c’mon who has that kind of time. You could I dunno complete Burn the Rope like a 100 times in the time it requires to read all of this, maybe more times.
Just to start with this story let me get clear that I had a cat once that died when I connected his tail to an outlet because I thought it was going to be like the cartoons,yada yada yada I spend 5 years in prison making cookies out of dirt and shit that I sold to other inmates that decided to killed me so I died. Then I returned home to discover that the dead cat was still there I couldn’t believe it.5 years and no one had picked up the effing cat?
Lost in the night I took he corpse of the cat and throw it in the garbage but for my surprise at the other side of the street there were these kids each and every single one with a kitten and I said: “um Heilo children” and then kids cried and cried. Their parents came out of the house and decided to kill me so I died again. The next morning I discover the same kids were playing in my yard with their kittens, I was pissed because their parents killed me.I took my plasma rifle and plastered to the wall and the kids screamed: “he is going to kills us” and then the cyberdemon said: “No I’m going to kill him first” and then he launched his rockets that I immediately dodged and then I fired killing everything insight except the kittens.
The kittens cried out loud: “lolz whies,the whies?” They could speak since they were magical zombie kittens. The kittens turned into an unicorn and chased me until we reach a river.In the river I grab a fugu fish from the river but not any fish a mystical fugu fih and then I faced the demonic unicorn and said the secret chant: “kuwo wei wa wanchi chao kuwo wei wa wanchi chao” then the magical unicorn exploited into zombie kittens except this time the kittens were on fire and then died.
“Game” I said in a triumphant manner complemented with an obligatory: “I owned you b*tches “but then one of them get up and said to me something I’ll never forget :“Read the first word of each paragraph” then I was a zombie.
Mr.ESC @ Jun 10th 2008 6:52PM
I'm aware the post above was incredibly stupid and that was the point of it so I'll make up to you with an honest post.
Edge review doesn't change anything really and scores above 8-0 are still great. I'm still buying a Ps3 for this game and KZ2.
Oh yeah nothing justifies burning kittens not even my crappy posts, joystiq comments, YTMND fads, Doom references or anything at all.
Respect animal life.
Geist @ Jun 10th 2008 9:32PM
Like someone said, you can't ignore long, uninteractive cutscenes merely because previous games in the series do it. It's like saying "Well, Game #2 has some totally shitty controls, but #1 did too so that's all right, since you know what to expect."
why not the LS2LS7? @ Jun 10th 2008 10:26PM
Geist:
The people are playing the game partially FOR THE CUTSCENES. I find them annoying, lots of MGS fans do not. They like the bizarre story, and that's how it is told, just like in other games.
It would be as stupid to have me review MGS4 (since I don't like cutscenes) as it would to have this guy do it.
Korova *Pyro aspect* @ Jun 10th 2008 4:06PM
I am waiting for IGN USA review. I think it will be less enthusiastic but still high. 9.8
arrrgh @ Jun 10th 2008 4:08PM
if only IGN's reviews still meant something
ThePerfectCompanion @ Jun 10th 2008 4:10PM
@ arrrgh
I'm so glad I'm not the only one who's realized just how pathetic IGN has become.
That place is horrible at reviews 90% of the time. And don't get me started on that loser Hilary...
NATO_Duke @ Jun 10th 2008 4:41PM
Is there any review site that you all dont think is complete crap? Seriously, is there? I want to read its perfect prose.
CTC XBL-supapaypamawio PSN-ctclaw @ Jun 10th 2008 5:05PM
I agree with nato, everyone is always whining about how you can't trust this place or that place, it's really stupid. I swear you all think there is some giant gaming conspiracy going on.
samfish @ Jun 10th 2008 5:05PM
I sure don't. I kinda of like the IGN Nintendo team, to be honest, but I generally think they're TOO hard on most games (especially since they have a tendency to write them up so sound really good, like Sonic & the Secret Rings).
But for my money, they hit the important points and I find myself agreeing with them...it's just that the score comes along and you kinda say, "Wait, it only gets a __?!"
The rest of the IGN crew is overly fanboyish and it bugs me. The atrocious God Hand review aside, them having awarded Okami with the 2006 Game of the Year after most of them not having even PLAYED Twilight Princess is what did it for me. And the worst part is, they were even passing off opinions on TP!
Don't get me wrong – I LOVE both games (as anyone who regularly reads Joystiq comments probably knows), but that's just wrong.
I also like RMC at GoNintendo, just because he's so personable in his reviews. I wish more people would do that...but at the same time, I get the feeling that he's hesitant to say TOO many bad things about a game. I don't think I've ever seen him just call out a game for being shit.
Also good are Kotaku's reviews. They're smart enough to do away with the score and organize the good and bad into nice, concise bullet points.
...the downside to THEM is that their reviews sometimes feel a little lacking in important details and sometimes I'd like a more through description of WHY something isn't working.
So NO! There is no perfect review site, although some of them come close enough for me personally to make a better judgment.
Also, I just kinda laugh at anything I read in EGM/1UP because they're such a joke.
Korova *Pyro aspect* @ Jun 10th 2008 5:05PM
I dont hold them up as Gospel, I just find it interesting that they delayed their review so as not to be limited by the pre-release review conditions. I think it might surprise on the low side because of that.
OMG, I sound just like a Wall Street analyst. Quick, somebody, start a review handicapping site and run a book on review score predictions.
CTC XBL-supapaypamawio PSN-ctclaw @ Jun 10th 2008 5:16PM
The other thing I don't get is that most of the time (of course there are a few exceptions) all the reviews from different places are generally within a point or two of each other.
Some examples...
Turok
Electronic Gaming Monthly 6.7/10
Game Informer 7/10
IGN 7.3/10
Gamespot 7/10
Super Smash Bros Melee
Game Informer 9.2 / 10
GamePro 4.5 / 5
Electronic Gaming Monthly 9.5 / 10
IGN 9.6 / 10
Pretty much any game you look at each score is pretty close to each other, so I think every game reviewing company is part of this conspiracy you all believe in.
jimmygotsmack @ Jun 10th 2008 5:44PM
I've said this before, and I will say it again, What the hell gets a 10 theses days, grand thief auto gets a perfect 10? I mean sure, it a great game, but for it to get the honor of the 10 spot "chuckle" which appearntly the only other game to ever get it on that site was legend of zelda in 98....... Makes you wounder if they only give a 10 once every 10 years as some sort ritual.
@ NATO_Duke
I SECOND YOUR STATEMENT. It seems like every review site here is a horrible site. I mean sure, things like xbox magazine, or playstation magazine, or Nintendo power should always be cased aside first, but, as far as I understood, I though ign was the last legit game site that anyone here actually cared about. Apparently thats not true ether.
Somebody list creditable sites?
CTC XBL-supapaypamawio PSN-ctclaw @ Jun 10th 2008 5:52PM
@jimmy
The thing is all review sites generally are within a point or two of each other, so if someone thinks that one isn't credible they shouldn't think that any of them are.
NATO_Duke @ Jun 10th 2008 6:02PM
Ha, you guys agree with me and I am now being voted down. Let me guess - Noshino is mad I asked him to give his rants a rest.
Korova *Pyro aspect* @ Jun 10th 2008 7:11PM
jimmy
Yahtzee is both credible and incredible!
jimmygotsmack @ Jun 10th 2008 8:22PM
@Korova *Pyro aspect*
......... no he isn't, he even said so himself...... infact, alot people don't notice he actually likes alot of the games he reviews.....
Also he is a comedian.
@ CTC XBL-supapaypamawio PSN-ctclaw
Well, the way you have it stated, every game that comes out should have one site giving it a 1/10 and another site giving it a 10/10. If the game is good, then its not far fetched to think many people will think its good, and if its bad, many people will think its bad. That would be annoying if reviews where that random, be kind of like movie reviews......
Seriously, almost any movie that comes out generally get about a 50/100 on meta critic, sure there are exceptions, but it comes down to you ether hate it, or you loved it. You only will know if you like it if you actually watch it, same goes with video games I suppose...
Korova *Pyro aspect* @ Jun 10th 2008 10:10PM
True, he is quite subtle about liking games. People who need scores to figure out whether the reviewer likes something or not may not be clear where he stands. At least gamers have two digit ratings. Movies have thumbs up or down - very sophisticated.
Him being a rant comic does not disqualify him from being a reviewer, that's just his style, like Ebert being fat.
Haggard @ Jun 11th 2008 6:42PM
@jimmy
I loved Speed Racer and that's at 37% on metacritic. I think this post is backing you up, but it's more likely proof of my childish stupidity.
PojoMofo @ Jun 10th 2008 4:10PM
"But it is faithful to its fans, its premise and its heart, delivering an experience that is, in so many ways, without equal."
This = 80????
Charlie_Six @ Jun 10th 2008 4:47PM
I can't wait to pick up my copy tomorrow at midnight, but I usually agree with reviews of games in extremely old franchises like Edge's. I thought Zelda Twilight Princess was very boring and wouldn't have given it anything above an 8. Call of Duty 4 was fun but shouldn't have gotten more than an 8.5, IMO.
It's simply the law of diminishing returns. The more I play something, the less I like it. If a reviewer is reviewing for some audience they expect to be playing the game series for the first time, I suppose they can boost its score on that level. But at that point the reviewer is becoming some kind of advertiser and not a reviewer. For people like me, who have played each Call of Duty, every sequel brings the score down for simply being a sequel that is living out gameplay established 10-15 years ago.
ComradeTrotskii @ Jun 10th 2008 5:06PM
Pojo, the 80 makes more sense when you view that quote it in its context, the words before that sentence
"MGS4 is not the game it could have been; nor is it the game it would have been had the series grown with the benefit of hindsight; nor is it the game it should have been if you believed that early trailer..."
and after
"...In years to come, as people stand before the grave marked ‘Tactical Espionage Action’, they’ll feel little choice but to salute."
http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=10748&Itemid=2&limit=1&limitstart=1
Brodie-san @ Jun 10th 2008 5:44PM
You have to understand that Edge only mark games out of 10. There is no 8.5 (85%) or an 8.9 or whatever. Games can only get 1 of 10 marks. I should note that I think only one or two games have ever got the igmonimy of scoring 1/10. Though Iron Man got 2 which strangely actually makes me wants to pick it up to see how bad it is!
10s are games that "redefine the industry". 9s are games that "are must haves and are excellent." 8s are apparently exceptionally good games and well worthy of time and coin.
I'm a little surprised it didn't get the 9 to be honest but how and ever. 8 is still a very good score for Edge.
This is the magazine that gave GTAIII a 6 and GoldenEye a 9. I don't always agree with the reviews in the magazine. For example: it's got a hard-on for Halo (the games getting 10/9/10 respectively) yet I've played 1 and 2 to completion and wouldn't give the games such lauded scores. And that's reviews for you. They're subjective.
I don't think Edge's 8 is going to stop a person who was going to buy it from not now buying it (and enjoying it - which is the main thing afterall.)