At the very least, we know to expect dozens -- if not hundreds -- of videos showing Japanese people waving their arms and legs about, trying desperately to maintain control while piloting Kinect-based games. We can hardly wait.
At the very least, we know to expect dozens -- if not hundreds -- of videos showing Japanese people waving their arms and legs about, trying desperately to maintain control while piloting Kinect-based games. We can hardly wait.
Reader Comments (45)
Posted: Sep 9th 2010 6:48AM Doc McFish said
I think Kinect more than silly games is a killer tool. I cant wait to see when people get good at programming for it.
Remember those mech games with custom controllers, kinect could use a nicely designed hud to control games like that.
Id like see a MYST game that uses kinect.
I think kinect will have a lot of life in it once they realize that its best use will be manipulating on screen virtual controls. Like inside a cockpit of an f16, ill sit back and use my hands to flip switches and pull handles (forgive me for not knowing whats inside a cockpit, but just for example) and ill look out that windows when i turn my head.
but as long as they make things like sports resort and kinectimals, I think we need to talk more about DLC like 800 ms points for a pet tiger or 1200 ms points for the 2 sports games ill ever play.
Reply
Remember those mech games with custom controllers, kinect could use a nicely designed hud to control games like that.
Id like see a MYST game that uses kinect.
I think kinect will have a lot of life in it once they realize that its best use will be manipulating on screen virtual controls. Like inside a cockpit of an f16, ill sit back and use my hands to flip switches and pull handles (forgive me for not knowing whats inside a cockpit, but just for example) and ill look out that windows when i turn my head.
but as long as they make things like sports resort and kinectimals, I think we need to talk more about DLC like 800 ms points for a pet tiger or 1200 ms points for the 2 sports games ill ever play.
Posted: Sep 9th 2010 6:51AM Doc McFish said
Id also love to see something to the extent of:
How many times are you sitting down playing a shooter, and ur buddy is like "over there" "to the left" "in the barn" Id love for kinect to show me where he is pointing, Like a sniper and a spotter or something. one with a controller one hands free.
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How many times are you sitting down playing a shooter, and ur buddy is like "over there" "to the left" "in the barn" Id love for kinect to show me where he is pointing, Like a sniper and a spotter or something. one with a controller one hands free.
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 6:38PM Jayeffaar said
Is anyone else looking forward to Microsoft stopping pushing "controller-free" games and starting to talk about controller-based games that also use Kinect for some of the functionality?
There's only so much you can do in a game without using buttons, but combine the potential of Kinect with the precision of using an actual controller, and you might have a winner.
As long as MS keeps focusing on hand-waving shovelware, I just can't get interested...
Reply
There's only so much you can do in a game without using buttons, but combine the potential of Kinect with the precision of using an actual controller, and you might have a winner.
As long as MS keeps focusing on hand-waving shovelware, I just can't get interested...
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 6:56PM Wiizer said
@(Unverified)
I don't understand this assumption that Kinect is anything more than what has been shown?
Is it because of those magical E3 videos? Is there some secret tech demo out there somewhere that shows something that I keep missing about this piece of hardware that conveys this 'feeling' that there is something more to Kinect?...
I'm legitimately asking.
Reply
I don't understand this assumption that Kinect is anything more than what has been shown?
Is it because of those magical E3 videos? Is there some secret tech demo out there somewhere that shows something that I keep missing about this piece of hardware that conveys this 'feeling' that there is something more to Kinect?...
I'm legitimately asking.
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 7:06PM BobTheElephant said
@Wiizer It is more just a matter of staying hopeful than assuming. Kinect can handle both controller and camera/voice/etc. at the same time, that much has been confirmed(http://www.joystiq.com/2010/09/08/tsunoda-describes-kinects-object-scanning-controller-wielding/). However, from what we've seen so far, the only people who actually want to see someone try that are the gamers...not the publishers and possibly not the devs. Ideally we'll see some Kinect games geared towards people other than who they're currently marketing for in the (near?) future...
Reply
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 7:12PM cool8man said
@(Unverified) The reason they aren't showing any mixed control games is because they don't want to dilute the core message that Kinect enables controller-free games. The general public and media would not be very excited about Kinect if it was just an enhancement or gimmick for traditional controller-based gaming.
Reply
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 7:13PM Jayeffaar said
@Wiizer
It's true that it's starting to look like Kinect isn't much more than a very expensive eye-toy with voice recognition and a huge marketing push.
It probably wouldn't have the necessary precision to be used for something like a head tracker in a racing game, or recognize hand gestures in a squad-based military game. And I can't imagine that many somewhat imprecise things I'd rather do by waving my hands in a serious game, than by pressing a button or moving a stick.
Reply
It's true that it's starting to look like Kinect isn't much more than a very expensive eye-toy with voice recognition and a huge marketing push.
It probably wouldn't have the necessary precision to be used for something like a head tracker in a racing game, or recognize hand gestures in a squad-based military game. And I can't imagine that many somewhat imprecise things I'd rather do by waving my hands in a serious game, than by pressing a button or moving a stick.
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 7:26PM cool8man said
@Wiizer "I don't understand this assumption that Kinect is anything more than what has been shown?"
What new game system isn't more than it's launch games? I don't understand how anyone could think that there will be no innovation with Kinect beyond the handful of titles that come out in the first 2 months.
"Is it because of those magical E3 videos?"
What magical E3 videos? Seriously what did Microsoft show for Project Natal that you don't think is possible or hasn't already been delivered on? And honestly what was "magical" about the concept video? The concept video never struck me as being overly ambitious. In fact the original concept videos for Xbox Live were way more off the mark than anything they ever conceived of with Project Natal/Kinect.
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What new game system isn't more than it's launch games? I don't understand how anyone could think that there will be no innovation with Kinect beyond the handful of titles that come out in the first 2 months.
"Is it because of those magical E3 videos?"
What magical E3 videos? Seriously what did Microsoft show for Project Natal that you don't think is possible or hasn't already been delivered on? And honestly what was "magical" about the concept video? The concept video never struck me as being overly ambitious. In fact the original concept videos for Xbox Live were way more off the mark than anything they ever conceived of with Project Natal/Kinect.
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 7:43PM PR0F3TA said
@(Unverified)
you wont see a game that uses a controller and Kinect... at least not for a while, the whole Kinect motto is "You Are The Controller" so don't hold your breath for a core game at TGS. i predict more of the mini game model they have been showing since the beginning
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you wont see a game that uses a controller and Kinect... at least not for a while, the whole Kinect motto is "You Are The Controller" so don't hold your breath for a core game at TGS. i predict more of the mini game model they have been showing since the beginning
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 7:54PM Wiizer said
@cool8man
Dude, you are such a sheep, don't even respond to me.
The Dashboard for one. The girls trying on clothes and chatting while doing so on Kinect.
The whole family playing the racing game... Um, six players at the same time ACTUALLY playing a game, not bystanders?
Do you want me to keep going?
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Dude, you are such a sheep, don't even respond to me.
The Dashboard for one. The girls trying on clothes and chatting while doing so on Kinect.
The whole family playing the racing game... Um, six players at the same time ACTUALLY playing a game, not bystanders?
Do you want me to keep going?
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 9:07PM cool8man said
@Wiizer
"The Dashboard for one."
The Dashboard is controllable by Kinect with both voice and gestures. They're even remaking all the apps to be compatible with gesture control. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfsGy0gRR4M
"The girls trying on clothes and chatting while doing so on Kinect."
Video chat has already been demoed. But you're right they haven't demoed the ability to try on dresses while chatting. Now I understand why you're so upset. They do have it so that you can watch news, sports, movies and TV while video chatting. Personally I think that's better than trying on dresses together but hey that's me.
"The whole family playing the racing game... Um, six players at the same time ACTUALLY playing a game, not bystanders?"
Watch the video again (link below). There were only 2 people playing the racing game. The daughter was driving and the father was in the pit crew. The mother and son were only watching. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2qlHoxPioM#t=0m37s
There is no instance of six players at the same time playing a game anywhere in any of the videos. There are only even 4 people in the family meaning you were imagining things that were never shown.
"Do you want me to keep going?"
Yeah please keep trying because so far the only legitimate thing I'll give you is that you won't be able to try on dresses while video chatting at launch. Although I imagine they could easily make a way for the person you are chatting with see you put different outfits on your Xbox Avatar.
Reply
"The Dashboard for one."
The Dashboard is controllable by Kinect with both voice and gestures. They're even remaking all the apps to be compatible with gesture control. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfsGy0gRR4M
"The girls trying on clothes and chatting while doing so on Kinect."
Video chat has already been demoed. But you're right they haven't demoed the ability to try on dresses while chatting. Now I understand why you're so upset. They do have it so that you can watch news, sports, movies and TV while video chatting. Personally I think that's better than trying on dresses together but hey that's me.
"The whole family playing the racing game... Um, six players at the same time ACTUALLY playing a game, not bystanders?"
Watch the video again (link below). There were only 2 people playing the racing game. The daughter was driving and the father was in the pit crew. The mother and son were only watching. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2qlHoxPioM#t=0m37s
There is no instance of six players at the same time playing a game anywhere in any of the videos. There are only even 4 people in the family meaning you were imagining things that were never shown.
"Do you want me to keep going?"
Yeah please keep trying because so far the only legitimate thing I'll give you is that you won't be able to try on dresses while video chatting at launch. Although I imagine they could easily make a way for the person you are chatting with see you put different outfits on your Xbox Avatar.
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 6:39PM That Burning Sensation said
I have yet to see ONE Kinect game I am interested in. Advanced dashboard controller does not a game make.
Reply
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 7:15PM anonim1979 said
@That Burning Sensation
Child of Eden ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrY4iETraik
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IY1r9DXZCZU
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Child of Eden ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrY4iETraik
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IY1r9DXZCZU
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 8:14PM Chareth Cutestory said
@(Unverified)
Its sad that the best argument for it isn't even exclusive to it...
Reply
Its sad that the best argument for it isn't even exclusive to it...
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 9:00PM That Burning Sensation said
@That Burning Sensation
I'm not saying it will never get a good steady line up of core games, but how soon before the big 3 plan to release new consoles. My concern, for a lack of a better word, is that by the time we see any headway with the Kinect or to some degree Move, the next Xbox or PS4 will be around the corner (if not already arrived). The 360 is already past the standard 4 year life cycle of console turnover. Yet, even when using Sony's expected hardware lifecycle (10 yrs), the 360 already is halfway there. With that in mind, typically with any new hardware release you expect atleast 2-3 years before developers have time to "learn" the new platform. That leaves approx 2 years before new consoles may arrive, if not sooner (depending on the economy). The move is a bit different. Developers are already accustom to the Wii and since the Move is some what similar, better games should arrive much soon. With that said, I will never replace the tradition controller. So what's the whole point of this, open the market to people who hate tradition controllers?! Why the hell am I still typing? Ok. The end.
Reply
I'm not saying it will never get a good steady line up of core games, but how soon before the big 3 plan to release new consoles. My concern, for a lack of a better word, is that by the time we see any headway with the Kinect or to some degree Move, the next Xbox or PS4 will be around the corner (if not already arrived). The 360 is already past the standard 4 year life cycle of console turnover. Yet, even when using Sony's expected hardware lifecycle (10 yrs), the 360 already is halfway there. With that in mind, typically with any new hardware release you expect atleast 2-3 years before developers have time to "learn" the new platform. That leaves approx 2 years before new consoles may arrive, if not sooner (depending on the economy). The move is a bit different. Developers are already accustom to the Wii and since the Move is some what similar, better games should arrive much soon. With that said, I will never replace the tradition controller. So what's the whole point of this, open the market to people who hate tradition controllers?! Why the hell am I still typing? Ok. The end.
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 11:44PM Darthweder said
@That Burning Sensation
Who said that you can't just plug the Kinect into your new Xbox?
Reply
Who said that you can't just plug the Kinect into your new Xbox?
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 6:39PM Ezio Auditore da Firenze said
Nice.
The sex-based Kinect games will be revealed.
Reply
The sex-based Kinect games will be revealed.
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 6:44PM Ezio Auditore da Firenze said
@Ezio Auditore da Firenze
That spanking/torture based 'Criminal Girls' PSP game would be a perfect XBLA port for Kinect, I think.
Reply
That spanking/torture based 'Criminal Girls' PSP game would be a perfect XBLA port for Kinect, I think.
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 6:49PM Ezio Auditore da Firenze said
@The MARIO
You don't need Kinect for that. Just a soft pillow.
Reply
You don't need Kinect for that. Just a soft pillow.
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 7:32PM cool8man said
@Wiizer The Star Wars game allows 3D movement. Not sure how it works but this is what Kudo Tsunoda had to say about the Star Wars game that Terminal Reality is making for Kinect:
Referring to the Star Wars Kinect demo at E3 Tsunoda said:
"It had a cool 3D world navigation paradigm which I think is going to be super awesome, plus we have a bunch of other games coming down the pipeline.
"We will see some awesome games where you are able to move around the world in a fully natural and fully intuitive way.
"The Star Wars stuff that you saw at E3 was just the tip of the iceberg and we've got a lot more of those kind of games coming".
Reply
Referring to the Star Wars Kinect demo at E3 Tsunoda said:
"It had a cool 3D world navigation paradigm which I think is going to be super awesome, plus we have a bunch of other games coming down the pipeline.
"We will see some awesome games where you are able to move around the world in a fully natural and fully intuitive way.
"The Star Wars stuff that you saw at E3 was just the tip of the iceberg and we've got a lot more of those kind of games coming".
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 6:51PM Yossy desu ne said
Isn't the correct term "threatens," rather than "promises," when it's something negative?
Reply
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 8:13PM cool8man said
@(Unverified) Nearly every popular motion control game on the Wii seems like it is greatly enhanced by Kinect.
Just Dance has sold 4 million copies on the Wii. How does buttons make that genre better on Wii? Just Dance 2 is one of the most anticipated games of the Fall.
Deca Sports franchise has sold about 3 million on Wii. How do buttons make boxing, tennis, bowling, baseball, archery, volleyball, snowboarding, skiing, etc. better? You can't even do sports like soccer or track and field with a Wii.
EA Sports Active has sold almost 3.5 million on Wii. My Fitness Coach has sold over 2 million on Wii. Gold's Gym franchise and Jullian Michaels have each sold over a million copies a piece on Wii. How do buttons make fitness games better? Without a camera to accurately monitor what you're doing there's no way for the game to correct your form or tell if you are cheating on exercises.
The Petz franchise have sold over 2 million copies on Wii. How do buttons make interacting with a virtual pet better or more realistic?
This isn't even including the Nintendo franchises which have sold tens of millions (Wii Sports, Wii Fit, Nintendogs, etc.). Kinect is not just addressing the popular Wii games, it's leapfrogging it.
Every single Xbox 360 owner has a controller with buttons already. The purpose of Kinect isn't to eliminate the need for the Xbox 360 controller, it's to enable popular motion control games on the Wii and improve upon them with better graphics, control, immersion, and accessibility.
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Just Dance has sold 4 million copies on the Wii. How does buttons make that genre better on Wii? Just Dance 2 is one of the most anticipated games of the Fall.
Deca Sports franchise has sold about 3 million on Wii. How do buttons make boxing, tennis, bowling, baseball, archery, volleyball, snowboarding, skiing, etc. better? You can't even do sports like soccer or track and field with a Wii.
EA Sports Active has sold almost 3.5 million on Wii. My Fitness Coach has sold over 2 million on Wii. Gold's Gym franchise and Jullian Michaels have each sold over a million copies a piece on Wii. How do buttons make fitness games better? Without a camera to accurately monitor what you're doing there's no way for the game to correct your form or tell if you are cheating on exercises.
The Petz franchise have sold over 2 million copies on Wii. How do buttons make interacting with a virtual pet better or more realistic?
This isn't even including the Nintendo franchises which have sold tens of millions (Wii Sports, Wii Fit, Nintendogs, etc.). Kinect is not just addressing the popular Wii games, it's leapfrogging it.
Every single Xbox 360 owner has a controller with buttons already. The purpose of Kinect isn't to eliminate the need for the Xbox 360 controller, it's to enable popular motion control games on the Wii and improve upon them with better graphics, control, immersion, and accessibility.
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 8:17PM Chareth Cutestory said
@cool8man
You're totally right... but does it matter? We're talking about a (roughly) $300 investment for a somewhat-improved Wii experience.
I'm really curious to see how many current Wii owners Microsoft manages to pull in, and how many of them will comprehend the improvements.
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You're totally right... but does it matter? We're talking about a (roughly) $300 investment for a somewhat-improved Wii experience.
I'm really curious to see how many current Wii owners Microsoft manages to pull in, and how many of them will comprehend the improvements.
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 11:54PM Morph156 said
@cool8man
Don't get me wrong, I see your point, but I'm not interested in again, playing games I've already played. I was totally on board with the Wii and I'm totally on board with my 360, BUT I'm not interested in shovelware.
Of course, I'm also not the guy they're marketing this to. I would rather see them deviate from the shovelware formula that's so problematic with Wii's game library.
Reply
Don't get me wrong, I see your point, but I'm not interested in again, playing games I've already played. I was totally on board with the Wii and I'm totally on board with my 360, BUT I'm not interested in shovelware.
Of course, I'm also not the guy they're marketing this to. I would rather see them deviate from the shovelware formula that's so problematic with Wii's game library.
Posted: Sep 9th 2010 12:03AM McDuckScrooged said
@cool8man Interesting how you have access to those figures, I am left wondering what you do for a living..
Dancing argument conceeded, controlers for dancing games are not necessary.
Sports games ? The Kinect has a 320x240 3d sensor. It cannot track your fingers or wrist movements..
How will it know you have fired an arrow in archery ? How will it know you have released your fingers ? Thats where a button is necessary..
boxing, tennis, bowling, baseball, archery, volleyball, snowboarding, skiing, etc. better?
With both the Move and Wii you have a much more precise measurement of angle / rotation of the controller and also velocity.. This in turn helps provide a better measure for boxing , tennis , bowling archery and volleyball..
Snow boarding and skiing - Your feet are stationary in both sports as they are strapped to a board or skii's. In both cases its to do with pressure of your feet and clever foot work and movement of your arms.. We already know kinect cant see what your feet are doing but the WiiFit board can and can work out exactly how your positioning your feet and the wiimote gives a good representation of your hand movements..
Kinect isnt leap frogging anything..
Here is some logic for you with both the move and the Wii accurate measurments of velocity rotation and movement are sent from the different gyros and accelerometers within the controllers directly to the system.. This raw data can then be directly processed by the game to do whatever it expects the user to do..
We already know the move is more accurate than the Wii it knows the position of the controller in 3d space always and has more gyros and accelerometers as well as the ability to do augmented reality .
The Kinect has none of this data, it has an RGB camera that is worse than the rgb camera on the ps3 (it can only do 640x480 @ 30fps the ps3 eye can do 640x480 @ 60 fps and 320x240 @ 120fps) and it has a depth sensor that has a 320x240 resolution and can only capture at 30 fps. From the pictures it captures it has to work out speed has to work out angle has to work out movement.. It doesnt leap frog anything, its actually a step backwards because it has to shift all of this processing onto the console processor.. The data it captures is all relative and is no where near as accurate as sensors built directly on a controller that a user holds..
This is the undeniable truth:
http://www.gametrailers.com/video/video-physics-kinect/703804 -- Game Trailers messing around with the Kinect sensor.. Its responsiveness is just horrible, you want to build good accurate measurement when it gets bamboozled from these simple tests ? Seriously get real ..
This is tests done for the Playstation move:
http://www.kotaku.com/5626934/playstation-move-stress-tests-using-lighting-changes-and-human-distraction
Crecente gets his son to try and distract him while playing, and the controller passes with flying colours.. The light testing is also really interesting, but iwaggle has done even greater tests on lighting, check it here:
www.iwaggle.blogspot.com/2010/09/video-iwatch-playstation-move-vs-light.html
Even when using absurd lighting conditions the Move can still be made to work..
This is the difference.. Microsoft are too scared to let people demo their hardware because it just doesnt work and yet your trying to tell me that it leap frogs the wii ? Get real..
Reply
Dancing argument conceeded, controlers for dancing games are not necessary.
Sports games ? The Kinect has a 320x240 3d sensor. It cannot track your fingers or wrist movements..
How will it know you have fired an arrow in archery ? How will it know you have released your fingers ? Thats where a button is necessary..
boxing, tennis, bowling, baseball, archery, volleyball, snowboarding, skiing, etc. better?
With both the Move and Wii you have a much more precise measurement of angle / rotation of the controller and also velocity.. This in turn helps provide a better measure for boxing , tennis , bowling archery and volleyball..
Snow boarding and skiing - Your feet are stationary in both sports as they are strapped to a board or skii's. In both cases its to do with pressure of your feet and clever foot work and movement of your arms.. We already know kinect cant see what your feet are doing but the WiiFit board can and can work out exactly how your positioning your feet and the wiimote gives a good representation of your hand movements..
Kinect isnt leap frogging anything..
Here is some logic for you with both the move and the Wii accurate measurments of velocity rotation and movement are sent from the different gyros and accelerometers within the controllers directly to the system.. This raw data can then be directly processed by the game to do whatever it expects the user to do..
We already know the move is more accurate than the Wii it knows the position of the controller in 3d space always and has more gyros and accelerometers as well as the ability to do augmented reality .
The Kinect has none of this data, it has an RGB camera that is worse than the rgb camera on the ps3 (it can only do 640x480 @ 30fps the ps3 eye can do 640x480 @ 60 fps and 320x240 @ 120fps) and it has a depth sensor that has a 320x240 resolution and can only capture at 30 fps. From the pictures it captures it has to work out speed has to work out angle has to work out movement.. It doesnt leap frog anything, its actually a step backwards because it has to shift all of this processing onto the console processor.. The data it captures is all relative and is no where near as accurate as sensors built directly on a controller that a user holds..
This is the undeniable truth:
http://www.gametrailers.com/video/video-physics-kinect/703804 -- Game Trailers messing around with the Kinect sensor.. Its responsiveness is just horrible, you want to build good accurate measurement when it gets bamboozled from these simple tests ? Seriously get real ..
This is tests done for the Playstation move:
http://www.kotaku.com/5626934/playstation-move-stress-tests-using-lighting-changes-and-human-distraction
Crecente gets his son to try and distract him while playing, and the controller passes with flying colours.. The light testing is also really interesting, but iwaggle has done even greater tests on lighting, check it here:
www.iwaggle.blogspot.com/2010/09/video-iwatch-playstation-move-vs-light.html
Even when using absurd lighting conditions the Move can still be made to work..
This is the difference.. Microsoft are too scared to let people demo their hardware because it just doesnt work and yet your trying to tell me that it leap frogs the wii ? Get real..
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 7:09PM BFBeast666 said
I have trouble getting excited about anything MS does recently. Halo does nothing for me (never has), and Kinect can kiss my furry ass. Too expensive and there is nothing even remotely interesting to do with it. The only things for which I'll turn my 360 on in the forseeable future will be Rock Band 3 and Fallout New Vegas. Until then, I'm busy playing Dead Space Extraction or Dragon Quest IX.
Reply
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 7:39PM cool8man said
@Alex R I agree about Condemned. I think that type of game would be perfect for Kinect. I don't know about "a lot of fighting" though as that could get tiring. A slower paced game where you do a lot of exploration examination (see Forza demo) combined with the some melee fighting could be excellent.
Imagine being able to do this with a forensic type horror game like Condemned: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90HFQPVVndE#t=2m22s
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Imagine being able to do this with a forensic type horror game like Condemned: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90HFQPVVndE#t=2m22s
Posted: Sep 8th 2010 10:47PM ch3burashka said
The two things that I want is Milo, and some kind of Braid/Limbo-esque indie darling thing. Once Kinect can be properly used to play "art" games, then I'm sold.
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