Konami lodges patent suit against Harmonix, MTV over Rock Band
Konami has filed a lawsuit against Harmonix, MTV Networks, and their parent company Viacom alleging that Rock Band violates patents it filed in 2002 and 2003. In the suit, Konami seeks to block Harmonix from using its "inventions" – we're guessing guitar controllers here – and, in addition, is asking for cash compensation. Bloomberg reports that Viacom has not received a copy of the compaint and, as such, could not issue an official comment.
Having introduced GuitarFreaks – a music game utilizing guitar controllers – in Japanese arcades nearly a decade ago, Konami has been late to the guitar game party in the States, only recently announcing its own answer to Guitar Hero and Rock Band with Rock Revolution. We've contacted Konami for comment on the legal proceedings and will update when possible.
Having introduced GuitarFreaks – a music game utilizing guitar controllers – in Japanese arcades nearly a decade ago, Konami has been late to the guitar game party in the States, only recently announcing its own answer to Guitar Hero and Rock Band with Rock Revolution. We've contacted Konami for comment on the legal proceedings and will update when possible.
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
WiiFTW @ Jul 10th 2008 10:08PM
Well, if Harmonix is being sued, why isn't Activision included? Their controllers are essentially the same as Harmonix's.
Tell them to go after Activision instead. Don't hinder the team that's making better games.
Noshino @ Jul 10th 2008 10:17PM
Activision paid Konami...
I really hope Konami wins, this suit is freaking stupid, Harmonix was well aware of these patents and so should have been MTV/Viacom, why didn't they do something about it?...
Sora267 @ Jul 10th 2008 10:30PM
"Activision paid Konami..."
I was thinking that right when I read the headline.
MarkHawk @ Jul 10th 2008 10:46PM
Didn't Guitar Hero Say they were the first to bring the Guitar, Drums, and Mic into one living room?
LOL
No offense to Konami, but seriously? Oh well more attention for HMX can't be a bad thing.
Noshino @ Jul 10th 2008 10:54PM
"No offense to Konami, but seriously? Oh well more attention for HMX can't be a bad thing."
......
"According to Ron Kay, a developer with Harmonix, the idea of Guitar Hero was directly inspired by Konami's GuitarFreaks arcade game, where the player used a guitar-shaped controller to interact with the game. At the time, GuitarFreaks had not seen much exposure in North America.[3][4] RedOctane was making dance pads for games like Dance Dance Revolution for home consoles and also operated an online video rental service similar to Netflix. RedOctane's Kai and Charles Huang recognized the popularity of GuitarFreaks in Japan through their rental service, and planned to create guitar controllers to bring the game to North America.[5] The Huangs raised $1.75 million for the effort, despite being turned down by some investors who "thought [the idea] was too weird".[5] They approached Harmonix, who had previous made music video games such as Frequency, Amplitude and Karaoke Revolution about making a guitar-based video game for those controllers. With a budget of about one million dollars (which Kay noted was "pretty tiny for a video game"), the two companies worked together to develop Guitar Hero. Kay noted that "No one had any notions about it being a massive success; we all just thought it would be fun to do."[3]
The team quickly recognized that "the controller really was the kind of magic sauce for what we wanted to do".[3] They identified three aspects of gameplay that they felt made the game stand out. These aspects included the note-matching aspect and the showmanship created by the use of the whammy bar and tilting of the guitar within the game. The third key aspect was the use of Star Power "to provide a little more depth to the game — some replay value, some interest for people as they were playing beyond just hitting the notes". [3] Harmonix used third party controllers made for GuitarFreaks that were already on the market for development of the game until RedOctane had prepared prototypes for the Guitar Hero controller.[3] The controller initially had pressure-sensitive fret buttons to mimic the playing of a real guitar, but the idea was dropped as it made the gameplay too complex.[6] The idea of using the whammy bar to boost Star Power, in addition to altering the pitch of sustained notes was only realized about a month before the completion of the game.[6]"
They knew from the beginning, why didn't they just pay like Activision did?
todd @ Jul 11th 2008 8:00AM
wondered the same
Paul (PSN: heypaul) @ Jul 11th 2008 12:14PM
Unlike most of the other frivolous video game lawsuits, this one is pretty valid. I grew up playing Guitar Freaks in Asian arcades and remember seeing Guitar Hero for the first time and thinking "how is this not infringing on every aspect of the GuitarFreaks IP?" They pretty much took Konami's game, ditched the J-Pop, slapped in some classic rock and called it a day.
Rock Band is certainly more innovative than GH, but the guitar portion certainly owes much of its success (and profit) to Konami's original design. Hell, their drum portion even reeks of Konami's DrumMania...
Hafk @ Jul 10th 2008 10:08PM
You're late.
I was enthusiastic about GF when I heard about it, but you never delivered. So quit whining, you had your chance.
Hafk @ Jul 10th 2008 10:25PM
Although, MTV/Harmonix should have checked the patents...
Stephen @ Jul 10th 2008 10:09PM
why did they just file this suit now, when rock band has been out since last year?
David @ Jul 10th 2008 10:34PM
Obviously Konami had to see if Rock Band made any money before trying to take it back.
FOXHOUND @ Jul 11th 2008 7:16AM
Not sure if this is one of those instances, but a lot of times; patent suits don't appear before the wide-media until they're done in the dryer.
wait. My train of thought derailed. ._.
I'm going back to sleep.
The_Punisher @ Jul 10th 2008 10:09PM
I'm with Konami on this one.
They made MGS4, they must be right
xD
wes @ Jul 10th 2008 10:13PM
Should'nt they be going after red octane insted?...They are the ones who made the controllers in the first place.
rcf1105 @ Jul 10th 2008 10:16PM
For the record, the reason Activision isn't being included in the suit is because Activision already has a licensing agreement with Konami:
http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=16014
Donald @ Jul 10th 2008 10:18PM
"The case is Konami Digital Entertainment Co. v. Harmonix Music Systems Inc., 08cv286, U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Texas (Marshall)."
::facepalm::
Demaar @ Jul 11th 2008 1:07AM
Good ol' Texas patent suits...
Jhongerkong @ Jul 10th 2008 10:19PM
Im totally having Roxor flashbacks right now
Jay @ Jul 10th 2008 10:41PM
I hear that.
"Konami will sue" isn't even funny anymore.....its just sad
yyr @ Jul 10th 2008 10:20PM
This irritates the crap out of me.
Konami is, at this point, completely and thoroughly unable to do ANYTHING innovative with their music games. The core gameplay of each and every title in their Bemani series--Dance Dance Revolution, beatmania IIDX, pop'n music, Guitar Freaks/DrumMania--has not changed since 2001. Minor features have been added to each series (like integrated record-keeping) but nothing else.
Whenever anyone comes along to innovate, Konami does not hesitate to sue the crap out of them. As soon as they realized that In The Groove had better gameplay, they buried the series and went right back to delivering the same old DDR year after year. They could have struck a deal and catered to both camps, but instead, they completely ignored the ITG fan base and buried the series.
Litigation over innovation...that's Konami. I won't be buying any more of their games, and I hope Rock Revolution turns out to be a complete failure on every level.
CitizenSnips @ Jul 10th 2008 10:30PM
Gotta admit though, Konami deserves to win this. Harmonix built a franchise off someone elses ideas.
Although really, stuff like this happens everyday.
Paul @ Jul 10th 2008 10:42PM
Does what you say actually justify copying old equipment without paying for the privelege to do so? Innovation is fantastic and truly new ideas should never be hindered but come on. Don't you think that mildly altering a previous invention without paying to do so is at least worth some dollars? Let's pretend you invented the fork and then I came and offered a "new" five prong poking/eating device. Don't you think you would be entitled to something for coming up with the core of the idea?
yyr @ Jul 10th 2008 10:51PM
This is a little different. This is a video game; concepts can be improved. Remember when Capcom sued Data East over Fighter's History? The precedent set back then was that game concepts were not patentable.
You can't always improve a fork. But there is always something you can do--no matter how small or large--to make a video game better.
The lawsuit probably has something to do with the hardware involved; it's the only way they have a case. It just freaking annoys me that they'll sue anytime they have a chance.
SonicRift @ Jul 11th 2008 12:50AM
I'm under the impression that it's patents that're holding back the Spork.
Moorio - XBL: peacebyanymeans @ Jul 10th 2008 10:30PM
Fuck Konami.
Sora267 @ Jul 10th 2008 10:35PM
Hmm....I remembered this story: http://www.joystiq.com/2008/07/10/activision-dreams-up-guitar-hero-music-platform-to-rival-itunes/
And, since Acivision OBVIOUSLY paid of Konami....
Activision is clearly trying to get rid of Harmonix's competition and unite the two userbases for GH:WT, at which point they'll be able to secure tons and tons of DLC and make an ubermusicplatform to rule the genre, until Guitar Hero starts sucking (more).
[/conspiracytheory]
Hafk @ Jul 10th 2008 10:43PM
Red Octane paid Konami to use a patent. There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with that.
You are just mad because Harmonix didn't pay and now they are getting sued for it. Shit happens, thats why you just fucking pay your bills.
Hafk @ Jul 10th 2008 10:45PM
And let me make this clear. NOT ACTIVISION
RED OCTANE
RED OCTANE
RED OCTANE
RED OCTANE
Since GUITAR HERO 1. Before Activision was even involved with the series.
Noshino @ Jul 10th 2008 10:47PM
by paid of, on my previous comment, I meant that Activision paid the licenses to Konami, not that they were paid of to go all against Harmonix
Also, your theory doesn't really makes sense since Konami is also releasing a music game, Rock Revolution
Anticrawl @ Jul 10th 2008 11:40PM
DEAR GOD!!! What the fuck people, off is spelt with two F's. TWO!!!
Sora267 @ Jul 10th 2008 11:43PM
1) Yeah, "of" was a typo and I was too lazy to post a fix to it.
2) I thought the [/conspiracytheory] tag at the end would convey my non-seriousness, but I guess I was wrong. I wasn't being serious =O
FSK405K @ Jul 10th 2008 10:35PM
Konami is ridiculous. They just did this same lawsuit like a year and a half ago against RedOctane or someone and lost that time, if I remember correctly. Why don't they go genuinely invent useful things again like another Konami code or something?
kataztrophy @ Jul 10th 2008 10:41PM
No idea is original, get over it already.
Ridgecity @ Jul 10th 2008 10:51PM
KA-CHING!!!
Mr Khan @ Jul 10th 2008 10:56PM
They waited a bit to jump on this, huh?
DRevenge @ Jul 10th 2008 11:41PM
I live in Japan and let me tell you, GuitarFreaks is total shit. Coming from someone who's owned the last 3 Guitar Heroes, I can tell you there is simply no comparison. There's a few arcades I frequent here that are play as much as you want with the exception of an initial fee. I've given GF its fair shake many times and its just awful, the controllers are complete crap and unresponsive compared to the GH/RB ones. The worst part is, these are arcade models, so they should be higher quality!
hhhenryhhh @ Jul 11th 2008 12:13AM
Unresponsive as in smaller window to hit each note? GF is more sensitive to timing, like a proper music game. I own GF 1-4,V2 and also all GH games, and I would definitely say that GF requires more skill.
leobebes @ Jul 10th 2008 11:49PM
Quick John Carpenter sue Konami for stealing Snake's likeness right down to his name from "Escape from NY" for the MSG4 series.
Konami has neglected the western market for many many years now. Japanese companies are notorious for stealing from American technology for years now they should return the favor by acknowledging it as a "sharing of ideas". This suit smells like sour grapes, Konami go back to the drawing board, Japan is suffering in the game development department and you are one of the main reasons.
Brett from Atlanta @ Jul 11th 2008 12:26AM
Ok 'Stiqers. I've got a plan. I hereby call a boycott to the piece of shit that will be Rock Revolution. We can kill 2 birds with one stone. We can stick it to Konami for being a bunch of sore losers (even though they legally have the right to be), and we can get rid of Rock Revolution so there are not three plastic drum sets floating around the video game market. Who's with me?!
Elsnerma @ Jul 11th 2008 3:36AM
I don't think many people were going to buy Rock Revolution in the first place. Almost everyone is excited about Rock Band 2 (and GH4).
And that's probably why the lawsuit comes out now. If they can block the release of Rock Band 2, they figure they will have less competition.
Ocho @ Jul 11th 2008 9:27AM
That's an excellent observation, Elsnerma. It completely explains the timing, total business move. Of course, I sense some sour grapes as well.
Since following their work since Amplitude, I've really appreciated what Boston's Harmonix has brought to (or at least popularized in) the western market. Hope they can settle this.
TWiNKiE @ Jul 11th 2008 3:19PM
How 'bout we boycott Harmonix and Rockband 2 instead?
Those guys are patent infringers!
Brett from Atlanta @ Jul 11th 2008 4:30PM
So you would rather have GH:WT and Rock Revolution. Are you retarded? Rock Band is great, and Rock Band 2 is gonna be fantastic.
ShadzKing @ Jul 11th 2008 2:50AM
Doesn't Konami have enough money from MGS4?
Seriously though, cmon Konami don't fall into this bullshit sueing bandwagon...I thought you were cool :'[
gohmifune @ Jul 11th 2008 3:11AM
MTV also provided patent/trademark issues concerning Drummania. Patent law, as I understand it is a defend it or you lose kind of deal, and there have been hindrances aside from demographic in the way of Konami.
Dio @ Jul 11th 2008 3:29AM
Um, I've actually been to a couple arcades that had Guitar Freaks. It was awesome.
I think it would be easier for everyone if they just made all of the damn controllers compatible with all games.
zeldazeppelin @ Jul 11th 2008 4:23AM
ok what ever they had it coming that why we have our current system so people can just take stuff with out paying for it.
xGeneral DEATHx @ Jul 11th 2008 3:31PM
My eyes are bleeding from reading that.
Punctuation, plz.
BIG T BROOKLYN KING RADIO @ Jul 11th 2008 6:13AM
first off, konami is NOT looking to take over the video game market. what they ARE looking to do is get a slice of the pie, which is something i cant blame them for if they are entitled. the people they are goin after are viacom, a big player with money to make this all go away. this wont be anything to even speak on in i a little bit. konami will walk away happy in the end. atari did this LOTS of times with their NUMEROUS patents on controller designs.
i for one dont play guitar hero, and even though i will readily admit that the hand and eye coordination you need for that games high level has got to be on par with some sort of GOD, i DO wish the game and the controller would actually be designed closer to a real guitar. this is mean by HELPING you learn the actual instrument. people say it would have been too hard and boring, but even calculus could be fun if your teacher was a naked, hot chick! the lesson is, its all in how you teach. your hands can get used to anything. i really think they should have pattered the controller closer to an actual ax.
Cigol @ Jul 11th 2008 6:51AM
It will have taken so long to get around to filing this (I imagine) because as soon as games are released they don't set off alarm bells that they are infringing on copyrights or patents, or whatever. They didn't sit back in their ivory towers WAITING, they didn't know!
Secondly, and again someone more knowledgeable can correct me if I'm wrong, but if Konami do not pursue infringement then they lose their rights to protect their patents in future.