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Reader Comments (98)

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 2:54PM Johnnynumber5 is powered by cell said

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Not so sure new TVs are necessary. Where does that assumption come from?
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 2:56PM (Unverified) said

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no, just glasses.
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 2:58PM (Unverified) said

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i was under the impression that this is being displayed on normal bravias.
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:20PM Mr Khan said

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hmm

It would be interesting, if true. But i thought special screens were needed to polarize the images?
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:25PM Special Agent Steve said

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@ Little Big PSN
Yeah, you need a new T.V. Just like with NVidia's software (that was shown LAST year I might add) you need to replace your T.V. Or, if you got lucky you won't. But a PS3 owner doesn't get that lucky.
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 2:45PM Haggard said

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Unless it's a game where literally nothing happens. You just stare at a jpeg for five hours.

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 2:49PM (Unverified) said

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Does anyone know what's to keep this feature from being implemented on 360 games?

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 2:58PM (Unverified) said

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patents
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:19PM (Unverified) said

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I think it's a Nvidia technology. It could be no coincidence that Nvidia and PS3, sporting the Nvidia RSX, both come out with this kind of technology at CES.
360 and Wii use ATi chips.
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 2:54PM KinseySS said

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4D is real but it something completely different than this.

4D was a texture development for objects changing in real "time" while rendering, like Metal rusting, grass growing, wood rotting, etc. I mean technically games already use things like this, but the 4D they were talking about is much more vast.

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 2:56PM snarfoogle said

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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:00PM TRTX said

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Can't find the exact quote, but uh...yeah...Kutagari did make a statement about PS3 being "4D".

http://ps3.ign.com/articles/696/696060p1.html

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:02PM (Unverified) said

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why do flame wars start? just buy all 3 consoles and nobody has to argue.

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:03PM (Unverified) said

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That's what I did... I love xbox 360 games, PS3 home and psp connectivity, and wii is great with friends for local multiplay... best of all worlds.
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:02PM Serious Kriss said

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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:26PM Special Agent Steve said

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Yeah, why is everyone getting excited over this. Nvidia already did it.
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:05PM NukeAssault said

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Technically speaking... if your playing a game in 3D and it supports rumble wouldn't that be 4D in a sense?

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:13PM (Unverified) said

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no, how do you figure?
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:21PM Shmil said

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No, that would be a sensation not a dimension.
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:24PM NukeAssault said

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Ah, i guess your right. I was thinking about (thx to wiki) something like this. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4-D_film
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:15PM (Unverified) said

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Seem's really cool.
Ive been reading about the Nvidia Nvision stuff that was released at CES too, and that's getting good responses.
If they can do it with a simple firmware update, and if Blu-Ray's ship with IMAX sequences(Dark Knight says it does) then this could be an awesome feature for the PS3.

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:29PM Erdie said

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WipEout HD in 3d. I can't even imagine how awesome that must look.

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:29PM Lekko said

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Simplified version for those that are curious:

(Disclaimer: this isn't 100% fact, I'm not the dev, but there's no other way unless of some newer tech.)

Basically, they are using shutter glasses on 120 Hz screens. A shutter pair of glasses works by tinting heavily one eye, while the other eye is left totally open. Then the screen merely alternates left and right eye images.

The problem with this is that you get a bit of a flickering effect that is stressful to the eye if done slow enough. It's like staring at a blinking light that is going just fast enough to be really, really annoying. This is because you are going very very rapidly from 100% bright to 10% brightness many times a second.

On a conventional screen running at 60fps, that means each eye will have to black out 30 frams per second. We all know (at least PC gamers know) that 30fps is a noticeable framerate and about the bare minimum to play at before animation stops being smooth. 30 frames per second isn't much of an issue on our sets today, but that's because they don't go fully black in between frames.

To counter this effect, you need a 120 Hz screen so each eye gets full 60 frames per second, which is fast enough to not harmfully strain the eye.

Now you should realize that the PS3 can't actually render games at 120Hz, most of the time they are about 30 Hz, so... how does this work on a standard PS3?

The PS3 can OUTPUT a 120Hz signal, but not really render it. You just double the frame outputs. As in you render the left eye screen, then the right eye screen, then just alternate them 1-2-1-2-1-2-1-2 to get the equivalent of a 30 fps game. since you are increasing the rate of flickering on the glasses, you aren't getting eyestrain, the system is rendering at regular speed, and the display can keep up with the output.

For comparison though, IMAX and theaters do not use shutter style glasses, they are using two lenses of different polarization. This same technique can't be used on standard TVs since an LCD set cannot choose what polarity to output for each frame.

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 7:38PM quotaPop said

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Geez, thanks for putting this out there for people to understand.

It was getting kind of annoying reading comments from all the people who assumed this kind of tech only requires a pair of polarized glasses.

----
Stop bitching people, this works in a very different way than the traditional 3D tech the majority of you are accustomed to.

that is all.
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 11:45PM Vidikron said

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@Evan

Umm... they still require glasses. I think most of the people commenting about glasses are more curious about the use of glasses rather than type.
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:29PM Brodo said

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As cool as this 3-D idea is, I could see wearing the glasses being tedious. If you've ever tried watching a 3-D movie it starts to get hard on your eyes.
Unless you can toggle between normal graphics and the 3-D graphics. Then you can give your eyes a rest

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:48PM Erdie said

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Haha, I swear, I could give some of you 500 billion dollars on here and you'd still bitch about having to pay tax on it. Absolutely no pleasing some of you.

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 8:34PM Inect said

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Well no duh the government will be getting over 175 billion from me.

Plus you would kill the dollar value.
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 3:53PM MikeCrazy said

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The 4th dimension is time and space! I'm pretty sure I'm right!

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 4:00PM Gun Barrier said

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actually the first 3 dimensions alone is space.

although the 4th can be time.
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 4:55PM (Unverified) said

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I'm totally blind in my right eye which has never been a big deal to me but in a year or two when 3d technology becomes popular in video games are my gaming days over:(

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 6:05PM (Unverified) said

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well, playing games in 3d is just to make flat pictures appear to have depth like real life. Since it's probably been a while that you've been blind in one eye, you probably won't remember what you're missing. Sense of depth in games right now already resemble real life for you, unfortunately.

I'm partially colorblind. Colors are just not vivid, and I often have trouble making out the difference between amber and green for example. So i really don't know what I'm missing with tv's that promise more vibrant colors.

There are sites that shows 2 versions of pictures. One that's normal, and a colorblind version. To someone like me, both pictures look identical. But my sister who isn't colorblind sees a huge difference.

http://colorvisiontesting.com/what%20colorblind%20people%20see.htm

"Red, orange, yellow, and yellow-green appear somewhat shifted in hue ("hue" is just another word for "color") towards green, and all appear paler than they do to the normal observer. The redness component that a normal observer sees in a violet or lavender color is so weakened for the protanomalous observer that he may fail to detect it, and therefore sees only the blue component. Hence, to him the color that normals call "violet" may look only like another shade of blue."

I'm thankful that it isn't as disabling as having only 1 working eye. Then again, what's worse than getting your hair dyed green and told that it's blonde? :(.
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 5:12PM (Unverified) said

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man i can't for the price to go down (well i can wait) to get in on games like LBP & MGS. i got a 360 & my wife won a Nintendo Wii thru a performance raffle at her job so i of course got the Top 3 Mario games & world of goo & such like the zapper. anyhoot. when i think of 3D or 4D i think of that guy that did some program that makes it the game screen change thru the angle you look at it with its "googles". http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jd3-eiid-Uw
head tracking dang that's it...

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 5:13PM Alex R said

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But surely, it's only a matter of time before something similar comes out for 360. I can't see any extra technology needed other than the glasses, and all video effects you see will be a result of whatever the console reads, not what it's capable of.

I think I might pass on this until we don't need glasses to see it.

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 5:40PM (Unverified) said

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i personally think the XBOX 360 could copy the Wii sensor thing & Wiimote in a way for that. i mean i got the 1st movie trivia game on clearance for like 15-20 bucks. and it brought the game, 4 controllers for it & a plug in sensor like the sensor bar for the Wii to pick up the signal of those extra controllers... so it could modify that i guess. but im no TECHie with a degree or without one for that matter. the Eyetoy im sure should do it as well. the xbox cam seemed too weak for the game they put out or weak in their programming attempt that i know of was only one... liked the video chat thing though.

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 5:41PM (Unverified) said

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You know what this means right? Some of you guys (including Me) are going to need a new 120hz HDTV, try turning on the 3d on a 60hz or worse 30hz if you run a interlaced picture, you might just go blind.

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 6:57PM SoulBlade said

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it's funny how many people on this site want to put sony down for doing something cool or complain about needing new TVs. my guess is these same people would be doing a 180 if it were shown on a 360.

seriously people, this is just demo stuff. it's ok if its not on your precious 360.

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 8:37PM original fred said

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TOO BAD WII/PS3/360/PC OWNERS!!2!

http://tinyurl.com/349ygu

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 9:22PM (Unverified) said

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Are all of you kidding me with this bitching about were some glasses? They're glasses! haven't u ever worn sunglasses before? Jesus what a bunch of babies i've seen a couple of the lastest movies to come out in the real3d format and it looks incredible. If all i have to do is wear a pair of glasses to get that experience than so be it. Please quit crying!

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 11:49PM Vidikron said

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Who is crying and why do you care?
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Posted: Jan 11th 2009 9:49PM myke6699 said

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I can see Logitech coming up with a really cool (read: not geeky) 3D glasses for the Playstation. It would probably look just like your normal sunglases or racing game- a google with optional HUD.

Posted: Jan 11th 2009 10:56PM (Unverified) said

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I love how often the word goggles is confused with google. lol

Posted: Jan 12th 2009 12:00AM (Unverified) said

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"Isn't time the 4th dimension? Wouldn't that make any 3d game technically 4d, from a nerd point of view?"

@Shmil: Time isn't necessarily the fourth. String theory suggests that there may be at least 10 dimensions.

How's that for a nerd point of view?

Posted: Jan 12th 2009 1:05AM (Unverified) said

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Yeah.. this is the future of films too.. right?.... right??

Posted: Jan 12th 2009 3:09AM Fweak said

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@T

it clearly means, specially the way he actually said it that the concept of the PS3 was to give a "4d" experience to players. IE: Audio, Video, Online, Gaming


Posted: Jan 12th 2009 4:13AM (Unverified) said

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Watching Nightmare Before Xmas in 3d finally convinced me that its a viable technology... its pretty awesome... though i did end up with a headache after about an hour.

I've been mildly unimpressed with the "next-gen" leap this time.. so i can imagine this would me more impressive.

I still have my NBC glasses... wonder if i can get hacked Nvidia drivers to do this.
(Nvidia has been doing it for years, right?)

Posted: Jan 12th 2009 7:41AM (Unverified) said

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This 3D thing is totally rad, dude.

Just imagine playing a survival horror game in 3D. Freakin' awesome.

Posted: Jan 12th 2009 1:39PM FredFredrickson said

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Anything involving wearing glasses (or any kind of head-mounted apparatus) is never going to catch on with the masses. Sorry, it's true.

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