Marvelous lost money on most of its Wii releases

by JC Fletcher on Nov 19th 2009 11:45AM

Pretty much everyone can guess why No More Heroes is being released again -- Marvelous needs money. During a Q&A presentation (PDF link, Japanese) about its fiscal Q2 2010 earnings, Marvelous boldly revealed that three out of its four 2009 Wii releases lost money, though it didn't say which was the winner.

Muramasa sold 47,000 units in Japan, the company said, not specifying American sales. Arc Rise Fantasia, which will be published Stateside by Ignition, sold 45,000 copies. Little King's Story sold 26,000 copies in Japan, 37,000 copies in North America, and 67,000 in Europe. Valhalla Knights: Eldar Saga, which came out in September in North America, sold just 16,000 copies (Japanese sales, which started in October, are not mentioned). Harvest Moon: Tree of Tranquility on Wii somehow sold 57,000 units in 2009 despite being a 2007 release in Japan, a 2008 release in America, and not out until October in Europe and Australia.

Because of lower development costs, Marvelous said, PSP software was more successful, with four out of five releases making money on similar sales numbers. Half-Minute Hero was Marvelous's overall best-performing title, at 70,000 copies sold.

[Via Siliconera]

Tags: Cing, earnings, half-minute-hero, Hero-For-30-Sec, little-kings-story, marvelous, Marvelous-Interactive, muramasa, Nintendo, RPG, RTS, sales, Wii, XSEED, XSeed-JKS, Yuusha-30

Reader Comments (74)

I say bring over as many of these games to the 360/PS3, alot of 'm seem like interesting games.

Agreed. I'd like to see a Harvest Moon game on one of the Big Two.

I still haven't recovered from HM64.

I had HM on the Gamecube. I don't think I ever did beat it or anything, but that game was fun. A lot of stuff to do and it was just very relaxing to play. Almost makes me want to plug that thing back in.

I tried the Gamecube versions, but they just weren't as engrossing.

Harvest Moon 64 is actually rare. We're talking 40 dollars for just the cartridge. But that's what happens when you release it as the system is dying...

I keep asking myself why these companies continue to release Wii exclusives? Hopefully they start asking themselves this as well cause I would love to play a lot of these games, but I don't want to buy a Wii for them.

because those games won't qualify as games on any other console, other than the ds of course.

Little King's Story and Muramasa are exceptional games for ANY console. hopefully this means that future releases come out for PS3 and 360, though.

There is no reason that developers shouldn't release Wii exclusives. Just because you don't have one, doesn't mean it isn't the best-selling console this generation. There are some amazing games available on the Wii, so if people continue to drag their feet on getting one, it's their fault if they miss all the good titles.

That said, it's a damn shame that the best-selling console should have such a hard time moving games. Muramasa was absolutely brilliant, and it makes me sad that so few have played it. It would be worth seeing it move to other consoles just so it can get the attention it deserves.

@Greyseal

"it's a damn shame that the best-selling console should have such a hard time moving games"

Well that's my point, they are having a hard time moving units on the Wii so why do the developers lock themselves into a system that does not have enough of your target audience?

There are several games that deserve more attention, but just because the Wii is the best selling console doesn't mean the people who bought it will buy any game that doesn't start with "Wii" in the title.

If developers love money then there are several reasons not to make any game exclusive to any system.

You know it's bad when your niche japanese games aren't even doing well in Japan. That being said I bought Little King's Story and Rune Factory Frontier and I would actually like a chance to play them next month before ports are announced :(

That may very well be the problem, they are niche. That and they probably suffered from lack of advertising. I mean other then the occasional article, did anyone see much promotion of these games?

I find the Japanese sales surprisingly low. Some of those games seem like the types that would perform decently in Japan.

I wouldn't be surprised if Little King's Story was one of the loss makers.

That game hit the bargain bin really, really quickly, and it was another reminder to myself that maybe buying games on day one of release isn't, financially speaking, always the best of ideas.

In general I never buy any games on day 1, even high profile ones. Its the same old story, they'll be reduced price pretty soon. I got a Wii, PS3, DS, and PSP, so there's always something good I can get cheap before I rush out and buy the newest game full price. Plus most 3rd party Wii games i just never want to pay full price for. I may have to bite on Muramasa though.

But the arguement is easily countered by saying without the Day 1 purchases, the game doesn't perform and thus the studio suffers. And likewise, any followups to a game you snagged for $10 used two years later become highly unlikely.

There is something to be said about bargain hunting. For the love of christ, do it. It's great for the consumers. Just keep in mind, for every Day 1 Activision purchase you make, Atlus suffers.

That just sucks, and I most of those games and enjoy them a lot.

Rented, pirated or bought?

had consensual sex with

Marvelous' first mistake may have been releasing games on the Wii...

In lieu of releasing them on PSP, perhaps, but these clearly aren't the kinds of games that are going to sell wherever you go. You shoot for the cheaper platforms because of it

There would be no bonanza for these titles on PS360, if that's what you're implying...

muramasa would definitely sell on ps3 or xbox.

How can a game "definitely sell" if the stores don't carry it? I went to 5 different Best Buys to get Muramasa. FIVE.

The idea that these games are selling poorly because they're Wii games ignores the problems of availability and promotion. When a publisher consistently has problems selling its games, that tells you far, far more about the publisher than the platform.

guttertalk, that's Ignition. Ignition is relatively new. Doesn't have the infastructure and already has several underperforming titles to their credits. When a publisher cannot move titles like King of Fighters XII or Muramasa, that stops the buyers from stocking further titles from Ignition. And before you know it, you're in the same boat as all PSP owners. Stores won't stock a library and as such, you're tossed to the wilds of Amazon, friend to the niche gamer.

But that has fuck all to do with Marvelous. Different region, different publisher. So your pointing out that you had to go to five different stores to find a Japanese release in America tells me one of two things. Either you're completely ignorant to the fact that most stores don't stock import games or you didn't read the fucking article. Both cases reflect poorly on you.

"But that has fuck all to do with Marvelous. Different region, different publisher. So your pointing out that you had to go to five different stores to find a Japanese release in America tells me one of two things. Either you're completely ignorant to the fact that most stores don't stock import games or you didn't read the fucking article. Both cases reflect poorly on you."

Uhhh...I hate to break it to you, but Muramasa was released in the US a while ago. its not an import at Best Buy...it would be a US release game NOT being sold at Best Buy. I've had the same problem with trying to find Muramasa. I just haven't seen it.

Thats right, Sean Penn went full retard and went home empty handed.

And little king's story was just awesome. There is no justice in this cruel world.

The trailer for LKS was truly awful. My 7-year-old saw it and thought it was a game for babies. Marvelous shot themselves in the foot trying to portray the game as kiddie friendly as possible.

Dear oh dear Msrvelous, look, save yourself time and just make PSP exclusives, no more heros on PSP will be a first day buy for me if you do ^^

You guys safe?

http://gizmodo.com/5408329/aols-slow-death-continues-a-third-of-staff-must-go

I remember, i think it was back in July 08, or something, that they weren't getting paid for a short period of time, and very nearly went under

If anyone else remembers when a lot of the articles were authored by "the Joystiq Staff" or the "______ Fanboy Staff" rather than individual authors.

Huh. Usually it's the case that you at least break even, because the profit thresholds are so low, but some of these sold under 100k worldwide

If one profited, i bet it was Muramasa. It had a relatively strong opening week in the states (like 50k or so)

I'll have to bookmark this article the next time you say it's easy to profit on the Wii and the developers shouldn't port their games to the PS(P)360. Now, we have evidence to the exact contrary of that statement and though I've asked repeatedly you've never put forth a single shred of hard data that shows Wii games are more profitable.

Sorry I'm late to the post and I probably won't see your reply but I must have missed this entry on Joystiq somehow.

The gravy train is over.

Unless you make Monster Hunter, anyway.

Why are there never posts about companies games not selling on other systems?

Looking at the pile of games on 360 at blockbuster the other day, half of them I've never heard of. Are these all multimillion sellers?

How well is china town wars doing on eh psp? 4-5 million yet?

Probably not, as I keep telling all of you guys the majority of the GTA fanbase is not interested in the top down GTA.

The other PSP gta games did sell at least 4 million, because it was like the GTA's that they know and love.

Just a few posts down there's a post about Sony having to push back their expected profitability date and we see posts about studios closing ans layoffs all the time. I think you're just seeing what you want to see.

To be fair, the troubles facing Dead Space and Mirror's Edge were well documented. And I think we all shook our heads and sighed as Spark Entertainment ruined the intriguing concepts found in Turning Point and Legendary.

But, to an extent, I do agree with you. What were the fates of games like Section 8, Darkest of Days and Frontlines?

"I think you're just seeing what you want to see." Breasts? Unicorns? Unicorn breasts? Where?

But seriously it dose seem every time a Wii game under preforms this has to be big news, even if its a weird little niche game nobody wants to buy.. It usually gets hits for the article, the anti-nintendo crowd come out to use this as proof that Nintendo is destroying gaming, and the Nintendo fans come out to argue with them.. Like I'm doing now.

Just look at bloom box.. that comes out, within a week theres articles everywhere that it bombed and its because its on the wii, that wii gamers don't like games, and Nintendo is destroying gaming..
Then we find out it didn't do that bad, and it makes it look like that whole stink up over the game's initial sales was a manufactured none story..

In this instance I think it's just being discussed because of the news of the ports. But other than that, I think it is a bit more notable, in general, when a company fails to turn a profit on the Wii because the user base is so much larger and the development costs so much lower compared to the other platforms. Those are two of the main reasons devs work with the Wii.

I don't know the sales, but China Town Wars on PSP is selling great on PSN. It's in the top 10 sales chart.

As far as other games not selling well on other systems, uh.. yea.. there are plenty of those. I mean, think of most cruddy games that had a large profile and you should get there...

Haze
Bionic Commando
Turok
ect.

Proportionally, I'm surprised there aren't MORE articles about how Wii games are under performing.

Wii's fanbase isnt gamers 50 million consoles mean nothing if they never buy games......

Original and insightful. Let me help.

Wii leads the other consoles in 3rd party software sales. So they do buy games, and buy non-Nintendo games. A lot of them.

Or games that aren't preceded by the words "Wii" or "Mario" anyway.

wii leads other consoles in 3rd party sales? that's a new one. xbox definitely have higher attach rate.

It's the shear size of the user base. The Wii doesn't need to have the highest attach rate to move the most software overall.

@m0m0:

http://vgsales.wikia.com/wiki/File:Nintendo3rdpartysales.jpg

http://www.edge-online.com/features/in-depth-analysis-games-and-console-sales?page=0,2

Folks need to learn what the numbers that they quote mean. Attach rate is merely a ratio.

A big percentage of that user base are just casual gamers. Like uncles or grannies. Those people just get Wii Fit and then forget entirely about the console. Who really move software sales? REAL gamers.

Wii owners have a tie ratio of 6.5 gamers per system. Stop with the nonsense they buy 1 or 2 games, and that's it. Wii games account for the majority of games sold.

http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=25740

(And stop using "attach rate" which is something different than tie ratio.)

That's still misleading. Tie ratio only takes into account the average number of games per system - it doesn't say *when* those games were bought. I personally have 7 games for my Wii - but the last one I bought was over a year ago.

Also - if you look at the graph further down the page - it shows the number of games to date being sold on the Wii as being the same as last year. That's very telling, as the Wii is still selling systems.

So - that means that a larger installed base is buying the same number of games - that's less games per user. That tells me that older Wii owners aren't buying anything, and the newer ones are snatching up games. The PS3 and 360 are growing, while the Wii is stagnant.

Oh - and according to the graph - the total YTD across all systems is 35+31+18 (mil) or 84 million. Wii sold 35mil or 41%. That's not a majority.. :P

I stand corrected: I'm pretty sure I'm remembering that the DS and Wii combine account for the majority of software sales. Nintendo was promoting that stat last and some of this year.

And, yes, the Wii sales are stagnating. But I was countering the claim that Wii owners don't buy games or buy very few. The Wii's tie ratio increased from 2008 to 2009 for the year through September (6.4 to 6.5). I mention the tie ratio only to refute that point. Now, you say you have only 7 Wii games, which is pretty close the tie rate. You seem to dismiss that number, but is it the 8 or 9 360 games that much better? Not so much that I'd dismiss the Wii gamers' purchases like some on this site. The average Wii gamer is buying about as many games as the PS3 owner.

And Nintendo hasn't had the big games like they had in 2008, although NSMBW has the appearance of being another big, long-tailed seller. Whether intentional or not, Nintendo has effectively given third parties the opportunity to promote their games without dominating competition from Nintendo titles. There's no doubt that Wii owners are missing out on some very good games, including several that Marvelous published. The problem is that third parties have fumbled the ball here.

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Marvelous lost money on most of its Wii releases

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