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Posted: Oct 18th 2008 12:08PM (Unverified) said

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Great points. I myself find that I spend more now downloading games than purchasing them, especially with my PSP. My PS3 I will still go out and buy the games, but for the some reason I really like how having all of my games on a memory stick adds to the portability of the PSP. Plus the new store gives you access to so much now.

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 12:48PM psn devilmaker said

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Firstly, I love the pic of the flying dog, its great!!!

I find all these claims that downloads will soon render discs pointless a load of rubbish. It all depends on download speeds and a possible download cache. It can be much quicker to go buy a disc game that is HUGE compared to a download of 1GB that has a game with a short play time. I am currently downloading Ratchet and Clank: Quest for Booty and am only 50% through it after nearly 6 hours of straight downloading. A 3GB download is far too big unless internet speeds increase greatly. I was very unhapy with the game size, but with enough "umm"ing and "arr"ing, I finally decided to give the download a go.

The same story also goes with hard drive space, you start to need bigger and bigger harddrives to fit all these games you download. For poratble games, the game itself takes up much less memory and therefore can be stored on the memory of the system as, for their size, the memory can be huge (a 16GB memory card for the PSP as an example).

Overall I would have to agree that for handheld systems, digital distribution is a much better path to follow than UMD discs, GBA cartridges or DS cards. Yet, when it comes to the living room consoles, the ones that don't need to be taken everywhere, discs are far better. Downloads are still a great medium to keep a game due to ease of use. But the disc, especially for Blu-ray is a far easier way to keep a game of such size to play and take with you the rare times that you do move your console.

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 4:00PM (Unverified) said

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well ur internet sucks cuz it takes me an hour with regular wireless internet to download 3 gbs.
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Posted: Oct 18th 2008 4:09PM psn devilmaker said

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It does, I really want my parents to get the virgin fibre optic internet. Up to 20mbps!!!.

btw. its now at 70%, after 7 hours...
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Posted: Oct 18th 2008 4:13PM psn devilmaker said

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oops, got my time wrong. 8 hours, its sped upo a bit though.
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Posted: Oct 18th 2008 5:18PM (Unverified) said

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wow i downloaded the r2 beta (~2 gigs) in about 30 minutes.
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Posted: Oct 20th 2008 2:40PM lobotomies4free said

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what service/plan do you have?
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Posted: Oct 18th 2008 1:26PM (Unverified) said

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I think this two-part article raises a lot of very good points about the impact that digital delivery will have on video game consumers. I was actually thinking about this today when I saw that LBP had been delayed because Sony and MM decided to fix the discs rather than opt for a patch. Of course if LBP was being offered as a download this wouldn't be an issue. And I completely agree that there will probably be a market for tangible digital goods for far longer than there will need to be. I for one am a sucker for certain bands and will gladly shell out the extra dough for a special edition or package CD/Vinyl but will gladly download other artist's songs without a second thought. Anyway, really good series. Would love to read more about perspectives on this issue because I see this being a huge factor in the coming years. Imagine the impact on the economy/environment if every video game, dvd/blu-ray and book were not offered on store shelves but only through download or streaming. I see a lot of good and bad implications with this, but it seems inevitable.

Posted: Oct 20th 2008 9:27AM (Unverified) said

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To use a cliche, I wonder if the world is big enough to handle both physical and digital media. I don't mean just for games, but for music, movies, everything. One could argue that we're currently transitioning, that eventually broadband speeds, storage space, etc. will become moot points and everything will be digital downloads.

It only makes sense from both a publisher and a consumer's perspective. Eliminate some of the middlemen - packagers, shippers, b&m stores, etc. - and prices go down or profit margins go up (ideally both). Will there still be a market for physical media? Of course, with collector's editions etc. that you mention. There are still people who like vinyl but they accept that they must be willing to pay more for it. But is there some reason besides logistics and nostalgia to hold on to physical distribution? Are there some important gaming experiences that can't be had with digital downloads? For example, remember in MGS1 when Campbell told you to look on the back of the cd case for a codec frequency. . .
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Posted: Oct 18th 2008 2:00PM (Unverified) said

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I love the digital downloads for portable systems, and since I have space, I would probably opt for the digital version of a game over the disc (it doesn't require getting up to change games after all. laziness ftw).

But i love seeing the titles on my shelf... I think I'll always be split between DD and hardcopies. I still buy cds... but I download them too. Same with movies, games, and just about everything else (including food).

Why not accept both as awesome and let the industry try out a new field as it has been since LIVE and the PSN came on the scene.

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 2:04PM Galley said

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I'd rather buy several $10 games, than one $60 game. I just can't commit that much time to a full game.

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 2:24PM Mazrael said

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If the games are coming from the consoles' server (PS3s' store & 360s' market place) it's not really going to take that long.. especcially with broadband speeds increasing along with a better routers.. I think I can get a 1.5GB demo in about 45 minutes.. if I can preorder games through it, maybe the consoles can power up at a certain time to get started, course then we'll need far bigger HDD's. games will be cheaper too & the dev's likely getting more money at the same time..
With bluray being slow & DVD being noisy too. HDD's spin faster & deliver more code.. PS3 can easily get a larger, faster HDD (usually..), unlike the 360 which use 5,600 or 7,200rpm notebook HDDs in a propiety case..

how many of your old games do you still play. myself, very few, so I could just delete them.. Game cases take up so much space when you have 50 or so, if not digital, why not use those slim cases they use in DVD boxsets for shows like Lost or Heroes...

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 2:25PM (Unverified) said

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I agree that the games are cheaper , and there are a lot of great games that wouldn't be put on the market if it wasn't for this.
My biggest con to this , 10 years from now , that PS3 you have will be collecting dust, if your someone like myself that trades in older games i don't play anymore and even older consoles. To give you an idea , i have owned every console other then anything Sega related in the past. Today i have a PS3 and a NDS lite. I trade in my older stuff to help purchase those more expensive items i do want to play. If that PS3 i have is filled with games that i can't get any money from. I am going to lose that trade in ability that i still want to keep. Hence why i think its a great idea, but in many ways its destroying the gaming market by putting out even more games that i don't have time to play , and some which shouldn't be played, and then not giving people the option to sell them to get something back from the game once its done.
I find the game company is gaining , while i am losing in this battle , its why i have really limited the amount i buy this way. Think i have spent 20 bucks, which to be honest is 20 dollars to much when i do go in to trade my system

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 2:33PM (Unverified) said

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As much as i want my games on a memory stick for easier carrying. I will never ever be comfortable with downloading legal copies on my pc since if my harddrive fails due to hardware failure or viruses i would have to pay again and redownload them. Plus i dont think that you can backup these games since i know they are protected in some way to avoid piracy. Its feels better to hold a physical copy of the game i paid for, and you cannot deny the fact that most gamers would rather see their collection on a shelf. You cannot even sell a downloaded game if youre tired of it. For me physical copies of a game are a better investment. The only reason that i will download a game is if it is really a small file that i wont have any trouble redownloading if it gets corrupted or erased accidentally.

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 3:19PM EvoAnubis said

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Acually, the way PSN works, once you buy a game, you can download it as many times as you like.
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Posted: Oct 18th 2008 3:52PM IcerC said

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I believe only 5 times.
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Posted: Oct 18th 2008 4:11PM psn devilmaker said

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Only 5 times, some games even state that it can only be done once I think.
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Posted: Oct 19th 2008 11:04AM (Unverified) said

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and you cant redownload movies or TV shows
found out the hard way on that
if you want it you must rebuy it
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Posted: Oct 18th 2008 6:02PM EvoAnubis said

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Only five times? LOL . . . you guys are confused.You can have your PSN account activated on 5 different PS3 consoles. For each console you have aactivated, once you buy a game, you can download that game on any of those 5 conbsoles as many times as you wish.5 consoles. Unlimited downloads.
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Posted: Oct 18th 2008 2:32PM Erdie said

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I'm for the diversity all the way. I gladly paid for High Velocity Bowling, but had they added enough extra fluff and only offered it as a $60 retail copy, buying it wouldn't even have crossed my mind.

That said, I hope Capcom's latest DLC plan with Mega Man 9 fails completely. The main game is great, but adding up all the costs of the add-ons, I could instead buy another game off of the PSN. Maybe it's just seeing the breadth of free content that's out there, especially for Burnout, that makes me look at paying money for changed enemy distribution with a critical eye.

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 3:31PM Dahk said

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The PSN actually implements restrictions for SOME games but not all. I think warhawk downloads are limited and I forget what else. Beta downloads are usually limited to 5.

A lot of great insight into digital distribution. But being a completist, my first inclination was actually to stuff my biggest (longest to complete) games on there so I actually have something to do everytime I open my PSP. Right now its FF7, and it's been on constant play for like 50 hours now haha.

But its definitely true, this whole big game experience is starting to morph into quick arcade games - especially on a portable. I bought echochrome, and its like a 50MB download! If all of these short games are like this, it'd be totally easy to transfer on and off. I'm finding that its just not exactly part of our mindset yet though lol. Our library is shifting from the shelf... to our external hard drives =P.

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 4:13PM Windmill said

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Digital downloads are horrific.

If digital downloads become the norm... well... that will mean the end of 2nd hand games. The end of rentals. Why, video gaming would become an impossibly expensive hobby to upkeep. No reselling. No borrowing. Ugh.

AWFUL.

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 9:51PM cushenstein said

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2nd-hand games would probably have less of a presence, it's true, but don't they already have digital rentals for movies? I'm sure they could do something similar for games.

Also, one of the points the article make is that not all digital games are expensive, which is one of their appeals. Mega Man 9, a huge franchise from a huge corporation, is only 10 bucks. The DLC is just a couple bucks more. If digital content really is re-creating the arcade experience, it follows that they won't be too expensive--I don't remember slapping down $40 every time I went to the arcade.

Personally, I don't think digital distribution is going to ever completely trump physical distribution, at least not until it makes sense. Downloadable music has taken off so much because it makes sense, but companies still produce CDs and people still buy them. Digitally downloadable games and movies don't yet make the same sense that music does, especially not with recent developments in HD and Blu-ray, so I imagine 2nd hand games will still be with us for some time. :)
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Posted: Oct 19th 2008 6:16AM Windmill said

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Just because its cheap doesn't replace the fact that second hand games = basically free!

See, buy a game 2nd hand, beat it, resell it. Maybe you lose $5 in transaction max, unless you aren't a smart buyer or take forever to beat a game and it decreases in value? With digital distribution, you're screwed. The only thing its good for is bringing down the price of games you'll keep for an eternity, which for the frugal, such games don't exist.

It means less money :( rentals maybe possible but 2nd hand games- man that SUCKS!
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Posted: Oct 18th 2008 4:31PM (Unverified) said

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Why can't people seem to grasp that the limit is not on number of downloads on the PSN network, but number of systems.

You can download a game over and over again, but you can only install the game on five systems. pretty generous if you think about it.

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 7:04PM Windmill said

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Yes it is actually pretty generous. At the same time though, if its an online-based game, then you're only allowed to have one system playing it at the same time. And of course, the larger games don't tend to have the 5-system download thing, though I think Wipeout might...

Regardless, it still fails compared to retail copies.
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Posted: Oct 18th 2008 7:27PM (Unverified) said

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Digital distribution will be the death of gaming.

1) It is not ownership, so Sony (or MS) will be able to control when and how you play the game *you* paid money for.

2) There's no telling if you'll ever be able to get another copy if your memory card/hard drive/whatever crashes and you lose your copy.

Digital distribution is enough to drive me from gaming completely.

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 11:30PM Jacksons said

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I can't see that ever happening, but it'd drive me away in an instant as well.
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Posted: Oct 19th 2008 7:59AM kujospam2000 said

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I agree with all this information, and I personally like both formats. I'm a big time game owner, and before I got more busy in my life I would spend about 2k a year on games and beating them. Although now it's harder to do that, mostly because not that many games are even that good enough to spend the money on. But the reason I really love downloadable content is because you don't have to switch disks. I hate doing that. I don't care about getting off the couch, or anything like that. I hate doing it for my computer also which is right next to me with all the disks. I know that every time I touch it, I have a dumb chance of dropping it and scratching it. So I usually use no-cd/dvd hacks atleast when it comes to PCs. Although at the same time, I don't like downloadable games because I only have 80 gigs on my ps3, and I'm already down to 30 gigs left in only a couple months of owning one.

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 10:04PM (Unverified) said

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Downloading games is really taking off. There's a bunch of great titles on PSN and its growing. Sure there are always be a need for disc based media, some games are too big to dl now (50 gigs of MGS4 with todays download speeds) but smaller games are fine. And don't worry about retailer they can find ways to offer a download service too they could sale codes so you could dl games from the store. Rental services could work like netflex, gamefly you get to rent the games as long as you want, when you want to rent something else instead of mailing it back you just click return the game and they delete one game and send you the next. There will always be a way for retailers and rental services to make money.I just hope they pass on the savings to us !

Posted: Oct 18th 2008 10:39PM DVincent said

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This two-part article was my favorite up to now. Good job Kylie =)

Nice read. I had some opinions I wanted to share, but just came back from work and can't rationalize properly so yeah.. Anyways I had to give you props. I admit I was one of the complainers about your articles some months ago, but this one was enough to change my mind. You improved a lot on your communication with the users of this site.

Posted: Oct 20th 2008 9:37AM (Unverified) said

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Thanks!
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Posted: Oct 19th 2008 12:25AM SharpShooter said

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Great article. I hope they have a mix. Make everything available digitally and have a physical format.

Posted: Oct 19th 2008 1:25AM lobotomies4free said

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They're one of my favorite things about PSN, from Flow to Eden to Linger in Shadows, and many in between. Expanding what a game can be as an interactive experience.

I just want to keep my games with a story on disc so I can always find spare copies

Posted: Oct 19th 2008 12:26PM (Unverified) said

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I found this post very insightful, and I'm happy to note that it seems Kylie's weekend articles have found an appreciative audience. 30'ish posts in and not one "WTF is this article?" type posts.

Good job.

Posted: Oct 20th 2008 9:41AM (Unverified) said

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omgwtf!? i click on this expecting to read about j.d. salinger and instead i get some crap about games? weak!

Sorry, couldn't resist. ^_^
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Posted: Oct 19th 2008 12:16PM (Unverified) said

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Downloads are great and very convienent. However, I must say that there is a certain appeal in going to the store and getting a physical disk with a game on it (or music/movie for that matter).

Posted: Oct 19th 2008 7:04AM (Unverified) said

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I would like to see arcade/classic games as downloadable content and DD is perfect for portable consoles.

However DD will always be catching up with increasing size of games. LBP would be an impossible download a 40GB and like I have said before here in the UK even on unlimited internet package the monthly limit is 20GB ( go over and you face been disconnected due to unfair use.)

Posted: Oct 20th 2008 3:35PM (Unverified) said

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My biggest problem with downloadable games is that I no longer actually own the game. If I buy a game, then stop playing it, either because I beat it or I just didn't enjoy it as much as expected, I can resell the disc. If I download it, it's stuck there, forever eating space on my harddrive, until I decide to throw it away forever. Nobody else can trade with me, GameStop won't take it for trade in value, nothing. It's worthless.

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