GTA: Chinatown Wars sells 89K units in March

My Prediction is correct!
From just 2 sites (Romulation and Mininova), Chinatown wars was been downloaded about twice as much as it has been sold.
Everyone say thanks to Martin.

It'd be hilarious if Rockstar complained about piracy. "When did the world become a bunch of theives?!"

@esposch:

When I went out and bought this 2 weeks ago, a friend of mine yelled at me and told me he could just mod my DS and could get me this for free.

I agree 100% with your statement.

Honestly, if I found out I had 2 weeks to live, I would got to every swap meet in the country, steal all the flashcarts and throw them onto a huge fire.
I find them nothing short of disgusting (moreso than any other forms of piracy except stuff made by Waninkoko - that guy deserves to be thrown into a gay black man's prison for 20 years, and repeatedly forced to drop the soap).
But obviously I know a lot of people here disagree with me, Xav...

A girl in my degree has a flashcart and I've seen her playing different high profile games like Mario Kart. I know her quite well so I gave her a lecture about why she shouldn't.

I have no qualms about pirating a Gameboy game or something really old such as NES because they are no longer made (though if it is on VC, I prefer NES games on VC sometimes) but the DS is a new console, and if some great games aren't selling, then they'll not get sequels, or the companies will abandon that console.

lets try this again, fuckers. If Viewtiful Joe had a threequel, and it were first person, and photo realistic, would it attract attention? No. People know Joe via eye. Fanbase: Alienated, regardless of quality.

Yeah, I guess everyone thought of buying it, but a bunch decided not too.

Also, it looks like I was right with the fanbase not wanting a 1 & 2 style GTA. Like I said before, it is pretty easy to figure out why the series exploded after 3 and they shouldn't have gone back to this. Hell, as pirated as the psp is LCS still sold around 200k-ish in the first week.

Were GTA 1&2 bad, or just not what most people wanted?

It's not like 2 & 3, though. I'm sure the videos must present that idea, but it feels more like a scaled down GTA4 than GTA 2 or 3. I haven't played it long, but I'm enjoying the hell out of it; it keeps a lot of the advancements that GTA4 brought to the table. Honestly, it plays better than VCS, and I enjoyed the hell out of that game too.

I personally didn't like them, but I think they got like 6 and 7s back in the day.

It's more that the fanbase that made GTA the juggernaut it is today do not want a game like Chinatown Wars. I was laughed at and called a troll when I said that, but I think we all realize now that I was right.

So mostly it's the way it looks that seems to be the problem with most people?

Pretty much Rob. If this gen has proven anything with games like carnival games selling as much as it did and Madworld selling bad, it's that the general populace is shallow. They like GTA the way it is now, and showing them a top down GTA on tv was a bad decision.

It's like what I said with killzone. If sony would have showed the general public the amazing graphics and explosions, they would have sold more. You need to put something in ads that wow these people, otherwise you're going to sell 89k in your debut month.

Suddenly I have less faith in the judgment of my fellow man.

I think its more of a problem that the fanbase doesn't even own a ds.

I think both you (tmac) and Gunbarrier are probably right on, it's a bit, or a lot, of both.

My guess is the top down presentation is probably not as appealing to the regular GTA fanbase, so the game is having to struggle to find people new to GTA.

Tmac, you are pissing me off. as someone who has played GTA1 and 2, i can tell you that CW is not like those games. this game is built on a full 3D engine unlike 1 and 2. I have read through all of ur comments on CW and all you are doing is running around shitting on it and mad world for their sales. as someone mentioned before, Clover games are always a ton of fun but dont sell well.

second of all, this is a half months worth of sales, not a full month so dont act like its selling as poorly as you make it out to be.

Have you played it? its very deep. There is as much to do in this one as 3, VC and SA. and you comparing it to the 2 stories games on PSP, it is much better. i have 1, 2, 3, VC, SA, VCS, LCS, 4 and CW and i have to say CW is better than the other 2 current portable ones. if you dont believe me and since you have clearly not played it, look at reviews.

You need to read my comments on it better then, because you're completely missing what I've been saying. I mean....you're not even close. This isn't about if I like it or if I'd buy it since I don't have a DS.

I'm talking about the people who made the GTA franchise what it is today sales wise (aka not us). You people can go on and on how it plays more like 4 and blah blah blah but you guys are not getting it. They don't care about that. All they see when they see the commercials is the top down view and they are INSTANTLY turned off, because it doesn't look like the GTA they know and love.

Some of you seem to either be in denial about this, or you guys are just coming around to what I've been saying about the wii and ds audience for years now.

These. People. Are. Incredibly. Shallow.

This game never had a chance the moment they announced it was a top down view. That's just the plain cold honest to god truth.

T(ool)mac is a douche. You can't go anywhere on this site without his bitch-ass troll head popping up and dropping some bullshit. He once said "I am the voice of the gamer" He's a fucking tool. Listen, tmac, go to metacritic, look at the DS section, and soak up the fact that GTA: CW is the highest rated game. I really don't think anyone but a fucking troll-minded child, like yourself, had a problem with the visual style for the game. In fact, most reviews mention how incredible Liberty City is, a truly awesome creation that is, in fact, completely 3D. You're always so completely uninformed and wrong, and I really wish someone would revoke your commenting privileges. GTA: CW is not top-down 2D. It is a quasi-isometric perspective in 3D. Stop acting like your some kind of video game analyst. You're just a kid with too much time on his hands and tons of bullshit.

I think it'll probably do well as time goes on, as I expect it'll be one of those games that's viewed as one of the 'must-own' titles for the DS. I'd guarantee it's on most DS owners list of games that they will purchase at some point.

I swear to god sometimes the reading comprehension some of you show makes me want to slam my head into a wall.

and that wasn't towards you markez. It was towards the two geniouses before us. Did I not explain what I was saying clear enough? Or do people just see my name in a wii/ds article and rage without even reading my comments?

tmac, do you realize that 1 out of every 2 comments you post you state that you were right about something?

It's really off putting and no guy is ever going to like you for that.

Okay, I'll bite. I also think you're totally wrong about people not wanting a top-down GTA. I think there's a lot of factors at play regarding these early sales figures, but that's not one of them. I think the major factor is the rampant piracy on the DS. People feel, particularly the demographic for GTA, that they should be able to "try it out" before they buy it, only they never get around to buying it. If you go to Kotaku, pull up every article written about Chinatown Wars and revel in the amount of commenters talking about how they pirated it. It's insane. Why these people can't make purchases based off of reviews and videos baffles me. Another factor is the fact that alot of the demographic for this game don't have a DS thanks to the "kiddie" label affixed by assholes like you. It's a perpetual cycle. But I think this is your extreme narcissism at work, thinking that you're some kind of video game analyst, when you're not.

I think this game will be a "long-tail" game, meaning that sales will continue to increase as word of mouth gets around about a how great a game GTA: CW is. But I don't claim to be an analyst, just someone who fits squarely in their demographic due to my age and purchasing habits. And this game is great, no doubt about it. But you're likely to never know that, because you don't own a DS. So why do you even care what the sales numbers are?

I also think the importance of analyzing video game sales numbers as if they were opening weekend box-office numbers is kind of disingenuous as well. Video games have always been a sort of "long-tail" retail sector anyway. Only established franchises on established consoles, like, Mario on the DS or Wii, or God of War III on PS3, Halo on the Xbox, etc. should be viewed in such a way. Because people are aware that those games are coming to those systems. A unique M-rated title's foray to a console with only a handful of M-rated games is not the same. Blogs putting this sort of emphasis on opening sales figures is going to ensure that tons of creative, original titles are going to be shelved in favor of safe bets. Joystiq and others need to stop this, immediately. You guys claim to love video games, but your actions are going to someday ruin them.

"But I think this is your extreme narcissism at work, thinking that you're some kind of video game analyst, when you're not"

You've given me an idea. I've had a hard time figuring out what I want to do, so since I'm right more than most of these so called real analysts I think I should do that. I hear Patcher makes some nice money being wrong most of the time, so I should make some good bank being right a lot.

I for one don't want to play a top-down GTA--I like the 3d perspective that they've used since GTA 3, so I probably won't be buying this game for my DS. Call me whatever you like, it just doesn't look interesting to me (and I loved GTA4). ... Oh, and Tmac is a total tool. Seriously, guy, get a life (outside of posting on game sites too-frequently) and take the old saying to heart: a hollow container makes the most noise.

See, tmac, I kind of figured you would totally skirt all of my points in favor of saying some highly self-involved. You've only proven my point.

And Retrodude, I'm glad we can agree that tmac is a fucking tool. It's too bad you won't buy GTA:CW because you're missing out on an incredible experience. It's silly to get hung up on something as trivial as a camera perspective. I loved GTA IV as well, and in my opinion, GTA:CW provides the better gameplay. But whether or not you buy it, I appreciate a fellow ally against douchey-ness.

I also had a feeling that you wouldn't see I was doing that on purpose to piss people like you and cody off. See, you have to be able to keep up with me if you're going to have a discussion. All you've proven you're capable of doing is calling people names, which my 8 year old nephew is also quite skilled at.

You are truly a sad little kid. Basically you're just trolling, you've admitted as much. You haven't been able to come up with any defense for your claim that people the majority of people don't want a top-down (which it's not) perspective GTA. And I doubt your 8 year old nephew is as good at name-calling as I am. That's crazy that you have a nephew only a few years younger than you. Good for your old parents.

The thing is that Tmac is 100% correct or at the very least partially correct.

The DS & PSP both suffer from RAMPANT online piracy. So, when a "core" title like this launches on the DS it's going to get pirated more than purchased. A game like Unicorn Petz won't get pirated as much because the user buying that product isn't as likely to pirate that material. Don't shoot the messenger because you don't agree with the troooof.

I don't need a defense for what I said with the top down view. My "defense" is the title of this headline "GTA: Chinatown Wars sells 89k units in March". YOU are the one who needs to defend it.

I actually agree with tmac for once. The presentation of this game probably was one of the biggest reasons it turned people off.
I have no problem believing this to be the case, especially when I think about all the GTA fans I've met in the past. "Shallow" is indeed the right word to describe them.

That said, I don't care about Chinatown Wars' sales. Hell, a part of me is almost pleased (almost). I friggin' hate with a passion every GTA game I've ever played. I suspect CTW would be no different.

I guess I didn't realize the piracy on the DS and PSP was that uber-serious. I mean if it's as bad as esposch sez up top, than I am seriously shocked at the trooof. I'm an adult with disposable income and I've never seriously considered pirating a videogame, so I'm apparently rather ignorant as to the scope of how bad it is.

And myself personally, I never buy as many handheld games as I do console games, dunno how much that'd play into this. Took a lot of personal goading to actually pick up Rhythm Heaven.

Eh it's ok guys. People are shocked and raging that it sold so bad, and even though all I did was give a perfectly reasonable reason why it sold bad, I will be their punching bag. Gotta let all that rage out somehow I guess.

Too bad, KennyPowers, that the piracy point was part of MY argument. All t(oolmac) said was the top down perspective was the reason for the sales figures.

And to you, tmac, I think neither of us is arguing whether or not it sold however many units, but rather WHY. So you didn't prove shit.

You're fucking out, I'm fucking in.

Yeah, fuck!

"You're fucking out, I'm fucking in."

What does that even mean?

Also, what do you mean I haven't given a reason why it sold bad? Isn't that what I said at the very start that somehow caused this irrational hatefest on me?

Piracy is certainly a problem too, no doubt. The combination of those 2 problems crippled this game. As samfish and I said though, most of these people are extremely shallow. I personally know a lot of people that immediately passed up on it because it didn't look like all the modern GTAs.

I hate to be the bringer of reason in a situation like this BUT...

Liberty City Stories primary function on PSP was via a glitch in the software that, believe it or not, could be used to downgrade your firmware back to the popular 2.0 hacked firmware making the rounds at the time for it's ability to pirate PSP games. In other words, one of PSPs biggest sellers is 100% wrapped around a bunch of thieves needing it to get at the PSP hacks.

So I'm sure if Rockstar would have had a glitch in the Chinatown Wars that allowed users to circumvent DSi piracy protections, this fucker would be a million seller.

It's like I always say, and though it pains me to admit it, PSP users sure do love their PSP games. They just don't like to PAY for them. Otherwise Japan wouldn't be the only region where PSP software ranks.

That would be a quote from Eastbound & Down, which I'm guessing is a little (a lot) over your head. And while it fit the situation, it really wasn't meant for you. I won't be explaining. Moving on.

I know what you do. I know your game. You come here, stir shit up, then try to act all incredulous when you're backed into a corner. My main point was that you can't say the major reason for these sales figures is because of the camera perspective. I then said that the major factors really had to due with the rampant DS piracy. As well as the fact that assholes like you condescendingly dismiss the DS, thus not giving games like GTA:CW a chance with core gamers. Then you disagreed, which then I challenged you to provide any kind of evidence, or for fuck's sake even just a decent anecdote or two, that the audience is put off by the perspective. You couldn't. Then you tried to claim that piracy was your argument. When it wasn't. You never said anything about piracy, ever.

I've already spent way too much time discussing this with you without you ever bringing anything to the table. Basically, I'm saying your initial statement was wrong, and I stand by that. But now you've kind of agreed to my point, so I'm right.

You're fucking out, Sheppys fucking in*!

*due to topical and insightful comment

Yeah, fuck**!

**I didn't know that, who knew that'd really push unit sales

lol! Yeah I remember it now, that's a fine Kenny Powers quote. I dropped one a thread the other day where Will Ferrel's character sez the 'dick slappin is my game!' bit.

You have about as much proof that it was piracy that I do with my reason, so please don't play that shit with me. I also never said that piracy was my argument, I admitted that it is a problem but I still think that the casual GTA fan passed this up because of how it looked.

You say I'm wrong, and yet you have nothing to back that up. I don't know how you can just say I'm wrong with that much confidence with no evidence. You don't even give consideration to the fact that there was likely more than 1 issue that caused this disaster.

I didn't come here to stir shit up, that's your own conspiracy theory and basically what you wanted to believe. I just said my reason why I think it bombed and I got pounced on, so I accepted my role as the punching bag to angry fans who can't figure out why it tanked.

But like I said, some tools on here just see my name and nerd rage without reading what I said and your first reply...along with JXC's reply is perfect evidence of not actually reading what I said because you just want a reason to pounce on me.

Lols at pointless argument.

IMO, tmac is right, I think the top down perspective made it a definite maybe for a lot of people and someone who is unsure about buying a game is also more likely to pirate it (unless they are plain dishonest which a lot of people are). I also think the marketing on this game was aweful.

Well, Anti-Villian, you mean the marketing is full of awe? I wouldn't go that far. But the newest ad is pretty bad-ass.

Look, if you really are judging a game by looks only, I don't know what to say other than your an idiot. Haven't you learned anything from games that look like shit but are fun to play? Pretty much any good game before this generation or so could qualify as such.

And tmac, I've given consideration to the fact that there's been more than two factors contributing to these sales numbers, as you can see from my previous posts. One, people pirate it, two, there is unfortunately, people like you who dismiss a DS game as an automatically inferior product, sight-unseen.

My assumptions of GTA being heavily pirated come from the fact that on this very discussion topic, someone says that between two download sites, the total downloads doubled this 89k figure. Go here to these posts from Kotaku to see people openly discussing the pirating of the game:

http://kotaku.com/5210334/dueling-analysts-chinatown-wars-sales-show-mature-game-risk-or-huge-opportunity

http://kotaku.com/5207325/from-flash-to-grand-theft-auto-chinatown-wars-cash

Quit being a troll, the act is seriously tiresome. You just enjoy being a contrarion, trying to incite a war on every. single. issue.

Jack, maybe I can help you.

This all boils down to the type of person who would buy Chinatown Wars. in other words, demographics. Allow me to explain.

PSP is currently rife with Piracy in every region BUT Japan. Why? Who is PSP targetting with their games and marketing? Actually.. they are targetting core gamers first. You can make whatever arguements you want but facts are facts. PSP is a very good system focusing on core gamers. So why is this a problem? Because Core gamers know how to look up information about a system and how to come across things like hacks and torrents and suddenly PAYING for the phenominal followup to Wipeout Pure, despite being $30, doesn't seem appealing. See also LocoRoco2 sales versus torrents. A $20 game that's still supposedly too expensive or whatever. Fact of the matter is core gamers know how to research this stuff and piracy on PSP is a hell of a big elephant in the room.

Not content to just steal PSP games though, the R4 has brought a lot of those same people to the DS and that demographic is exactly the same demographic GTA would focus on. For whatever reason, GTA was heavily pirated. Sorry, torrent numbers prove it.

But also keep in mind a lot of those pirated copies could simply be from people in regions who don't have the game yet.

But what does this all mean in the long run? Absolutely nothing.