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Reader Comments (150)

Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:36AM (Unverified) said

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Dang that red dragon knight sure looks excited...

Posted: Feb 4th 2010 10:02AM (Unverified) said

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can't unsee
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:36AM CaptainProtonX said

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Young,, unknowing lad falls into power to save the world.

Yeah...I had enough of that back in the 90s.

Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:39AM Bubbameister33 said

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Does he have amnesia?
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:41AM Bluebreaker said

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Nobody wants to play teenagers anymore. Not even the teenagers.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:46AM (Unverified) said

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If all those cliches weren't enough to let you know this is a japanese game...the guy turns into a giant mech-like robot.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 12:15PM GuardianLegend said

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@tmac,

Are robots really a Japanese thing still? 10 years ago I would've agreed with you, but since then the US (and other nations too) has loved the two immensely popular Transformers films, as well as the Iron Man, District 9, and Avatar movies. (Tobey Maguire is making a Robotech film, too.)

These four IPs have brought in billions of dollars, none of them were directed by Japanese people, and they all featured robots or mech suits pretty prominently. Coincidentally, all four involved a "powerless guy gets powerful and saves the world (or a region)" themes as well. Although Iron Man made it's guy a billionaire, THEN made him powerless, before giving him the robot suit... of power.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 4:39PM Spookimitsu said

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SMH at the thought of Hollywood raping my fond memories of robotech ^

is nothing sacred?
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 5:36PM TheDarkWayne said

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@Guardian Only one of the films you listed was actually about robots. Iron Man had absolutely no robots in it and is a property that outlived the Cold War, and District 9 and Avatar had modest robots for like, 10 minutes. Hardly the same level of dozens upon dozens of television and games focused solely upon giant robots. BTW transformers was created in Japan
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 8:04PM (Unverified) said

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Mech-like robot? It's CLEARLY a magic-like suit of ARMOR.

Gosh, no appreciation for distinction

And if anything, magic and knights are very Western.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:34PM GuardianLegend said

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@Dark Wayne,

This is a really nerdy conversation but I guess I will go with it anyway.

First, we need to break down the economics. How much did each of the films I mentioned cost to produce? And how much did they bring in terms of revenue? Then, we need to compare and contrast this to how much it cost to produce various Japanese anime shows and manga, and how much revenue they generated. The reason for this is that one giant, extremely popular mecha IP (ex: Transformers movies) is a lot more important than one unpopular mecha IPs (ex: the PS2 game Robot Alchemic Drive). It can take a hundred small IPs to match the popularity of one large IP. The American made and consumed Transformer films have, in just two films, overtaken all the sales of 30 years of Mobile Suit Gundam shows, which is the most popular mecha series in Japan. The TF films certainly overtook Gundam in budget. Wikipedia says the TF films brought in $1.5 billion dollars, half of which came from American audiences alone, and that the sequel cost $200 million to make. We aren't even including merchandise sales here. That $1.5 billion is just from the movies. A businessweek article says that Hasbro sold $480 million in Transformers toys in 2007 alone.

Meanwhile, Gundam SEED, the 50 episode anime series made in Japan, cost a mere $10 million dollars to make, and probably didn't break the $50 million revenue mark. Wiki also says that the entire Gundam franchise is a 50 billion yen franchise (which is just $561 million dollars). So the two Transformers films, made in the US, have US domestic sales that outweigh the total of Gundam's sales, and that is including all of Gundam's DVD and merchandising. And we haven't even factored in Iron Man, Avatar, and District 9. Iron Man, Avatar (a $2 billion dollar movie so far), and Transformers all have sequels coming, too.

In terms of sheer dollars spent to produce and consume "robot featured" properties like Transformers, Avatar, District 9, and Iron Man, I think it's clear that American audiences have become fans of mecha in a big way. Americans, per capita, may have spent more money on mecha IP than Japanese, per capita, in the past 10 years.

As for the Iron Man suit not being a robot, it is identical to the Gundam suits in that a human operates it from within, and Gundam is probably the most popular "robot" show in Japan. Indeed, most of the popular "robot" shows from Japan don't feature sentient robots, but suits that require a pilot, like Iron Man. This suit in White Knight Chronicles appears to be of a similar idea. The hero essentially becomes a powerful suit of armor.

And District 9's climax is entirely centered around the robot suit Wikkus gets. Without that suit, the movie's memorable climax is gone. Avatar's climax involves mechas galore as well. Neither of these films are about mecha per se, but neither are the most popular Gundam shows. The Gundams exist to sell toys, but there are characters, stories, and politics to follow, just like District 9 and Avatar.

Finally, the old Transformers was animated in Japan, but the writing team was American (or at least North American). The Marvel comics were American made as well. Furthermore, the budget for Transformers 1 and 2, and profits, probably outweigh the entirety of ALL the Japanese Transformers shows/mangas put together. Bottomline: Americans love Transformers more than Japanese do, and their spending habits show it.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:38AM sonicspike41 said

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Well looks like I just became $60 richer, or I am no longer $60 poorer, depending on how you look at it.

I always wondered what this game was like, and now, sadly, I know. Perhaps they can put that same combat/skill system to use in a better game next time.

Posted: Feb 4th 2010 10:40AM quackdocter said

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yea i wish i had read this before buying it yesterday, i could have spent those $60 elsewhere, that said this game would be worth to buy at $40 which is what i feel it should have been in the US.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 10:47AM Kattleox said

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If by "next game" you mean Dark Cloud 3 then oh yes I hope you are right. Level-5 are by far my favorite devs and they have made a good chunk of the games on my top 10 list, and--I'm suprised nobody has brought it up--havent really ever made a bad game. The first dark cloud wasn't fantastic, but it was innovative enough to cover up its flaws. DC2 was AMAZING mixing so many types of gameplay with a fun and engaging story. Dragon Quest VIII was DQVIII: we all know it was amazing. Rogue Galaxy, Professor Layton, and Jeanne d'Arc, all in true Level-5 fashion, were Amazing and really helped to perfect their respective genres. WHY would anyone think WKC would be bad? Well it was, against all odds (and curiously, the two games that aren't cell shaded are the worst).

As for you though, go buy one of those other games. Its not $60 and any one of them will be what this game was trying to be. Lets just hope they stick to their guns and make a new Dark Cloud next time.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 11:06AM Petebot330 said

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I don't understand why people buy games before reading the reviews. (Unless it's a Valve or Bioware game--that's acceptable)
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 12:27PM darthnilloc said

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I think kattleox just answered that. Level 5 is usually a fantastic dev and it's really disappointing to hear that this game doesn't stand up to their track record.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:39AM Bluebreaker said

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Everyone keeps saying that this was a surprising misstep from Level-5 given the work that went on it. But I personally think a lot of people did like it anyway because of the FFXII style gameplay. Don't believe everything a fanboy tells you. :)

Posted: Feb 5th 2010 1:27AM afrosheen said

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I bought it yesterday and that's all I can keep thinking about...why am I playing FFXII again? Programming your characters with combo sets, letting the AI work out what your other 2 party members are doing, hacking away brainlessly at enemies until they die. It's FFXII in HD.

That said, it's not bad by any means, it's just not as great as it could be. It looks like a bad hybrid of east-meets-west game development and it doesn't fit together very well, the way L5 has done it. The graphics are subpar considering the time they've spent on it, the framerate dips in spots and there are strange clipping issues. If you wear a nice flowing cape and carry a longsword, the sword pokes halfway out of it at all times. Should have been easy to catch in QA. Textures, for the most part, are done well, but the lighting is simple and so are the character models.

It seems to me a late PS2 game that got HD treatment halfway through the dev cycle. I haven't gotten into the online system yet (which is supposed to be alot of fun and MMO-ish) but I think that's where the bulk of the game is.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:39AM Shadowbender said

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While I'm sure there will be numerous upon numerous people that will enjoy this game...this is very disappointing. But I do agree with what they said in the beginning: Had they released this years ago, WKC would have been praised by critics and I'm sure would have been pleased, much more then we will be right now. These days, it's tough to live up to RPGs like Mass Effect 2 or Fallout 3.

All this being said, I'm still thoroughly interested in this, but I seem to be fueled with some disappointment.

Posted: Feb 4th 2010 11:42AM (Unverified) said

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I certainly hope no one is going to try and compare this (or like RPGs) to Mass Effect or Fallout. Even if the game was amazing and stellar, I couldn't in my right mind even begin to make that comparison past the most basic points. RPGs though they all are, they're still worlds apart.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:40AM s ls said

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I skipped this game yesterday at GameStop for Tatsunoko Vs. Capcom after looking at the reviews... best decision ever

Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:50AM (Unverified) said

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Good move!
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 10:05AM RobS the 3rd said

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Good choice my friend!
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 10:26AM PedoJokerBear said

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capcom thanks you.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 1:47PM (Unverified) said

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I made the exact same choice yesterday, and I'm not looking back....am currently hooked on Tatsunoko vs Capcom....although I was hoping that this game would turn out decent since I do like Level-5 as a Dev....well better luck next time Level-5.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:42AM (Unverified) said

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comments are currently turned off please read above for more details.

Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:45AM (Unverified) said

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...wat??
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 10:35AM TheBrainninja said

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...on Engadget.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 11:12AM Curtis17 said

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Nobody cares!
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:44AM (Unverified) said

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So it's a mediocre jrpg, which I kinda saw coming because Level-5 hasn't made a good *console* rpg since Dark Cloud 2 which was quite a while ago. I don't even know if I want them working on DC3 anymore given their recent history.

Anyway after reading the review I feel even worse for JC now, as I remember that one WRUP post where everyone but him was playing ME2, and he had to play this. I was at least hoping he enjoyed it so it wouldn't have looked as bad.

Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:58AM (Unverified) said

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Dragon Quest VIII and Rogue Galaxy were both excellent, in my opinion.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 10:01AM (Unverified) said

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I couldn't stand either. Keep in mind this was when I was still into jrpgs too. I remember looking forward to rogue galaxy more than FF12 because of how good dark cloud 1 and 2 were...then being crushed when I actually played it.

DQ8 remains to this day one of the most boring games I've ever played.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 10:57AM (Unverified) said

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....you dont like anything do you tmac....yeah WKC sucks i wont argue that, but DQ and Rougue Galaxy were damn good....but hey to each his own righty?????
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 4:02PM shiftplusone said

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Rogue Galaxy is one of the most divided RPGs I've ever seen. People either love it or absolutely hate it

I hated both it and dq8. No game that boring should be that long
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 5:06PM gatotsu911 said

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@ShiftPlusOne:

If you think Rogue Galaxy is one of the most divisive RPGs ever, you must've never heard of Chrono Cross.
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Posted: Feb 5th 2010 3:40PM Softserve said

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I didn't care for Rogue Galaxy. It felt similar to the complaints in this review... It just felt like it went on and on, with more time spent on nearly useless side quests and what I guess could best be described as "mini-games".

I loved Dark Cloud 2, though... and DQVIII was also wonderful, although that's not all Level-5 there.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:51AM Giggman said

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So far (I know it's early) the PS3 exclusives have been greeted with mediocre reviews. I'm not too interested in Heavy Rain yet, but I hope that gets the ball rolling Sony.

* Oh yeah, and God of War is coming....*

Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:55AM (Unverified) said

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To be honest, predicting that MAG and this would be average wasn't exactly the hardest predictions ever to anyone who was paying attention.

But Heavy Rain looks good so far, the only scores I saw were a couple of 90/100s and we all know god of war 3 will rake in the reviews.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 10:01AM s ls said

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MAG is surprisingly getting positive reviews, it has its flaws but what Zipper is trying to build upon is pretty good.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 10:06AM Vidikron said

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MAG seems to be somewhat of a mixed bag on the review side, though most people I know actually playing it love it. Overall the impressions/reviews I've seen since it launched are fairly positive. Certainly much better overall than this game.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 10:08AM Giggman said

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I would maybe pick up a game like this if I had the time to dedicate to it. I want MAG but I know that I would just play it on ocassions and not be able to go in depth with it.

I also just picked up Mass Effect so I can carry the experience over into ME2 but I'm not liking that game at all and wondering if I should just skip it and go on to the second one.

*But oh well... God of War is coming...*
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 10:14AM Vidikron said

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That's actually the same reason I haven't picked up MAG. Online games like that always take a lot of time to stay competitive, and from what I've read that's especially true for MAG.

I also didn't like the first ME. It's like an RPG that they tried to give a true shooting mechanic but failed miserably. It controls as poorly as an RE game. Plus the inventory system was one of the worst I've ever seen. I eventually just stopped playing. But I still plan to play ME2 because everything I've read about the game indicates that the issues I hated at fixed. But given my experience with the first game I haven't been in a hurry to get the second. I have a couple of other games to finish up first.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 10:14AM Vidikron said

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*are fixed
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 11:54AM GuardianLegend said

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@Vidikron,

I was in MAG beta (which is nearly identical to the final game) and I didn't get the impression that high level players would be at a significant advantage over low level players. The difference between level 1 and 10 is significant, but the higher you go, the less advantage you're getting.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 12:25PM Johnnynumber5 is powered by cell said

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MAG certainly isn't the standard FPS fare you get in say modern warfare or battlefield bad company. Leveling up is much more difficult than in mw2 and the game does require some serious dedication. It's not a pick up and play game. But, it is one of the most innovative fps's to come out this generation. It's like the shooter version of demons souls ... not something you play casually as it will chew you up and spit you out. It's not a very pretty game graphically but the mos exciting part is regardless of how many player are in match I've yet to experience any amount of lag. It's the definition of a love it or hate it game in my opinion. If you love online shooters and wish there was a deeper experience then its for you ... but only the hardcore devoted need apply.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 6:02PM Duke said

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Johnny /Tigre - did you just copy paste your previous comments on MAG in there. I think so. C'mon man!
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:45PM Johnnynumber5 is powered by cell said

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no I didn't duke was just recalling from memory.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:52AM Vcize said

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I only lightly followed this game but I was under the impression you could go through the actual story mode in co-op (you'd each be in charge of one character in the battle or something like that) which sounded cool to me.

The fact that really the "co-op" is just taking your character into some random dungeon crawl and is completely separate from the story kills any interest I had.

Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:55AM (Unverified) said

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I remember watching the first real trailer for this and thinking, WOW. That's beautiful and the combat looks really impressive. Block, attack, sneak up behind. It was not 100% original, but it looked fun to play. But after this review and GT review, it's like this 2006 video below was a deceptive. I mean, what happened to the graphics in 4 years? It became all cartoony and half assed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEXvnoY-KoU
*Link Original 2006 TGS Footage. Supposedly in game, non cut scene.

Posted: Feb 4th 2010 9:57AM (Unverified) said

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When it came to sony trailers in 2005-2006, I think it was a common rule to just ignore them and accept that it wasn't indicative of what the actual game would be.

We all remember the infamous Killzone and Motorstorm ones.
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