David Braben: most game interaction involves killing (unfortunately)

by Ludwig Kietzmann { Jul 28th 2009 at 11:00PM }

Though political alarmists and misguided cultural crusaders will savor the admission, it's true that killing is something that takes up much of our pastimes. It's a shockingly simple act, easily repeatable and often very rewarding. There's certainly a modicum of skill required -- the right hack here, the well-timed slash there -- but even we've become a little desensitized and unmoved by our daily murder of random human beings.

And the same holds true for what's happening in games. In a recent discussion with Eurogamer, Frontier's David Braben observed, "In games, most interaction involves killing, unfortunately." The Elite designer noted that while killing felt realistic "for better or worse," interactions with characters, be they NPCs or online pals, fail to be fulfilling. "It's either stealing stuff from them, killing them and then stealing stuff, or having a bit of voice chat, if you're lucky," he said.

While we'd argue that that plenty of gamers have been killing time with non-violent titles (think Flower or Rock Band), it's hard to dispute Braben's point in the context of player-character interaction -- or to overrule his optimism. "Where it gets interesting is when you can't distinguish AI from a real character, and I know that's still a long way away, but we were saying 10 years ago, when will you not be able to distinguish computer graphics from the real world?"

That's something we'll have to ask Milo!

[Image: The Onion's Close Range]

Tags: david-braben, frontier, lostwinds

Related From Joystiq

David Cox details the 'epic yet sad' score of Castlevania: Lords of Shadow
13 days ago
Upcoming Castlevania's 'lead' console is the PlayStation 3, says Konami producer
21 days ago
Kotick: Activision 'sticking with' DJ Hero franchise
22 days ago

Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)

Derek @ Jul 28th 2009 11:05PM

that's funny

Cheesus(Crust) @ Jul 28th 2009 11:07PM

HA! I played that game a while ago, it was funny. The video was good also!

whylekat @ Jul 29th 2009 12:53AM

What the hell game is that?

Will @ Jul 29th 2009 1:33AM

That game is Close Range

http://www.theonion.com/content/video/hot_new_video_game_consists

whylekat @ Jul 29th 2009 12:13PM

So it's a fake game? Is this a fake article as well... =P

Mazrael @ Jul 28th 2009 11:07PM

AI and people act differently.. you can see it on Gears 2 MP

devilsei @ Jul 28th 2009 11:11PM

Yep. People on Gears 2 will curse and bitch at a moments notice, while the AI shuts the f*** up and gets sh** done.

Radical Dylan @ Jul 28th 2009 11:11PM

And if they give me the option to kill milo in any sick manner that pleases me, i'll buy a copy for each of my friends so we can all enjoy our own secret (or not so secret) sick pleasures.

devilsei @ Jul 28th 2009 11:12PM

Dude... why not train Milo to rick-roll and kill things instead?

Radical Dylan @ Jul 28th 2009 11:20PM

Kill What, he is stuck in his own little program... just him and your interaction with him... So who else is he interacting with in order to kill them or even rick-roll them?

Rob @ Jul 29th 2009 12:09AM

...I pray to god I never meet you in real life.

WREturns (www.theseagullweekly.com) @ Jul 29th 2009 12:16AM

Hey, Dylan. Can I get your email address? My brother is a federal agent and I think he'd like to talk with you. Nothing serious, just some basic questions over coffee or something. What was your real name, again?

Radical Dylan @ Jul 29th 2009 12:35AM

Hahahahaha!!
I'm an American, I know my rights...
But I have the right to remain silent right?
And can you ask him if i can keep the handcuffs afterwords, they could come in handy...
Hahahahahaha!!

NervousXtian @ Jul 28th 2009 11:12PM

I'd say generally a lot of games are about killing.. but you'd be ignoring all sports titles which are pretty darn popular, not to mention all racing games, which have ZERO to do with killing. Last time I checked, they sell a lot as well.

Oh.. and Wii Sports/Resort.. those are about killing? Oh.. guess not..

devilsei @ Jul 28th 2009 11:12PM

Wii Sports does kill...

it kills your soul...
all kinds of dead...

SoulBlade @ Jul 29th 2009 10:03AM

one of my favorite things to do in the old Nascar games was to drive in reverse and cause huge pileups. The game never explicitly told me someone had died, but I like to think they did.

Vandell @ Jul 28th 2009 11:12PM

There is a very key difference between killing people in games and killing people in reality:

ONE OF THEM ISN'T REAL.

gonintendo @ Jul 28th 2009 11:19PM

Exactly. when I frag a guy in cod, some blood effects kick in and then the ragdoll system makes AN ARRAY OF TRIANGLES AND IMAGES fall to the ground. he will respawn in a matter of seconds so there is no loss. if I did the same in reality, I might feel disgust (blood spilling out) and guilt (even if he's a terrorist, he probably has a family that will miss him)

cknblade @ Jul 28th 2009 11:28PM

Mass Effect comes to mind as a counter to that argument. Yes, there was killing, but a lot of the interaction was through their very detailed conversational system. I can think of five instances off the top of my head where bloodshed was avoided in that game through the magic of diplomacy.

Jacob @ Jul 29th 2009 1:36PM

And as crazy as this sounds, I feel victorious in surviving a dungeon in Zelda (my favorite series) because I defeated the puzzles, not the boss at the end or the little baddies in-between.

I think this article generalizes a bit too much.

MikeO. @ Jul 29th 2009 10:31PM

I don't think the general populous is as desensitized as we even allow ourselves to believe.

I've been killing creatures and people my entire gaming life but the first time I put a revolver in the face of an elderly man in GTA IV and pulled the trigger, I let out an, "Oh shit" at seeing his head pop back and his body go tumbling backwards.

While it's still corny compared to real life, it gave me a very brief sense of having actually shot someone, and it felt very odd.

Sly @ Jul 28th 2009 11:33PM

it's not really the killing that's enjoyable. it's the results. the little "+5" coming up after a kill? listening to the whining of your victims after you no-scope them? the glee of teabagging a downed enemy and then killing them when they come back to the scene to repeat it all again?

you don't get those kinds of results in beat 'em ups, hack & slashes, and racers.

Tony Montana @ Jul 28th 2009 11:38PM

It doesn't matter if you kill somebody in a game its NOT real.

On the other hand the argument is valid in terms of game quality.

It'd be nice to have a game where your choices lead to something different rather than the same old boring bs.

Problem is games like RPG's with big story lines are forming into sub-FPS games with few RPG elements as gaming is getting more popular and starting to appeal to the lowest common denominator.

CH3BURASHKA @ Jul 28th 2009 11:36PM

"I see your point, I just think you're an asshole." - Chris Antista, Gamesradar.com

I get where he's coming from, but then again would you rather have The Fenix have a heated debate with the Locust and realize that deep down inside, they're all the same, or cut the bastard in half? For the people who want the former, aren't the Ace Attorney games filling that niche?

Also, hilarious first paragraph and transition!

WREturns (www.theseagullweekly.com) @ Jul 28th 2009 11:44PM

Killing is a popular theme in gaming because it makes the gamer feel empowered. There is nothing that makes you feel more in control of something than if you have the power of life or death over it and gaming provides that in a safe, relatively acceptable way. Like it or not, killing makes you feel like God and, for the moment at least, that's a very good feeling.

Saria the Cat @ Jul 28th 2009 11:54PM

I'm not exactly in disagreement with this sentiment. I'm the type of player that values non-violent NPC interaction more than the violent aspects. That's why games Fallout 3 are a step in the right direction for my type of player, methinks. You have the option to be violent (and in that post-nuclear, anarchist environment, you have to be a lot of the time), but there are also really good interactions to be had with fleshed out characters in that same environment.

Though a lot of other games that focus only on violence are not entirely gratuitous. War games, for example, probably feature the most killing, but this is the most realistic interaction you'd have...in a war.

I think another reason violence is a prime feature in games is because 99% of the makers and players of games are males, and males tend to be more physically aggressive, period. This could be due to how we raise kids culturally (raise girls to be passive aggressive, males to be active aggressive), but just biologically you can make the argument that males tend to be more physically violent. So it's not surprise that most games feature violence. I'm not saying this is a fault on the males' part, but it may explain the content of the majority of games.

ArchiGamer [thephilosophyofgames.wordpress.com] @ Jul 29th 2009 12:16AM

It also, to further your argument, in part that violence is part of our society, if you like it or not. It is a part of our lives just as death and birth, and it shouldn't surprise us to see it portrayed in any other art medium. I think most of the time violence is part of a game its more for the added realism, or something of the sort, I may be over interpreting a little bit, but I hardly think any of the games we play are ever graphic in their violence; there are far worse things that people have done in the real world, than anything seen in games, so far. And until I see anything on the level of what some serial killers do, I see violence in games the same as in movies: its not real, nor is it there for you to copy.

Saria the Cat @ Jul 29th 2009 12:22AM

I was going to mention that as well, the fact that life and death and even killing is a part of our society, so featuring a game based on the reality of society without killing would be unrealistic. I think because murder is one of the greatest social taboos that players want to experiment with it in a fantasy setting, since they can do it without punishment. And of course, no one should be acting out everything they do in games in real life. :)

whylekat @ Jul 29th 2009 1:46PM

I also agree. Things get taken too far for the wrong reasons. I recently read a article talking about how defending a game such a Rapeplay does injustice to the rest of the gaming world. Here's my favorite excerpt which I think applies nicely.
Terrence at GameCouch:
"Any Grand Theft Auto game is a brutal descent into the criminal underworld — yet violence has repercussions and the player always has choices. GTA IV received acclaim from the New York Times and the GTA series has been analyzed in scholarly works like The Meaning and Culture of Grand Theft Auto.
When the Jack Thompsons of the world say that GTA IV is a murder simulator game based on killing cops and prostitutes, we can explain how the violence in GTA IV works. We’re able to describe the role of violence within the narrative and explain how the violence is an aspect of the game’s overall commentary on society. We can even draw parallels between GTA IV’s violence and the violence found in notable movies."

NFK @ Jul 29th 2009 12:49AM

Honestly I think killing is more of a gameplay mechanic most of the time. For instance, what the hell is supposed to happen when you're approaching a goomba? Should it just kind of walk off the screen? Should you start a conversation to reach a reasonable conclusion? Should you have to avoid it completely? No, you jump on it and it "dies", only to respawn later just like in FPS games.

The better argument is that games GLORIFY killing too much. However, to single games out instead of movies is the reason I defend violent games. I am against ANY form of media that depicts explicit, psychotic violence and murder. But honestly, virtually no video games are like that.

Radical Dylan @ Jul 29th 2009 1:02AM

aaw... you must not like the saw series too much...
not to mention that pitiful excuse of a game that is supposed to come out soon based on that movie.
I'm ashamed that i associated my self with that movie after seeing the terrible game being created based off of it.

mocax @ Jul 29th 2009 12:57AM

mario kills with his ass too... :(
pacman eats his enemies.... :(

Snake Robot Podium @ Jul 29th 2009 8:42AM

Are Pac-Man's enemies already dead?

Gamer4Life @ Jul 29th 2009 2:11AM

Let's face it violence/killing is satisfying, it's part of being sentient, video games let us do this is a safe and harmless way (see no one actually gets hurt/dies). Violence is so common in games not only cause it's easy to do but as I said satisfying. Until the entire universe doesn't enjoy violence games will continue to contain violence and continue to be satisfying.