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Reader Comments (89)

Posted: May 9th 2009 8:16AM Foetoid said

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So they'll protest over the few thousand kids who maybe get to play "Americas Army", but not the 1000x that amount of kids playing COD4? Well done!
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Posted: May 9th 2009 8:47AM (Unverified) said

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To be fair, CoD4 has a rather anti-war message. (Play the Shock and Awe mission in the single player campaign to see what I'm talking about.)

I interpret the message as "war is absolutely horrible and horrifying, but sometimes it's simply necessary."
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Posted: May 9th 2009 9:07AM (Unverified) said

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This Army Experience center is paid for with Federal tax dollars though (as in, our money). I'd like to see it shut down too.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 11:02AM Vidikron said

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That's not even really the point. The Army is essentially luring kids in with a chance to play some free shooters and then giving them their join-the-army spiel in the process. Personally, it's not something I would bother protesting over, but I understand where these guys are coming from.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 11:02AM TheDarkWayne said

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The single player has an anti war message, but the multiplayer is about absolutely nothing except killing people for fun.
Gundam guy, why do you want it closed down? Because it uses a game? So the fuck what? If it wasn't a game they'd just use something else like a sweet action movie the army made themselves or hired someone to make. Sounds like you just dont like the Army, because this doesnt really mean two shits unless this one recruitment center and others like it have drastically increased recruitment, which I doubt.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 5:29PM (Unverified) said

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Dark Wayne, I would also like to see the Army stop using Federal tax money on "sweet action movies." I think the Army is very necessary. Someone has to defend the country. But far too much of the Army's recruitment methods are unethical. A lot of it comes off as brainwashing of kids. I think the Army should require a college degree and the minimum recruitment age should be 22-24 or so. This will increase the quality of the recruits.

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Posted: May 9th 2009 8:48PM (Unverified) said

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Having an effective message is not 'propaganda'. Propaganda requires skewing or altering the truth - in other words, being like Michael Moore.

You don't like that kids might join the Armed Forces because they might think it's fun because there's the (slight) chance they'll die. Big whoop. Significantly more people die in auto accidents in the US every year than die in the military.

I am curious to know how you think the Army should recruit. Sit the kids down and tell them all the horrible things that could possibly happen to them? Then should firefighters show you films of burn victims? Should colleges show you films of (horror) English majors who have to move home and work at Taco Bell? Get off your tired high horse.

And the Army uses Federal dollars to recruit because the Army is a Federal institution. What you should be upset about are brownshirt groups like Americorps and ACORN getting Federal money.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 11:50PM Mr Khan said

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I would at least like to see that money reallocated. Instead of trying to lure people in with bad video games, they could put that money towards something productive, like body armor, or drones.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 8:21AM cloroxbb said

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I could agree on protesting if the army was FORCING kids to shoot actual people, but protesting an ARMY recruitment center having an ARMY video game set up for people to play, thats just retarded. Seriously, there are much worse things in this world that are happening, that should be protested. GET A ****ING LIFE people. Quit worrying about stuff that doesnt matter, and get a clue!
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Posted: May 9th 2009 2:03PM Batzarro The worlds WOrst Detect said

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The more visible the target...
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Posted: May 9th 2009 8:22AM wellsley said

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Hrm...wha? Oh, I thought COD4:MW:MW2 came out early or something...well, back to hibernation, kay l8ter bai.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 8:29AM Foetoid said

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l8ter shouldn't have a 't' in it since the number 8 has that sound already..


Just saying.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 8:45AM Bowser Rogozhin said

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Harold Bishop lecturing others on the tubes.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 8:47AM Bowser Rogozhin said

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Harold Bishop is hip on the internets slang, yo. Salt n Pepa hip.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 8:50AM Bowser Rogozhin said

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Okay, yeah, the double post is worth a downvote. Well, triple post now.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 8:53AM Foetoid said

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What on earth are you talking about lol!
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Posted: May 9th 2009 9:08AM Bowser Rogozhin said

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I don't know. Consider this the after effects of last night and today's boredom at work.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 9:13AM Foetoid said

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Go have a Dark 'n' Stormy. That'll fix it.
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Posted: May 10th 2009 3:12AM wellsley said

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Obviously I was joking. At least, I thought it was obvious...
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Posted: May 10th 2009 9:51PM dartmerc said

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Obvious. Also stupid, unnecessary and unrelated.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 8:23AM vidguy said

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"War is not a game" - agreed, but the game is a damn good recruitment tool. Unless the protesters wish to go overseas to die for their country?
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Posted: May 9th 2009 8:41AM (Unverified) said

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Maybe they don't want anyone to go overseas to die for their country. Also, surely you want to recruit people with a realistic understanding of war... rather than encouraging the idea that war is in any way shape or form entertaining. I doubt I'd strictly agree with this protest but come on.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 9:10AM vidguy said

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Not really. People that have a "realistic understanding of war" don't want to go to battlefields to kill others and risk getting killed, or at least have more reservations about it than someone with a shallow understanding.

The military uses video "games" (more properly "simulations") to train. They've even been experimenting with holographic imaging to allow real soldiers to train by fighting holographic enemies. This game is at a recruitment center. I don't see what the protesters are upset about.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 10:08AM Crono141 said

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They're upset because they believe that the world is full of pink unicorns and leprichans who just want to hold hands and sing "The Candy Mountain Cave" song, and that America is an evil death dealing country who likes to trick children into killing the pink unicorns and leprichans.

When in reality the world is full of people and countries who would be delighted in the destruction of our country and our way of life, as well as that of our closest allies. Thats why we have the military, not only for defense of ourselves, but for the defense of our allies as well.

People who protest military recruitment centers are stupid arrogant hippies. Period.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 10:41AM (Unverified) said

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Crono, long time no see. That's exactly what I was thinking. I remember watching footage of people in Palestine dancing in the streets as the WTC towers fell. I don't want people going to war, but if we have to I want our side to have bigger guns, more people and better training.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 12:08PM Liquidmark said

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"No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country."
-George S. Patton

There, busted a hole through your opening statement right there.

Seriously, perhaps we should focus on making less enemies in the world or focus on NOT being thieving, cowardly, assholes. War should be a LAST RESORT, not the first option chosen.

Personally, I've been in a few deadly situations in my life. All of which were handled without fear or unnecessary violence.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 1:13PM Nigeria said

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"I remember watching footage of people in Palestine dancing in the streets as the WTC towers fell"

Without having a link at hand, I read that those people were actually paid peasants. That was poor education and decent propaganda on show, not the reflections of the majority. And it shouldn't be used as an excuse to stoke concerns, genuine as they may be. That's boxing clever, and that's a little bit naughty.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 11:57PM Mr Khan said

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But think about the amount of ill-will we would have to generate to get people to dance with glee at the deaths of thousands.

Clearly something is wrong.

Equally, this sort of thing is reprehensible, but nothing too extreme to merit such vehement protest.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 8:41AM Bowser Rogozhin said

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I can't watch the video here, but the original article is written well too emotively. Too many adjectives and hyperbole. By the third or fourth paragraph I had lost all trust that she could be considered a reliable source of information. Not to say that she is wrong or anything, but this is a major problem with citizen journalism. No semblance of balance is demonstrated. Citizen journalism is all so petty, so selfish, so narrow eyed. Bitter, even.

But as I click send, my eye catches a glimpse of the site's sub-headline: progressive, tough, liberal. Okay, so that explains it. They're fans of old world politics, the type that loves to compartmentalise rather than analyse.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 9:09AM (Unverified) said

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Are you sure progressives are old world politics? Obama was labeled one of the most liberal Senators, and now he's President, and the Republican party has lost nearly everything at the Federal level.

Not saying the Democrats are "progressive" but I think it's harder to claim liberals are some relics of the past when they seem to rule everything at this moment.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 9:34AM Bowser Rogozhin said

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That wasn't really a swipe at liberals, rather the people who enjoy taking up entrenched political positions without any genuine desire to leave their comfort zone. The same charges could be labelled at conservatives, socialists, or anybody else who clings to a decrepit flag of 19Century ideals.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 9:30AM jcar302 said

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Sometimes all these protests do is give free publicity.

It's like when grand theft auto had the segment of the game where you were supposed to "kill all the hasians" because they were gang member drug dealers.
I went right out and bought that game, before they yanked it from the shelves, for the censored version.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 11:58AM wako said

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Haitian*
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Posted: May 9th 2009 12:04PM jcar302 said

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I had a feeling i spelled it wrong, just too lazy to look it up.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 10:17AM (Unverified) said

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Something that isn't mentioned in the article or the story that I feel is relevant is the location of the center. It is located across the mall's hallway from a Woodward skateboard park, which is also directly next to the Dave & Buster's (arcade). The protesters claims that the tactic is to entice recruits with the suggestion that war is fun and games is not that far off when given these factors. It is strategic. I am an adviser to a skateboard club in New Jersey, and when we brought the kids to the skateboard park, I was really shocked by the Army experience. It is deception payed by the taxpayer, and it really made me feel sick. I fear that this pilot will prove successful, and you will likely start seeing them in your neck of the woods.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 10:24AM BoBsS said

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"War is old men talking and young men dying"

This is basically a set up for that quote. Old men paying for games so that the young people can join and die.

I'm not saying that the recruitment center should close, all I'm saying is that these people actually think that the game will help recruit people.

People joining the Army aren't stupid. They know what they are getting themselves into and are willingly acknowledging that they are putting down the ultimate sacrifice a person can do ... a video game is not helping them decide ... the poor slumping economy does so they should instead go and lineup in front of AIG and do stupid shit like this.
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Posted: May 10th 2009 3:41PM BigD145 said

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People that join have no idea what they are getting themselves into because they've never actually been in the Army before.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 10:25AM (Unverified) said

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Lets see - its ok if say a cleric comes into a western country and preaches hatred against its citizens (typically on taxplayer money), or for movies and other media to show gory and violent scenes, but quite shocking for the Army to encourage kids to join up and serve their country. For an immigrant like me, the attitude of some people in the US / UK is quite bemusing really. Even if you believe (like me) that the recent war was indefensible and based on lies, does that mean being patriotic or fighting for your country is such an awful thing?
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Posted: May 9th 2009 12:53PM Ignatius said

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Being a patriotic United States citizen means this; you question every single thing your government says and does. Why? Because our country was built upon rebellion, the Bill of Rights was meant for us to hold our government in check. Blindly believing anything our government says is not patriotic, it's incredibly stupid.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 2:09PM aristokrat said

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Yes, but joining the Armed Forces because you want to defend the country you love, despite its actions, is quite patriotic indeed.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 5:32PM (Unverified) said

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My driver, drunk or sober = stupidity.
My country, right or wrong = patriotism?

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Posted: May 9th 2009 10:38AM (Unverified) said

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I detect some chicken hawks present.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 10:47AM greggoo said

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if kids wanna join the army when theyre young thats all well and good, hell GI Joe had me doing somersaults and shit with plastic knives when I was a wee one, but if they turn 17 or 18 and still don't know what war is... well then they're just dumb. You can blame video games all you want but are honestly gonna say to yourself, "that guy only joined the army because he played some shitty war video game when he was 13"

1942 was a war game that (ironically) was made in 1984... anybody protest that?
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Posted: May 9th 2009 10:52AM (Unverified) said

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Did you shoot people in the face in 1942? Did they have recruitment soldiers standing next to you in the arcade watching you play it?

No, you shot at unrealistic, gigantic versions of bomber planes and the only person watching you was a smelly dude drinking a slurpie.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 11:05AM greggoo said

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because blowing people up in planes is different than shooting them? Okay what about mercs? back in the day that was realistic as hell... AND you set people on fire!
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Posted: May 9th 2009 1:10PM Rentaro said

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I had a giant flipping laser in 1942. Moral of the game: less soliders, more lasers
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Posted: May 9th 2009 11:03AM (Unverified) said

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Im actually kinda surprised it lasted as long as it did. The mall being private property and all.. the 'protesters' were just loitering and screaming in the middle of the hall. If it had been a group of 4+ teenager they would have been escorted out of the mall almost immediately. Actually, if it was the mall near here someone causing a disturbance is quickly taken away and informed they have been banned from coming back to the mall (not sure how they enforce that...).

@Samik - Yes, patriotism is an awful thing. What does it do? It divides us and keeps us seperate. It makes us believe that 'we're better than (you) are', when really no one is better than any other person. Instead of making things up to keep us from progressing ,we should be striving to make EVERYONEs lives better regardless of if they live in the United States or in South America or in Africa etc. We are all one people. We all have a stake in fate of the planet and our race. The longer we keep ourselves divided, the longer it will take to live peacfully.

www.thezeitgiestmovement.com
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Posted: May 9th 2009 6:05PM (Unverified) said

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Actually, what you are describing is called nationalism, not patriotism.
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Posted: May 9th 2009 11:13AM (Unverified) said

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I can't help but notice that the majority of protesters here were either fat or old... Hippies and those that have no idea what exercise is... just an observation...
I agree with Greggoo, boys (at least) have a natural tendency towards fighting for fun, but if you make it to adult hood and still have no idea of the consequences of war, something other than video games went horribly awry in your life...
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Posted: May 9th 2009 11:31AM (Unverified) said

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What would you like the protesting populace to look like? Considering approximately 64% of Americans are overweight or obese.

Most kids don't join the military because they want to "protect freedom" (who falls for that shit anymore?) they join because of MONEY.
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