Unsealed docs suggest Microsoft knew about 360's disc scratching

by Ross Miller on Dec 15th 2008 5:30PM

It's been some time since we've heard about any lawsuits against Microsoft over the Xbox 360's disc-scratching issue. A document in one pending suit was unsealed last week and asserts that Microsoft discovered the problem prior to launch and had multiple options to fix it, all of which the company rejected at the time. We've heard the argument before, but there are a few new alleged details here.

The three options listed were increase the magnetic field of disc holder (rejected because it would interfere disc opening and closing mechanism), slowing disc rotation speed (would have slowed game loads) and installing small bumpers (would cost an additional $35 to $75 million). According to the document, Microsoft's solution of appending the manual and offering a disc replacement program was deemed insufficient by company employees via an internal email. The plaintiffs are still seeking class action status while Microsoft hopes the courts will end up disc-arding the whole issue (har).

[Via X3F, SeattlePI]

Read - Plaintiffs' Motion for Class Certification (PDF File)

Tags: class-action, lawsuit, legal, microsoft, scratc, scratched-discs, Xbox-360

Reader Comments (134)

The most faulty POS I ever bought in my life. Never will I buy a Microsoft console until I hear more about its hardware.

HAR HAR HARRRRR, MIKE JONES IS TEH FUNNY! LOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOLOLO!!!!111111

Go back to your Soulja Boy album. Children aren't supposed to interrupt adults.

Well, I haven't experienced this problem, so I dunno.

"HAR HAR HARRRRR, MIKE JONES IS TEH FUNNY! LOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOLOLO!!!!111111"

You sir have earned the Gold Standard seal of approval for internet posts.

Did I do it right Haggard?

I've still had zero problems with my 360's hardware over a year later.

With first generation hardware in any genre, from VHS to CD to DVD to games it's always "buyer beware". We early adopters have always been on the vanguard of the screwed, and it's a phenomenon not unique to Microsoft. Is it worth it? Jury's still out on that, but I do so like being first...

This was Microsoft's second generation of console

Agreed. Is there any piece of the console where they didn't cut corners?

"Agreed. Is there any piece of the console where they didn't cut corners?"

Yes, PS3. And it's getting raped because of the cost involved in not cutting corners.

They cut corners with the PS3 - it's just that those corners involved a lack of hardware power instead of a lack of hardware quality. If they had decided not to include Blu-Ray in the PS3, we'd be seeing games on the PS3 that are worlds beyond what the 360 can do.

Unfortunately for Sony, components for BRD were expensive at the time, and in order to keep things relatively affordable (and I use that term loosely), they couldn't put hardware inside the PS3 that was much better than the year-old Xbox 360.

Not worth the trade-off, in my opinion. But that's a whole other argument.

Lack of Hardware power Marty? Did you leave your brain back in 1955?

So do these IN GAME Uncharted 2 screens show this lack of power you speak of?

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=14015473&postcount=1

It lacks a subject... a character... a focus point.

haha... I didnt scroll down, and on further inspection, the first image does have a character... seems pretty bad when the character isn't easily recognizable as a focus point though.

All hardware will experience its downsides. I've never had this happen to either of my 360s.

The ps3 has potential to have greating processing power, but they skimped on the memory. For something which is supposed to be more powerful than the 360, and going strong with a 10 year plan putting in the same amount of RAM was a mistake. They should've upped it to a shared 768 minimum.

thanks for the propaganda Marty. we can always count on ya for that.

anyway, i never thought that the disc scratching was all that huge of a problem anyway (nowhere near a RRoD fiasco). seemed pretty isolated and an actual normal early adopter problem. i mean ive never had it happen to me but from what ive heard, as long as you dont move the thing while it's running, it's fine (i could be wrong though).

LOL@Kill Jebus

What? In-game? You mean like the early Motorstorm trailers? How about the first trailers for Killzone 2. As I've always said, trailers and screen shots that Sony claims to be in-game should be taken with a grain of salt. Killzone 2, for example, does not look spectacular like they tried to make it look with the trailers. The texture quality is more than common in today's generation of games, the models are not anything special. The only thing Killzone 2 has is fancy lighting (in terms of graphics only, I'm sure the gameplay is great). Expect to see Uncharted 2's graphics look half as good as that, as I don't doubt those are target screens.

The 360 is a real nail of a console, people will look back back over the years and everyone will realise not only how much of a shit console it was/is, but how microsoft duped everyone into drinking from it's kool-aid fountain and was backed up by thousands of internet fan boy cretins who would rather follow microsoft off a cliff like lemmings than admit they were duped.

microsoft are laughing all the way to the bank, I hope this law suit nails the fuckers.

Yeah shag, you're doing it just fine.

5th hot meal, thats idiotic. Millions of people are enjoying the console and there has been a huge attach rate for the games. You are just spouting fanboy kool-aid drinking bullsh*t yourself.

*sigh*

I didn't say it was lacking in what it CAN do, what I meant was that it could have been worlds beyond the 360 if they had not included Blu-Ray.

I call 200 comments plus.

I just left Gamestop where a guy was returning the game because of this. Poor guy, poor choice of console. (And yes, that does mean I mean PS3 FTW.)

That was exquisite. You got your "XBOX SUKS" message across perfectly well all in a guise of sympathy for the less informed games such as myself who bought a 360. Well done.

doh. gamers*

Let's not get into this now. We all know the Xbox 360 has completely dominated the PS3 because of Sony's lack of support for any of their consoles. I have a PSP, regret that purchase.

My "guise" of sympathy is genuine... if more people saw how superior the PS3 is to the XBOX then there would be far less people buying them and far more people satisfied with their purchase. Don't drag the PSP into this. That ship has sun- sailed.

"if more people saw how superior the PS3 is to the XBOX then there would be far less people buying them"

HA

oh wait, no

*looks at pun*

No Ross. Bad Ross.

This is completely unsurprising. For a company to not be aware of virtually all issues with their product, they would have to be monumentally stupid. They know most of the time - they simply refuse to acknowledge it publicly in the hopes that it won't come to light immediately (so as to reap maximum profits in the meantime) and then when it does, act ignorantly and conduct damage control.

This is highly typical.

Quite. While it's annoying and lame as hell, the 360 is hardly a Ford Pinto is it?

Yes, but as Microsoft should know, everything comes out in Court.

Two major examples:
- Microsoft's anticompetitive practices regarding IE and Windows (MS claimed IE was essential to Windows, executive emails showed it was just a way to take control of the internet by not supporting standards and making sites only display properly in IE. Ask Netscape.)
- Jim Allchin (former head of Windows) talking about how much he loves OSX and would love Longhorn (later Vista) to be like it. Even claiming about Spotlight "I don't think we'll be able to get search this fast".

There have also been emails released from people like Bill Gates, complaining that Windows is so unintuitive and complicated that even he couldn't figure out how to use it. He was trying to download Movie Maker, and got so confused he gave up.

Microsoft just won't learn. If I was in charge of MS, I'd ditch the in-house email system. It's done nothing but hurt them. Write all notes on starch wafers and have them digested in a massive pit in the basement. Get them delivered by monks with their tongues cut out or highly trained mice.

A new videogame system built by my company is sold from a retailer. It scratches discs. Or the system red rings and fails. Now, should we initiate a recall? Take the number of system in the field, A, multiply by the probable rate of failure, B, multiply by the average out-of-court settlement, C. A times B times C equals X. If X is less than the cost of a recall, we don't do one.

Gamer: Are there a lot of these kinds of failures?

Xbox Exec: You wouldn't believe.

Gamer: Which company do you work for?

Xbox Exec: A major one.

This is your life, and it's ending one minute at a time.

I am Jack's expired warranty.

Fuck off with your disc drives and strine green power lights. I say never be complete. I say stop being perfect. I say let... lets evolve, let the chips fall where they may.

The first rule of the Xbox 360 is you do not talk about hardware failure rates. The second rule of the Xbox 360 is YOU DO NOT TALK about hardware failure rates. Third rule of Xbox 360, someone attempts a repair, opens the console, or picks at the sticker, the warranty is over. Fourth rule, only one guy to a game (unless you pay for Xbox Live). Fifth rule, one Marketplace download at a time, fellas. Sixth rule, no three red lights, no extended warranty. Seventh rule, Xbox Live bans will go on as long as they have to. And the eighth and final rule, if this is your first Xbox 360, you'll eventually have to get it replaced.

First rule about Project Microsoft is: You do not ask questions.

Interesting...Is this the problem where you move it while the disc is spinning and it gets scratched? I've never had my 360 scratch a disk.

Its clear MS rushed this console to be first and made a few mistakes.

I've had a couple of discs clearly scratched by the 360, though nothing like the photo on this post. Oblivion was the first. Over time, these oblong, roundish scuffs appeared on some of our discs.

I got one of those cheap, disc polishing machines and it made the discs still usable. It still happens occasionally, but seems to only be on one out of ever 5 or 10 games.

The housing of the laser would scratch the discs. When the disc got to a certain RPS, it would wobble just enough to cause the disc to come into contact with the housing. A tiny bit of rubber would have fixed the problem, but MS chose not to for cost reasons.

In hindsight, MS made the right move in releasing faulty hardware. (sarcasm)

Early PSX's had the same problem which Sony fixed in 1996.

Moving the Xbox is just a stupid accusation from Microsoft. How many people do you know who move any of their consoles while they're playing?

No, this is the problem where you have your X360 sitting still in your home entertainment center, pop in a disc, hear a terrible noise, and now have a $60 coaster instead of your new game.

It would surprise me if they didn't.

I mean come on, even a fanboy can (should) see that the 360 was a piece of shit on launch hardware wise.

Didn't they initiate a replace scratched disc policy or something early on?

"I mean come on, even a fanboy can (should) see that the 360 was a piece of shit on launch hardware wise"

Yeah, but we don't like to talk about it.

Hey those who forget the past are bound to repeat it.

Seriously though, I(we should) hope it doesn't happen again. MS got lucky and didn't suffer too much backlash from it, which IMO would've been deserved for their shotty 'build now, fix later' mindset they used to have.

But with it all behind us now, we can start to enjoy the reason we're here: The games!.

I most definitely should have bought a couple lotto ticket instead of buying my launch 360 because it hasn't red ringed or scratched discs.

I avoid all launch hardware as it's bond to have some sort of problem.

Even the Wii had problems, and if that thing was any simpler, it would have been made of rocks and dirt!

Nintendo doesn't care about gamers, they are only in it for the money.

Nintendo HATES game people.

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Unsealed docs suggest Microsoft knew about 360's disc scratching

Reader Comments (134)

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